Trump and Tehran: This is not 2003 and Iran is not Iraq

[Tokhme khar]

We have had the unfortunate experience of running into LA hamshahri all the time. Its a bad experience suffice to say. Just Zionist brainwashed people running their mouths working menial jobs. This is a fact!

Well then you are indeed a Tokhme Khar. Glad you can at least realize your true nature.

 

[Tokhme khar]

Lot's of practically every race/ religion/ culture we've come across. There are millions of self hating jews, Chinese and Indians too. In this case here he may be an ex MKO operative. Self hate was indoctrinated very early in their training. Culture shock and peer pressure and the need to conform are huge factors in the West. It's sad how he's ended up. Perhaps a reasonable education might have helped. I'd blame his parent/ s for this outcome.

 

[WordsMatter]

Lot's of practically every race/ religion/ culture we've come across. There are millions of self hating jews, Chinese and Indians too. In this case here he may be an ex MKO operative. Self hate was indoctrinated very early in their training.

Holy sh*t you are daft...

 

[Tokhme khar]

No you are a waste of oxygen. An oxygen thief.

Holy sh*t you are daft...

 

[LeGenD]

US military "men" after encountering Iranian military men:
View attachment 462786

View attachment 462787

US military "men" are good in killing civilians, torturing prisoners and supporting terrorism. They are not good in fighting.

That incident has propaganda value for Iran (understandable) but not wise to draw conclusions from it and ignore history: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Praying_Mantis

One can expect a few incompetent blokes in any armed force but American war-machine is a juggernaut of power-projection (holistically), and a large number of their troops are battle-hardened because they have fought in Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya and Syria in recent years.

 

[mike2000 is back]

LOL Comments here are funny.

 

[Tokhme khar]

Sure Einstein.......battle hardened losers in SyRaq and AfPak........lol

and a large number of their troops are battle-hardened because they have fought in Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya and Syria in recent years.

 

[VEVAK]

LOOL!!



Unfortunately, yes...

Highly recommend this read for everyone to get a better understanding of why this lecture is happening:

@AmirPatriot @Tokhme khar @Bahram Esfandiari @VEVAK @mohsen @raptor22 @zartosht @mangekyousharingan @

Iranian American Self-Hatred

“We were white until the Arabs came and raped our women,” is the sort of thing you’ll hear Iranian Americans say, when expressing their distaste for Islam. A reverse Orientalism in a sense, they will often refer to Arabs–Gulf Arabs, mainly– as ‘locust eaters’ (malakh khor).

To those familiar with the Iranian Diaspora, it is no news that members of the community are chauvinistic when it comes to their culture and history, even if it includes racist claims and comments that quietly fall under the category of white supremacy.

Iranian Americans often cite their so-called ‘Aryanism’ when taking pride in their ancestral homeland—whose original name Iranzamin means ‘land of the Aryans’—even though being ‘Aryan’ or ‘white’ does not seem to reflect upon them during extra searches by the TSA, getting pulled over by the police, or being the target of Islamophobic hate crimes. It also didn’t prevent them from being targets of anti-Iranianism for 444 days during the Iran hostage crisis, when the insults were “camel jockeys go home!” and “deport all Iranians!”

So why is it that a subsection of Iranian Americans continues to lean on its ‘whiteness’ when society treats it as ‘brown’?

Much of the post-1979 generation of Iranian Americans—those who haven’t visited Iran—satiate their curiosity about their ancestral homeland through anecdotes highlighting bouts of history as told to them by their parents and grandparents. The quick version was that Shah was wonderful and that Islamic zealots following the evil mullah Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini overthrew what was a progressive, Westernized country.


But that wasn’t all. Iranians were once a pure race, and it was a backwards religion led by a group of desert men who raped and pillaged towns, forcing Iranians to convert to Islam and stray from their ancient Persian religion Zoroastrianism. Thanks to the Arabs, we now had to deal with the Islamic Republic of Iran. This explains why so many Iranian Americans refer to themselves as “Persian.” They don’t want to be associated with the current government of Iran. This was obviously important during the anti-Iranianism of the 1980s.

Of course, it is problematic when Iranian Americans describe themselves as being the exception to the world and Iran as being purely Persian. This is firstly because there are countless other ethnic groups in the country—including Arab, Armenian, Baluchis, Kurdish, Turkish, and so forth— meaning that “Persian” does not define it. This is exactly why referring to one self as “Persian American” (or usually just “Persian”) is incorrect because while one can be Iranian American, not all are Iranians are “Persians”. Much of this ignorance gets passed down by wider society, including verbally through relatives, but in truth, it is deeply rooted in a history steeped with Iranian exceptionalism.


