Unconfirmed 9 Afghan Casualties at CHAMAN

[Pak Nationalist]

Unconfirmed reports of over 9 Afghan casualties in
Skirmish at Pak-Afghan International #Chaman border as Taliban border guards opened fired at Pakistani border force.
Afghan footsoldiers
trespassing tried to erect a post on Pakistani side upon which they were stopped by Pak

https://twitter.com/x/status/1496833860868481026

@Areesh @PakNationalist @Menace2Society @PakSarZameen47

Are the casualties Taliban casualties or civilian casualties? As our leaders subside imports from Afghanistan, this is how the new regime in Kabul repays us. History tells that Afghans never understand the language of appeasement or decency. They require to be put in their place (48, early 60's) before they begin behaving properly/as per their station. However, we are already stretched thin with the entire Western flank burning from the North to the South.

yes and they are flying high thinking they defeated the world, while every country that was fighting in Afghanistan flourish and prosper Afghanistan was/is/will be in ruins but hey Taliban are victorious right? they are delusional and I am pretty sure that they are high on the hashish as well, many ANA members defected and surrendered to Taliban, reenlisted as Talibs are going to fight Pakistan, same cause different banner.

Let go of this delusion. The talib footsoldier hates Pakistan with even greater tenacity than the ANA uniform wearing salaried soldier did in the days of ISAF propped regime in Kabul. These are not ANA recruits posing as Taliban, THESE ARE TALIBAN. Disabuse yourself from this notion that there is any such thing as a goodTaliban. Liberals might not have been right about many things, but they were right as hell on this one.

 

[NaqsheYaar]

More like the Kandahari Faction are trying to show it's importance through these stunts when the Haqqanis are the One Controlling Kabul and all the important Ministeries. Pakistan knows where to place the right card at the right time.

Only you seem to know the reality of the situation, others are just blabbering..

 

[Riz]

No need to bring in your phobia about General Zia in every thread

why ? He was the very first who smelled the American dollars long ago

 

[Mr.Green]

It seems that there is going to be low level conflict along the border with Afghanistan. India has sent wheat to them via Pakistan while Imran Khan has cancelled 50,000 tons of wheat aid to them.

 

[araz]

I think we need to calm down. Whether we like it or not the Afghans are our brothers. This is not something Iam saying but merely repeating the commands of my Hadi SAW.
There are a number of complexities afflicting the Afghan setup. They have never been a cohesive force and execution of the orders of a Central command have proven to be difficult. There is lack of education and understanding of the basic problems and norms of international relationing. There is a tendency of local commander to get enamoured by the desires of the people within their group as the cohort retains its strength by keeping the majority happy.
They are also frustrated by lack of resources with possibly hungry families and all forms of livelihood being constrained.
The problem is multifactorial and needs tactful handling. There 2ill be a need for repeated reminders, some cajoling and morale boosting and a bit of dreesing down when required. The balance between the three is paramount to our successful execution of our vision of management of this very tricky situation.
A

 

[Areesh]

why ? He was the very first who smelled the American dollars long ago

He did what was needed to be done at that time

 

[Riz]

He did what was needed to be done at that time

And musharraf did his best and it was the need of time, then zardari did his best, then nawazu did its best , it was zia who thrown us into afghn mess from where we never able to get out until today

 

[Menace2Society]

So does musharraf did his best and it was the need of time, then zardari did his best, then nawazu did its best , it was zia who thrown us into afghn mess from where we never able to get out until today

Agreed. He over committed. Pakistan was still blue pilled back then and believed in "ummah brotherhood" and now it realises the truth of the world, there is no such alliance and majority are machiavellian. It has always been this way since the beginning of history, there is no utopia.

The five eyes is a relationship based on ethnicity and they are consciously evolved enough to collaborate from corners of the world. In most parts of the world even neighbors struggle to work together, that's how far behind you are

If he wanted to make it work then Pakistan should have merged with Afg as soon as the soviets left and made a play for integration of rest of the stans to form a giga central asian bloc with Pakistan being the South Asian tip and cultural and military epicenter.

