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Taliban fight takes heavy toll on Pakistani troops

Please don't under-estimate my ignorance. I do my best but haven't been to Pakistan and while I do read and talk to people that's not the same as being immersed in and thus feeling changes in culture.

How do they keep it up, then?

Are these bereaved families honored by their communities? Or are they told they shouldn't be fighting "America's war" against the Talibs and thus their husbands and fathers "deserved" to die?

Well, certainly I experienced an atmosphere "bad-mouthing" the P.A. (Bangladeshi ex-1971 Pakistani diplomat neighbors). Yet try as I might, I can't find much to love about the P.A. and ISI today: they strike me as institutions which, although tactically proficient, continue to cover up their inept strategic choices with the same prevarication, brutality, and hauteur that led to defeat in conflict after conflict, right up to the present day.


Well it is your choice to believe in what you have to. We have plenty of "believers" amongst us too, who will take the worldly things as a matter of faith. And then no amount of information, clarification would work on them.


Pak army is all volunteer, and thus it is a matter of pride to be in the army and fight for the country.

Bereaved families of the officers are the get the highest level of respect and gratitude as they are the families of the martyr.

Parents dream of the day when their son will be commissioned. And then still they dream of the day when their sons will give the ultimate sacrifice.

American and Pakistani lefties do not like this, so they come up with all kind of conspiracy theories about low morale and other $hite.

So I urge you to update your info unless the current set of pointers have become your faith.


Peace.
 
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Is that what officers say to keep up soldiers' morale so they keep fighting terrorists? That's both deceitful and cowardly! How can such officers make effective military leaders?

any lie that works, or any truth that doesnot work, is that not what you did ? deceiful and cowardly isnot it ?
 
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Pakistan army up to it's old tricks:



Pakistanis in denial 10 years after 9/11

ABBOTTABAD: The young Pakistani officer sighs when he thinks about what happened to Osama bin Laden. “Was he really here?” he said, adding that “All that, it’s like 9/11, we don’t even know if it really happened.”

Sitting at the end of the track leading to the compound where US Navy SEALs killed the al Qaeda leader on May 2, Abdullah prefers to enjoy the fresh air blowing down from the Himalayas than relive his country’s darkest hour. “This is a holiday compared to Mathani or Charsaddah,” he added, referring to parts of the northwest where Taliban bomb attacks and shootings have killed so many of his colleagues.

Abdullah is just one of millions in Pakistan who doubt that bin Laden was behind the 9/11 attacks. That spotlights the country’s ambiguous relationship with extremism and selective approach to militants in what Washington calls the headquarters of al Qaeda.

The ambiguity is all the starker given that the cataclysmic events of September 11 dragged the nuclear power into a decade of fighting and violence that the government in Islamabad claims has killed 35,000 people.

The bulk of the Taliban and al Qaeda escaped the US invasion of Afghanistan by fleeing into Pakistan. The army - furious with the West for doubting its commitment to the terror fight - said more than 3,000 soldiers have died battling them since
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Opposed to the US alliance, jihadist groups - once sponsored by the state to fight in Afghanistan and against India - have splintered into a local Taliban blamed for more than four years of unrelenting bomb attacks. In such an insecure country - so fearful of India, distrustful of America and protective of its traditional influence over Afghanistan as a counterweight to Indian power - conspiracy theories fester unchecked.

Wahab Khan Maseeb, 20, leaves his lectures at the medical faculty in Abbottabad. A young Pakistani-American in jeans and a T-shirt, he was in school in Brooklyn on that fateful day 10 years ago. He saw the ash cover everything.

Like others, he saw the “Loose Change” series of documentary films, which accused elements of the US government of carrying out the 9/11 attacks. “It was pretty convincing,” he said. In a country awash with anti-Americanism and anti-Semitism, newspapers peddled totally unsubstantiated claims that 4,000 Jews didn’t turn up to work in New York that day, so the attacks were somehow a Zionist plot.


Such theories are preached from mosques and propagated by madrassas responsible for the education of millions of largely penniless children.

