Sweden decides against Hercules replacement, opts for MLU instead

[Zarvan]

While Sweden had planned to replace its ageing C-130H Hercules airlifters, it will now upgrade them instead. Source: IHS Markit/Patrick Allen

Sweden has decided against procuring a new transport aircraft type, opting instead to upgrade its ageing Lockheed Martin C-130H Hercules fleet, a service official disclosed on 8 May.

Speaking to reporters, Colonel Magnus Liljegren from the Swedish Air Force (SwAF) headquarters said that the service's six remaining C-130Hs (two of the original eight were mothballed in 2015) will be put through a mid-life upgrade (MLU) that will run from about 2020 to 2024.

"[Replacing the C-130Hs] is a question that has been asked [in Sweden] forever," Col Liljegren said, noting that the SwAF operates the oldest C-130 fleet in Europe with aircraft dating back to the mid-1960s. "We are now looking at an MLU instead."

According to Col Liljegren, this MLU will likely cover the aircraft's avionics and "some other products", but will not involve major structural work such as replacing the centre wing-box. As noted by the colonel, structural work such as this would be too expensive considering the airframe hours that are left in the fleet. Even with the MLU, the six C-130Hs will not fly beyond 2030-32.

With one of the SwAF's C-130Hs serving also as an aerial refuelling platform, the SwAF will likely lose this capability temporarily while that particular aircraft goes through the MLU. However, as Col Liljegren explained, this is not a capability that is often used by the SwAF.

Having received the first of its C-130H aircraft in 1965, the SwAF had hoped to have them upgraded as part of the US Air Force's wider Avionics Modernization Program (AMP). However, Sweden had already pulled out of the programme on cost grounds by the time it was cancelled by the US Department of Defense in early 2012.

The current plans for a C-130H MLU are contrary to earlier announced objective of replacing them with a new and modern type, with a procurement effort to be launched in 2021.

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http://www.janes.com/article/70179/sweden-decides-against-hercules-replacement-opts-for-mlu-instead

 

[Fledgingwings]

How many hercules,s does Swaf has?

 

[Lord Of Gondor]

How many hercules,s does Swaf has?

Speaking to reporters, Colonel Magnus Liljegren from the Swedish Air Force (SwAF) headquarters said that the service's six remaining C-130Hs (two of the original eight were mothballed in 2015) will be put through a mid-life upgrade (MLU) that will run from about 2020 to 2024.

 

[Penguin]

 

[Vergennes]

@A.P. Richelieu @Penguin

Sweden pushes off C-130 replacement, dashing Brazil’s hopes of near-term KC-390 sale


STOCKHOLM — The Swedish Air Force has postponed plans to upgrade its Lockheed Martin C-130H Hercules fleet instead opting to do a mid-life upgrade for its six transport aircraft, an Air Force official said May 8.

Col. Magnus Liljegren, head of the Air Force department at the Swedish armed forces headquarters, said it was probable that the work would consist of updates to aircraft’s avionics systems, not structural upgrades of the airframe itself. For that reason, the C-130s will fly only until the early 2030s.

“The question is still there: Is [an upgrade] worth it or not,” he said. “As it seems now, yes, we are going for a mid-life update.”

The decision buys Sweden a little more than a decade to figure out how it will replace its C-130 inventory, which is the oldest in Europe. However, it also puts to rest questions about whether Sweden would emerge as a near-term customer for Brazil’s KC-390, produced by Embraer.

Sweden and Brazil have developed a close military partnership, in large part because of the South American country’s decision to buy 36 Gripen E/F aircraft from Saab instead of the Dassault Rafale and Boeing Super Hornet. In 2015, Maj. Gen. Micael Bydén, then the head of the Swedish Air Force, said the KC-390 was a "definite alternative if it develops the way it has been described."

Now, with Sweden’s defense budget already straining to accommodate new procurement, “it’s not on the table,” Liljegren told reporters during a briefing in Stockholm. Defense News attended the briefing as part of a Saab-sponsored media trip and accepted travel and hotel accommodations provided by the company.

Speaking to reporters days later, Brazilian Brig. Gen. Márcio Bruno Bonotto, the country’s president of the coordinating committee of combat aircraft program, sounded an exasperated note about the lack of international commitment to the KC-390. Bonotto said that he had conversations with a foreign military — not Sweden — where he expressed concerns about how Brazil had spent millions of dollars on that country’s products with no reciprocation.

“What kind of partnership is [that]?” he asked. “That's the question."

He added: "Regarding the Swedish, we have the same approach. We don't want that [countries] buy our products, talking about the KC-390, because we are friends. I'd like to go to the competition, because I'm sure that we have a good product."

