“This war against our republic is also a war against Iran’

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

The intention behind tagging the users was not to "build a mob", but to have them read the content of my reply, since it's a detailed response that addresses certain points Iranians are recurrently confronted with, so they might benefit from reading it, and I deemed it better to tag them than to repost the same here.

I didn't mention Daesh, and the groups I am referring to beyond Daesh. Daesh merely took over that particular view, but didn't have a monopoly on it (and Daesh is defined by more than just that). It's got nothing to do with anyone's confession (Sunni/Shia). I have had discussions with various Sunni Muslims (presumably) that I disagree with, but not everyone of them is applying a strict 'kuffar vs Muslims' reading grid to practically every conflict that involves Muslims, even to some which primarily tend to obey a different logic, as is the case here (this here is essentially a political conflict like every other war, but in the realm of the public representations of those involved, the so-called "ethnic" factor prevails over the religious one).

You reply to my post in the appropriate thread, where I made it, and not here to your Iranian chorus.

This is dishonest.

If you have issues with my post, direct it to me for clarification and I will explain.

if you simply disagree with my assertions, then let us agree to disagree and not create unneeded drama or bad blood.

assalam alaikum all.

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

My post didn't have anything to do with your posts.

I responded to Hormuz's post which was quoting salarsikandar's post. My post did not have anything to do with salarsikandar's post either. Can't figure out where I spun your posts. I'm confused.

I just required your oversight as to the conversation between brother @SalarHaqq and I.

It was not in relation to your post.

 

[krash]

I just required your oversight as to the conversation between brother @SalarHaqq and I.

It was not in relation to your post.

Ah.......that explains it. I was trying to figure out how I had offended you.

With regards to your request, I'm here, brother.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

the average person is geopolitically illiterate. This gets taken advantage of so easily by governments.

Iranian enemies are doing everything they can to try and blame Iran for this and turn Azeri Iranians against the government.

its almost about time for Iran to tear the disgraceful turkemenchai and golestan "treaties" and make territorial claims against azerbaijan and make it a long term policy to annex azerbaijan.

The azerbaijani regime thinks that because Iran is reluctant to take steps against it because of their azeri populace, this gives them a free hand to trade with Israel weapons for Zionist presence and spies on the Iranian border.

Azerbaijan has moved israeli spy equipment onto the Iranian border. Iran has every right in the world to take direct kinetic action against these zionist terrorist assets threatning Iran, and a direct strike on azerbaijan as a warning to never do this again

Iran cannot simply stand idle while enemies make moves against it right on her sensitive border areas.

You're asking for Iran to violate the territorial sovereignty of a neighboring State - Azerbaijan's borders are internationally recognized, including the region of NK that it is fighting to reclaim.

A better option would be to build a stronger relationship with Azerbaijan, allow people to people contacts and in the long term try and leverage the large Azeri population in Iran to convince Azerbaijan to become part of a Federation or union.

You're not going to find any supporters outside Iran or Armenia for a policy of forcibly occupying another country, Azerbaijan.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

it is funny how people from pakistan forget that pakistan was the main supply line for nato to attack afghanistan and unsing pakistan as a logistic hub to send their troops weapons food etc.
but you always scream about muslim unity when it comes to other countries where was your mulsim unity when isis beheaded sunni and shia muslims in iraq and syria.

The US/NATO obtained UNSC approval for military operations in Afghanistan. The fault was with the Taliban at the time because they refused to hand over OBL and act against Al Qaeda.

When you think about it, those same conditions, of the Afghan Taliban committing to act against Al Qadea, ISIS and other terrorist groups, is exactly what the Afghan Taliban have agreed to in negotiations with the US in the recent US-Afghan Taliban talks. To think that so much bloodshed and conflict could have been avoided had the Afghan Taliban agreed to hand over OBL and act against Al Qaeda leadership after the 9/11 attacks.

On your second point about ISIS, Pakistan condemned it then and also acted against ISIS and ISIS-TTP collaboration in Pakistan. I don't understand what your expectation from Pakistan was. The US was already involved with helping Iraqi forces combat ISIS and Pakistan was embroiled in fighting its own war against TTP and Daesh terrorists in Pakistan.

So please don't drag Pakistan into your issues with other countries (Turkey and Azerbaijan in this case). We have our own issues to deal with. Iran & Iranians need to stop disrespecting Pakistan at every turn because you're destroying the goodwill towards Iran that exists in Pakistan. At one point 80% of Pakistanis viewed Iran favorably, and that number has come down significantly in recent years.

