The subcontinent’s Muslim is influenced more by Hinduism than Islam

[jeypore]

i will not go into detail because i dont think it is necessary but i think that pakistani culture is more influenced by sufism than with hinduism but i do think that the way we practice our religion in pakistani is slightly different than the way arabs practice it but its not very different.

Now be little realistic, That sentence should have been approached with, Arabs practice is a goal to be climbed, but the culture is what has to be fought with. That is not new by the way, it is a form of where the center lies, isn't it. And that ailes not only Pakistan but other far east muslims countries also, where the culture is so different from the core.

 

[Omar1984]

Sufism has a lot of influence on they way Pakistanis and many Muslims of the subcontinent practice their religion. Most Arabs do not agree with Sufism.

Arabs are mostly from Wahabi school of thought, and the hardliners in our region also follow that school of thought. Most Muslims of the subcontinent follow the Hanafi school of thought, which is influenced by Sufi Islam. It really has nothing to do with Hindusim.

P.S. We dont worship the moon, we need to see the moon to end fast and celebrate Eid, we've been doing that for over a thousand years.

 

[Panditji]

Arabs are mostly from Wahabi school of thought, and the hardliners in our region also follow that school of thought. Most Muslims of the subcontinent follow the Hanafi school of thought, which is influenced by Sufi Islam. It really has nothing to do with Hindusim.

We are talking about cultural influence here, Omar, and when you consider culture, it is an abstract thing.

What you discuss here are schools of thought that interpret the religion and its deployment in the following masses. Apart from this, the way of thinking, beliefs, customs traditions, are a much wider field of human activity.

When one converts, all of these are not substituted 100%. The cultural aspect is mostly left untouched, because if it is tried to be changed forceably, it is a great distress on the individual, so the cultural aspect lingers on. Even when there is considerable time after conversion, a person may not completely discard the native culture, because the surrounding in which he lives does not allow him to do it.

It is therefore very common for individual followers of Islam from different parts of the world to continue with their traditions and customs, along with Islamic religious practices. It is a fact, and denying it is just hurting your credibility.

To think of it, do you consider Bangladeshi, Indonesian, Malaysian, Sudanese, Libyan, American, Armenian, East Turkestani Muslims all have the same cultural practices?

 

[niaz]

I have no idea who Mr. Akbar Patel is but I have never come across such twisting of facts by anyone. The article is based on incorrect assumptions.

Firstly, Saudi’s don’t follow scientific observations 100%. I live in UAE for the last 5 years, each year one has to wait until very late for the official announcement of the beginning of Ramadan and of Eid. If it was based on scientific calculations, one would know the day of the Hajj and of Eid years in advance. Also Saudis have once changed the date of lunar month by one day in the middle of the month. Countries that observed onset of Ramadan and Eid on Sunday did it because they want to celebrate it the same day as in Saudi Arabia, irrespective of the sighting of the moon.

There is an undisputed Hadith which states that you start fasting after sighting the moon and end fasting after sighting the moon. To infer that subcontinent Muslims do it because of reverence to the lunar deity is blasphemy.

Moon cycle is easily observed and many cultures; including Amerindians; followed lunar calendar. The word Month is derived from the moon itself. According to the Pakistan Meteorology Department, birth of moon was not physically possible in any part of Pakistan on Sunday, how can some people of NWFP claim to have sighted it? Scientific observation! Hogwash.

However, there is no doubt that culture influences religious beliefs of the people and old habits die hard. For example wearing of red on wedding day (Mid East brides wear white), veneration of graves of the saints, celebrating Shab Barat with fireworks, a distaste of the widow’s remarriage, celebrating Basant are indications of the influence of old Hindu culture among the subcontinent Muslims. Iranians were among the first converts to Islam but they still celebrate Naurooz with more fervor than Eid.

This article demonstrates that the author is either ignorant or is deliberately trying to malign subcontinent Muslims.

 

[eastwatch]

Zakir, why this trash talking, and why make those assumptions about other's worth?

