Talks for Su-35, Mi-35 sales to Pakistan are underway: Russian Deputy FM

[ganesh623]

And what if Putin Shows India 2 Middle Fingers you know India Air force is dependent on Russian Spares ... your MiG 29 Su-30MKI and other wants spares from Russia to operate... Even If Russia and Pakistan Finalize the Deal of Su-35 would you really think that India will back of From all the deals just like that... Even if India does that who's gonna give India Spares of the Current fleet of Yours? Still now Half of your MKI are grounded facing repair issues ..... You guys Bitch just like same when the NEWS came about the Mi-35 Helicopters that India wont let that happen Russia will not give you Mi-35 visit any thread about Mi-35 deal.... Even your Government did protest to Russians and asked them not to give Pakistan Mi-35 But Russia Showed Middle Finger to India Just like that.... Did India Cancelled all of it's deals with Russia? i don't think so... You guys are just making fools of yourself here...

You guys bitch all day here about Russia won't give you this Russia won't give you that You cannot afford it Where is the money Russia won't give these on Soft Loans LOL

You Bhindians think that Soft loan is almost equal to Free or Gift.... Soft loan is payment can be extended into few more years it's not it's coming free

Pakistan is not gonna buy Su-35 in Large numbers like you guys are thinking only 2 squads will come if the talking get materialized that 36-40 jets most probably....

ACM Sohail is going to Russia next month And Putin in coming to India in December a lot of thing can happen in between that....

You talk too much for nothing. Talk only when you have su-35 painted in green.

 

[hell__raider]

Dont worry about them, that isn't your problem. By the way i appreciate that slowly and slowly you have digested the fact that russian can sell weapons to Pakistan and now you are worry about their safety in pakistan.

India is buying the best available weapons from US, France as well as Russia. Its good for India. Why should we worry about Russia selling weapons to Pakistan. US & France used to sell weapons to Pakistan yet we bought weapons from them. No issues.

 

[I M Sikander]

India is buying the best available weapons from US, France as well as Russia. Its good for India. Why should we worry about Russia selling weapons to Pakistan. US & France used to sell weapons to Pakistan yet we bought them. No issues.

We are also buying weapons from usa , russia, china, france , turkey, south africa.

We know how much it matters to india when russia sells high tech weapons to pakistan.

All indian members are crying in almost 3 dozen threads related to pak russia weapon purchases.

 

[hell__raider]

Dont worry about them, that isn't your problem. By the way i appreciate that slowly and slowly you have digested the fact that russian can sell weapons to Pakistan and now you are worry about their safety in pakistan.

India is buying the best available weapons from US, France as well as Russia. Its good for India. Why should we worry about Russia selling weapons to Pakistan. US & France used to sell weapons to Pakistan yet we bought them. No issues.

We are also buying weapons from usa , russia, china, france , turkey, south africa.

We know how much it matters to india when russia sells high tech weapons to pakistan.

All indian members are crying in almost 3 dozen threads related to pak russia weapon purchases.

People who are crying has nothing to do with Indian Defense Forces of Indian Government. They are just ordinary Indians or journalists. Pak is buying Mil-35. We are buying Apache which is better. Pak is buying Su-35. We are buying PAK-FA which is better. Why should we worry. If Pak gets PAK-FA or F-35 & India do not get it we should be worried.

 

[I M Sikander]

You talk too much for nothing. Talk only when you have su-35 painted in green.

Vow words of wisdom from indian member.

So what the fu...k india and all indian members are doing for the last 10 years regarding MMRCA deal.
Stop nonsense till iaf gets rafale in indian teeranga.

 

[Muhammad Omar]

You talk too much for nothing. Talk only when you have su-35 painted in green.

Wait for that ,,,,

 

[ganesh623]

Vow words of wisdom from indian member.

So what the fu...k india and all indian members are doing for the last 10 years regarding MMRCA deal.
Stop nonsense till iaf gets rafale in indian teeranga.

Its a official contract, and both parties are officialy negotiating, nothing behind closed doors.
Same cant be said for su-35.

 

[dadeechi]

How many units of su-35 do you see coming? I sense some 24-36. What do you guys think?

At a minimum 60

 

[notorious_eagle]

if Russia can afford to lose India who is the biggest buyer in the world and biggest buyer for Russia.....so good luck

Calm Down

These are just pressure tactics. Pakistan to pressure the US to release additional F16's and for Russia to pressure India to procure additional MKI's.

If Pakistan is to procure another platform, it is most likely going to be J10's and J11's and not SU35. Russia will most likely not going to be the most reliable partner when procuring such an expensive and advanced platform like this.

 

[Muhammad Omar]

At a minimum 60

Nope just 36 -40

 

[batmannow]

I don't take anyone word or believe anyone without using my brain. Compare the size of both the plane you will soon realize what i mean.

