Why Iran Needs a War Economy

[Sineva]

Yeah I am Qasem soliemani son

Could you please pass on to your father,that I think hes doing a really great job and that he really should seriously consider a future career in politics,as I think he has the makings of a future president of iran.

 

[scythian500]

I'm living in Iran , Khouzestan .... why you don't dare to say it !?

I am living in Iran and not in the capital and I don't agree with most of your points. You have to study political and economic history to know that Iran is already passing the last curve.. Last curve is where internal forces manage to filter bad guys and modify the system in a way to step in the next phase. Not because the elite wants it..no, but because people have stronger demands and old system does not work anymore...

This is the story of the emergence of powers. They are not born overnight.. There is a process need to be taken.. Revolutions.. post revolutions chaos... creating new political, social and economic foundations .. Revolution eats its children... New gen come to power... Society becomes confused... then they choose not to repeat already tested scenarios (war, revolution, partitioning, etc).. {Iran is here at the moment} They choose to kill the snake in the house.. creating another set of new political, social and economic foundations... New gen becomes mature.. Everything finds a balance.. Long term security and prosperity develops..

So, i assure you.. there would be no changes in Iran except for better... Iran is now mature enough to handle existential threats.. This is the price people of Iran must pay if they want to gain a long term good... it is like a surgery.. Iran is damned by its location, geography, ethnic and religious structure, potential powers she has within... so, Iran can not just surrender and become a client state like others and then taste prosperity.. It won't work for Iran as it does n't for France, or Italy or Russia... It is like petting a tiger at house.. soon or later it will bit u!!

Next phase to my eyes would be, a semi-united party takes the lead.. shows competence to prove itself to the people and to the world.. Then that big party loosen up the power and slowly other strong parties (next gen) come to existence.. It will be a balance of power and ideas and therefore prosperity and security...

Now the question is, how this dominant semi-united party will form.. There are two possibilities... most probable is that people learn to demonstrate a conditional support to the system. hence more demonstrations, more demands and the system finds no other option but to get back straight and change the system into cleaner more efficient one...

The other scenario is another war imposed on Iran.. The result would be same... Iranians become united around the fighting stock.. or the same semi-united dominant party... Then people learn to support the only functioning party available and that will turn scattered powers into one accumulated power unit that is able to provide both prosperity and security. Of course that dominant party show compromise some of its ideas to be fit for a nationwide acceptance.. and it will if u ask me...

The way from one dimension kingdoms and sultanates up to a healthy, functioning single or multi-party system is a long way.. It took Europe hundreds of years..so why not for Iran? Although, I would say it takes another generation at least for Iran... so Iran would find its optimum point of efficiency somewhere in between this gen and new generation.

Btw, every nation has its own characteristics..this means the processes would be different for each nation.. as it is for Iran..

 

[scythian500]

The truth is that average salary of Iranian is about 15,000,000 Rials while the line of Poverty ( according of static of central bank of IR) is more than 45,000,000 Rials ....

do you think these poor people can survive in a prolong conflict !?

No, its not.. The average income of Iranian families last year was nearly 44 million tomans per year while expenses were around 42 millions.. Although, this numbers will be changed this year due to high inflation rates but even with that is not as critical as you paint it.. This is average..means some families earn less and some much more...

But I agree than pay is not enough in most smaller cities but lets not forget that income is not just salary...

People buy stuff (car, houses, commodities, etc) and their prices grow alongside or even more than inflation rate and most people earn from this... For example, nearly 70 percent of all Iranians have their own houses.. Almost everybody in the working age has a car these days... this is why your father owns a house and a car and savings while his salary would not suffice if it was only up to salaries...