That was not making things up. I am in India, and I see that as a fact. Have you been around these places? If you had been, you too would have seen it.

Note that this practice is among the middle class and lower middle class, as they are the ones holding close to their traditions and culture. The upper classes in both India and Pakistan seem to be westernized yuppies, so forget basing your observations on them.

Now, What do you mean by "Everything"? Is there any substantiation of this sweeping statement?

I do not know which Muslim women wear what, but where did you get the idea that they are sticking to that tradition because they think it is their old Hindu culture? Some Indian posters are citing a wrong reason for this phenomenon, if any. It is not that all the Muslims are the descendents of converted Muslims. At least 40% to 50% of the Muslims were immigrants from other countries and other CULTURES.

But, once these immigrants started to live in Hindustan, they intermingled with the local Muslims gradually. No family can say for sure that they belong to local stocks or they belong to foreign immigrant stocks. It can be safely assumed that all the Muslims of Hindustan are of mixed origin unless can be proved otherwise. This mixing of bloods happened more during the British Raj of 190 years, when almost all the Muslims became very poor and illiterate, and all of them almost lost their original identities and thus the distinction.

So, we must think of the true reasons why this mixed group of people have kept, if it is really true, on holding some of the Hindu traditions. In my opinion, if there is really some adhesion to Hindu culture or tradition, then it is due to that the Muslims have been living in a predominantly Hindu society for many hundred years, and it is certainly not due to conversion, as some posters are trying to imply.

 

[Panditji]

I do not know which Muslim women wear what, but where did you get the idea that they are sticking to that after knowing it is their old Hindu culture?

Come down to India. I will show it is a common practice. I have been to Maharashtra, Andhra, Karnataka, and Delhi regions. I have seen it in all places.

It is not that all the Muslims are the descendents of converted Muslims. At least 40% to 50% of the Muslims were immigrants from other countries and other CULTURES.

At independence, there were about 33 million Muslims in India. Today, there are 150 million. This itself says that about 80% of Indian Muslims were born and brought up in India during this period. your assertion that 40-50% came through immigration does not hold water.

But, once these immigrants started to live in Hindustan, they intermingled with the local Muslims gradually. No family can say that they belong to local stocks or they belong to foreign immigrant stocks. It can be safely assumed that all the Muslims of Hindustan are of mixed origin unless proved otherwise.

For this part, I am with you.

This mixing of bloods happened more during the British Raj of 190 years, when almost all the Muslims became very poor and illiterate, and all of them almost lost the sense of distinction.

No. British Raj was only about 200 years, that too in a very mixed rule of native kings ruling under the umbrella of British dominion, and Muslims were here right from the period of Prophet (SAW), to some extent or other. What you call as a clean cocktail of 'immigrant' muslims and local population is more like the local population itself, with some incidental contribution from the occasional foreign source. If we take into account the percentages, I would neglect the phoren contribution, altogether, because it is like a drop in an ocean.

So, we must think of the true reasons why this mixed group of people have kept, if it is really true, on holding some of the Hindu traditions. In my opinion, if there is really some adhesion to Hindu culture or tradition, then it is due to that the Muslims have been living in a predominantly Hindu society for many hundred years, and it is certainly not due to conversion, as you have implied.

It is here you go off on a tangent. It was mainly the foreign rule of the Mughals and their west Asian influence that created the interesting cocktail of Indian Muslim culture. The beautiful language that is your national language is also a result of such mixture of cultures, and there are contributions from both sides to this mix, so there is no point in tracing yourself to someone or other. One can have pride, no issues there, but facts should always be kept clear.

 

[alirulesall123]

i will not go into detail because i dont think it is necessary but i think that pakistani culture is more influenced by sufism than with hinduism but i do think that the way we practice our religion in pakistani is slightly different than the way arabs practice it but its not very different.

Do we force the veil upon our sisters and wives? Do we kill christians and look down on other muslims just because they're not desi? Do we believe that the women have no rights, and that they do not even deserve to go outside without a man's permission? No, we don't. There is a world's difference between how arabs and desis view Islam.

