UAE Mirage to PAF and SH to IAF Extract

[mean_bird]

Why PAF did not opt for Mirage-2000 in 1990's - some explanation that I found

There is just one explanation---Where do you think Zardari got the nickname, Mr. 10%?

When i asked my contact about this "focus interference system", he gave me a meaningful smile.

I think this is what you are talking about.

04's EW suite also has a ECM pod. It and the ECM on the tail provide joint work. ECM current uses traidtional infrared something? modern missile's countermeasure to this is getting stronger each day. To let this simple and cheap ECM achieve high efficiency shows system's level, RWR, MPR and such. This system is only equipped by rafale and F-22. F-18E/F and F-16E/F needs upgrade to have this. 04 should also have ECM inside of fighter. It uses modern ECM technology and uses precise tracking system. Can achieve the affect of large ECM machine with small equipment. This ECM is most modern active guided AAM. It can also counter gither radar lock and scan. It's mainly for PAF's enemy IAF's R-77 missiles.

Basically, from what I understood from this statement, because of its integration of various ECM measures, it can identify potential threats and focus on that. Thus even with a smaller engine and less power, by focusing on the target, it can have the same effect as a large equipment would have.

 

[Kharian_Beast]

Would be an excellent choice for many air forces that I can think. For PAF it would be long overdue and many can argue it makes no sense anymore, but in reality the whole thing is sweetened with the dash 9 standard being part of the picture. I am sure the hours on the airframes are not an issue and neither should their condition really be in doubt. UAE has around 60-9 standard aircraft as of now. I'm pretty sure they aren't too inclined on parting with them though in any case.

Ground attack is excellent, and A2A combat is excellent as well, enough to pit it against air superiority fighters confidently or to deliver nuclear ALCM's in dense environments, etc.

However if an upgrade package is being offered for a plane that many say rivals an F-16 A (with all their scholarly work done as evidence pssh yeah) then the Thunder will eventually fill this role and the money would be better spent upgrading the infantry in terms of small arms, wheeled and tracked infantry fighting vehicles and a proper full coverage air defense network. Where the money will be coming from is a question and a half in itself, so I guess both scenarios are flawed.

 

[ice_man]

Why PAF did not opt for Mirage-2000 in 1990's - some explanation that I found

After the re-evaluation of Mirage-2000 in the early 90s, it was deduced that Mirage-2000 is a state of the art, deep strike fighter with BVR technology, but in turning dogfights at medium and low altitudes it was out-manoeuvred by an F-16A.

Hi,

Sonic---thankyou good buddy---you proved my point---paf had no threat from the F 16---iaf couldnot have acquired it at all---so if paf had become m2k buyer from the gitgo---iaf would have only been stuck with russian aircraft.

Secondly---there are some videos on u tube showing grrek m2k's and F 16's---and check out the speed of he encounter---around 200 knots to 350 knots---the F 16 couldn't get away.

it was said that the delta wing used to bleed air speed in a turning fight...however, this was the case in the old mirage IIIs & Vs....however, with the introduction of FBW on the mirage 2000's it was no more an issue. so it was a major mistake by the PAF to ignore the Mirages back then!


however, another major issue why even considering the UAE mirages is a dream to far for our PAF is becasue as i posted earlier:

In the course of development, 2 key issues came up with respect to the F-16 Block 60. One was the familiar issue of source code control for key avionics and electronic warfare systems. The other was weapons carriage.

As a rule, the software source codes that program the electronic-warfare, radar, and data buses on US fighters are too sensitive for export. Instead, the USA sent the UAE “object codes” (similar to APIs), which allow them to add to the F-16’s threat library on their own.

The other issue concerned the Black Shahine derivative of MBDA’s Storm Shadow stealth cruise missile. The Missile Technology Control Regime (MTCR) defines 300 km as the current limit for cruise missiles, and the terms of the sale allow the United States to regulate which weapons the F-16s can carry. Since the Black Shahine was deemed to have a range of over 300km, the US State Department refused to let Lockheed Martin change the data bus to permit the F-16E/Fs to carry the missile. It is believed that the Mirage 2000v9 upgrades the UAE has purchased from France will address this issue, giving the UAE a platform capable of handling their new acquisition.

http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/the-uaes-f-16-block-60-desert-falcon-fleet-04538/


this link clearly tells us that currently the only platform CAPABLE in the UAE Airforce of carrying a cruise missile is the MIRAGE 2000-9 no way would they give it away for any price!

 

[hembo]

Going through this long and very interesting thread something interesting comes to my mind. To pile up to Mastan Sir's anguish, an Indian Evil Defense strategy, at this interesting hour, could be (Just a very rare evil thought on my part),

1. Buy those M2Ks from UAE asap to prevent PAF to even ponder on the possibility.

2. 126 MMRCA deal: forget all evaluations, just go for F-18 SH with a under the table deal with the US that they have to scrape the F-16 Blk60 to Pakistan deal, under any pretext. Be it Pakistan not doing enough on the WOT by not going after the Haqanis or shooting down one of its own Drones and then blaming it on Pakistan. India can later compensate them the cost of the drone. In fact go for the naval F-35s as well!!



P.S.: Please mind my signature. I still stand by it and will do so for all my life.

 

[jha]

Going through this long and very interesting thread something interesting comes to my mind. To pile up to Mastan Sir's anguish, an Indian Evil Defense strategy, at this interesting hour, could be (Just a very rare evil thought on my part),

1. Buy those M2Ks from UAE asap to prevent PAF to even ponder on the possibility.

2. 126 MMRCA deal: forget all evaluations, just go for F-18 SH with a under the table deal with the US that they have to scrape the F-16 Blk60 to Pakistan deal, under any pretext. Be it Pakistan not doing enough on the WOT by not going after the Haqanis or shooting down one of its own Drones and then blaming it on Pakistan. India can later compensate them the cost of the drone. In fact go for the naval F-35s as well!!



P.S.: Please mind my signature. I still stand by it and will do so for all my life.

hahahaha really evil thought....

 

[Luftwaffe]

ice_man UAE has shown interest in Rafale if the deal takes place Rafale would be the one to carry black shaheen...is there any immediate threat to UAE? i guess not unlike Pakistan UAE can get what they intend and want when ever they're are promised from F-16s to if Rafale becomes a choice in time so i can still hope UAE -9 can land in Pakistan in time if ever PAF gives a chance to it..

 

[MZUBAIR]

One thing good about JF-17 engine is that Pakistan can get its spares from Poland , Czech and other eastern European nations if not directly from Russia .

No need to goto Poland......China will surely support us.

At the moment we need to midgy JF-17 frame for Block II, which I hope in progress.

Wt JF-17 needs?

Batter Engine---that give it more thrust, speed, increase pay load, and increase flying hours.

Batter Radar------ Probabily AESA or some other capable that can track, scan, detect and fire from more then 180/200 KM.

Hard points 9 or 11.

Advance Missiles required.
Air to Air
Air to Ground
Air to Sea (Harpoon etc)

 

[SBD-3]

No need to goto Poland......China will surely support us.

At the moment we need to midgy JF-17 frame for Block II, which I hope in progress.

Wt JF-17 needs?

Batter Engine---that give it more thrust, speed, increase pay load, and increase flying hours.

Batter Radar------ Probabily AESA or some other capable that can track, scan, detect and fire from more then 180/200 KM.

Hard points 9 or 11.