بانک مرکزی با ارایه نتایج بررسی متوسط هزینه - درآمد خانوار سال ۹۶، اعلام کرد: درآمد یک خانوار شهری در سال گذشته ۴۳ میلیون و ۹۲۷ هزار تومان و هزینه نیز ۴۲ میلیون و ۱۳۰ هزار تومان بود

https://www.khabaronline.ir/news/789960/خانواده-های-ایرانی-چقدر-درآمد-داشتند-چقدر-خرج-کردند

 

[SubWater]

Could you please pass on to your father,that I think hes doing a really great job and that he really should seriously consider a future career in politics,as I think he has the makings of a future president of iran.

OK, sure.
lol
-----------------------------------------
It is better we focus on the content of the text instead of whom saying.
I wrote about economic deterrence but my friend OldTwilight decide to nagging about current economic situation. I tried to find and discuss solution. I strongly believe there is economic solution for Iran and we have ability to solve our weakness. regime change or bending to west is not solution. Today we produce all of our benzine, that mean we can solve the problems. we are exporting around 2 mil bpd oil ,and that is source of problem. why do we export raw oil to foreign refineries and petrochemical factories while we can build new refineries we have knowledge, enough man power and money. create capacity for all of Iran oil export. selling final products are easier than raw oil in black market also our enemies are dependent on oil even more than us low oil prices harm us for sure but it hurt them as well. we must reduce our budget dependence on raw oil quickly then bring down raw oil prices below 30$.
Look who will come to beg for upper oil prices. (Russians, American and Saudis)
at that prices many American and Russians companies are going to bankrupt. that mean we make our weakness to our power.

absolutely, implementing what I said is hard but I believe It is possible.

 

[OldTwilight]

You are naive , Iran currently is falling apart and you are fooling yourselves with fake statics ....

Just try to think rationaly and you see Iran as whole is going to be extinct if IR keep its current internal policy .....


Japan population is 128 millions , but they only have 300,000 government employee , but Iran with 85 million population has more than 4 million government employee and more than 400,000 government manager which most of them are corrupted ....
how can our weak economy afford to pay the salary of all these guys !?

this just one of fundamental problem of IR which couldn't solve in past 40 years ( in fact , it get worsen by each passing day )

 

[scythian500]

s

You are naive , Iran currently is falling apart and you are fooling yourselves with fake statics ....

Just try to think rationaly and you see Iran as whole is going to be extinct if IR keep its current internal policy .....


Japan population is 128 millions , but they only have 300,000 government employee , but Iran with 85 million population has more than 4 million government employee and more than 400,000 government manager which most of them are corrupted ....
how can our weak economy afford to pay the salary of all these guys !?

this just one of fundamental problem of IR which couldn't solve in past 40 years ( in fact , it get worsen by each passing day )

son.. You are too young to know, Iran was going through much worse and today's situation is nothing comparing to those... You,re not aware how other countries work, this is why you think Iran is failing with all these enmity around it... With all the corruption and mismanagement you see today in some parts of government, Iran is still one of top %25 and if it was not for war and foreign agents (so called Islah tlalab), it would be much better... 40 years is nothing to see how a system work and ends up with... 40 is the magical number in fact...

Means it is becoming ripe..and because she is mature now, she would do necessary adjustments herself in order to get new power to go on..

With all the negative things that you see (or made to see!!) Iran is on the right track and it took Iran centuries to get back on track and it is on one now... Think strategic... don't be like those Chinese oppositions who were taking pictures of how hard their workers were living while China was China and she could not take any other way in order to fill the gap with other advanced nations... There are consequences, hence temporary in each of these processes.. I don't ask you to be smart.. I ask you to read how nations evolved...

Iran is on the right track... but I,m sure a lot would be changed by Iranians themselves from inside.. and it would not be another revolution or regime change... It will be in form of killing the snake at house... or cleansing the parasites through modifying the system for better...

You are naive , Iran currently is falling apart and you are fooling yourselves with fake statics ....

Just try to think rationaly and you see Iran as whole is going to be extinct if IR keep its current internal policy .....