 

[pak-marine]

BS title "south Asians Muslims r inspired by Hindus" it should have been headed some thing else. On the other note yes its correct we are from the same region there isnt any difference as far as culture ,life style and languages are considered. And no matter how much we hate and kill each other the fact is we are the same background , culture ,region its just a minor religious difference for some its a big deal for others its petty. One feels it when he is in one of those western or middleeastern countries , Its all about race then and the funny and strange part is the same are so friendly there. Bottom line is its all about race and a nation is made up of people from similar regions and race.

 

[MilesTogo]

I am of the view that with time at least Pakistani Muslims will be able to get rid of all Hindu influences in their society. Not so sure about Indian Muslims though.

 

[Al-zakir]

That was not making things up. I am in India, and I see that as a fact. Have you been around these places? If you had been, you too would have seen it.

Note that this practice is among the middle class and lower middle class, as they are the ones holding close to their traditions and culture. The upper classes in both India and Pakistan seem to be westernized yuppies, so forget basing your observations on them.

Perhaps you are drinking same daru as your other brother. No Muslim women can wear Mangalsutra(Mangalsutra in India) regardless the national affiliation. I suggest you guys to refrain from this kind of insulting lie to our culture. I think I know more about my region than you. Capisce

Now, What do you mean by "Everything"? Is there any substantiation of this sweeping statement?

Everything mean everything that has affiliation with Hinduism. Hindu religion based on Shirk and shirk is haram in Islam thus Muslim can not practice no Hindu culture.

 

[garibnawaz]

Which deshi daru are you drinking? Are you out of your unworthy mind?

Stop making thing up, will you? Everything from Hinduism is haram in Islam.

I am stating facts as I see them. Your rude replies are not going to change it.

Islam prohibits many other things. How many muslims stay away from it?

Here are some of the photos to prove my point.

http://www.zawaj.com/weddingways/indian_lifeisbigger/048.jpg

GB

 

[garibnawaz]

Sara Khan wearing mangalsutra.



Fatima Ghadiyali (married to Ajit Agarkar) wearing mangalsutra.

I will try to find more pics and sources to prove my point.

GB

 

[garibnawaz]

Which deshi daru are you drinking? Are you out of your unworthy mind?

Stop making thing up, will you? Everything from Hinduism is haram in Islam.

Dawood Ibrahim's daughter married to Javed Miandad's son. Note the Mangalsutra in her neck among all the gold show.

What else you want?

GB

 

[EjazR]

Perhaps you are drinking same daru as your other brother. No Muslim women can wear Mangalsutra(Mangalsutra in India) regardless the national affiliation. I suggest you guys to refrain from this kind of insulting lie to our culture. I think I know more about my region than you. Capisce

Everything mean everything that has affiliation with Hinduism. Hindu religion based on Shirk and shirk is haram in Islam thus Muslim can not practice no Hindu culture.

You are mixing up wearing jewelry with religion just like the author of the article did. Wearing a piece of jewellry unique to the subcontinent by muslims does not become shirk. It is purely for decorative/beauty purposes.

Similarly wearing red color in wedding is part of sub-continental culture just like wearing lots of jewellry. Even things like covering your head for females and respect to elders is again part of our culture. Infact I feel proud when I see President Pratibha Patil wear a saree AND cover a head with her pallu showing her strong attachment to traditions. Even though muslim women are required to do it as per their religious beliefs, it is also a part of sub-coninental culture.

 

[KillBill]

Perhaps you are drinking same daru as your other brother. No Muslim women can wear Mangalsutra(Mangalsutra in India) regardless the national affiliation. I suggest you guys to refrain from this kind of insulting lie to our culture. I think I know more about my region than you. Capisce

Zakir, You may be knowing more about your religion, but I do know more about my country and countrymen. I have a lot of Muslim friends ( more than you would love to) and all of their married women wear Mangalsutras. Its a sign of their marriage. So before spitting venom just think twice what you are saying.