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We defeated the USSR, so shall we the US

RPK

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ANALYSIS: We defeated the USSR, so shall we the US —Shahid Ilyas

Daily Times - Leading News Resource of Pakistan


We have never let the Afghans focus on building their state and realise their dreams of economic prosperity. And we continue to do so even today. Do we expect exotic Afghan rugs from Kabul in return?

In response to a piece in this paper titled ‘Is the Islamic Republic of Pakistan going to disintegrate?’ (Daily Times, July 30, 2011), this author received many e-mails. Many of them were threatening and abusive. All the abusive ones had one thing in common. They claimed that I was certainly an American agent and received American dollars. One wishes one were that lucky! One fellow stated, “I want to discourage you from this (writing) profession.” I am sure this gentle fellow would have instantly declared me as one of the best brains this republic ever produced had I done the popular hatemongering against Afghanistan, the US, India and Israel.

The Islamic Republic seems to suffer from terminal paranoia given the kind of narratives most of its people are made to believe in, nay, made to kill and die for. What exactly did I say that had these friends of mine frothing at the mouth? I quote one excerpt from the column in question: “The republic is currently represented by a few Punjabi generals, religious fundamentalists, feudal lords and Syeds. This clique has to decide between two options. Either the Islamic Republic is allowed to disintegrate, or it has to fashion itself according to its ground realities.”

One fails to understand how one becomes an American agent by pleading with the generals, syedo-feudals and religious fundamentalists to have mercy on Pakistan. If the US indeed shares this view with the people of Pakistan, there could be no better friends. But one has doubts, for this rotten system has partially survived thus far courtesy the inflow of American dollars and military hardware.

The fact of the matter is that, starting from its inception, the Islamic Republic would have gone bankrupt many times over had it not been for the inflow of American dollars and military hardware. This applies even now. And yet we (by ‘we’ I mean the establishment and its consumers of brainwashing in the middle and upper-middle classes) are one of the most — probably ‘the’ most — anti-American countries on planet Earth! And this nonsensical anti-Americanism has brought the Islamic Republic to the verge of collapse. People’s energies are wasted on poisonous narratives rather than on positive things.

How unfortunate are we to have a country whose existence our policy makers believe depends on the perpetuation of conflicts, silencing of dissent, torture, human rights violations and hatemongering. Minus hatred, torture, turmoil and conflict, the republic is believed to have nothing that can keep it together. More than 60 years of its existence have been wasted. Had our leaders — military and civilians — built a stable economy and strong democratic institutions, the populace would have had this as an incentive to stand united and not let it disintegrate. Our leaders would not have depended on hatemongering and conflicts for the country’s unity.

The ‘educated’ middle and upper-middle classes — exceptions apart — whose rage shoots up at the mention of Afghanistan, the US, Israel and India, cannot put forward a single good reason for their ideology of hate. Their only reason, if at all it can be elevated to the status of reason for the sake of debate, is that these countries are secretly working towards dividing Pakistan. One wishes they had enough wit to move a step further and think with a cold mind as to why they would want to divide the Islamic Republic.

This paranoia is the consequence of the wrong foreign policy of the Islamic Republic over the past 60 years. It believes that if Pakistan-based groups (Lashkar-e-Tayyaba and company) can work for the disintegration of India, the latter cannot be expected to have goodwill for the Islamic Republic. One hopes we do not forget the mayhem in Mumbai involving Ajmal Kasab and his links to our republic. This is just one example from hundreds in which the Islamic Republic has demonstrated its intention to bleed India. Do we expect baskets of mangos from India in return? We must be kidding!

Afghanistan has been bled by our republic for a very long time. We have never let the Afghans focus on building their state and realise their dreams of economic prosperity. And we continue to do so even today. Do we expect exotic Afghan rugs from Kabul in return?

We are probably the only country to have declared our enmity to Israel. Let us forget about Iran because we are not Iran. To this day, the Pakistani passport can take you everywhere (in theory) except Israel. Our so-called ghairat brigade nurtures more hatred against Israel than HAMAS does. And we know who pulls the strings of this brigade. Do we expect the arrival of financial experts from Israel to correct our bankrupt economy?

Our most unreasonable hatred is our hatred of the US. We apply the logic, which says, “The friend of my enemy is my enemy.” The US, being a friend of Afghanistan, India and Israel — our perceived enemies — is our enemy. Therefore, rather than adjusting ourselves to the chessboard of global politics, we are vainly involved in a struggle to change the rules of chess. We want the world to play according to our rules. Our rules are the following:

1) The world should leave Afghanistan and hand it over to us. Thanks ‘strategic depth’!