Iranian Exceptionalism

Although Iran, then known as “Persia” was invaded countless times, it managed to sustain a distinct culture and dialect by adopting the Arabic alphabet despite the coming of Islam when the Arabs took over. Ferdowsi’s classical masterwork Shahnameh (“The Book of Kings”) was the first incidence of this heritage.

Under the Safavid Dynasty, in an effort to separate themselves from their Sunni Arab neighbors, Twelver Shi’ism was adopted as a Persian state religion. Under the Pahlavi dynasty, Reza Shah attempted to counteract Shi’ism by placing more emphasis on Zoroastrian traditions (including Mehregan, Nowruz, Sadeh, and Tirgan) in an effort to craft an alternative culture dating back to ancient times. Part of this meant changing the country’s name back to Iran in 1935, in an effort to distinguish it from Arab countries and shed its Islamic roots. It has also been argued that in renaming “Persia” as “Iran,” Reza Shah was at least partially influenced by Nazi Germany.

Reza Shah was deeply inspired by Mustafa Kemal Ataturk’s secular experiments in Turkey and wanted the world, particularly the West, to know that Iranians were of a different race, spoke a different language, had different religious practices, and a different culture and history that made them modern (and implicitly European). They were different from their Arab neighbors who were seen as tribal, backwards, and uneducated. Historian Reza Zia-Ebrahimi describes ‘Aryanism’ as dislocative nationalism:

“… served as the official ideology of the Pahlavi state (1925-1979), and was therefore repeatedly hammered into the minds of generations of Iranians through mass-schooling, partisan historiography and propaganda. Its influence is therefore non-negligible… In other words, [dislocative nationalism] aims to dislodge Iran from its empirical reality as an Islamic and Eastern land, and portray it as a member of the European family gone astray in the Middle East. The alleged racial kinship between the Aryans of Iran and Europe is the racial discourse that allows such dislocation and as such, racial thought is a fundamental aspect of dislocative nationalism.”

When Reza Shah’s son Mohammad Reza Pahlavi (commonly known as “the Shah”) cemented his dictatorial rule after the 1953 MI6 and CIA-backed coup against Mohammad Mossadegh, he further promoted his father’s agenda of dislocative nationalism. For instance, he exaggerated the true purpose of the Cyrus Cylinder as an ancient Persian human rights charter, in an effort to cast Iran as part of the European liberal tradition, while concealing his own government’s authoritarian policies. He also infamously described Iran’s location as an “accident of geography,” among other things.


Diaspora Nationalism Today

The aftermath of September 11, leading to the War on Terror, has made this dislocative nationalism and Iranian exceptionalism difficult because, as sociologist Neda Maghbouleh argues, “For these young people, after something like 9/11 when clearly Iranians were being lumped together with these different groups, what these parents were telling them about Iranian exceptionalism begins to fall flat. Of course, they’re going to make connections, not just to Arabs and Turks, but also South Asians: Indians, Pakistanis, Bangladeshis.”

These connections are made fascinating by the fact that the US Census continues to feed into the notion that Iranians are white or Caucasian, with Magbouleh noting that “in terms of the state, the state clearly understands and treats [Iranian Americans] supposedly as the ‘whites’ that they’re categorized as, yet in their everyday travels through the world, Iranian Americans are not treated as the whites that they are legally.”

In 2010, the Check It Right Campaign tried to encouraged Arabs and Iranians to check ‘other’ on the US Census and fill in their true ancestry as an effort to show they weren’t invisible. Iranian American actor and comedian Maz Jobranihighlights this in a humorous anecdote: “When I was applying for college, I actually looked for the box to mark Iranian and I went to my counselor and I said, ‘There’s no Iranian box.’ And they go, ‘Well, you’re white.’ I go, ‘What do you mean I’m white?’ I took all the insults growing up — camel jockey, towel head, all this other stuff — and all I had to say was, ‘Dude, I’m white!’”

This reflects the difficulty of being Iranian American today. The Diaspora’s often jingoistic and exceptionalist mentality is based on an idea of ‘us’ versus ‘them,’ in an effort to continuously separate one’s self from one’s neighbors based on an image of one’s of being ‘white.’ And yet, this doesn’t reflect in reality, because everyone seems to see it otherwise. No matter how light your skin color is, your name, your passport, your religion says it all.

