Vietnam welcomes China's military development: Vietnamese defense official

[siegecrossbow]

This is the voice from a Vietnamese people:

- About the topic: it's not hard or it is very simple to understand the tactic in those political talk. Vietnam is doing what it needs to protect its own interest.

- To those Chinese friends out there:

+ Vietnam is smaller than China, yes. China has bigger army than Vietnam, yes. But can China win the war if they invade Vietnam, need to be reconsidered!

Because you think in a very simple way, bigger army -> victory. When invading a country, you need to think about the post-war effect. France invaded Vietnam, occupied it, but still lost the war.

One more thing, I know that many of you does not familiar with Vietnamese History, but I have this to say:

- War between Vietnam and China has been for THOUSANDs of years already. Vietnam was occupied for the 1st thousand year, then Vietnam claimed its own independence. China had been invading Vietnam for another thousand year, but still UNSUCCESSFUL. In one thousand of year in history, it just keeps like this:
-China invaded Viet and captured Viet -> Viet rebel -> fail -> rebels again -> Victory -> China retreated -> Plan to invade again.

So war between China and Viet is not the new thing, it happened for thousand years already. So we are not surprised if China invade us again.

Vietnam won the war against France, USA, China not in short time, but in long time. It means that Viet people keeps fighting until the last man standing. Yup, China can win the war in 1 year, but can it keep fighting for the next 30 years? Unless China is going to kill all people in Vietnam.

Why does Chinese people still think about invading Vietnam? Because those history is not taught in Chinese School.

In 1979, China invaded Vietnam north border one more time to "teach" Vietnamese a lesson because Vietnam beat the PolPot, who got aids from Chinese, in Cambodia. After months of fighting, and losing thousand of troops, China claimed "victory" and then retreat????

In the conclusion, I want to say this:
+ there is wrong in the way that new young Chinese think. They think that their country is big enough, army is strong enough. So they can do whatever they want, "smaller countries" should obey them in any mean. "Smaller countries" has no power compared to current Chinese supreme power.

I know that the top dogs in Chinese Government are smart enough to consider the issue carefully. They understand that "small countries" still has the power and strength which is not easy to beat down. Not like those new young Chinese, who has little or even none knowledge about history of war.

If you check the earlier threads no one talked about how China has invaded Vietnam in the past or potential Chinese invasions of Vietnam. We were only talking about how Vietnam (which I respect) is playing China against the U.S. in a game of geopolitics.

Why bring up the past conflicts?

 

[CardSharp]

nlnforever, it is poor form to copy and paste the same reply from one thread to another. We've already read what you posted on the other thread.

 

[nlnforever]

Because I read the whole topic with every posts and see some posts which tried to diminish Vietnam in any mean, even by saying that Vietnamese is cruel by killing its own people. How's about the civil war in China? In Civil War, you need to kill your own people.

I'm here not to try to prove that my country is better or China is a big bullier. But I cannot stand the way that many Chinese think how China has enough power to do whatever it wants.

I copy and paste some, not the whole, because some people might not look at the other thread. If you mind, you can skip it, no need to read it.

Please look at the new current Chinese claim @ the south sea. I can say:
+ Even the normal mental person can say there is something wrong in this.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

But I cannot stand the way that many Chinese think how China has enough power to do whatever it wants.

I do not think that China should be able to do whatever it wants.

Regarding the claims in the South China sea, those were due to historical reasons and Chinese artefacts that were found on those islands.

That said, I do think the claims in the South China sea do deserve to be looked over, and negotiated upon in a way that seems more geographically "fair" to other nations.

 

[CardSharp]

By your own 200 mile boundary, Vietnam has no claim on either the Parcels or Spratelys. So let's not pretend that we know everything here.

This is a complicated issue since boundaries are now being settled via geographical features like ocean shelves and these take time to demarcate.

Example UN geographical dispute report.
http://www.un.org/depts/los/nippon/...es/fellows_papers/mom_0506_cambodia_itlos.pdf

 

[no_name]

1 -China invaded Viet and captured Viet -> Viet rebel -> fail -> rebels again -> Victory -> China retreated -> Plan to invade again.


2 Vietnam won the war against France, USA, China not in short time, but in long time. It means that Viet people keeps fighting until the last man standing. Yup, China can win the war in 1 year, but can it keep fighting for the next 30 years? Unless China is going to kill all people in Vietnam.

