Why Pakistan Army is Quiet on Drone Attack

[R Wing]

Often I am critical of Pakistan Army but seriously over this issue I genuinely feel sympathy with ISPR. I would not like to be in their position. Chances are they knew about this. Can they own up to it? No. Look at the crazy reaction we see here.

On the other hand it is possible they did not know about this. In which case what does the army do? Call the American's. You already know what their reply is. "We will do what we think to pursue our interests". So what do you do? Have a war with them because they certainly are not going to take heed of what your asking them. Have a meeting conclude that we don't want war. Now how do you explain this to our mad public?

So best policy. Stay mum.


Don;t try to divide us.

You, sir, really need to open up to the possibility of dealing with the US with means other than direct confrontation (which obviously isn't an option). In statecraft, when you appear to be on the backfoot, the other country will necessarily take undue advantage of your weak position. Naturally, it can be expected that the US, being the sole hyper-power, would have the upper hand --- but our leaders, both military and civilian, have done such a poor job at managing this balance that the US not pretty much monopolises the leverage equation.

I'm not sure what the ISPR should do --- that's their job to know --- but silence is probably the option that inspires the least confidence in our Armed Forces.

 

[Azadkashmir]

keep russians close cos they are inconflict with usa
media to concentrate number of dead inoocnet civilians by drones, evil usa face to be shown for international support.
then start shooting down drones.
publically say we have no choice public dont want it they are angry and revolting.
start silently throw out all thier assets and agents execute some of them.
tell saudis we done them favour load of time now they should intervene by threatening drop the dollar if not threaten the saudis if we go down we nuking your fields. crashing the dollar.
russians already wnat to do this.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

deny hint of racism

It's everywhere. Sadly. Scots, English take crap at Irish in UK. Sikhs, West Bengalis, Tamils, Telagu,Bihari, assorted plus in India and these are vertical dividers. I won't go into the horizontal caste "prejudice" which gnaws it's way through Indian society. You should know that. By comparison Pakistan is a homogenous nation.

So let's not make especial case for Pakistan. Crap goes both ways between Pashtun, Punjabi, Sindhi or Baloch etc. Back to topic please or open another thread. Thanks.

 

[HttpError]

That is because there isn't much they can talk about. Wait for any domestic issue they will be the first one to tweet and do commentary.

 

[Imran Khan]

That is because there isn't much they can talk about. Wait for any domestic issue they will be the first one to tweet and do commentary.

 

[باپ]

Yeah, airforce has been asked to shoot drones and they have asked for one thing only, get them parliamentary resolution or prime minister orders,which they never got.
Just hanging terrorists by military courts is called breach of democracy and blocked by supreme court. No general wants to stand in the same court for putting country in a state of war with America by shooting drones, and civilian leadership including people like You blaming it all on them.
You still blame them on Kargil ? Don't you?
Army was ordered by prime minister to leave the peaks they conquered in Indian territory and prime minister signed no formal ceasefire or safe passage agreement with India. When our army started coming down from the peaks,Indian army used them for target practice and so many were killed.
When prime minster was asked why he did that,he said he didn't ask army to attack kargil and doesn't take any responsibility of what happened there.
Also PAF was directly ordered by prime minister not to take part in the kargil war,so they couldn't engage Indian jets who bombarded Pakistani soldiers day and night.
Army is still licking those wounds.
They are not willing to take any further blames while losing precious men.
Not a single shot will be fired at drones until civilian leadership shows full backing of the army on the matter.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

really need to open up to the possibility of dealing

Thank you. Sane voice finally. Yes you make very valid and lucid point.

US monopolises the leverage equation.

That's fantastic description "leverage equation". I would give positive rating if I could. Yes, your right direct confrontation is not even on the table and should not be unless we have gone crazy with Mad Cow disease.

So what are we left with? The leverage equation you allude to. The million dollar question is has our government extracted the maximum out of that equation using every lever it has available? In other words could we still extract more out of that equation that slightly tilts things in our favour. We know even with the best will in the world the final equation is going to be loaded against us simply because they are superpower and we are not.

My feeling is that we probably have extracted the most out of this equation. We will never know for sure because we are not privy to the heated discussions that take place behind closed doors between US and Pakistan.

The Pakistan public instead of wailing and crying should in fact use these cases of what indeed is humiliation to work hard to fix the problem and that definitely is not by showing two fingers to US. The solution lies in the hands of Pakistani public. Unite, build, educate and remove the structural weakness in the country. That in the long term will give us the strength to extract more from the "leverage equation". The army is not some miracle machine. It is just reflection of Pakistan society. When you blame it or you see warts in it well that is you and me. Those are warts on our faces.

I want Pakistani's to consider another very proud and very martial race. The Japanese. In 1850s Japan was closed off and insular society living in the middle ages. They did not want to talk, engage or have anything to do with outside world. Then in 1853 US Navy warship under Commodore Perry arrived in Japan. Effectively the warship pointed the guns at Japanese and told them "agree to open up or we blast you to hell".

Link > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perry_Expedition


I show these picture illustrate how backward they were in 1850. However the Japanese were not stupid. Realizing that their swords were no match for US Navy ship they accepted US demands to open up. However they were utterly humiliated. The Japanese code of honour is very unforgiving. Far more demanding than anything we have.

Now this is where Japan proved it's mettle. Humiliated they were. But reaction. Quitely resolve that it was never going to happen again. Orders were given to copy the "barbarian" Westerners in everything. Copy, copy and copy. Within two decades Japanese had given up their traditional clothing. They changed their manners. They learn't to think like Westerner's. They built industry. Japan went through transformation from middle ages to being a Western country in less than 50 years. American gunboat diplomacty had led to entire country and culture transforming themselves.