Diplomatically, the US has never been more frustrated with Pakistan for refusing to, or being incapable of, rounding up al Qaeda allies in the northwestern tribal belt. US troops said the Haqqani network, whose leadership is based in North Waziristan, poses the biggest threat to security in Afghanistan, yet Pakistani intelligence agents are known to have close ties to the group. “And yet there is no choice but to maintain a relationship with Pakistan. Why? Because we’re fighting a war there,” US Defence Secretary Leon Panetta said recently. With the US relationship worse than ever in the wake of the bin Laden raid, the perception that the US has dragged Pakistan deeper into disaster is prevalent among all classes of society.

“Even educated people now believe in these theories, largely because of a large distrust with the US,” said journalist Zahid Hussain, author of “Frontline Pakistan” and “The Scorpion’s Tail”.

The danger is that conspiracy theories create a climate in which it is easier for extremist networks to recruit.

“The wave of intolerance sweeping the country is also due substantially to the conspiracy theories put about by the ruling establishment and their allies in the media,” wrote Ahmed Rashid this summer in the New Republic magazine. One popular narrative - that Washington is in cahoots with India and Israel to destroy Pakistan’s nuclear weapons and the Muslim world - papers over inadequacies of corruption and inefficiency closer to home. After the May 2 bin Laden raid, for example, Pakistan denounced the violation of sovereignty rather than elaborate on how and why the al Qaeda leader managed to live for years near the country’s top military academy.

Four months on, there are still no answers, feeding suspicions of collusion between elements in the security forces and al Qaeda. “Certainly there were perhaps retired or mid-level elements in the intelligence agencies who perhaps knew bin Laden was in the country or how to get messages to him,” Rashid told AFP.

Instead of blaming India, Israel and the US, Pakistanis should realise “it is the selective state sponsorship of extremism that is destroying the country”, he wrote in New Republic
. afp
 
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This is a great opportunity for the sacrifices made by these brave soldiers to be advertised, and special fundraisers held under the auspices of the many foundations for this purpose, with inclusion of prominent civilian and media figures. All the nation needs in this case is a little reminding and cajoling, that is all.

Funds are for cricketers, minister's sons/daughter completing mcse, funds are for fraud taxi wala scheme, funds are for highspeed trains that will never see the the day, funds are for benazir monument, funds are for bullet proof cars and so on..
 
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Solomon2,

Morale for Pakistani military comes from the love of Pakistan and Islam. Today the Pakistani Military Academy is turning out more young officers then in any another time in history and it still has to turn away many many more people.

Pakistani soldiers have sen first hand the brutality of the TTP against both soldiers and civilians. That is where the morale for fighting comes from. Sadly, you don't know Urdu or I would post interviews from soldiers talking about their morale and where they get their motivation even while knowing their comrades have died and they could also die since they lack the 24/7 air support that the US enjoys and operate in even worse terrain.

---------- Post added at 01:29 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:28 PM ----------

muse,

Looks like you're up to your old tricks. Irrelevant post from you. Questioning 9/11 does not mean one supports taliban terrorism you dolt.

---------- Post added at 01:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:29 PM ----------

Solomon2,

Here you can find out motivation of some Pakistani soldiers and civilians:

https://www.facebook.com/PAKSSG
 
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The morale problem must be terrible. I can't imagine that the troops don't suspect that many of the terrorists killing them retain the support of the ISI, that it's mostly a show to please the Americans, and therefore the low-ranking jawans are dishonored cannon fodder in the political battles of their superiors.

Americans who have become cripples in afghanistan and iraq morale is what you should be worried bout mr zion lova
 
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Despite his injuries, he does not regret going to war against the Taliban and hopes he can return to active duty.

”I am satisfied I have done something for my country,” said the 27-year-old soldier. ”If I can go back to that area and serve my country, God willing I will.”

There are some here who could learn a lot from this Pakistani hero. Despite the price he has paid he has no problem going back. He seems to understand the danger the Taliban poses to Pakistan. If those Pakistani soldiers who are doing the fighting have no regrets about taking on the Taliban. Then you should ask yourself why do you?
 
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Brave soldiers still in high spirits. Such determination will one day crush the nightmare of the Taliban.
 