Japan population is 128 millions , but they only have 300,000 government employee , but Iran with 85 million population has more than 4 million government employee and more than 400,000 government manager which most of them are corrupted ....
how can our weak economy afford to pay the salary of all these guys !?

this just one of fundamental problem of IR which couldn't solve in past 40 years ( in fact , it get worsen by each passing day )

Btw, as expected most of your numbers are wrong...

Iran has a relatively small public sector in terms of number of employed people by Gov:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_public_sector

Only % 18.3 of employees are hired by the public sector in Iran..

The number for Canada is +%22... France %25... Finland %27..Norway %38.. China %50 and India %55

Ok, let's get down to Japan:

There are 2,855,106 local government employees in Japan, with 2.24 local government employees in every 100 population.

https://stats-japan.com/t/kiji/13181

به گزارش گروه وبگردی باشگاه خبرنگاران جوان؛ ایران چیزی نزدیک به ٢‌میلیون و ٣٢٨‌هزار کارمند دارد که تعداد آنها در ١٥‌سال گذشته ثابت بوده است. از این میان ٤١‌درصد کارمندان دولتی زن هستند و این میزان نسبت به ١٥‌سال گذشته حدود ١٠‌درصد بیشتر شده است.

 

[OldTwilight]

s

son.. You are too young to know, Iran was going through much worse and today's situation is nothing comparing to those... You,re not aware how other countries work, this is why you think Iran is failing with all these enmity around it... With all the corruption and mismanagement you see today in some parts of government, Iran is still one of top %25 and if it was not for war and foreign agents (so called Islah tlalab), it would be much better... 40 years is nothing to see how a system work and ends up with... 40 is the magical number in fact...

Means it is becoming ripe..and because she is mature now, she would do necessary adjustments herself in order to get new power to go on..

With all the negative things that you see (or made to see!!) Iran is on the right track and it took Iran centuries to get back on track and it is on one now... Think strategic... don't be like those Chinese oppositions who were taking pictures of how hard their workers were living while China was China and she could not take any other way in order to fill the gap with other advanced nations... There are consequences, hence temporary in each of these processes.. I don't ask you to be smart.. I ask you to read how nations evolved...

Iran is on the right track... but I,m sure a lot would be changed by Iranians themselves from inside.. and it would not be another revolution or regime change... It will be in form of killing the snake at house... or cleansing the parasites through modifying the system for better...



Btw, as expected most of your numbers are wrong...

Iran has a relatively small public sector in terms of number of employed people by Gov:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_public_sector

Only % 18.3 of employees are hired by the public sector in Iran..

The number for Canada is +%22... France %25... Finland %27..Norway %38.. China %50 and India %55

Ok, let's get down to Japan:

There are 2,855,106 local government employees in Japan, with 2.24 local government employees in every 100 population.

https://stats-japan.com/t/kiji/13181

به گزارش گروه وبگردی باشگاه خبرنگاران جوان؛ ایران چیزی نزدیک به ٢‌میلیون و ٣٢٨‌هزار کارمند دارد که تعداد آنها در ١٥‌سال گذشته ثابت بوده است. از این میان ٤١‌درصد کارمندان دولتی زن هستند و این میزان نسبت به ١٥‌سال گذشته حدود ١٠‌درصد بیشتر شده است.

just read this ....

https://www.tabnak.ir/fa/news/85998...‌های-بی-کیفیت-با-قیمت-بالا-و-در-شرایط-انحصاری

then ....

 

[OldTwilight]

Currently 1 $ = 11,000 Toman

In Iran : 1 Kilogram red meat is about 80,000 Tomans which mean its around 7$ per killogram in Iran ....

min wage in Iran is 1,300,000 Tomans ....


in other countries .. ( eu and USA ) ==> 4.3 $ per kilogram
https://www.indexmundi.com/commodities/?commodity=beef

so the funny point is that our salary is between 1/10 or 1/20 of other countries while we have to pay twice or thrice of everything in IR

this is good , but the data is out dated ...

https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/country_result.jsp?country=Iran

 

[Homajon]