The C-130 midlife upgrade will likely occur from 2020 to 2024, Liljegren said. The Air Force has not yet selected a defense company to conduct the upgrade work, but C-130 prime contractor Lockheed Martin would be a likely contender.

Because Sweden has only six C-130s, the work will make a major impact on aircraft availability.

“We will perhaps go down to 50 percent [availability], and 50 percent is two to three aircraft,” he said.

http://www.defensenews.com/articles...ashing-brazils-hopes-of-near-term-kc-390-sale

-

Speaking to reporters days later, Brazilian Brig. Gen. Márcio Bruno Bonotto, the country’s president of the coordinating committee of combat aircraft program, sounded an exasperated note about the lack of international commitment to the KC-390. Bonotto said that he had conversations with a foreign military — not Sweden — where he expressed concerns about how Brazil had spent millions of dollars on that country’s products with no reciprocation.

“What kind of partnership is [that]?” he asked. “That's the question."

@Taygibay @Louiq XIV Why do I have the strong feeling that he's talking about France ?

Anyway back in the time if I remember,there was an agreement between Lula and Sarkozy where France pledged to order a dozen if not more KC-390s..... IF Brazil bought the rafale ?

 

[Penguin]

Anyway back in the time if I remember,there was an agreement between Lula and Sarkozy where France pledged to order a dozen if not more KC-390s..... IF Brazil bought the rafale ?

On 7 September 2009, it was announced that France was interested in buying 10 KC-390s as part of negotiations for Brazil to buy the Dassault Rafale.
http://www.estadao.com.br/noticias/...anceses-preve-venda-de-jato-da-embraer,430878
Translated excerpt: In addition to confirming the opening of negotiations for the purchase by the Brazilian government of 36 French Rafale fighters, the statement issued on the occasion of the French President Nicolas Sarkozy's visit to Brazil, signaled the French government's intention to buy 10 transport planes Military helicopters KC-390. The provision marks the compromise between the two countries for the development of a partnership in the aviation industry.

On 2 October 2009, Sweden declared its intention to evaluate the KC-390 transport aircraft for long term tactical air transport needs connected to its F-X2 offer on JAS 39 Gripen
http://www. defence talk .com/saab-offers-gripen-fighter-technology-transfer-to-brazil-22389/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embraer_KC-390

Differrent promises, it would seem.

 

[A.P. Richelieu]

On 7 September 2009, it was announced that France was interested in buying 10 KC-390s as part of negotiations for Brazil to buy the Dassault Rafale.
http://www.estadao.com.br/noticias/...anceses-preve-venda-de-jato-da-embraer,430878

On 2 October 2009, Sweden declared its intention to evaluate the KC-390 transport aircraft for long term tactical air transport needs connected to its F-X2 offer on JAS 39 Gripen
http://www. defence talk .com/saab-offers-gripen-fighter-technology-transfer-to-brazil-22389/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embraer_KC-390

Differrent promises, it would seem.

Latest study shows the defense is underbudgeted.
We need to increase the budget (today 5,25B$) by about 15-20% to meet the plan.

Lots of holes to fill.
Then again, it is about 1% of GDP.
In 1975, we spent 3,1% of GDP.

 

[Penguin]

Latest study shows the defense is underbudgeted.
We need to increase the budget (today 5,25B$) by about 15-20% to meet the plan.

Lots of holes to fill.
Then again, it is about 1% of GDP.
In 1975, we spent 3,1% of GDP.

Aren't you glad you're not part of NATO ;-)

 

[T-123456]

A country like Sweden wont replace 6 or 8 50 year old C130s but goes for an update?

 

[The Accountant]

While Sweden had planned to replace its ageing C-130H Hercules airlifters, it will now upgrade them instead. Source: IHS Markit/Patrick Allen

Sweden has decided against procuring a new transport aircraft type, opting instead to upgrade its ageing Lockheed Martin C-130H Hercules fleet, a service official disclosed on 8 May.

Speaking to reporters, Colonel Magnus Liljegren from the Swedish Air Force (SwAF) headquarters said that the service's six remaining C-130Hs (two of the original eight were mothballed in 2015) will be put through a mid-life upgrade (MLU) that will run from about 2020 to 2024.

"[Replacing the C-130Hs] is a question that has been asked [in Sweden] forever," Col Liljegren said, noting that the SwAF operates the oldest C-130 fleet in Europe with aircraft dating back to the mid-1960s. "We are now looking at an MLU instead."

According to Col Liljegren, this MLU will likely cover the aircraft's avionics and "some other products", but will not involve major structural work such as replacing the centre wing-box. As noted by the colonel, structural work such as this would be too expensive considering the airframe hours that are left in the fleet. Even with the MLU, the six C-130Hs will not fly beyond 2030-32.