It is critical the Iranian American community tackle this problem. Indeed, as anthropologist Alex Shams writes, “the failure of Iranian Americans to recognize their own complicated racial position in the United States risks doing our community a great disservice. We must be brutally honest with ourselves and with each other about systems of race and racial oppression in this country as well as how we fit into them, both in terms of privilege and oppression.” Considering America’s immensely violent racial history, this is particularly important for the Diaspora there, though it has consequences everywhere.

My friend being Aryan has nothing to do with being white! The word Aryan has come up in Iranian writings as description for Iranians dating back to Cyrus the great 2500 years ago at a time where most white people were still living in trees and caves with no type of government to speak of!

FYI a vast portion of Indians, Afghans and Pakistanis are also Aryans! And there is nothing white about them! Aryans were a group of people that lived by the Caspian Sea and later migrated due so weather conditions (likely due to a very bad and long winter) Some came south and others went as far as India..... It has absolutely nothing to do with being white! There are people in Syria, Iraq, Turkey, Republic of Azarbijan, Turkmenistan, Armenia, Georgia, Uzbekistan, Tajikistan, Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan & India whos origins go back to the Aryan tribes and these aren't people I would consider as white!

Also, Iranians inside Iran have called their country Iran or Arya or Arya Zamin for over 1000 years!
This has nothing to do with any delusions of wanting to be white!
Prior to Reza Pahlavi it was foreigners outside Iran that called Iran Persia but the word Iran or Arya or Arya Zamin was used by Iranians inside Iran to describe their country for over 1000 years before Reza Pahlavi was even born!
Iran is an ethnically diverse country made up of various Aryan tribes and using the world Persia to describe Iran would have only served to disenfranchise various Iranian tribes and although Iranians inside Iran called their country Iran but as the world was becoming more interconnected with new forms of transport (rail road & Aircraft) having foreigners describe Iran as Persia would of had a negative impact on all other Iranian tribes and would have sown the seeds of discord and dissent

As for Islam being forced on Iranians next time an Iranian says that to you can simply remind them that
even today with all the modern technology available to the Iranian government even in a single province of Kurdistan using modern weapons there is absolutely no way the Iranian government could possibly ban the Kurdish language altogether and force every person in Iran's Kurdistan Province to speak Farsi only even at home!
So the idea that 1000 years ago at a time when people got around with horses and used swords and arrows as weapons (which by the way were weapons available to almost everyone at that time) the idea that under those conditions any government or invading army could possibly force a religion on every individual in a country as vast as Iran is utter nonsense


As for the deluded or racist views of some Iranians! There are delusional racist people in every country on the planet and Iran is no different and delusional Iranians aren't restricted to Iranian Americans! There are delusional Iranians both inside and outside Iran and I have meet plenty of normal Iranian Americans that are under no such delusions.

 

[Fafnir]

LOOL!!



Unfortunately, yes...

Highly recommend this read for everyone to get a better understanding of why this lecture is happening:

@AmirPatriot @Tokhme khar @Bahram Esfandiari @VEVAK @mohsen @raptor22 @zartosht @mangekyousharingan @

Iranian American Self-Hatred

“We were white until the Arabs came and raped our women,” is the sort of thing you’ll hear Iranian Americans say, when expressing their distaste for Islam. A reverse Orientalism in a sense, they will often refer to Arabs–Gulf Arabs, mainly– as ‘locust eaters’ (malakh khor).

To those familiar with the Iranian Diaspora, it is no news that members of the community are chauvinistic when it comes to their culture and history, even if it includes racist claims and comments that quietly fall under the category of white supremacy.

Iranian Americans often cite their so-called ‘Aryanism’ when taking pride in their ancestral homeland—whose original name Iranzamin means ‘land of the Aryans’—even though being ‘Aryan’ or ‘white’ does not seem to reflect upon them during extra searches by the TSA, getting pulled over by the police, or being the target of Islamophobic hate crimes. It also didn’t prevent them from being targets of anti-Iranianism for 444 days during the Iran hostage crisis, when the insults were “camel jockeys go home!” and “deport all Iranians!”

So why is it that a subsection of Iranian Americans continues to lean on its ‘whiteness’ when society treats it as ‘brown’?

Much of the post-1979 generation of Iranian Americans—those who haven’t visited Iran—satiate their curiosity about their ancestral homeland through anecdotes highlighting bouts of history as told to them by their parents and grandparents. The quick version was that Shah was wonderful and that Islamic zealots following the evil mullah Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini overthrew what was a progressive, Westernized country.