Good that it is now also published in Iran:

https://www.tasnimnews.com/fa/news/1397/10/24/1922359/چرا-ایران-به-اقتصاد-جنگی-احتیاج-دارد

 

[scythian500]

Currently 1 $ = 11,000 Toman

In Iran : 1 Kilogram red meat is about 80,000 Tomans which mean its around 7$ per killogram in Iran ....

min wage in Iran is 1,300,000 Tomans ....


in other countries .. ( eu and USA ) ==> 4.3 $ per kilogram
https://www.indexmundi.com/commodities/?commodity=beef

so the funny point is that our salary is between 1/10 or 1/20 of other countries while we have to pay twice or thrice of everything in IR

this is good , but the data is out dated ...

https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/country_result.jsp?country=Iran

If we assume that Iranian employees get something between 1.8 to 2.2 millions per month in average (which is not considered even average these days in Iran!) then let,s compare the purchasing power of Iranians comparing to Americans or Europe as a whole:

For statistical purposes let's say the average is 2 millions per month:

A barbari bread weighs 510 grams and cost u 700 IRTs each.. in Mashhad we pay 440 IRTs and its weight is 388 grams each. This means Iranians can buy 2857 breeds in Tehran and 4545 breads in Mashhad. How many breeds an American or Average French or Dutch can buy?

- The price of one liter of unleaded petrol in Iran is 1000 IRTs (8 American cents!!). This means an Iranian can buy 2000 liters... What is the number for American and Europeans?

- The price of an average apartment of two rooms (75 square meters) in an average kind of decent neighborhood in Tehran is around 400 Million IRTs. Which equals 200 months or nearly 16 years. This is an average in Tehran, while I can easily buy the same apartment for 250 millions which makes it 125 months or around 10 years. What is the purchasing power for an American or Londoner or Parisian?

- Bus tickets for a 10 km trip in Tehran and Mashhad is 500 IRTs. That makes 4000 tickets per months.. how much is for Europeans and Americans?

- I can buy a full meal (Persian) in Mashhad for around 10000 to 20000 depending on the food. Means I can buy 100 to 200 meals a month

- My utility bills combined for last two month was around 160000 IRTs which makes it 80 Thousand each month!! I paid 45000 for natural gas (heating, cooking and hot water) and its minus zero these days... this makes it 3.75 Dollars for two month or less than 1.9 dollars per month!!!! I paid 50000 for electricity and 25000 for drinking water and around 40 thousand for phone...

I,m not saying everything is perfect because thanks to some traitors ever week some product is being played with so the prices go up to as they declared it themselves make people angry and make them come to streets!!

This means you are just a liar and a kid who likes to complain on purpose.. I wish for once Iranians who don't like their current Iran be fair for themselves if not to others...

What matters is that Iran and Iranians not only will survive again as they did in many millennia but this time will rise up again as she deserves it...

 

[Hack-Hook]

A barbari bread weighs 510 grams and cost u 700 IRTs each.. in Mashhad we pay 440 IRTs and its weight is 388 grams each. This means Iranians can buy 2857 breeds in Tehran and 4545 breads in Mashhad. How many breeds an American or Average French or Dutch can buy?

you proved to me you are not in Iran

- The price of an average apartment of two rooms (75 square meters) in an average kind of decent neighborhood in Tehran is around 400 Million IRTs. Which equals 200 months or nearly 16 years. This is an average in Tehran, while I can easily buy the same apartment for 250 millions which makes it 125 months or around 10 years. What is the purchasing power for an American or Londoner or Parisian?

honestly , where ? when ?I wanted to buy an apartment with twice that amount and I could not find any . price of an apartment in Tehran jumped 100% in last several months.

- My utility bills combined for last two month was around 160000 IRTs which makes it 80 Thousand each month!! I paid 45000 for natural gas (heating, cooking and hot water) and its minus zero these days... this makes it 3.75 Dollars for two month or less than 1.9 dollars per month!!!! I paid 50000 for electricity and 25000 for drinking water and around 40 thousand for phone...

lucky you , mine is twice

and would you like me to take pictures of foods price in chain-stores and post them here?