With one of the SwAF's C-130Hs serving also as an aerial refuelling platform, the SwAF will likely lose this capability temporarily while that particular aircraft goes through the MLU. However, as Col Liljegren explained, this is not a capability that is often used by the SwAF.

Having received the first of its C-130H aircraft in 1965, the SwAF had hoped to have them upgraded as part of the US Air Force's wider Avionics Modernization Program (AMP). However, Sweden had already pulled out of the programme on cost grounds by the time it was cancelled by the US Department of Defense in early 2012.

The current plans for a C-130H MLU are contrary to earlier announced objective of replacing them with a new and modern type, with a procurement effort to be launched in 2021.

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http://www.janes.com/article/70179/sweden-decides-against-hercules-replacement-opts-for-mlu-instead

If c130 have refueling capability then why we are not using the same for our f16s ? Is this again uncle Sam's approval issue ?

 

[Penguin]

If c130 have refueling capability then why we are not using the same for our f16s ? Is this again uncle Sam's approval issue ?

http://www.lockheedmartin.com.au/content/dam/lockheed/data/aero/documents/global-sustainment/product-support/2011HOC-Presentations/Wed_1115-C-130_Retrofit_Kit_Offerings.pdf
https://dimo.com/in-flight-refueling/
https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/malaysia-signs-up-for-two-c-130-tanker-conversions-24419/
http://www.lockheedmartin.com.au/co...ons/Wed_1115-C-130_Retrofit_Kit_Offerings.pdf
It's a conversion, it costs money.

A country like Sweden wont replace 6 or 8 50 year old C130s but goes for an update?

Replace? Not yet.

 

[A.P. Richelieu]

A country like Sweden wont replace 6 or 8 50 year old C130s but goes for an update?

They claim that structurally, the planes can fly until 2030,
but need other improvements.

Aren't you glad you're not part of NATO ;-)

The agreement NATO has is to increase to 2% in 2024.
We need to increase to 1,3% to meet the plan.
If we want to do more than what is in the plan, further increases are needed,
so we might end up with 2% as well.

 

[The Accountant]

http://www.lockheedmartin.com.au/co...ons/Wed_1115-C-130_Retrofit_Kit_Offerings.pdf
https://dimo.com/in-flight-refueling/
https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/malaysia-signs-up-for-two-c-130-tanker-conversions-24419/
It's a conversion, it costs money.


Replace? Not yet.

But i think PAF should go for it ... with 18 c130 in hands ... few converted could be a trumendous boast to the capabilities specially for MLUs without cft ... i wonder why we did not opt for it till now ...

 

[war&peace]

Sweden has no enemies in the region so it is not in a hurry to spend a lot on defense. But MLU will afford Sweden the time to observe the development of new military transport airplanes including KC-390 and will be in a better position to decide about future upgrades.

 

[Penguin]

But i think PAF should go for it ... with 18 c130 in hands ... few converted could be a trumendous boast to the capabilities specially for MLUs without cft ... i wonder why we did not opt for it till now ...

Pakistan got four Il-78MP aircraft from Ukrainian surplus aircraft stocks, fitted with removable fuel tanks in the cargo hold and 3 UPAZ-1M 'Sakhalin', (unifitsirovaniy podvesnoy agregat zaprahvki;— standardised suspended refuelling unit), refuelling pods; two on pylons under the outer wings, and the third on the port side of the rear fuselage. (the length of the hose deployed in the airflow is about 26 m, the hose inner diameter is 52 mm, the fuel transfer rate is 900 to 2,200 liters/min). The first of the four aircraft was delivered in December 2009. A total of four Il-78MPs have been delivered to the PAF as of May 2012. The Il-78MP is a multi-role aerial refuelling tanker/transport aircraft, used not only by the Pakistan Air Force but also by the Indian and Chinese Air Forces (besides Russia and Ukraine). Last January, the Pakistan Air Force signed an agreement with Russia's JSC Rosoboronexport for the refurbished of its fleet of Ilyushin Il-78 air-to-air refuelling tanker aircraft at the Russian 360th Aircraft Repair Plant.
IL-78s tank the JF-17, which has a refuelling probe fitted as standard, and the Mirage III/VI Rose aircraft. By contrast, F16 normally tanks via boom to the aircraft's back. So, without acquiring e.g. CFT or wingtank that houses a refuelling probe, F16 can't do hose and drogue refuelling, and KC-130 would be useless.

See CARTS:
http://www.codeonemagazine.com/article.html?item_id=56
http://www.f-16.net/f-16-news-article4163.html

Or earlier ART/S:
https://airrefuelingarchive.wordpress.com/2009/05/12/sargent-fletcher-arts-pod-f-16-vista/
https://airrefuelingarchive.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/7a7c4b39d01.pdf.

And, of course, see: https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/disc...not-have-in-flight-refuelling-support.455035/