 

[Areesh]

So does musharraf did his best and it was the need of time, then zardari did his best, then nawazu did its best , it was zia who thrown us into afghn mess from where we never able to get out until today

Zia didn't ask Soviets' to come and invade Afghanistan. With Soviets in Afghanistan, Pakistan had no choice but to get involved in Afghanistan

If he wanted to make it work then Pakistan should have merged with Afg as soon as the soviets left and made a play for integration of rest of the stans to form a giga central asian bloc with Pakistan being the South Asian tip and cultural and military epicenter.

 

[One_Nation]

I see a pattern that those located outside of Pakistan are calling for using military on Afghanistan all the time and repeatedly reminding us how much Afghans hate Pakistan promoting a message that doesn't need to be promoted.

Is it because they feel safe where they are?

Afghan hatred is not just for Pakistan. They hate each other in the same manner. They will attack Iranians, Indians, Chinese in the same manner if their paths are crossed. This is what backward cultures do.
Just look at how many Americans they have killed who many Afghans claimed to love.

Pakistan has tools to deal with these Gengis Khan's blood carrying barbarians which will work slowly over time. It is wrong to say Pakistan has no choice. There are plenty of options available when dealing with a herd of animals if you are smart enough.

 

[Colonel_Hardstone]

I think we need to calm down. Whether we like it or not the Afghans are our brothers. This is not something Iam saying but merely repeating the commands of my Hadi SAW.
There are a number of complexities afflicting the Afghan setup. They have never been a cohesive force and execution of the orders of a Central command have proven to be difficult. There is lack of education and understanding of the basic problems and norms of international relationing. There is a tendency of local commander to get enamoured by the desires of the people within their group as the cohort retains its strength by keeping the majority happy.
They are also frustrated by lack of resources with possibly hungry families and all forms of livelihood being constrained.
The problem is multifactorial and needs tactful handling. There 2ill be a need for repeated reminders, some cajoling and morale boosting and a bit of dreesing down when required. The balance between the three is paramount to our successful execution of our vision of management of this very tricky situation.
A

Golden words.


Having state of the art American equipment does not create discipline and culture of following chain of command in a 'militia'. That's what Taliban effectively are, a 'militia'. Pakistan military on the other hand are a cohesive/disciplined force which are well trained.

The field commander took the decision to open fire and I am fine with it. What is done is done.

Now, its time for behind the scene diplomacy and realpolitik. We don't want a 'Hot Western Border' and don't want to divert our attention away from the 'Eastern Border'. Time to dispatch capable personnel to Afghanistan and talk this through. Incidents like this will flair up because we are dealing with 'impulsive hot-headed militia-men' but we better develop a political plan on how to deal with these issues.

Taliban need Pakistan and we are Brothers. I know the feelings of a large number of Afghans (in Afghanistan and diaspora) but this is what diplomacy and realpolitik is all about...We need to deal with the cards which we have been dealt with.

In the future, we need to ensure that there is balance and tact before the military response.

India would want nothing more then a 'Hot Western Border' for Pakistan to sink resources into!

 

[KaiserX]

I see a pattern that those located outside of Pakistan are calling for using military on Afghanistan all the time and repeatedly reminding us how much Afghans hate Pakistan promoting a message that doesn't need to be promoted.

Is it because they feel safe where they are?

Afghan hatred is not just for Pakistan. They hate each other in the same manner. They will attack Iranians, Indians, Chinese in the same manner if their paths are crossed. This is what backward cultures do.
Just look at how many Americans they have killed who many Afghans claimed to love.

Pakistan has tools to deal with these Gengis Khan's blood carrying barbarians which will work slowly over time. It is wrong to say Pakistan has no choice. There are plenty of options available when dealing with a herd of animals if you are smart enough.

Oh shuttup I dont care about India, Iran I care about the afghan hatred of Pakistan and their expansionist aims. The afghans have killed far more people in Pak than the US/Iran/India. Thats a fact.

There is only 1 way to deal with Afghans/Talibs I have laid it out clearly in a previous post. Each and every nationalistic PDFer should promote the ideas behind this post. We are lucky that we have influential/key members with strong connections. Intelligent posts on this forum are keenly read by PEOPLE WHO ACTUALLY MATTER. If even 10% of the members on this forum united and promoted such though on this forum and other OSINT sources then we will see a strong move by Army leadership/ISI. If people like you or other pakistanis have such love for these barbarians then please do us a favor and move to taliban infested afghanistan as soon as possible and save us the 3rd internal front. I love freedom, that is why my family chose pakistan.

For these terrorist we need precision strikes utilizing a combination of UAVs, Surface-Surface missiles, and Fighter jets equipped with precision targetting pods that we have amply available. All these options should be backed by SSG/army raids into afghanistan territories. The military measures will be taken alongside a parallel diplomatic course to convince the IAE to take action against TTP/BLA.

At the same time all of these options would entail a definate loss of life and equipment on our side which we should be prepared for before hand. At the end of the day even if we lose a few dozen tanks, a few jets, and hundreds of men we would save ourselfs from decades of terror that we have suffered the last few decades from continuing into the next few decades.

It should follow an escalation ladder. Week 1 We start off with UAV strikes via Shahpurs/TB2s/CH4s and minor incursions 30-40km into the border. A few dozen key terrorist TTP/BLA leaders from kunar to balochistan will be targetted in unison. Keep the terrorist on their toes.

If that does not stop the problem within a few weeks and we continue taking losses we should escalate to launching surface to surface missiles and airstrikes. Week 2 would entail at least 126 strikes on key TTP/BLA targets representing the number of students lost in peshawer at army school. If the IAE military elements are found at TTP bases they too shall not be spared and should be targetted by fighter jets. This should continue to be supported by SSG raids into afghanistan. This should be carried on for a period of 1 week simultaneously to not give terrorist a chance to think.

If the secondary escalation ladder does not work then we utilize the final option which would be to effectively change elements of the taliban regime in power that are anti-pakistan. Many here do not understand that the Taliban is not a unified force and has many factions. Some of these factions are pro-pak and some are anti-pak. We may have no choice but to strike kabul and take out those in leadership that are anti-pak and replace them with pro-pak leaders.

For this on week 3 Pak would inititate a No Fly Zone over all of Afghanistan to bring international attention to this issue. Close all border crossings into afghanistan including trade, commerce, travel, etc... Economically strangulate the Taliban terrorist while launching simultanious air strikes across afghanistan. The UN would be convened and a final diplomatic push will take place while Pak masses forces to its western border.

The initial strikes would start off with the PDF using baburs/fatehs/shaheen 1B to target powerplants, communication centers, IAE military command centers, and air bases.The airforce would shoot down any IAE air asset that challenges PAFs air presence. Within a few days the all IAE air bases are levelled with all eqquipment destroyed.

Simultaneously PDF would have to dedicate a mechanized armoured divison consisting of 80k troops, 2k SSG, 300 tanks/1000 IFV/200 MRAP backed by UAVS/Mirages/JF17s/J10C/F16s. Incurisions will take place at 4-5 different points accross the border. The IAE would never be able to mass so much firepower in so many place at once. PDF would be able to break through enemy gaps, encircle the enemy, inflict mass damage. While the breakthrough occurs in 2-3 different place. The key force would be a SSG battalion backed by an al-khalid tank brigade and Hamza IFV battalion that would continue onwards and mount a surprise and deep incursion into Kabul itself.

SSG comandos will themselves be dressed in the uniforms of the Bhadri 313 to sow confusion and infiltrate their ranks while delivering the final fatal blow which would be the assasinate/arrest of anti-pak taliban terrorist and replacing them internally with a new regime. As soon as mission is accomplished PDF would retreat back into Pak territories. ANytime during the conflict IAE forces could surrender unconditionally and PDF could retreat. Either way Pakistan would prove its resolve and the IAE would understand that the cost of using its territory against pak would be way to risky due to us targetting their national infrastructure in retaliation.

We have the capabilities in place and have invested billions over decades to go this route but lack the political will to do so.

As of now we are on stage 0.5 of this where army leadership and pakistani people are becoming aware of the talibs evil desire. The end result if you ask me would be

1. To raise the cost so signficantly that the talibs will never dare to do another panga with pakistan again.
2. To effectively remove anti-pakistan elements of the taliban from power

 

[TheSolution]

I see a pattern that those located outside of Pakistan are calling for using military on Afghanistan all the time and repeatedly reminding us how much Afghans hate Pakistan promoting a message that doesn't need to be promoted.

Is it because they feel safe where they are?

Afghan hatred is not just for Pakistan. They hate each other in the same manner. They will attack Iranians, Indians, Chinese in the same manner if their paths are crossed. This is what backward cultures do.
Just look at how many Americans they have killed who many Afghans claimed to love.

Pakistan has tools to deal with these Gengis Khan's blood carrying barbarians which will work slowly over time. It is wrong to say Pakistan has no choice. There are plenty of options available when dealing with a herd of animals if you are smart enough.

Then the pattern you see is wrong;

You clearly haven't seen what Pakistani citizens have to say about Afghans, especially the ones residing in their country causing trouble.

Secondly, you're wrong again, Afghan hatred certainly is just for Pakistan (and Punjabis). Of course if their paths cross they'll go to war against anyone, that literally applies for every country against every other. Even Pakistan and China would go to war if something necessitated it.

But the hatred of Afghans is focused exclusively at Pakistan, for the most part. Not anyone else. Don't be ignorant. There are video recordings of them saying they are more happy to fight against Pakistan than the Jews. They equate Pakistan to Israel. This is a common sentiment. They prefer India over Pakistan, again a common sentiment. Some also support India in Kashmir.

I think we need to calm down. Whether we like it or not the Afghans are our brothers.

Say this to one of them in real life

Whether you like it or not, the Afghans despise you to their core and consider you akin to Israel and filth.

 

[ummarz]

Hating on a whole group of people is no different than what some very vocal Afghans do. But that doesn't mean that all Afghans are like that. When you are calling for genocide of a whole group of people, you are automatically wrong. Why let your self get all upset about a few who want to take over Punjab. Can they do that? Will you not fight back? Besides the dumb foot soldiers in the video don't know that those they are fighting are Pathans themselves on the Pak side. In case anybody needs a reminder, most Pathans live on the Pakistani side. If any Pathan/Punjabi believe that they are racially superior then they are stupid and going against Islam. If we look at both of our nations, if we were so superior wouldn't we be somewhere by now in the world. The rest of the world is so far ahead of us.

Our subcontinent is suffering from mental health problems that come from war. It is the reason for cultural narcissism, or sometimes known as generational trauma. India and Pakistan seem to be slowly healing, and acknowledging this problem. Where as for Afghanistan its a long journey ahead.

Last point is that India would want nothing more than for Pakistan to get embroiled on the western front like it has been with China. They are trying their very best for this to happen. Please lets not make it happen.

 

[KaiserX]

Hating on a whole group of people is no different than what some very vocal Afghans do. But that doesn't mean that all Afghans are like that. When you are calling for genocide of a whole group of people, you are automatically wrong. Why let your self get all upset about a few who want to take over Punjab. Can they do that? Will you not fight back? Besides the dumb foot soldiers in the video don't know that those they are fighting are Pathans themselves on the Pak side. In case anybody needs a reminder, most Pathans live on the Pakistani side. If any Pathan/Punjabi believe that they are racially superior than they are stupid and going against Islam. If we look at both of our nations, if we were so superior wouldn't we be somewhere by now in the world. The rest of the world is so far ahead of us.

Our subcontinent is suffering from mental health problems that come from war. It is the reason for cultural narcissism, or sometimes known as generational trauma. India and Pakistan seem to be slowly healing, and acknowledging this problem. Where as for Afghanistan its a long journey ahead.

Last point is that India would want nothing more than for Pakistan to get embroiled on the western front like it has been with China. They are trying their very best for this to happen. Please lets not make it happen.

No Pakistani on this forum has advocated for genocide against afghans. You bought up a none-issue to make a useless point. Please point out where anyone wanted to kill innocent afghans. This is all about taking care of TERRORIST IEA/TTP/BLA elements using precision and surgical means to do so.

All nations should focus on themselves. unfortunately afghanistan has became a major cancer on our side that will have to be delt with at some point militarily no matter what. There will be a course correction.