Comparing the size of your brains is what we are doing now & its still smaller then moodi jee , s burned b@lls ?lolzz
Now I have question why you are so interested in SU-35s even India is not getting it?

 

[$@rJen]

Su-35s for Pak :: Pie in the sky






Saturday, September 19, 2015

By : Russia India Report




Is Russia planning to win friends in Pakistan and lose influence in India? If Russia sells the advanced Su-35 fighter aircraft to Pakistan, it is likely to lead to a major diplomatic rift with India.

• Is Russia planning to win friends in Pakistan and lose influence in India? If Russia sells the advanced Su-35 fighter aircraft to Pakistan, it is likely to lead to a major diplomatic rift with India. So why did Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov make the statement that Russia and Pakistan were “negotiating for the delivery of an unspecified number of Su-35 jets” to Islamabad?
  
  The best case scenario is that Russia is keen to ensure India’s return to its fold. As India enters into an increasing number of defence partnerships with Russia’s rivals, particularly Israel and the US, but also France and the UK, Moscow believes two can play the game. It is in this backdrop that Russia has entered into a defence cooperation agreement with Pakistan.
  
  Another reason could be that the judgement of some Kremlin players is clouded by the pressure of economic sanctions and they would like to grab a larger share of the global arms market in which Russia traditionally has been a leader. However, this possibility can be discounted as western sanctions have not had the intended impact. Despite an unfavourable geopolitical climate in 2010-14, Russia accounted for 27 per cent of the global arms market, with approximately $14 billion in exports. In fact, Rosoboronexport, Russia’s weapons export cartel, has orders exceeding $40 billion on its books.
  
  Russia’s offer to Pakistan could, therefore, be in the same category as the forever-on-hold S-300 sale to Iran. Moscow has attempted to squeeze diplomatic concessions from the US and Israel as payoff for withholding the air-defence system from Tehran.
  
  Likewise, the Russia-Pakistan talks over the Su-35 could be a ploy to get India fully on board the PAK-FA stealth fighter programme. The Indian Air Force (IAF) was originally committed to buy 200 of these fifth generation fighters but has since cut back the planned buys to 127. Now India wants to buy these jets directly off the production line from Russia rather than jointly develop the aircraft.
  
  Perhaps the Russians believe that Pakistan’s possession of the Su-35 could scare India to buy larger number of the PAK-FA. India may also be forced to purchase other advanced Russian weapons as sops for blocking the Sukhoi sale.
  
  
  What can the Su-35 do?
  
  With around 60 MiG-29s and a Su-30 fleet projected at 300, India currently enjoys an enormous advantage over Pakistan. While India would like to maintain this edge, the Su-35 will make a dent – albeit a slight one – in the IAF’s advantage. Although the much larger IAF, with its AWACS force multipliers, would easily tackle the Super Flanker, the presence of a brand new fighter – that is more powerful than anything in the IAF – could cause some anxiety among India’s war planners.
  
  According to Pakistani analyst and former PAF pilot Kaiser Tufail, the Su-35 being a twin-engine aircraft with an extremely long range, would help Pakistan “have a significant and potent presence in the Arabian Sea”.
  
  He adds: “These fighters would also allow unhindered patrolling by naval (long range maritime patrol aircraft), as well as providing top cover to our fleet at sea....Essentially, I see it as a guarantor of maritime security as far as the airspace is concerned.”
  
  To be sure, the Su-35 will be a game changer only if wielded in sufficient numbers and in sync with other air defence assets and missiles. But Pakistan is unlikely to order more than two squadrons of the Su-35 because of the expenses of operating a heavy fighter. The Super Flanker burns as much fuel per hour as an entire Karachi neighbourhood. Plus, twin engines would mean double the maintenance time of a single-engine F-16 in the PAF fleet.
  
  
  Diplomatic powwow ::
  
  How serious is the offer? Ryabkov is a junior minister in Russian cabinet. But making an offer to a financially insolvent client – that is also an exporter of terror – is one thing. Making it stick is a different ball game. Approval for the sale will have to go through several rungs of the Russian parliament Duma and the military, plus there are higher powers in Vladimir Putin’s inner circle who can overrule Ryabkov. So there’s every possibility that the Su-35 for Pakistan will end up being the equivalent of the S-300 for Iran.
  
  However, in the highly unlikely scenario that the Su-35 wears Pakistani colours, Russia can say goodbye to its largest buyer. Although Russia was the second largest arms exporter in the world during the period 2010-14, it was less diversified than the US. According to SIPRI, “Three countries; India, China and Algeria; accounted for almost 60 per cent of total Russian exports.” India alone accounted for 39 per cent.
  
  In contrast, the US which led with 31 per cent, had Korea as its top buyer at just 9 per cent. The US therefore had a better spread than Russia.
  