 

[Hormuz]

Strawman never works. Just because the Saudis are dishonest does not mean you get to be as well. His argument and Pakistan have nothing to do with the Saudis or ISIS.



Don't fool yourself. You "help" only when it is in your national interest to "help". Nothing wrong with that. In fact, rightly so. However, keep your Iran is the Messiah propaganda to yourself. We haven't seen you jumping around for the Kashmiris. We have seen you stoking and facilitating sectarian and Indian terrorism in Pakistan.



Had Obama been our master, Iran would have been Iraq years ago. Ungrateful and dishonest as you are, I'd recommend keeping your pot shots at Pakistan within circles devoid of sense or honor. This yelling and frothing at the mouth every time Iran is questioned will not be entertained here.

he said we defend the tyrant assad by that i meant that syria got attacked by tyrans and u should mention that and not only talking about one side. what would have pakistan done when foreigne groups would attack them. so thats nonsense.

again i never said we don't go for our national intressed please read carefully what i wrote then u know what i meant with all my post. all the goverments we helped asked us directly for help this is proven by all goverments iraq syria palestine yemen etc. again if kashmir ask for help Iran will help. u take out 1 country and say why is Iran not helping kashmir. why didn't pakistan helped iraq syria yemen palestine etc. so please don't let us talking who helped who cause pakistan is not in position to point the finger on us.

as i said before all the nato supply lines where from pakistan to afghanistan and go and educate urself about the cia prensence in pakistan with the knowledge of the pakistani goverment.
the usa had 40 years time to attack Iran never did and if they could they wouldn't need pakistan for this they have turkey as a nato partner and the persian gulf arab states which r better positioned and for an attack on Iran.

anyway we can talk this issue in another thread since we got off topic.

 

[Hormuz]

Its funny that I see iran poison our shiate population and using them as fodder o further their sick agenda in ssyria.

as mentioned Palestinians didn't ask for our help, where the FK were you when Kashmir was being and is being slaughtered by Indians, and you were signing chabahar till China came throw unimagainable amount of money on you that Iran can barely imagine and you swtiched sides to higest bidder

ah ok so palestine have to ask for ur help but we should interfere in kashmir without they asking for help. as i said like americans double standart.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

how can i reply on quotes and not on the whole text like krash did?

Highlight the text you want to respond to, a little pop-up menu that says reply/quote pops up. If you select 'reply', it will take you to the reply text box with the selected text shown as your quote above.

If you select 'quote' it stores that text in memory and you can add it or multiple quotes by clicking the 'insert quote' button in the reply box.

 

[Hormuz]

you have your own sick agenda, you have taken over iraqi afairs

Three killed as Iraq protesters attack Iran consulate in Karbala

Demonstrators in southern city attempt to storm building, as weeks-long protests in Iraq continue.

www.aljazeera.com

Iraq unrest: Nearly 40 killed in fresh wave of protests

Troops fire live rounds in Nasiriya, Baghdad and Najaf on one of the bloodiest days of unrest so far.

www.bbc.com

Thats why the terror spreading terroist suleiman was bombed to hell by USA in Iraq, he was controlling Iraqi affarirs and Iraqi shia popluation before he got bombed to shytes by USA

hahahaha bbc and aljazeera are u serious????

what u jealous about Iran is so powerful. pakistan would die for a gerenal like sulaimani. all over the world people went on the streets for the matyrdom of this great men but u know better. he fought ur masters puppet in the region and thats what makes u mad i mean u as a person not pakistan as a country.

 

[Hormuz]

if you look and read propaganda news of Khomenui channel then you would know jack shit but here is your proof which ofc as an Persian uyou will deny

Iranian guards kill Pakistani soldier near border

Iranian border guards attacked an FC vehicle inside Pakistani territory killing one and injuring three others.

www.dawn.com

Also when we shot terrorist drone coming from Iran to Pakistan

Iranian drone allegedly on spying mission shot down 'deep inside' Balochistan

The unmanned aircraft was shot down by a JF-17 Thunder fighter jet. The PAF has declined to comment on the matter.

www.dawn.com

we wouldn't need to send drones if wouldn't support terrorists. no need to say more.

as i said on my previous post we can discuss this in another thread cause it's off topic here.