But that wasn’t all. Iranians were once a pure race, and it was a backwards religion led by a group of desert men who raped and pillaged towns, forcing Iranians to convert to Islam and stray from their ancient Persian religion Zoroastrianism. Thanks to the Arabs, we now had to deal with the Islamic Republic of Iran. This explains why so many Iranian Americans refer to themselves as “Persian.” They don’t want to be associated with the current government of Iran. This was obviously important during the anti-Iranianism of the 1980s.

Of course, it is problematic when Iranian Americans describe themselves as being the exception to the world and Iran as being purely Persian. This is firstly because there are countless other ethnic groups in the country—including Arab, Armenian, Baluchis, Kurdish, Turkish, and so forth— meaning that “Persian” does not define it. This is exactly why referring to one self as “Persian American” (or usually just “Persian”) is incorrect because while one can be Iranian American, not all are Iranians are “Persians”. Much of this ignorance gets passed down by wider society, including verbally through relatives, but in truth, it is deeply rooted in a history steeped with Iranian exceptionalism.


Iranian Exceptionalism

Although Iran, then known as “Persia” was invaded countless times, it managed to sustain a distinct culture and dialect by adopting the Arabic alphabet despite the coming of Islam when the Arabs took over. Ferdowsi’s classical masterwork Shahnameh (“The Book of Kings”) was the first incidence of this heritage.

Under the Safavid Dynasty, in an effort to separate themselves from their Sunni Arab neighbors, Twelver Shi’ism was adopted as a Persian state religion. Under the Pahlavi dynasty, Reza Shah attempted to counteract Shi’ism by placing more emphasis on Zoroastrian traditions (including Mehregan, Nowruz, Sadeh, and Tirgan) in an effort to craft an alternative culture dating back to ancient times. Part of this meant changing the country’s name back to Iran in 1935, in an effort to distinguish it from Arab countries and shed its Islamic roots. It has also been argued that in renaming “Persia” as “Iran,” Reza Shah was at least partially influenced by Nazi Germany.

Reza Shah was deeply inspired by Mustafa Kemal Ataturk’s secular experiments in Turkey and wanted the world, particularly the West, to know that Iranians were of a different race, spoke a different language, had different religious practices, and a different culture and history that made them modern (and implicitly European). They were different from their Arab neighbors who were seen as tribal, backwards, and uneducated. Historian Reza Zia-Ebrahimi describes ‘Aryanism’ as dislocative nationalism:

“… served as the official ideology of the Pahlavi state (1925-1979), and was therefore repeatedly hammered into the minds of generations of Iranians through mass-schooling, partisan historiography and propaganda. Its influence is therefore non-negligible… In other words, [dislocative nationalism] aims to dislodge Iran from its empirical reality as an Islamic and Eastern land, and portray it as a member of the European family gone astray in the Middle East. The alleged racial kinship between the Aryans of Iran and Europe is the racial discourse that allows such dislocation and as such, racial thought is a fundamental aspect of dislocative nationalism.”

When Reza Shah’s son Mohammad Reza Pahlavi (commonly known as “the Shah”) cemented his dictatorial rule after the 1953 MI6 and CIA-backed coup against Mohammad Mossadegh, he further promoted his father’s agenda of dislocative nationalism. For instance, he exaggerated the true purpose of the Cyrus Cylinder as an ancient Persian human rights charter, in an effort to cast Iran as part of the European liberal tradition, while concealing his own government’s authoritarian policies. He also infamously described Iran’s location as an “accident of geography,” among other things.


Diaspora Nationalism Today

The aftermath of September 11, leading to the War on Terror, has made this dislocative nationalism and Iranian exceptionalism difficult because, as sociologist Neda Maghbouleh argues, “For these young people, after something like 9/11 when clearly Iranians were being lumped together with these different groups, what these parents were telling them about Iranian exceptionalism begins to fall flat. Of course, they’re going to make connections, not just to Arabs and Turks, but also South Asians: Indians, Pakistanis, Bangladeshis.”

These connections are made fascinating by the fact that the US Census continues to feed into the notion that Iranians are white or Caucasian, with Magbouleh noting that “in terms of the state, the state clearly understands and treats [Iranian Americans] supposedly as the ‘whites’ that they’re categorized as, yet in their everyday travels through the world, Iranian Americans are not treated as the whites that they are legally.”

