Turkiye will totally change the rules of game in region: TF-X MMU Stealth Fighter

[leviathan]

LOL After China test F31 and J20, a lot of countries start to make a 5th generation fighter. Here is the club member list! A warm welcome to Turkey to officially join the 5th generation fighter creation club!
#1 ATD-X
At the beginning of the twenty-first century, Japan, seeking to replace its aging fleet of fighter aircraft, began making overtures to the United States on the topic of purchasing several Lockheed Martin F-22 Raptor fighters.
20 Years LATER: a test plane only had 34 test fly and retired.

#2 IAIO_Qaher-313
The IAIO Qaher-313 (Persian: قاهر-۳۱۳; also Ghaher-313, Conqueror (Tamer)-313, Q-313, F-313) is a planned Iranian single-seat stealth fighter aircraft that was publicly announced on 1 February 2013.
5 Years LATER: A thing that cant off the ground.

#3 HAL AMCA
In October 2008, the Indian Air Force asked the ADA to prepare a detailed project report on the development of an MCA incorporating stealth features
10Years LATER: a 500$ plastic model

#4KAI_KF-X
The project was first announced in March 2001 by South Korean President Kim Dae-Jung at a graduation ceremony at the Korea Air Force Academy.South Korea and Indonesia agreed to cooperate in the production of KF-X/IF-X warplanes in Seoul on July 15, 2010, agreeing to produce roughly 150 to 200 aircraft, of which Indonesia would procure 50.
10Years LATER: 5$ CGI art

#5 Flygsystem_2020
In 2012, Lieutenant Colonel Lars Helmrich of the Swedish Air Force asked members of the Riksdag to consider the development of a new jet fighter or to upgrade all present JAS 39 multirole fighters to the NG model, claiming the early versions of the aircraft will be useless by 2020.
6Years LATER: 50 Mins PPT slide

#6 TAI TF-X
During Theresa May's visit to Turkey in January 2017, BAE and TAI officials signed an agreement, worth about £100 million, for BAE to provide engineering assistance in developing the aircraft.

 

[Nike]

@Indos

Turkey is clearly far ahead of Indonesia in avionics and missiles and so Indonesia would have nothing to offer in this area.

The only area that it is at a similar level to Turkey is in airframe tech. Indonesia has more design experience for large aircraft while Turkey has more experience in UAVs and licence production of fighters like the F-16 where it built from scratch 80% of the airframe components like aft center fuselages and wings.

For Turkey to succeed in building a competitive 5th generation fighter it needs to go with a world-class company like BAe that has ample design and systems integration experience. This way Turkey will be learning from the very best and so can then truly go it alone for it's next fighter after TF-X.

No offence but Indonesia is nowhere near at a level where it can contribute significantly in making a competitive jet that comes into service in 2029.

Says a Bengal whose country is insignificant in any field, especially aviation industry which is zilch or zero.

Indonesia had active smart bombs program (JDAMS like)

ground attack missiles (maverick reverse engineering), Air launched C705(in cooperation with China) and AA missiles (sidewinder reverse engineering)

 

[HRK]

(maverick reverse engineering)

(sidewinder reverse engineering)

plz share the detail of these mention Indonesian weapons and I also US did not make any sort of objection to this RE ....??

 

[MMM-E]

Says a Bengal whose country is insignificant in any field, especially aviation industry which is zilch or zero.

Indonesia had active smart bombs program (JDAMS like) View attachment 505881 View attachment 505882 View attachment 505883 ground attack missiles (maverick reverse engineering), Air launched C705(in cooperation with China) and AA missiles (sidewinder reverse engineering)

Yes he is right
Turkey is far ahead of Indonesia in avionics , eletronics and missiles


-- 65 km BOZDOGAN ( solid-state RF seeker, with advanced counter-measure capability and datalink update )
-- 25 km GOKDOGAN ( a high resolution dual colour imaging infra-red seeker, with a comprehensive off-boresight capability, along with advanced counter-measures )

SOM air launched Cruise Missile

-- precision strike capability against both land or sea targets
-- network enabled capability ( only a few country in the world )
-- Stealthy and precise
-- Terrain hugging and Sea skimming
-- Imaging Infrared Seeker
-- INS / GPS
-- Terrain Referenced Navigation
-- Image Based Navigation
-- Automatic Target Recognition
-- mach 0,94 speed
-- SOM-1 : 300 km range ... SOM-2 : 800 km

LGK Laser guided Bomb

MK-82,MK-84
Range : 12 km
Guidance : Laser

HGK

MK-82,MK-83,MK-84
Range : 28 km
Guidance : INS - GPS

KGK

MK-82,MK-83
Range : 111 km
Guidance : INS - GPS

TEBER

MK-81,MK-82
Range : 28 km
Guidance : INS - GPS - Laser
CEP : 3m

NEB Penetrator Bomb

the first concrete penetrator system developed in Turkey
NEB can be used with High Precision Guidance Kit with MK-84