 

[HAIDER]

In 2016 Iran-Russia tried their best to resolve Azeri and Armenian conflict, but dialogue never come to any conclusion. Since then both parties walk away. Even Armenia has security pact with Russia.


Iran’s delicate balancing act in the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict
Iran shares borders with Armenia and Azerbaijan, and is home to communities with origins in both countries.

A picture taken on April 24, 2018 shows Iranians shopping for carpets at the Bazaar in Tabriz in Iran's northwestern East-Azerbaijan province [Atta Kenare/AFP]
By
Maziar Motamedi
5 Oct 2020
Tehran, Iran – With Armenia and Azerbaijan locked in a fresh conflict over the contested region of Nagorno-Karabakh, neighbouring Iran finds itself in a delicate balancing act, with political, historical and ethnic considerations.
Iran’s official stance, after having tried to resolve the long-running conflict in previous decades through diplomatic means, remains one of mediation, calling for an immediate ceasefire and dialogue.
Iran also recognises several United Nations resolutions that stipulate Nagorno-Karabakh, which is controlled by ethnic Armenians backed by Armenia, is part of Azerbaijan and that occupied Azeri lands must be returned.
The region broke away from Azerbaijan in a war during the late 1980s and early 1990s but is not recognised by any country as an independent country, including Armenia.
Iran, which shares borders with both Armenia and Azerbaijan, last week reassured Azerbaijan that it recognises its territorial integrity and that it holds an important place in Iranian foreign policy.

In this photo released by an official website of the office of the Iranian Presidency, Iran’s President Hassan Rouhani, right, shakes hands with Azerbaijan’s President Ilham Aliyev during their meeting at the Saadabad Palace in Tehran, Iran, Wednesday, Nov. 1, 2017 [Iranian Presidency Office via AP]Iranian President Hassan Rouhani also had a phone call with Armenian Prime Minister Nikol Pashynian to call for conflict resolution “through political discourse and international laws”.

However, there have been allegations that Iran supports Armenia, which in turn is supported by Russia. Recently, videos circulating on social media purportedly showed military equipment being transferred to Armenia via trucks passing through an Iranian border pass.
Iran quickly denied the allegations, saying they were “baseless rumours” aimed at smearing relations with Azerbaijan. Iranian state television broadcast footage from the Nordooz border terminal where the vehicles in question were.
They were shown to be Russian Kamaz trucks, which a local official said had been purchased by Armenia before the conflict and were being transported through Iran. The trucks were shown to be carrying vehicle parts.

In this photo released by an official website of the office of the Iranian Presidency, President Hassan Rouhani, left, and Armenian Prime Minister Nikol Pashinyan shake hands during a welcome ceremony at the Saadabad Palace in Tehran, Iran, Feb. 27, 2019 [Office of the Iranian Supreme Leader via AP]Meanwhile, several rockets and shelling from the Nagorno-Karabakh fighting have landed on Iranian soil, with several shells hitting a residential area close to the border for the first time, injuring a six-year-old, on Thursday.

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Iranian foreign ministry spokesman Saeed Khatibzadeh reacted to the incident, saying the country “will not tolerate” the conflict spilling into its borders.
Geopolitical factors
The involvement of other countries in the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict, and their relations with Iran, makes the issue even more complicated.
Israel, for instance, has developed close ties with Azerbaijan and sells Baku military equipment.
Assistant to the president of Azerbaijan, Hikmet Hajiyev, said last week that Azeri forces have been using Israeli-made attack drones in the conflict. In response, Armenia recalled its ambassador from Israel.
Turkey, Baku’s strongest ally in the conflict, has thrown its unequivocal supported behind Azerbaijan.
French President Emmanuel Macron said on Friday that Turkey had sent Syrian fighters drawn from “jihadist groups” to fight for Azerbaijan in Nagorno-Karabakh and that it had “crossed a red line”. Turkey and Azerbaijan deny the allegations.
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Considering the various and opposing vested interests in the region, Iranian politician Mohammad Javad Jamali believes resolving the conflict is now more difficult than it was before.
“We believe those who foment the killings, especially the US and Israel, would like the fires of conflict to remain aflame,” the former senior member of the Iranian parliament’s national security and foreign policy commission told Al Jazeera.

Iran’s Black Church, an ancient Armenian Christian place of worship, near Chaldoran 650 km (404 miles) northwest of Tehran close to the borders of Turkey and Armenia October 8, 2007 [Caren Firouz/Reuters]According to Jamali, members of the OSCE Minsk Group, especially the United States, have failed in their stated goal of ending the conflict.

The group, co-chaired by France, Russia and the US, was formed in 1992 to reach a peaceful, negotiated resolution to the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict.
Jamali believes the clash can only be resolved through peaceful means, specifically via a UN-led effort that would consider the intricate geopolitical, historical and ethnic factors involved.
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“The only ones who will be hurt by this are the people of the region,” he said. “This conflict cannot go on forever in such a strategic area of the region”.
Mahmoud Ahmadi Bighash, a current member of the parliamentary national security and foreign policy commission, also believes the conflict cannot be resolved through anything but negotiations.
“The two countries must put an end to fighting through peaceful means and negotiations that do not include other countries, like the US and Israel, that don’t want the region to be peaceful,” he told Al Jazeera. “Fighting in the region will certainly be to the detriment of our country as well, and I believe we must work toward ending the conflict.”
‘Psychologically we are one nation’
Parts of modern-day Azerbaijan, Armenia and Turkey were once part of the Persian Empire, with communities spread on either side of the modern boundaries.
As a result, many of the ethnic Azeris who live across Iran, especially in the provinces of Ardabil and East Azerbaijan bordering Azerbaijan, feel a close kinship with people across the border.
“In terms of political divides and official borders we are two separate countries, but psychologically and religiously we are one nation,” says 42-year-old Soleiman, a resident of Tabriz, the capital of Iran’s East Azerbaijan Province.
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“It’s like there’s a fight going on in your brother’s house, you would look at their problem as your problem,” he told Al Jazeera, requesting his last name be withheld to protect his privacy.
Soleiman, who was a child when Nagorno-Karabakh broke away from Azerbaijan in a bloody conflict, agrees with the UN resolutions calling for the freeing of Azeri lands, saying that Armenian troops should withdraw immediately.
“No war anywhere in the world has ever been good for anyone, and I sincerely hope this conflict would be resolved without military fighting as soon as possible.”
Several Iranian cities are also home to Armenian communities who feel just as strongly about the long-running conflict.
“It’s not the first time that the people of Artsakh have been disturbed by Azerbaijan, the first one being in 1992, right after Artsakh was declared an independent territory,” said Tehran resident Armond, using the Armenian name for the contested territory.
Twenty-six-year-old Armond said centuries ago, the area now known as Nagorno-Karabakh was called Kachen after the Armenian family who ruled the territory.
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“It breaks my heart because I know the Armenians of Artsakh want to live in peace, and Azerbaijan is the puppet that the government of Turkey is using with the intention of eventually finishing the Armenian Genocide,” said Armond.
Armenia says approximately 1.5 million Armenians had been systematically murdered during and shortly after World War I by the Ottoman government, an account that is officially recognised by more than 30 governments, including the US, Russia, and Germany. Turkey vehemently denies accusations of genocide, saying a few hundred thousand Armenians had died as part of the war.
Demonstrations in Iran
In the past week, several videos were published on social media showing small demonstrations in at least four cities, including Tehran and Tabriz, in support of Azerbaijan.
“Karabakh belongs to us and will continue to belong to us,” protesters can be heard chanting in one video.
Last week, imams of Friday prayers in four predominantly Azeri provinces, namely West Azerbaijan, East Azerbaijan, Ardebil and Zanjan, issued a joint statement in support of Baku.
Azerbaijan is acting in “full compliance” with the law, Islamic law and four UN Security Council resolutions, they said.
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Former MP Jamali said imams hold a “non-diplomatic and non-administrative” place. They usually try to reflect the views of their people and are free to express their opinions, he said.
“But certainly, the stance of the Islamic Republic is the one announced by the officials,” he told Al Jazeera.
“Indeed we respect both our neighbouring countries, especially as we have both Azeri Turkic and Armenian people in our country,” Jamali said, “and our political efforts have always been aimed at improving relations with our neighbours.”

 

[krash]

he said we defend the tyrant assad by that i meant that syria got attacked by tyrans and u should mention that and not only talking about one side.

Does not absolve Iran from supporting one of the dogs in that dog fight.

what would have pakistan done when foreigne groups would attack them. so thats nonsense.

Firstly, we need to see which Syrian we are talking about. While the Syrian you support has Saudi funded Syrians to fight, the Syrian he fights has Iranian funded Syrians to fight. I hope the irony is not lost on you.

again i never said we don't go for our national intressed please read carefully what i wrote then u know what i meant with all my post.

I never said that you did. I stated that fact, a fact which is well within Iran's right. However, you went beyond and implied that Iran is the righteous warrior against oppression in the world, which it is not.

all the goverments we helped asked us directly for help this is proven by all goverments iraq syria palestine yemen etc.

The government in Afghanistan did not ask for your help. You in fact supported the ANA against the then internationally recognized government of the country. No government in Pakistan ever asked for anything, yet you were found funding and enabling local Shia militants against the Sunni militants supported by the Saudis.

again if kashmir ask for help Iran will help. u take out 1 country and say why is Iran not helping kashmir.

Doesn't matter if they ask for it or not. The sheer fact that you have remained in bed with the country which has been and still continues to commit mass murder, mass rape, and every other atrocity in the book for the past 75 years against the innocent and hapless people of Kashmir shows that your pot shots against Pakistan are hypocritical at best and your self-aggrandizing is laughable at best. The fact that you have allowed, if not abetted, the Indian terrorist network to operate from Iran against Pakistan is a matter we can come to later.

why didn't pakistan helped iraq syria yemen palestine etc. so please don't let us talking who helped who cause pakistan is not in position to point the finger on us.

We helped them whenever their fight was obviously just. We supported and fought for them, even received gallantry awards, in wars and natural disasters. You obviously do not know about it. Heck we even supported you, provided you with ammunition and financial support against Iraq, dismantled their plans to support Iranian militants from Balochistan. This was done against American and Saudi pressure, you know, the two you claim to be our "masters". You obviously have forgotten about it.

What we did not do, unlike Iran, is further our own interests in those countries by causing further chaos and then claim it to be "help".

as i said before all the nato supply lines where from pakistan to afghanistan and go and educate urself about the cia prensence in pakistan with the knowledge of the pakistani goverment.

Yet those whom Nato fought against in Afghanistan praise and thank Pakistan while the US complains about us. This is how it is done. Maybe Iran can learn a thing or two from us? Otherwise, supplying funds and rudimentary weaponry to a militant group isn't that great a feat.

 

[Ich]

If Armenia is gone, then the strategic options for Iran imo gone bad. It then would look like a vice. The northern jaw with Turkey, Georgia, Azerbaijan under command of the freakishly Erdogan, and the southern jaw with the other persian gulf states and Israel. And Iran, Irak, Syria, Lebanon between the jaws. This does not look good.

 

[Ich]

The US/NATO obtained UNSC approval for military operations in Afghanistan. The fault was with the Taliban at the time because they refused to hand over OBL and act against Al Qaeda.

When you think about it, those same conditions, of the Afghan Taliban committing to act against Al Qadea, ISIS and other terrorist groups, is exactly what the Afghan Taliban have agreed to in negotiations with the US in the recent US-Afghan Taliban talks. To think that so much bloodshed and conflict could have been avoided had the Afghan Taliban agreed to hand over OBL and act against Al Qaeda leadership after the 9/11 attacks.

On your second point about ISIS, Pakistan condemned it then and also acted against ISIS and ISIS-TTP collaboration in Pakistan. I don't understand what your expectation from Pakistan was. The US was already involved with helping Iraqi forces combat ISIS and Pakistan was embroiled in fighting its own war against TTP and Daesh terrorists in Pakistan.

So please don't drag Pakistan into your issues with other countries (Turkey and Azerbaijan in this case). We have our own issues to deal with. Iran & Iranians need to stop disrespecting Pakistan at every turn because you're destroying the goodwill towards Iran that exists in Pakistan. At one point 80% of Pakistanis viewed Iran favorably, and that number has come down significantly in recent years.

Yes, me too think that it is not a thing Pakistan wants to get entangled in. There are to much other things Pakistan has to go on first. The problem i see is not Pakistan, but a lot of Pakistani men following the call of Erdogan, if it was in Syria or now with Armenia. This could backfire to Pakistan itself in the following years.

 

[salarsikander]

ah ok so palestine have to ask for ur help but we should interfere in kashmir without they asking for help. as i said like americans double standart.

when did they ?