- Bus tickets for a 10 km trip in Tehran and Mashhad is 500 IRTs. That makes 4000 tickets per months.. how much is for Europeans and Americans?

bus ticket in the line I use to go to my work is twice

- I can buy a full meal (Persian) in Mashhad for around 10000 to 20000 depending on the food. Means I can buy 100 to 200 meals a month

yes you can buy fast food like Falafel and Sambuseh

 

[scythian500]

View attachment 535718

you proved to me you are not in Iran

honestly , where ? when ?I wanted to buy an apartment with twice that amount and I could not find any . price of an apartment in Tehran jumped 100% in last several months.

lucky you , mine is twice

and would you like me to take pictures of foods price in chain-stores and post them here?


bus ticket in the line I use to go to my work is twice


yes you can buy fast food like Falafel and Sambuseh

You could spend 10 times more..its up to u... for these are the prices I pay everyday here... No need to post photos... and for a huge falafel + free salad bar i pay 3500 IRT here (belive me cheaper options exist).. Sambouse is 1500 each... and I,m not talking about poor neighborhoods here...an average class..
I pay 12000 for a very fine (huge meal for me and used to be 8000 last summer) kubide meal in Taavon restaurant which I normally go to if I,m by myself... I pay 15000 for a good juje kabab in same restaurant (it used to be 10 months ago) .. for 20000 I can have a sultani or barg plus coke and salad and yugort...
You can easily google this resturant and see menus, prices and even call them for prices if u are curious!
https://www.google.com/search?q=رستوران+تعاون+مشهد&rlz=1C1GGRV_enIR751IR751&source=lnms&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi1o6iApJPgAhWmwFQKHV1RAK0Q_AUICSgA&biw=1366&bih=694&dpr=1

For bread which is the main food in Iran next to rice, this is one new price list. Its kinda similar to in Mashhad I think:

Ok I found for Mashhad:

and this is for bus tickets in Mashhad:

https://bus.mashhad.ir/news/5556382-تغییر-نرخ-بهای-خدمات-ابتدای-اردیبهشت-ماه.html

and this is for Tehran:

https://www.yjc.ir/fa/news/6516859/قیمت-بلیت-اتوبوس-در-سال-97-مشخص-شد-جدول

So maybe its better if u move here! or maybe it means you are not living in IRAN or you are one of rich guys of Tehran whose life style is stranger to Iranians!

 

[Hack-Hook]

You could spend 10 times more..its up to u... for these are the prices I pay everyday here... No need to post photos... and for a huge falafel + free salad bar i pay 3500 IRT here (belive me cheaper options exist).. Sambouse is 1500 each... and I,m not talking about poor neighborhoods here...an average class..

you are talking about a long time ago in a galaxy far far away

and do you knew what you are eating if they gave it by that price to you
http://plus.ir/news/13616/فیلم-لحظه...مینال-غرب-چه-کسانی-قربانی-این-اقدام-کثیف-شدند
http://www.irna.ir/fa/News/82610948
https://www.yjc.ir/fa/news/5325235/کشف-4-تن-همبرگر-فاسد-در-تهران

and the majority of the lines are given to private sectors only BRT and some very busy and profitable line are in the hand of Municipality

 

[El Sidd]

Had Iran invested the money within its territory instead of fueling proxies in her neighbours, there would be political stability and human growth in Iran.

Just Power hungry corrupt Elite under cloak of religion and nothing else

 

[Raghfarm007]

Had Iran invested the money within its territory instead of fueling proxies in her neighbours, there would be political stability and human growth in Iran.

Just Power hungry corrupt Elite under cloak of religion and nothing else

If Pakistan ever gets infrastructure like below, then come and talk. Iran is a respected power cause it is developed infrastructurally, industrially and militarly: