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Turkiye a NATO Member? Think Again

Ow man... Im surprised I lived to see that day a Greek calling Turkey an emerging super power :woot: thank you amalakas for making me smile :)

Hey, there is no arguing with the facts, large population, strategic location, emerging hi tech industry, what more does one need.



However, we cannot be a super power unless we gain this riches by force...

You were doing fine there until you got to that point.. what exactly do you mean "by force" ??

you are not actually suggesting a war of conquest against Georgia, Iran or Russia do you ?

I really hope you didn't just say that...


:coffee:
 
You were doing fine there until you got to that point.. what exactly do you mean "by force" ??

I meant 'its impossible'

If we had this riches from birth like Iran we were a super damn power

From now on Turkey is an active player in mediterranean and middle-east but certainly not a world power...
 
From now on Turkey is an active player in mediterranean and middle-east but certainly not a world power...

well,

if Turkey carries on building a solid industry, and perhaps becomes energy sufficient .. (perhaps with a few nuclear power stations) then I don't see why not..

Money makes the world go around, not weapons.. the US did more with money than it did with wars... so ...

:coffee:
 
Well there was a way to gain some petrol maybe but we missed that chance after 1 march 2003

We have some historic rights on two provinces of Northern Iraq musul and kirkuk

Untill second American invasion majority of this provinces' populace was Turks. But after second gulf war local thug named barzani moved his kurdish men to settle down this area

So he got his regional adminstration and gained representation in Iraq senate. Its a step to independent kurdish state in northern Iraq and south eastern Turkey

Remember US gave her word before the invasion that she will protect Iraq's territorial integrity at any cost :rofl:
 
T.C.nin guneydoguda dogal gaz/petrol vardir galiba.....

i understand there are exploration projects there
 
T.C.nin guneydoguda dogal gaz/petrol vardir galiba.....

i understand there are exploration projects there

Yes, there are petrol reserves in south eastern Turkey thats why people of this place is being provoked. Some international powers play dirty games in there...
 
Friends, I started this thread as a way to pose questions that will allow us to think about developments and to discuss what they may mean - Turkiye for the first time, in more than 100 years, that's right, I am going back before the Republic, is thinking of herself, as a free and independent power, not just a power with the ability to defend herself, but rather as a moral power, a arbiter among nations, to create a new legitimacy ---- And this is something certain interests are very much against, but they are not the totality of anything but a discredited past :


September 22, 2010
At the U.N., Turkey Asserts Itself in Prominent Ways
By MARK LANDLER

UNITED NATIONS — If the United Nations General Assembly often serves as a stage for ambitious countries to project a new image, none has grabbed that opportunity this year with as much vigor as Turkey.

In a flurry of speeches and meetings — and one meeting that did not happen — the Turkish president, Abdullah Gul, defended his country’s close ties to Iran, proclaimed Turkey’s intention to become a leader in the Muslim world, and spurned an attempt to mend fences with Israel over its deadly raid on an aid flotilla bound for Gaza.

Turkey’s muscle-flexing has left the United States uneasy, with administration officials worried that Iran had obtained access to financing for its nuclear program through Turkish banks, and that Turkey’s rift with Israel could complicate American efforts to make peace in the Middle East.

Israeli officials reached out to Turkey to arrange a meeting this week between Mr. Gul and the Israeli president, Shimon Peres, in New York. But it collapsed amid Israeli claims that Turkey had demanded an apology from Mr. Peres for the flotilla raid and Turkish claims that Mr. Gul had no time — all of which inflamed a sore that the Israelis hoped had been gradually healing.

Turkey’s leaders made no apologies, saying they did not start the fight with Israel. Nor are they shy about Turkey’s ambitions, declaring that its status as a Muslim democracy, its growing economy, and its location at the hinge of Europe and Asia should make it a central player in resolving problems like the Iranian nuclear program and the Middle East conflict. “If you look at all the issues that are of importance to the world today,” Mr. Gul said in an interview on Tuesday, “they have put Turkey in a rather more advantageous position.” Turkey, Mr. Gul said, was the “only country that can have a very important contribution to the diplomatic route” with Iran — a clear reference to its effort, along with Brazil, to head off the last round of United Nations sanctions against Iran. After the United States brushed aside those negotiations, Turkey voted against the sanctions in the Security Council.

Mr. Gul said Turkey would adhere to the United Nations sanctions, but would not allow the measures to constrict its broader trade with Iran.

On Wednesday, Turkey’s trade minister said in Istanbul that the American-led campaign to ban all banking transactions with Iran was a mistake. Turkish officials said it was up to Turkey’s banks and companies to decide whether to go along with tougher unilateral sanctions decreed by the United States and the European Union.

“If the demand is for Turkey not to have any trade, any economic relations with Iran,” Mr. Gul said, “it would be unfair to TurkeyHe claimed that some American and European companies continued to do business with Iran under new names, circumventing the sanctions. “That is why the sanctions do not yield the results that are envisioned for them, in most cases,” he said.

Administration officials and experts on sanctions said that as Dubai and other Persian Gulf emirates had begun to crack down on their banking links to Iran in response to the sanctions, Iran had sought other intermediaries that would give it access to the Western financial system. Turkey is an obvious channel, as is Qatar, these officials said.