Underground Petrochemical Depots
Bunkers
Aircraft Shelters
Command/Control Centers
Surface Targets

Aircraft Runways
Dams
Bridges
Critical buildings
Area Targets

Radar Antennas
Stationary Air Defense Missile Sites
Industrial Facilities
Parked Aircrafts

Aselsan ASELPOD Targeting Pod

Aselsan MEHPOD Jamming Pod

SPEWS II self-protection electronic warfare suite

and Aselsan develops GaN based AESA Radar and Roketsan develops AKBABA anti radiotion Missile

 

[Cybernetics]

LOL After China test F31 and J20, a lot of countries start to make a 5th generation fighter. Here is the club member list! A warm welcome to Turkey to officially join the 5th generation fighter creation club!
#1 ATD-X
At the beginning of the twenty-first century, Japan, seeking to replace its aging fleet of fighter aircraft, began making overtures to the United States on the topic of purchasing several Lockheed Martin F-22 Raptor fighters.
20 Years LATER: a test plane only had 34 test fly and retired.

#2 IAIO_Qaher-313
The IAIO Qaher-313 (Persian: قاهر-۳۱۳; also Ghaher-313, Conqueror (Tamer)-313, Q-313, F-313) is a planned Iranian single-seat stealth fighter aircraft that was publicly announced on 1 February 2013.
5 Years LATER: A thing that cant off the ground.

#3 HAL AMCA
In October 2008, the Indian Air Force asked the ADA to prepare a detailed project report on the development of an MCA incorporating stealth features
10Years LATER: a 500$ plastic model

#4KAI_KF-X
The project was first announced in March 2001 by South Korean President Kim Dae-Jung at a graduation ceremony at the Korea Air Force Academy.South Korea and Indonesia agreed to cooperate in the production of KF-X/IF-X warplanes in Seoul on July 15, 2010, agreeing to produce roughly 150 to 200 aircraft, of which Indonesia would procure 50.
10Years LATER: 5$ CGI art

#5 Flygsystem_2020
In 2012, Lieutenant Colonel Lars Helmrich of the Swedish Air Force asked members of the Riksdag to consider the development of a new jet fighter or to upgrade all present JAS 39 multirole fighters to the NG model, claiming the early versions of the aircraft will be useless by 2020.
6Years LATER: 50 Mins PPT slide

#6 TAI TF-X
During Theresa May's visit to Turkey in January 2017, BAE and TAI officials signed an agreement, worth about £100 million, for BAE to provide engineering assistance in developing the aircraft.

China's entry into 5th gen fighters changes the calculations for other nations. For Japan it is looking to counter China's and Russia's Airforce capabilities. South Korea needs to counter Japan and China's capabilities.

Other than the direct countering of Chinese capabilities, the entry of China's 5th gen fighter for the export market has the potential of being in the hands of different nations' adversaries. 5th gen fighters will no longer just be within the hands of NATO and associate allies.

Another factor is the change it brings to the export market. With an upgrade in generation, the competitiveness of 4th generation products gets eroded. To preserve marketshare and profits, these nations are compelled to develop and sell 5th generation products as well.

Many of these 5th generation planes began development relatively late and will take some time before a true 5th gen product enters service. First block of KF-X for example was not designed with internal weapons bay but rather a recessed missile holding section. Incremental development makes the leap easier, 5th generation is a major leap in aerospace technology. China on the other hand began the J-XX program during the late 1990s. No one at the time knew China was developing a 5th generation fighter, it was still thought to be very poor and technologically backwards, thus there wasn't any public information to react to and compel some nations to develop their own 5th generation fighter.

Both Russia and China's 5th gen programs are pushing global 5th gen fighter proliferation, of course the US initiated it.

 

[UzaySan]

why did this thread become a dick measuring contest?

 

[Indos]

@UKBengali @Marine Rouge

RX 750 LAPAN

Cruise Missile

 

[UKBengali]

This is that should be cautious, BAe is a British company, BAe seeks profit and I am not sure that BAe will use 100% of its expertise to help Turkey sincerely. Indonesian hire some foreigner for N 250 plane and the plane prove to have more weight than it should be. Now we use 100 % Indonesian to design N 219.

Beside that BAe hasnt got any experience in STEALTH design.

Good post on the whole.

Yes, BAe will obviously not teach Turkey everything they know but working with them will produce a better aircraft than Turkey trying it alone or working with Indonesia.

Totally disagree that BAe has no stealth experience as it has been heavily involved in F-35(only Tier 1 partner) and is developing Taranis stealth UAV since 2010. Also BAe has started the design for the UK's own Tempest stealth fighter.

BAe Taranis

 

[Indos]

Good post on the whole.

Yes, BAe will obviously not teach Turkey everything they know but working with them will produce a better aircraft than Turkey trying it alone or working with Indonesia.