Advance Missiles required.
Air to Air
Air to Ground
Air to Sea (Harpoon etc)

do you want it to be a strike fighter??????......JF program was envisaged for an economical close support fighter....not a strike fighter anyway......I think JF-II will be the same thing with changes in Avionics and waponary only......I believe JF-III will feature the major changes both in airframe and tech will be in the class of medium class fighter.....capable for strike missions

 

[MZUBAIR]

do you want it to be a strike fighter??????......JF program was envisaged for an economical close support fighter....not a strike fighter anyway......I think JF-II will be the same thing with changes in Avionics and waponary only......I believe JF-III will feature the major changes both in airframe and tech will be in the class of medium class fighter.....capable for strike missions

So wt did I said, I was also saying abt Block II

 

[SBD-3]

So wt did I said, I was also saying abt Block II

but I am talking about BL III

 

[M.ASIF AMIN]

Hello all
good news but its not favour to PAF . one mirage 2000 opretional cost is five time more with F-16. India, Egypt, Peru, Greece, and UAE have no any aditional plane for mirage aircraft, all airfirces want replace with other including india. plus mirage's equiptment & spare part so expensive, PAF want all mirage & Rafale EW - avionics systems apply in JF-17 , our JF-17 already an Gripen/ mirage 2000
you will see our bird make top 10 best aircraft in the world .. K-8 example you have many nation replace there trainer (including HAWK) with K-8

 

[SBD-3]

Hello all
good news but its not favour to PAF . one mirage 2000 opretional cost is five time more with F-16. India, Egypt, Peru, Greece, and UAE have no any aditional plane for mirage aircraft, all airfirces want replace with other including india. plus mirage's equiptment & spare part so expensive, PAF want all mirage & Rafale EW - avionics systems apply in JF-17 , our JF-17 already an Gripen/ mirage 2000
you will see our bird make top 10 best aircraft in the world .. K-8 example you have many nation replace there trainer (including HAWK) with K-8

hehehehehehehehehehe.........Grippen is F-16 E now

 

[Super Falcon]

UAE is reliable and time tested friend of pakistan in pakistan's economy development uae and its leadership played a major role not only investing in major sectors of pakistan but also helped pakistan financially in defence and im sure H.H Sheikh KHLIFABIN ZAYED President of UAE H.H Sheikh MOHAMMAD BIN ZAYED CHIEF of UAE Airforce H.H Sheikh MOHAMMAD BIN RASHID Prime Minister of UAE and Chief of armed forces comtinue to help pakistan and Mirages are without their will ness impossible we should all be thankfull to them and their great leadership who every year continue to help palistan's gdp with our workers live their they send money to pakistan in billions im thank full to UAE and its all rulers and leaderships

 

[SBD-3]

UAE is reliable and time tested friend of pakistan in pakistan's economy development uae and its leadership played a major role not only investing in major sectors of pakistan but also helped pakistan financially in defence and im sure H.H Sheikh KHLIFABIN ZAYED President of UAE H.H Sheikh MOHAMMAD BIN ZAYED CHIEF of UAE Airforce H.H Sheikh MOHAMMAD BIN RASHID Prime Minister of UAE and Chief of armed forces comtinue to help pakistan and Mirages are without their will ness impossible we should all be thankfull to them and their great leadership who every year continue to help palistan's gdp with our workers live their they send money to pakistan in billions im thank full to UAE and its all rulers and leaderships

But we must know that today the business prevails.....nothing much like "brotherhood" stuff remains............A cup of tea is a cup of tea and a business is a business......I have no doubts about the goodwill of UAE but we should not be over optimistic....to be honest

 

[ice_man]

UAE is reliable and time tested friend of pakistan in pakistan's economy development uae and its leadership played a major role not only investing in major sectors of pakistan but also helped pakistan financially in defence and im sure H.H Sheikh KHLIFABIN ZAYED President of UAE H.H Sheikh MOHAMMAD BIN ZAYED CHIEF of UAE Airforce H.H Sheikh MOHAMMAD BIN RASHID Prime Minister of UAE and Chief of armed forces comtinue to help pakistan and Mirages are without their will ness impossible we should all be thankfull to them and their great leadership who every year continue to help palistan's gdp with our workers live their they send money to pakistan in billions im thank full to UAE and its all rulers and leaderships

you will be very wrong if you really believe what you wrote. Gawadar hasn't been developed because of the people you mentioned.