In 2010, the Check It Right Campaign tried to encouraged Arabs and Iranians to check ‘other’ on the US Census and fill in their true ancestry as an effort to show they weren’t invisible. Iranian American actor and comedian Maz Jobranihighlights this in a humorous anecdote: “When I was applying for college, I actually looked for the box to mark Iranian and I went to my counselor and I said, ‘There’s no Iranian box.’ And they go, ‘Well, you’re white.’ I go, ‘What do you mean I’m white?’ I took all the insults growing up — camel jockey, towel head, all this other stuff — and all I had to say was, ‘Dude, I’m white!’”

This reflects the difficulty of being Iranian American today. The Diaspora’s often jingoistic and exceptionalist mentality is based on an idea of ‘us’ versus ‘them,’ in an effort to continuously separate one’s self from one’s neighbors based on an image of one’s of being ‘white.’ And yet, this doesn’t reflect in reality, because everyone seems to see it otherwise. No matter how light your skin color is, your name, your passport, your religion says it all.

It is critical the Iranian American community tackle this problem. Indeed, as anthropologist Alex Shams writes, “the failure of Iranian Americans to recognize their own complicated racial position in the United States risks doing our community a great disservice. We must be brutally honest with ourselves and with each other about systems of race and racial oppression in this country as well as how we fit into them, both in terms of privilege and oppression.” Considering America’s immensely violent racial history, this is particularly important for the Diaspora there, though it has consequences everywhere.

An excellent description of the phoney "persian" nationalism that one sometimes encounters from the odd deluded poster on this forum,basically the iranian equivalent of the repugnant american alt-right and its fellow travelers.Ironically I`ve encountered the odd zionist who has more than a little sympathy for these same views ie "you guys arent arabs so you should be supporting israel[and america]".

 

[Fafnir]

And what would you say about yourself? That you worship the mullahs when you are blind to their crimes? I think you are the "stupid" here. But then again why bother with insults. That's your response to everything.


And after all the "research" that you have done, your counter argument is always the same: "you fool", "you stupid", "you know nothing", "you are MKO", "you are shahi", "fake intellectual"... Come up with some counter-argument that does not involve you guys loosing your temper in the face of an opposing view. But I guess that's too much to ask.

IRI is in trouble, whether you like it, admit it, or acknowledge it. And it has nothing, and absolutely nothing, to do with the US embargo. It's the result of bad governance, and corruption. It's an autocracy run by unqualified people. The US did not ask your agha zadehs to rub the Iranians dry. Or are you saying it did?! The US did not tell IRI to hire unqualified people to run state institutions. In fact your leader and his favorite son, Mr. Ahmadinejad, said as much when he said he doesn't want mohandes but instead wants momens. I guess when that's the criteria for being qualified, you see all these people burning their forehead to get a high ranking position.


Just to be clear here:

• China's main strategic concerns are Taiwan and South China sea. China will not jeopardize her growth, due to her economic integration with the west, to "protect" IRI. In fact China has been diversifying her crude purchases away from IRI for some time now.
• Russia's main concern is her periphery: Ukraine, and the "istans" that once were part of USSR. Russia is an opportunistic player. As there will be light, Russia will sell IRI if it meant removing the European and American sanctions.

Of the rising power, and the dying one, which would you think will stand-up to the US? Did these two "powers" intervene when IRI was punished with the most severe economic sanctions in human history during Mr. Khamenie's favorite son's presidency? Of course you already know the answer.

Don't blame IRI's economic woes on sanctions. That's a scape-goat of a statement; that's a cop-out. IRI problems are self-inflicted. IRI is more than willing to spend a fortune to prop-up a tyrant in Syria, spend 100 times more on Islamic propagation than on Iranians' education, allows for corrupt and unqualified managers to run the government and state industries, [you know the rest]... and yet you bring out the sanctions card; that's an old card in need of revising.