Totally disagree that BAe has no stealth experience as it has been heavily involved in F-35(only Tier 1 partner) and is developing Taranis stealth UAV since 2010. Also BAe has started the design for the UK's own Tempest stealth fighter.

BAe Taranis

Oh I dont know that, thanks for the info. STEALTH design is something that is critical to build 5 gen fighter. I am glad that BAe also has some experience on that. It means Turkey is not wrong choosing BAe as its partner. But I am still cautious whether BAe will reveal its STEALTH secret to Turkey to the fullest. At some degree STEALTH is still a secret knowledge and not many nation can produce a STEALTH plane. I still wonder, for example, whether Russian PAKFA really is a STEALTH fighter. Beside RCS reduction, Radar Absorbent Material is also the biggest secret on STEALTH. I dont think it is easy to get the knowledge. I am afraid BAe will only share what the public has already known about designing STEALTH plane while on the same time keep the real secret on them. Even until Today USA never sell its F 22 to anybody except themselves.

Talking about Bangladesh, yes I am confident that it will acquire STEALTH fighter at 2030. If it continue to grow around 7 percent per year, there will be no doubt it will become a G 20 country someday, I really hope so. There will be a competition any way on who will supply those fighters on Bangladesh. The one available on the street for Muslim countries will be TFX (if the program successful) KFX (if the program successful), Russian PAKFA, and Chinese F 31. The one that will use many US technology will be KFX and many Muslim nations maybe want to hinder getting US sanction so that the competition will be between PAKFA, TFX, and F 31.

 

[UKBengali]

Talking about Bangladesh, yes I am confident that it will acquire STEALTH fighter at 2030. If it continue to grow around 7 percent per year, there will be no doubt it will become a G 20 country someday, I really hope so. There will be a competition any way on who will supply those fighters on Bangladesh. The one available on the street for Muslim countries will be TFX (if the program successful) KFX (if the program successful), Russian PAKFA, and Chinese F 31. The one that will use many US technology will be KFX and many Muslim nations maybe want to hinder getting US sanction so that the competition will be between PAKFA, TFX, and F 31.

PAK-FA is not a true 5th generation stealth fighter and only a highly advanced 4th generation one.

As for BD economy, HSBC predicts that BD will be the fastest growing economy till 2030, with GDP growing at an average of 7.1% a year till then. Let me tell you that BD is now growing at around 8% a year and 8-9% a year average till 2030 is perfectly realistic.

Yes, BAF will be looking to operate a fleet of stealth aircraft in the 2030s. China will almost certainly not get the order as BD is trying to reduce dependence on them due to Rohingya issue partly. Turkey in my opinion is the favourite for stealth aircraft order as by buying from them BD will get a good aircraft from a reliable supplier that can be counted on at times of need. KFX is highly unlikely and is only a possibility if the TF-X project is cancelled or fails which looks unlikely to me.

 

[Pakistansdefender]

Though we are working on azm and it would take years and years to built it.
Till then we should join this Turkish fighter for local manufacture.
We can learn so much from this project and I have a very good feeling for this too. Lol

 

[cabatli_53]

For strategic Airforce projects like TF-X, Hürjet, Turkish institutes supported by government commenced reverse brain-drain program for qualified engineers working all around the World. Under this program, Many engineers from different expertise area has accepted invitation of Turkiye and started working in Turkish institutes. They are inside of all strategic subsystem projects like turboshaft, turbodiesel engines, T-625 transmission, inside of Tf-X and Hürjet design team or Roketsan. The last meeting(TEI and TAI was there) held in Turkish ambassy building in Britan arranged to invite Turkish engineers working in British aerospace institutes. Majority of them will also be transfered to Turkey because their country invites them to work inside of prestige projects which lead an industrial revolution for their country in all aspect.

 

[-------]

Turkish Engineers from years ago ventured abroad to companies like Sikorsky, lockheed, general electric, mercedes, rolls royce, bosch, siemens..etc because Turkey lacked opportunity for them to use their qualifications due to Turkey being technologically poor country and lacked ambition.. Now that Turkey has technological and scientific ambition those engineers are returning by the truck load.. They want to be part of Turkeys technological and scientific revision.

 

[Islamic faith&Secularism]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1053328490790035461

Ismail Demir The President of Defence Industry says a few countries want to join in MMU, We are in evaluation of it.

 

[cabatli_53]

@İsmailDemir

• TF-X prototypes will fly with off the shelf turbofan engines.
• TRMotor institute will be the center of Turkish engine intelligence collected from other Turkish institutes and Indigenous turbofan engine program have been commenced from scratch.
• TF-X domestic engine program is open to international cooperation but Main contractor will be Turkish institutes. RR&Kale JV keen on participating in this program. Negotiations are proceeding.
• Various countries want to be "partner" in TF-X project. We are evaluating them to convert the program into multi-national system.