Barely 50 years after Commodore Perry's humiliation the Japanese had learn't how to make ships, trains, modern industry and almost looked any regular Western country. Then when ready they decided to show the world what they were. In 1905 they had war against Russia and utterly defeated that country and sank most of the Russian Pacific fleet. Japan was recognized as a great power that year and was accepted as honorary member of the Western world. It was accorded full respect.

Link > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russo-Japanese_War

There is a lesson in this for Pakistan. Look forward not backward.

 

[Super Falcon]

Time to shift the foreign policy in new direction enough of old crap

 

[Azadkashmir]

Thank you. Sane voice finally. Yes you make very valid and lucid point.


That's fantastic description "leverage equation". I would give positive rating if I could. Yes, your right direct confrontation is not even on the table and should not be unless we have gone crazy with Mad Cow disease.

So what are we left with? The leverage equation you allude to. The million dollar question is has our government extracted the maximum out of that equation using every lever it has available? IOn other words could we still extract more out of that equation that slightly tilts things in our favour. We know even with the best will in the world the final equation is going to be loaded against us simply because they are superpower and we are not.

My feeling is that we probably have extracted the most out of this equation. We will never know for sure because we are not privy to the heated discussions tat take place behind closed doors between US and Pakistan.

The Pakistan public instead of wailing and crying should in fact use these cases of what indeed is humiliation to work to fix the problem and that definitely is not by showing two fingers to US. The solution lies in the hands of Pakistani public. Unite, build, educate and remove the structural weakness in the country. That in the long term will give us the strength to extract more from the "leverage equation". The army is not some miracle machine. It is just reflection of Pakistan society. When you blame it or you see warts in it well that is you and me. Those are warts on our faces.

I want Pakistani's to consider another very proud and very martial race. The Japanese. In 1850s Japan was closed off and insular society living in the middle ages. They did not want to talk, engage or have anything to do with outside world. Then in 1853 US Navy warship under Commodore Perry arrived in Japan. Effectively the warship pointed the guns at Japanese and told them "agree to open up or we blast you to hell".

Link > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perry_Expedition


I show these picture illustrate how backward they were in 1850. However the Japanese were not stupid. Realizing that their swords were no match for US Navy ship they accepted US demands to open up. However they were utterly humiliated. The Japanese code of honour is very unforgiving. Far more demanding than anything we have.

Now this is where Japan proved it's mettle. Humiliated they were. But reaction. Quitely resolve that it was never going to happen again. Orders were given to copy the "barbarian" Westerners in everything. Copy, copy and copy. Within two decades Japanese had given up their traditional clothing. They changed their manners. They tlearn't to think like Western's. They built industry. Japan went through transformation from middle ages to being a Western country in less than 50 years. American gunboat diplomacty had led to entire country and culture transforming themselves.

Barely 50 years after Commodore Perry's humiliation the Japanese had learn't how to make ships, trains, modern industry and almost looked any any regular Western country. Then when ready they decided to show the world what they were. In 1905 they had war against Russia and utterly defeated that country and sank most of the Russian Pacific fleet. Japan was recognized as a great power that year and joined as honorary member of the Western world. It was accorded full respect.

Link > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russo-Japanese_War

There is a lesson in this for Pakistan.

but they have no soul, they in heavy debt, did you know when thier economy crashed they blamed the jews bankers, did you know they buy alot of books about exposing zionism. usa give china the technology blueprints, transfer of machine tools. sorry japan got fcuked over they tried to resist the bankers, but were threatened then we had fukishima rumour is isrealis were behind it.

jew warburgs funded thier victory against russia cos czar nicholoas kept jews in check.

 

[Samlee]

If Pakistan cannot even defeat India, what is USA in comparison?

Your Comments Just Goes To Show Your True Nationality

 

[Norwegian]

Your Comments Just Goes To Show Your True Nationality

Dude I am born in Holy Family hospital Rawalpindi. So don't mess with me

 

[Indus Pakistan]

but they have no soul,

But you have soul. Yes? Let me tell you why.

You got taken over by Hindu Rajah and frigged you over and over.
You got taken over by the British who frigged you over and over

In fact you have been frigged so much so often that you can't even tell when your being frigged. Nay so much that you need it up yours because bending is your default position.

And you talk about Japanese. They fought Russia. They defeated it. They fought America for 5 years and it took two atom bombs for them to lay their guns down. Have some respect for the Japanese even if you don't have any for yourself.

they in heavy debt

Have a look outside. Almost every second car is Japanese. What does that tell you?

 

[Samlee]

Dude I am born in Holy Family hospital Rawalpindi. So don't mess with me

Nice Joke

 

[Imran Khan]

kidher hai ye tweeter ajkal ?

 

[Azadkashmir]

But you have soul. Yes? Let me tell you why.

You got taken over by Hindu Rajah and frigged you over and over.
You got taken over by the British who frigged you over and over

In fact you have been frigged so much so often that you can't even tell when your being frigged. Nay so much that you need it up yours because bending is your default position.

And you talk about Japanese. They fought Russia. They defeated it. They fought America for 5 years and it took two atom bombs for them to lay their guns down. Have some respect for the Japanese even if you don't have any for yourself.

I didnt get taken over i wasnt even born then. They defeated russia thanks to warburg financing nothing happens with material resources and money. same coud be said about afgans they defeated many empires never been colonised to this day, isnt mighty usa strugging to occupy it including nato . why doesnt usa pick russia or china why cos it a ss will turn red dawn.

oh by the way cant blame us for pakistan ills, azad kashmir has no say in anything not even sport.