“In a climate of financial restrictions and sanctions, Turks are actually increasing their trade with Iran,” said Ray Takeyh, a senior fellow at the Council on Foreign Relations and former adviser to the Obama administration on Iran. “It stems from their desire to be a pivotal power in the region.”

Treasury Department officials have visited Turkey to urge the government to put the sanctions into effect. The United States has also reminded Turkey of its obligations as a member of NATO.

A Treasury official said that what mattered more than Turkey’s public stance was the response of Turkish banks and companies. He said many were worried that dealing with Iran could have repercussions on their business in the United States and Europe.

Mr. Gul insisted that Turkey did not want to see a nuclear-armed Iran. “The perception here in the U.S. is that what Turkey is doing is in some way undermining U.S. policy Mr. Gul said. “That is definitely not the case.”

For now, Turkey’s rift with Israel has hampered its role as a peacemaker in the Middle East. In 2008, Turkey mediated talks between Israel and Syria, but those ended after Israel’s military strike on Gaza, which was harshly criticized by Turkey’s prime minister, Recep Tayyip Erdogan.

Mr. Gul, an academic who has served as foreign minister, has a less blunt public image than Mr. Erdogan, though both are viewed with concern by critics who fear Turkey is drifting toward a more militant Islamic focus.

After failing to meet Mr. Peres, Mr. Gul made time to see Iran’s president, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad. He also met Wednesday with representatives of Turkish and American companies at the Plaza Hotel.

Nothing seemed to make Mr. Gul prouder than Turkey’s economy. Turkish bonds, he pointed out, were a safer investment than those of Portugal, Italy and Spain — three members of a European Union that has not yet accepted Turkey. And Turkey did not have to bail out its banks. Mr. Gul recounted a meeting with a head of state this week, in which the leader told him, “Turkey used to be known as the sick man of Europe, whereas Turkey now is the only healthy man of Europe



Sebnem Arsu contributed reporting
 
Not to mention the constant support and lobbying for Turkey against any and all Greek position in the UN,NATO,EU stage and the constant downing of Greece in all US related matters and affairs....

pretty much Turkey is an emerging super-power and it owes that to a very large extend to the US.

:coffee:

Agreed. There needs to be a fair equilibrium established as far as our relations with both Turkey and Greece are concerned, both Nato partners. As far as US-Greece relations go, it has gotten the short end of the stick as compared to US-Turkey relations.

Given this and the past animosity between Greece and Turkey... i can't but help too roll my eyes when quite a few Turks accuse my country of not doing enough in helping their country.

It really and truly sucks at the top!
 
Agreed. There needs to be a fair equilibrium established as far as our relations with both Turkey and Greece are concerned, both Nato partners. As far as US-Greece relations go, it has gotten the short end of the stick as compared to US-Turkey relations.

Given this and the past animosity between Greece and Turkey... i can't but help too roll my eyes when quite a few Turks accuse my country of not doing enough in helping their country.

It really and truly sucks at the top!

We dont want anything from you, just stay pragmatic...
 
We dont want anything from you, just stay pragmatic...

Of course nobody wants their country to look weak by accepting outside help, but that is not what i had meant to imply. No need to let national pride get in the way. Please allow me to rephrase that, "A few Turks have questioned if we had given anything in return in the relationship".

And i think the answer to that is, they have received much more then they have ever realized beyond the countries wildest dreams, and beyond the consternation of a few unmentioned regional countries, which i will leave out for the obvious reasons!
 
Agreed. There needs to be a fair equilibrium established as far as our relations with both Turkey and Greece are concerned, both Nato partners. As far as US-Greece relations go, it has gotten the short end of the stick as compared to US-Turkey relations.

Given this and the past animosity between Greece and Turkey... i can't but help too roll my eyes when quite a few Turks accuse my country of not doing enough in helping their country.

It really and truly sucks at the top!


US should put more pressure on France and other countries to openly condemn PKK and terror groups like that

by the way, nowdays very few people talk about Turkish/Greek animosity. That is a thing of the past, except among the nationalist parties

main issues and irritants are PKK; and the occasional Armenian rhetoric. I'm sure some Turks dont understand why U.S. should get angry over Turkey's cooperation with Iran (and Syria). Every individual country has his/her own national interests to look out for
 
Of course nobody wants their country to look weak by accepting outside help, but that is not what i had meant to imply. No need to let national pride get in the way. Please allow me to rephrase that, "A few Turks have questioned if we had given anything in return in the relationship".

And i think the answer to that is, they have received much more then they have ever realized beyond the countries wildest dreams, and beyond the consternation of a few unmentioned regional countries, which i will leave out for the obvious reasons!
It's give and take ... It's not like USA established this close relationship just to help another country. She has interests over this relationship and so does Turkey.
 
It's give and take ... It's not like USA established this close relationship just to help another country. She has interests over this relationship and so does Turkey.

That is pretty much what foreign relations boils down to. Well that and how much to give and take should be applied to a country in a key regional location. In the case of US interests, Turkey as a bridge to US relations with the middle east.
 

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