2) The US should denounce its friendship with India and Israel.

3) We should be allowed everything we want from India. We want Srinagar and Delhi if possible!


4) The world should continue giving us dollars, or else we will commit suicide attacks with nuclear jackets around our waist, thus destroying ourselves and all others around us.

None of our demands are going to be entertained. These are dreams. And one wishes dreams could help realities. We either have to be powerful enough to force the world into accepting our demands (dreams), or we have to play global chess according to international rules. Since 1947, we have mindlessly striven to force our rules down the throat of the world. The end result is talk about the prospects of the disintegration of the Islamic Republic. It actually disintegrated once. Please stop hatemongering and try to put your house in order. I promise, the world will be helping.

Postscript: The preposterous belief of our policymakers that we defeated one superpower (the USSR) and we will defeat the remaining one has to be changed. This is going to sink the remaining part of the Islamic Republic.

The writer belongs to Waziristan and can be reached at ilyasakbarkhan@gmail.com
 
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Pakistani media still has some sane voices and it doesn't fear from making its point.

Must give credit to them.

Sadly, the almighty Pakistani Army is not willing to listen to the 'bloody civilians' and loosen its grip on the besieged country.
 
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Pakistani media still has some sane voices and it doesn't fear from making its point.

Must give credit to them.

Sadly, the almighty Pakistani Army is not willing to listen to the 'bloody civilians' and loosen its grip on the besieged country.

Shouldn't it be like-

Taliban defeated the USSR- so they shall defeat Pakistan And USA ?
 
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Warning!
2ibn2ma.jpg
 
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lol i think you forgot kargil?? india dont have the balls to fight like USSR had.India goes crying to UNO instead of fighting like a man and we dont fight woman

Are you sure we went to UN ???

Pakistan News Service - PakTribune

‘Kargil a bigger disaster than East Pakistan’ - World - DNA ( Gen Ali Kuli Khan Khattak)

Sorry OT... "We defeated the USSR, so shall we the US —Shahid Ilyas"
As far as defeating USSR... Soviets didn't confront Pakistan.. if they did it would have been tragic for you... Rather than confrontation with bigger powers , the outlook should be of effective diplomacy and promotion of peace.
 
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Reading the artilce shows the "bazari" style of "arm chair think tank-hood" , the issue is the writer did not include himself in all of that "guilt" but sneaked out of as if he is some sort of "enlightened one" in a place full of "200 million idiots".

US did give 80+ million dollars to our media outlets inc print , broadcast and online for what ? - What is the "Return on investment" for the US ??
I am not saying that criticism of one's self is bad but it has to be fair and backed by facts not common urban legends.

What exactly US is doing good to Pakistan anyway and it rather makes me laugh how the writer thinks that Pakistan would have gone bankrupt if it wasn't for the US aid over the years. What a joke ! - We sold ourselves to the US and did their dirty work which changed our geopolitical landscape , if we weren't doing what we did for the US then Pakistan would have been a much stable , much indepenant & prosprous country. Just imagine if we didn't send "mujahedeen" to fight soviets ? Who was behind all this , we were just proxies , US was the real "gainer" not us.

Putting in a nutshell , this article is rubbish bin worthy to its core.
 
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Reading the artilce shows the "bazari" style of "arm chair think tank-hood" , the issue is the writer did not include himself in all of that "guilt" but sneaked out of as if he is some sort of "enlightened one" in a place full of "200 million idiots".

US did give 80+ million dollars to our media outlets inc print , broadcast and online for what ? - What is the "Return on investment" for the US ??
I am not saying that criticism of one's self is bad but it has to be fair and backed by facts not common urban legends.

What exactly US is doing good to Pakistan anyway and it rather makes me laugh how the writer thinks that Pakistan would have gone bankrupt if it wasn't for the US aid over the years. What a joke ! - We sold ourselves to the US and did their dirty work which changed our geopolitical landscape , if we weren't doing what we did for the US then Pakistan would have been a much stable , much indepenant & prosprous country. Just imagine if we didn't send "mujahedeen" to fight soviets ? Who was behind all this , we were just proxies , US was the real "gainer" not us.

Putting in a nutshell , this article is rubbish bin worthy to its core.


and India also!!! we could have been good neighbours with peace and trade prevailing amongst us
 
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These guys needs US money to fight a bunch of terrorists and dreaming about defeating US great , GOOD LUCK PAK:enjoy: :rofl:
 
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Reading the artilce shows the "bazari" style of "arm chair think tank-hood" , the issue is the writer did not include himself in all of that "guilt" but sneaked out of as if he is some sort of "enlightened one" in a place full of "200 million idiots".