I have to chuckle at you first claiming in one paragraph that iran "was punished with the most severe economic sanctions in human history" and yet in the next you`re saying that irans economic woes have nothing to do with sanctions and that they are a "cop-out",but then of course if you actually had to admit that sanctions played a major role in irans economic problems then you`d no longer be able to say its all irans own fault,altho I suspect that even if by some miracle you did ever admit that you`d probably just turn around and say its irans own fault it got sanctioned in the first place,right?[lol].
As for syria what did you expect iran to do?,just sit back and watch as it became another libya?.Not to mention that when virtually the rest of the world was backing saddam in his war of aggression against iran sria was one of literally less than a handful of friends/allies that iran had on its side and the only arab state as well

Well you certainly seem to have a good idea of what you dont like,but have you bothered to give any thought as to what you would replace the iri with if it did indeed go belly up as you seem to think it will inevitably do?.In my experience people like yourself have been so busy fixating on what you dont like,and if only it could all be got rid of then everything would surely be oh so much better,that you dont bother giving much thought as to what would replace it or even what you would prefer to have replace it,so please illuminate us as to what you think should be the perfect political replacement for the iri and the cure as you no doubt see it for all of irans many ills,after all I`m sure I`m not alone in this forum in wondering what you would prefer instead as most of your posts that I remember seem to consist of just bashing the iri without offering any solutions or alternatives,well nows your chance my friend,have at it dont be shy.I for one am really quite curious to see what you actually prefer to the iri
Oh and please do try and be precise,as in no vague bullsh!t about just wanting "democracy",state what sort you want ie 2 party,multi-party,neo liberal,social democratic,popular vote or electoral college,will it be a carbon copy of an existing nations system or a hybrid?,would it have a president or a prime minister or both?,or would you prefer something else entirely?,perhaps a throw back to the good old bad old days of pahlavis pro western/israeli "arab style" dictatorship with reza jr as the king of kings or perhaps you have an idea for something completely and totally different,anyway I look forward to your response.

 

[WordsMatter]

I have to chuckle at you first claiming in one paragraph that iran "was punished with the most severe economic sanctions in human history" and yet in the next you`re saying that irans economic woes have nothing to do with sanctions and that they are a "cop-out",but then of course if you actually had to admit that sanctions played a major role in irans economic problems then you`d no longer be able to say its all irans own fault,altho I suspect that even if by some miracle you did ever admit that you`d probably just turn around and say its irans own fault it got sanctioned in the first place,right?[lol].
As for syria what did you expect iran to do?,just sit back and watch as it became another libya?.Not to mention that when virtually the rest of the world was backing saddam in his war of aggression against iran sria was one of literally less than a handful of friends/allies that iran had on its side and the only arab state as well

Well you certainly seem to have a good idea of what you dont like,but have you bothered to give any thought as to what you would replace the iri with if it did indeed go belly up as you seem to think it will inevitably do?.In my experience people like yourself have been so busy fixating on what you dont like,and if only it could all be got rid of then everything would surely be oh so much better,that you dont bother giving much thought as to what would replace it or even what you would prefer to have replace it,so please illuminate us as to what you think should be the perfect political replacement for the iri and the cure as you no doubt see it for all of irans many ills,after all I`m sure I`m not alone in this forum in wondering what you would prefer instead as most of your posts that I remember seem to consist of just bashing the iri without offering any solutions or alternatives,well nows your chance my friend,have at it dont be shy.I for one am really quite curious to see what you actually prefer to the iri
Oh and please do try and be precise,as in no vague bullsh!t about just wanting "democracy",state what sort you want ie 2 party,multi-party,neo liberal,social democratic,popular vote or electoral college,will it be a carbon copy of an existing nations system or a hybrid?,would it have a president or a prime minister or both?,or would you prefer something else entirely?,perhaps a throw back to the good old bad old days of pahlavis pro western/israeli "arab style" dictatorship with reza jr as the king of kings or perhaps you have an idea for something completely and totally different,anyway I look forward to your response.

I would like to make a few clarifications in response to your assertions (or your response to my assertions):