  So without India, Russia’s arms exports will atrophy. And although the likes of Algeria, Indonesia and Malaysia continue to be steady buyers of Russian weapons, the flows to these countries are a trickle rather than a torrent. No country offers Russia such a long-term market as India.
  
  India was also the first international customer for the MiG 29, and in fact expressed interested in it during its development in the early 1980s. Again, the IAF was among the first air forces in the world to induct the Su-27/30. India’s early investment in the PAK-FA project is enough indication of its seriousness in the project.
  
  In the backdrop it seems unlikely Russia will go ahead with ramping defence ties with Pakistan beyond a few helicopter gunships.
  
  
  Stopping the Kozyrevs ::
  
  It was under Andrei Kozyrev’s watch that India diversified away from Russia. Kozyrev (Russian foreign minister from 1990 to 1996), who sought close ties with the West, had declared after the Soviet Union was dissolved that the new Russia would no longer give special importance to India and would in fact treat India and Pakistan as equals. So basically, the country that was indirectly responsible for the deaths of 15,000 Soviet lives during the Afghanistan War was preferred by him over friendly India.
  
  Deepa Ollapally of George Washington University writes in the paper ‘Indo-Russian Strategic Relations: New Choices and Constraints’, “Kozyrev relegated India to a secondary role. During this initial phase, which was to last until 1996, India was forced to take the initiative to try to build new bridges to the Duma and utilise earlier Soviet lobbies. India was able to exploit lobbies against Kozyrev's tilt which had formed in the Russian Federation presidential apparatus. It was aided by such figures such as Vladimir Lukin who called for greater attention to be paid to old allies.”
  
  “However, then Prime Minister P.V. Narasimha Rao had no choice but to diversify India's security links as its most crucial erstwhile ally continued to labour in confusion and anxiety over its economic and political status, with no clear signal regarding its foreign policy preferences.”
  
  Kozyrev currently lives in Miami where he has acquired money and a nice tan. He slams Putin to the delight of his American backers. The thing India and Russia must do is sidestep or sideline such actors and keep the phone lines open. For, just as there are a few Indian leaders wanting closer ties with the West at Moscow’s expense, there are some Russian leaders who cannot see the importance of having India on their side.
  
  According to Ryabkov, increasing military cooperation between Islamabad and Moscow would not negatively impact Russia's ties with India. His statements would vindicate Rao’s decision to wean India away from over-dependence on Russia. Compared with Rao, current Prime Minister Narendra Modi belongs to the right leaning RSS, which is pro-American. He is unlikely to treat such an issue lightly.

 

[aqjafri]

Go Go PAF....Masha Allah We r increasing our capability day by day.... Nazar na lagay mere watan ko insha Allah...world is now recognizes our efforts n ability.

 

[batmannow]

We are also buying weapons from usa , russia, china, france , turkey, south africa.

We know how much it matters to india when russia sells high tech weapons to pakistan.

All indian members are crying in almost 3 dozen threads related to pak russia weapon purchases.

Crying won't stop Russia giving Pakistan Su35s then why to cry ?lolzz

Calm Down

These are just pressure tactics. Pakistan to pressure the US to release additional F16's and for Russia to pressure India to procure additional MKI's.

If Pakistan is to procure another platform, it is most likely going to be J10's and J11's and not SU35. Russia will most likely not going to be the most reliable partner when procuring such an expensive and advanced platform like this.

Prove your point that , Pakistan is going to get j10s or j11s ?
Any official link ?

and you think just because india is buying western stuff which it always did like china always did with russia ... you think russia will break away or will deliberatelli jeopardise all its interests with india when it fulli knows what you did with chechen rebels and your past dealings with ukrein and indian stand for russia on cremia crisis.... think again

Russia won't be breaking away from India , its India which will shot itself in the foot , by over reacting against Pakistan Russia $u 35 deal ?
India is just on receiving side , it always was & always will be ?

as i said saeen ji before ... dont count your chickens till they hatch

As we replied before ,we don't have any chickens ,we have only lions which will see you with your dam broken dreams with PAK FA still far 50 years from now ?lolzz

 

[Super Falcon]

India is nothing every one seas it as bitch so every one wants a piece of it

Another way there is also pressure from china on russia to be closer with pakistan

If russia lusten india it looses three times bigger buyer what india is and pak to add with it

And if india go closer to russia USA pull indian strings

Russia wants india not buy weapons from its enemy

And in both cases india is looser
And why india is jealous it is bigger than us but its jealousy has no limits

Did we oppose M 777 procurment no because we dont fear but you oppose all our procurments becoz u fear

And india also went to china knees down asking not selling pak any weapons but they refused your oppinion

Every one has right to pricure weapons

India is only country in world which is jealous for neighbors