3. I know that the top dogs in Chinese Government are smart enough to consider the issue carefully. They understand that "small countries" still has the power and strength which is not easy to beat down. Not like those new young Chinese, who has little or even none knowledge about history of war.

1. actually chinese history with ancient korea is like that too
2. China should never do what france did and what US is(was?) doing in Iraq

3. For example of an disasterous campaign, refer to the Sui-gogureo war:
Goguryeo?Sui Wars - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[CardSharp]

1. actually chinese history with ancient korea is like that too
2. China should never do what france did and what US is(was?) doing in Iraq

3. For example of an disasterous campaign, refer to the Sui-gogureo war:
Goguryeo?Sui Wars - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I'm not too convinced about the history in the wiki page you linked. It smacks too much of the modern Korean revisionism. (the same brand that says Koreans invented Chinese writing)

When Sui army had reached Salsu (thought to be present-day Chongchon River), the water was shallow. Eulji had already cut off the flow of water with a dam. When Sui army had half crossed the river, Eulji opened the dam, drowning many thousands of Sui soldiers. Goguryeo charged the remaining Sui army. The historical text records that Sui soldiers had to run almost 200 kilometers that day to escape death. The Battle of Salsu contributed to the massive overall casualty figure for Sui during the campaign. Emperor Yang crossed the Liao River to attack Goguryeo, initially, with 305,000 men. Only 2,700 returned

This sound too much like some Korean folklore than real history.

 

[huzihaidao12]

Because I read the whole topic with every posts and see some posts which tried to diminish Vietnam in any mean, even by saying that Vietnamese is cruel by killing its own people. How's about the civil war in China? In Civil War, you need to kill your own people.

I'm here not to try to prove that my country is better or China is a big bullier. But I cannot stand the way that many Chinese think how China has enough power to do whatever it wants.

I copy and paste some, not the whole, because some people might not look at the other thread. If you mind, you can skip it, no need to read it.

Please look at the new current Chinese claim @ the south sea. I can say:
+ Even the normal mental person can say there is something wrong in this.

I suggest you go to see Turkey and Greece, which is international norms.

 

[no_name]

You see if china claims what's shown on the map of south china sea, then it pretty much squeezes everyone out, not to mention that it will reduce other countries ability (or at least legitimacy) to surveilance their Hainan naval base

 

[Nomenclature]

Please look at the new current Chinese claim @ the south sea. I can say:
+ Even the normal mental person can say there is something wrong in this.

There's nothing 'new' about the current Chinese claim. We've been claiming the same area for over fifty years now.

 

[huzihaidao12]

The number of old debt for too long, really no need to struggle. Also if you really want to emphasize, I'll tell you a fact, in ancient times, when the Vietnamese powerful, aggression and bullying other Southeast Asian countries, even when the decline in China, some Chinese territory occupied, seized the opportunity to expand influence .This is no surprise, but I have to say, China and Vietnam's history, culture and border people's lives is the same origin, it would be to see a positive exchange of the two countries at the Millennium, after all, thousands of years of hatred is absurd.

By the way, welcome to the members of Vietnam to join the discussion, in fact I have some interest in Vietnam, you can introduce more and more the present situation in Vietnam?

 

[no_name]

I'm not too convinced about the history in the wiki page you linked. It smacks too much of the modern Korean revisionism. (the same brand that says Koreans invented Chinese writing)



This sound too much like some Korean folklore than real history.

Actually that sounded like what Han Hsin did during Chu-Han contention.

But the point I want to make was that the war pretty much directly led to the down fall of an empire.

Even had Sui needed to sent 30000 men expiditions ten times it would have achieved better than a single 300000men expedition.

 

[CardSharp]

I suggest you go to see Turkey and Greece, which is international norms.

Multiple choice test!

Cyprus is closer to

A) Turkey
B) Greece

*hint the answer starts with Tur and rhythms with Key

 

[huzihaidao12]

You see if china claims what's shown on the map of south china sea, then it pretty much squeezes everyone out, not to mention that it will reduce other countries ability (or at least legitimacy) to surveilance their Hainan naval base

International precedents, such as Turkey and Greece, which is in fact the demarcation of KMT in the international meeting, there is international recognition.

 

[huzihaidao12]

Multiple choice test!

Cyprus is closer to

A) Turkey
B) Greece

*hint the answer starts with Tur and rhythms with Key

Maritime boundaries, the ownership of some of the island.