• IRI has been the subject of most severe economic sanctions in human history: Yes, that's correct. And that has come, or did come about, as a result of IRI's clandestine pursuit of nuclear technology. Not that the pursuit of such technology is wrong or prohibited, but IRI's pathway to such technology has been suspect. You may argue that nuclear technology is the right of every nation and I would agree with you. But consider this: if tomorrow it turns out that Iraq, or the Taliban, the two most vocal of Iran's enemies, have had a clandestine chemical weapons program in the works, how do you think IRI would react? I am sure IRI would respond with every element of her power since both of these states have had a history of animosity toward Iran. So why should the US, or other western economies, react differently to IRI's mis-behaviors? IRI does not believe in the western constructed world order that has been in place since WWII, is a sworn enemy of the US, has undermined her positions through-out the globe, and continues to be a behind-the-scenes spoiler. Certainly the US and her allies consider IRI a foe, don't you agree?
• IRI is responsible for her economic plight: Yes. It's one thing to say western countries don't sell us the "technology that we need", but completely a different story when IRI in fact can sell the world her oil, make billions of dollars, and yet has an economy that is in shambles. IRI's national currency lost about 30% of its value last year. Are you suggesting it's due to the actions of the US or other western countries? Youth unemployment is staggeringly high. Is it Canada's doing? Iran's state employed workers are on strike daily for not receiving their wages. Is that the fault of the UK? Inflation is out of control. You are not suggesting this is the work of Israel? Iran is facing an existential environmental threat. Is that France's fault? Why is it that when the US fails in some endeavor that's the result of her incompetence, but when IRI fails, and has been failing her people you are OK with IRI's narrative that "it's not because we have incompetent people running the country but west's animus." In other words corruption, incompetence, bad planning, waste, out-right theft by religious foundations has nothing to do with IRI's plight?
• I wrote my original comment in response to the false, and faulty, assertion that IRI is strong and there's nothing that the US can do to her. IRI is not strong and the US can do plenty. And as a result plenty will die. I am not advocating that the US should attack Iran, but simply trying to point out that IRI is in no position to take on, or challenge, a behemoth like the US. IRI, and her apologists, think IRI can do exactly that because the Russians and Chinese would come to her aid. This proposition is wrong on so many levels: first if your strength comes from the strength of others then you are not that strong, are you? 2- What incentive exists for these foreign powers to challenge, engage, and confront the US? Is it IRI's oil? The world is awash in oil. Is it her other rare natural resources? Which ones? Her geo-political position? Her allies? IRI's raison d'etre is to be anti-west. Do you believe that's a good enough incentive for either of these powers to side with her? How many countries are siding with N. Korea?
• Just because the viable alternatives to IRI are weak today we shouldn't assert that they will remain weak. I assume, because of the flag you use under your avatar, you either live in New Zealand or are a New Zealander. You are lucky that you live in a free society. Iranians deserve as much, and more: good governance, freedom, independence, and wealth. Deng Xiaoping once said "to be rich is glorious" and he was right. China today is the second largest economy in the world. It's a rising power, unchallenged by her neighbors, and making new alliances. China attained this position not by challenging the western hegemony but by allying herself with the west. IRI's sole obsession is to challenge the west, to be anti-US, pro Islamic Umma. These are not objectives that most Iranians, whether living in or outside of the country, approve of. If they were, Iran would not have the highest number of brain-drains in the world.
• IRI will collapse, the same way all autocracies collapse: by force, whether foreign or domestic. Let's hope it will not be a bloody one. In the past few days the ethnic Arabs in southern Iran have poured into streets because they were insulted on national TV. But they also have been discriminated against and branded as separatists whenever they have objected to their plight. This is true of many other ethnic groups, women, and ordinary Iranians. A funny thing happened on the way to understand the recent popular uprising in Iran by IRI's elites: instead of addressing the root causes, IRI has decided to ban an app. You tell me if that's a hallmark of a good government.

 

[VEVAK]

I would like to make a few clarifications in response to your assertions (or your response to my assertions):