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Americans who have become cripples in afghanistan and iraq morale is what you should be worried bout mr zion lova

Dear Poster,

Perhaps you got this information from the local Mullah.

The reality is as follows:

Pakistani officers fighting alongside American soldiers tell a different story than what you heard from the UK Jihadis. keeping in mind the history of Afghanistan, the US soldiers have made tremendous gains. They are brave and would match the morale of the best soldiers in the world.

So please do not use your clouded glasses to see this world.

Peace.
 
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Dear Poster,

Perhaps you got this information from the local Mullah.

The reality is as follows:

Pakistani officers fighting alongside American soldiers tell a different story than what you heard from the UK Jihadis. keeping in mind the history of Afghanistan, the US soldiers have made tremendous gains. They are brave and would match the morale of the best soldiers in the world.

So please do not use your clouded glasses to see this world.

Peace.

This won't advance your visa application
 
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25 Pak soldiers killed in cross-border attack


* 20 terrorists also killed as 200-300 Afghan-based ‘terrorists’ attack 7 FC posts in Chitral

* Military says intelligence about presence of Pakistani, Afghan terrorists had been passed to NATO, Afghan authorities but no worthwhile action was taken

ISLAMABAD: Taliban fighters killed 25 Pakistani troops in a cross-border raid Saturday, the military said, blaming alleged inaction by Afghanistan and NATO in the latest flaring of tensions between the neighbours.

Some 200 to 300 “terrorists” based in Afghanistan attacked seven paramilitary Frontier Corps checkposts in the northwestern district of Chitral early Saturday morning, Pakistan’s military said in a statement.

The term “terrorists” is frequently used by the military for Taliban and al Qaeda-linked militants. The military said both Pakistani and Afghan fighters were involved. “At least 25 security forces personnel embraced shahadat (martyrdom) in the attack,” the statement said, adding that the attack was launched “from across the border”. About 20 of the militants were believed to have been killed. The border posts were overrun by militants, but reinforcements have now been sent, it said.

The Pakistani military said that those believed to have co-ordinated the raid – including a radical cleric from the Swat valley, Maulana Fazlullah, and a Pakistani Taliban commander from Bajaur, Faqir Muhammad - had previously fled into Afghanistan in the face of Pakistani military offensives.

“Since their expulsion from their native areas, the terrorists have organised themselves in Kunar and Nuristan provinces with the support of local Afghan authorities,” the military’s statement said.

It said the “scanty presence of NATO and ANA (Afghan National Army) forces” along the border had led to “safe havens” for militants on the Afghan side, allowing them to launch attacks in Pakistan.

Intelligence about the presence of Pakistani militants and their Afghan supporters had been passed to NATO and Afghan authorities, the statement said.

“But no worthwhile action has been taken against the terrorists and attack against Pakistani border posts have continued with impunity,” it said. It was the latest in a series of alleged cross-border incidents, many of which have raised tensions between the neighbours as the Afghan war continues to claim a high toll after almost 10 years
. afp
 
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Hmmm thats very good physical therapy really help him to come up i really appreciate ur will power will power is every thing for the if u dont have u cant do anything...................................
 
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We have to engage this menace of extremism. We cannot allow parallel ruling systems to run in this country. We need to contain extremism through military muscle and also education.

If this country has to progress, all the in-fighting has to stop. Otherwise, this nation will face extinction in the long run.

This is our war too. We need to forget USA and India in this regard. Our military top brass also should come clean on the matter of Haqqani Network. If we do not plan to target it, fine. However, it should not be allowed to use Pakistani territory for fighting war in Afghanistan. This is the real bone of contention between Pakistan and WEST. All the previous gains and sacrifices made by Pakistan are getting overlooked just because of this strategic blunder.

In the end, defeating extremism would serve our interests perfectly in the region and people would be able to live without fear.
 
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Its so sad that we are facing heavy terrorism sponsored from acroos the border area. the US/NATO is directly involved in this evil game no doubt about that.They shold be sincere to get rid of this terrorism game and shold go home peacefully.:smokin:
 
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