US did give 80+ million dollars to our media outlets inc print , broadcast and online for what ? - What is the "Return on investment" for the US ??
I am not saying that criticism of one's self is bad but it has to be fair and backed by facts not common urban legends.

What exactly US is doing good to Pakistan anyway and it rather makes me laugh how the writer thinks that Pakistan would have gone bankrupt if it wasn't for the US aid over the years. What a joke ! - We sold ourselves to the US and did their dirty work which changed our geopolitical landscape , if we weren't doing what we did for the US then Pakistan would have been a much stable , much indepenant & prosprous country. Just imagine if we didn't send "mujahedeen" to fight soviets ? Who was behind all this , we were just proxies , US was the real "gainer" not us.

Putting in a nutshell , this article is rubbish bin worthy to its core.

At the bolded part-Thats right sir The Pakistani government is also to be blamed along with the US for that Soviet War.
 
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The preposterous belief of our policymakers that we defeated one superpower (the USSR) and we will defeat the remaining one has to be changed. This is going to sink the remaining part of the Islamic Republic.

Do the policy makers actually "believe" in that fairytale that it was Pakistan that defeated the USSR ?
 
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Look at it this way..The writer may be a gloated liberal.
But the fact remains..Many of these Madressa's, the religious parties that fund them.. the Hizbi guys..
they all believe that the defeat of the USSR was due to the spirit of Jihad.
Well, if one is go by that logic.. then perhaps they should also realize that when god was at their side, he did not rain down pellets from the sky on the Russians. he provided the Muj assistance through other means. Means such as weapons and monetary aid by the US.. weapons that came from stocks in Israel.. weapons that had "Jewish" tech. Did that make them any less effective as weapons in Jihad? NO
Did the Mujaheddin have any issue with taking those weapons then? NO
Would the Mujaheddin have defeated the USSR without international assistance? NO
Would the PAF have had equal success against the DRAAF and Soviet jets without the F-16's and Aim-9Ls?? NO.
(those implying the Taliban had anything to do with the USSR's defeat needs to go read history again, the Taliban were young kids when the conflict was being fought..and the older ones fought within the ranks of what was the Northern Alliance)

Now.. coming to the Pakistani choice in taking sides in the Afghan war.. well for starters, Pakistan was already famous as a US Pony.
India and USSR were close allies. And at that time.. there was a very real existential threat to Pakistan since the USSR was hungry for a port to the Arabian sea, and a war between India and Pakistan would have allowed both to mount an invasion and finish the "Pakistan problem(to the hawks anyway)" once and for all.
So the choice to side with the US, at that time .. looked the most beneficial.

All said and done.. we had a virtual divorce from the US in the 90's..
then comes 2001... and a dictator without holding any referendum on what was a crucial national decision, without consulting any party.. takes a unilateral decision to accommodate the US.
it might be argued that the US was bloodthirsty.. and therefore at the time to avoid having Pakistan become a target the decision had to be taken quick.
Yet.. even if siding with the US was selected, would it not have been prudent to consult the terms and conditions of the alliance on a national level??
No, that did not happen.. the concession were granted without question by the dictator and the result is the mess we are in today.

We cannot defeat the US, even if China decides to back us up with weapons and military hardware.
There is no vast border with China, moreover.. unlike the USSR.. China has massive trade with the US.
The military of the USSR was a lumbering behemoth.. the US however has a military blistering with the latest technology and hardware.
Something they demonstrated on may 2.
Will this EVER convince the delusional?? NO
They are products of an indoctrination pattern that seeks to empower the clergy into being supreme.
Thous shalt not question the Mullah. nor his logic... what he preaches is the word of god.
Guess where this idea came from??
Suddenly Micheal Moore isnt all fantastic conspiracies when it comes to pointing out his fundamental observation.
 
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We defeated the USSR, so shall we the US

Indeed and why not?

At the end of a rainbow is a pot of gold and lots of people who have chased that have grown rich!
 
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On this topic... please avoid ethnic issues.
stick to the subject matter.. instead of playing the racist harp.
 
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What if the Kashmir issue gets solved between India and Pakistan....do you think there will be still the same amount of hate towards India???
 
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What if the Kashmir issue gets solved between India and Pakistan....do you think there will be still the same amount of hate towards India???

Dont think so..
We wont need such a large army then..
the hate may end up being focused elsewhere.
 
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