• IRI has been the subject of most severe economic sanctions in human history: Yes, that's correct. And that has come, or did come about, as a result of IRI's clandestine pursuit of nuclear technology. Not that the pursuit of such technology is wrong or prohibited, but IRI's pathway to such technology has been suspect. You may argue that nuclear technology is the right of every nation and I would agree with you. But consider this: if tomorrow it turns out that Iraq, or the Taliban, the two most vocal of Iran's enemies, have had a clandestine chemical weapons program in the works, how do you think IRI would react? I am sure IRI would respond with every element of her power since both of these states have had a history of animosity toward Iran. So why should the US, or other western economies, react differently to IRI's mis-behaviors? IRI does not believe in the western constructed world order that has been in place since WWII, is a sworn enemy of the US, has undermined her positions through-out the globe, and continues to be a behind-the-scenes spoiler. Certainly the US and her allies consider IRI a foe, don't you agree?
• IRI is responsible for her economic plight: Yes. It's one thing to say western countries don't sell us the "technology that we need", but completely a different story when IRI in fact can sell the world her oil, make billions of dollars, and yet has an economy that is in shambles. IRI's national currency lost about 30% of its value last year. Are you suggesting it's due to the actions of the US or other western countries? Youth unemployment is staggeringly high. Is it Canada's doing? Iran's state employed workers are on strike daily for not receiving their wages. Is that the fault of the UK? Inflation is out of control. You are not suggesting this is the work of Israel? Iran is facing an existential environmental threat. Is that France's fault? Why is it that when the US fails in some endeavor that's the result of her incompetence, but when IRI fails, and has been failing her people you are OK with IRI's narrative that "it's not because we have incompetent people running the country but west's animus." In other words corruption, incompetence, bad planning, waste, out-right theft by religious foundations has nothing to do with IRI's plight?
• I wrote my original comment in response to the false, and faulty, assertion that IRI is strong and there's nothing that the US can do to her. IRI is not strong and the US can do plenty. And as a result plenty will die. I am not advocating that the US should attack Iran, but simply trying to point out that IRI is in no position to take on, or challenge, a behemoth like the US. IRI, and her apologists, think IRI can do exactly that because the Russians and Chinese would come to her aid. This proposition is wrong on so many levels: first if your strength comes from the strength of others then you are not that strong, are you? 2- What incentive exists for these foreign powers to challenge, engage, and confront the US? Is it IRI's oil? The world is awash in oil. Is it her other rare natural resources? Which ones? Her geo-political position? Her allies? IRI's raison d'etre is to be anti-west. Do you believe that's a good enough incentive for either of these powers to side with her? How many countries are siding with N. Korea?
• Just because the viable alternatives to IRI are weak today we shouldn't assert that they will remain weak. I assume, because of the flag you use under your avatar, you either live in New Zealand or are a New Zealander. You are lucky that you live in a free society. Iranians deserve as much, and more: good governance, freedom, independence, and wealth. Deng Xiaoping once said "to be rich is glorious" and he was right. China today is the second largest economy in the world. It's a rising power, unchallenged by her neighbors, and making new alliances. China attained this position not by challenging the western hegemony but by allying herself with the west. IRI's sole obsession is to challenge the west, to be anti-US, pro Islamic Umma. These are not objectives that most Iranians, whether living in or outside of the country, approve of. If they were, Iran would not have the highest number of brain-drains in the world.
• IRI will collapse, the same way all autocracies collapse: by force, whether foreign or domestic. Let's hope it will not be a bloody one. In the past few days the ethnic Arabs in southern Iran have poured into streets because they were insulted on national TV. But they also have been discriminated against and branded as separatists whenever they have objected to their plight. This is true of many other ethnic groups, women, and ordinary Iranians. A funny thing happened on the way to understand the recent popular uprising in Iran by IRI's elites: instead of addressing the root causes, IRI has decided to ban an app. You tell me if that's a hallmark of a good government.

What an absurd comment! China's growth comes from scientific progress and industrial development in a country with a vast population (LARGEST IN THE WORLD) and NOT from acceptance of western culture!
China's vast population allows for a very strong central government and proper investment from that government has led to a strong and growing China! But still China's GDP per capita is still ranked in the 60's and by the most part it's China's vast population that has lead China to where it is today NOT WESTERN CULTURE!

As for Iran banning apps..... as long as western powers like the U.S. are using apps and social media websites to target Iran then the Iranian government not only has every right to ban apps but should be obligated to do so!

and as for your so called uprisings your so called protest wouldn't even fill a football stadium in a country of 80Million people!
Also, the fact that the U.S. and the Saudi's have been attempting to cause problems in Iran's boarding provinces and have been actively funding various groups there is not news to any Iranian and only a fool would think that it is a genuine uprising rather than a few foreign funded mozdoors

 

[mangekyo]

What an absurd comment! China's growth comes from scientific progress and industrial development in a country with a vast population (LARGEST IN THE WORLD) and NOT from acceptance of western culture!
China's vast population allows for a very strong central government and proper investment from that government has led to a strong and growing China! But still China's GDP per capita is still ranked in the 60's and by the most part it's China's vast population that has lead China to where it is today NOT WESTERN CULTURE!

As for Iran banning apps..... as long as western powers like the U.S. are using apps and social media websites to target Iran then the Iranian government not only has every right to ban apps but should be obligated to do so!

and as for your so called uprisings your so called protest wouldn't even fill a football stadium in a country of 80Million people!
Also, the fact that the U.S. and the Saudi's have been attempting to cause problems in Iran's boarding provinces and have been actively funding various groups there is not news to any Iranian and only a fool would think that it is a genuine uprising rather than a few foreign funded mozdoors

He has no idea what he is talking about. Try convincing Al Qaeda that pigs are holy, you might have a better chance