Su-30MKI & JF-17 Air Fight

[sancho]

Kindly try searching about J7Pgs BVR capability i hope u will be shocked.
J7PGs do have BVR capability.

F-7PG

The F-7MG fighter is serving with the Pakistani Air Force (PAF) as the F-7PG. The PG variant is generally same as the MG variant but its avionic configuration has been tailored to meet the PAF requirements. As the Marconi Super Skyranger radar did not meet the PAF requirements, the F-7PG is fitted with an I-band Italian FIAR Grifo-7 pulse-Doppler fire-control radar (37km range), which was optimised to fire the U.S.-made AIM-9L all-aspect short-range AAM, making a lethal combination in air-to-air combat.

Jian-7 (J-7, F-7, Fishbed) Interceptor Fighter - SinoDefence.com

Besides that this was confirmed by pakistani members here before too!

PAFs thinking isnt capped in a bottle.Havent u heard of the plans?
BlockI.BlockII,Block III all will be upgraded and try using ur mind.Right now the infant JF17 is considered to be as capabale as F16 Block 15 what will it be compaired to after it gets matures?

As far as I read it in the JF thread, PAF has planed this:

50 x JF with current Chinese config
100 x possibly with French config
100 - 150 x improved versions with AESA radars and higher trust engines mainly

In the same timeframe IAF has planed:

upgrading 60 x Mig 29 to SMT
upgrading 50 x Mirage 2000 to 2005
40 x LCA MK1
100 - 150 x improved versions with AESA radars and higher thrust engines mainy

Except of the improved versions of JF and LCA, all thes fighters will be multi role fighters, with new avionics, muti mode radars, BVR and PG strike capable, so technically on par and as you can see even in the same numbers.
But as I said, these will only be the low end of PAF and IAF, just like F7 and Mig 21 in the past!

 

[sancho]

Bison will not be a major threat on its own just 2-3 years down the line, the MIG-21 platform is agile but that is about it and that point remains valid no matter what engineering feats are pulled off, limited space and limited performance envelop of such an old design cannot be overriden.
Bison will need helping hands to stand a chance in future.

That's what I said right? IAF will never let them engage JF 17, or F16 alone, because they are clearly inferior to them. But combined with AWACS, or MKI, they are still very useful in BVR.

Anyways JF-17 is not an Su-30 killer either...it will however be a very flexible platform and may prove to be a very formidable jet in the hands of PAF.

Air Superiority would be the primary domain of FC-20 and F-16.

Totally agree with you! JF is a good and cost-effective fighter, for those roles it was meant for, but that was not fighting MKIs, or MMRCAs.

 

[Myth_buster_1]

40 x LCA MK1
100 - 150 x improved versions with AESA radars and higher thrust engines mainy

bullchit! provide me a credible source not a fanboy claim that IAF will have 150-200 LCAs by 2020? Infact only by 2024 will their be a LCA version ready with AESA radar etc for production while a 4.5 gen version of JF-17 will be operational.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

As far as I read it in the JF thread, PAF has planed this:

50 x JF with current Chinese config
100 x possibly with French config
100 - 150 x improved versions with AESA radars and higher trust engines mainly

What about AESA and engine PAF is looking for Block II?

In the same timeframe IAF has planed:
upgrading 60 x Mig 29 to SMT
upgrading 50 x Mirage 2000 to 2005
40 x LCA MK1
100 - 150 x improved versions with AESA radars and higher thrust engines mainy

Sorry to interupt the gravy train we didnt ask about indian plans?
We already have an active sqadron and ur nowhere in even induction.Its so far for u guys to talk about AESA and stuff.Even different India sites talk about the proper induction of lca till 2020(back bone to be precise)Under these circumstances im not even sure if u induct them completely by 2025
Till then we might be looking on something new.As the plan of induction of all Blocks of Thunder is by 2014-15

 

[DMLA]

What about AESA and engine PAF is looking for Block II?

Sorry to interupt the gravy train we didnt ask about indian plans?
We already have an active sqadron and ur nowhere in even induction.Its so far for u guys to talk about AESA and stuff.Even different India sites talk about the proper induction of lca till 2020(back bone to be precise)Under these circumstances im not even sure if u induct them completely by 2025
Till then we might be looking on something new.As the plan of induction of all Blocks of Thunder is by 2014-15

I beg to disagree. Unlike pakistan, India has AESA sources from which we can obtain the said systems if we want to. However, it has been decided that we would call for only the AESA modules and processing units and integrate the radar in India. RFI has already been sent out for the same. so unlike pakistan where all I hear is chinese developments, India has a clear road ahead wrt AESA depoyment.

wrt LCA, in a response at the parliament (Question Hour) it was stated that IOC is slated for next year. weapon intagration, live firing, high speed envelope, etc have been tested. Radar integration (MMR) is going on and AAM tests can be expected soon.
Work on the mk-II may take "x" number of years which I am not privy to. However I am certain of one thing. If it indeed takes 10+ years, IAF will go for 250+ MMRCA instead...all with AESA

 

[Storm Force]

Growler

A word of caution RE LCA INDUCTION

If the IAF don,t get LCA MK2 by 2015 LATEST complete as planned with both the euro jet engine and aesa radar THE INDIANS will simply double the MMRCA order.

Which wud you prefer as a PAF fan boy

1. 126 mmrca & 150+ LCA

OR

250 MMRCA

India does not have the cash constraints or LACK OF SELLERS for any MMRCA deal.

Anything is possible be it F18SH Typhoon Rafael or PAK FA FGFA

 

[12345]

By 2020-2025 IAF force structure will resemble more or less be like this

With 250 FGFA( as per deal 200 2 seaters and 50 singleseat) taking the primary air dominance role.
250 MCA multi role(more biased for deep strike role)
280 MKI multi role
200 MRCA multirole
200 LCA air defence(40 MKI,160 MKII)

This is after retiring all the current aircraft.Mare likely by 2025.
But if we take 2020,the numbers will include upgraded 29,Mirage,Jaguars

After this decade,IAF will be consolidating its numbers on both AMCA and FGFA and throwing numbers into UCAV`s

MKI,MRCA will be last foreign fighter to be inducted while LCA will be last 4th gen to be inducted into IAF.

Future of the force structure is around FGFA and AMCA.Since IN and RuN also proposed a 5th gen carrier aircraft.
And IN will make its final decision in 2014 (to choose either of FGFA/AMCA) only after MCA prototype flies.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

I beg to disagree. Unlike pakistan, India has AESA sources from which we can obtain the said systems if we want to. However, it has been decided that we would call for only the AESA modules and processing units and integrate the radar in India. RFI has already been sent out for the same. so unlike pakistan where all I hear is chinese developments, India has a clear road ahead wrt AESA depoyment.

ever heard of VIXEN offer from UK?French offers?
The chinese AESA is an option if its better and in time of the BlockII.

wrt LCA, in a response at the parliament (Question Hour) it was stated that IOC is slated for next year. weapon intagration, live firing, high speed envelope, etc have been tested. Radar integration (MMR) is going on and AAM tests can be expected soon.

Please buddy any real confirmed news that its ready?its still in testin

Work on the mk-II may take "x" number of years which I am not privy to. However I am certain of one thing. If it indeed takes 10+ years, IAF will go for 250+ MMRCA instead...all with AESA

Nice joke buddy.....acordin to ur govt LCA will be ur backbone till 2020.But ever wonder that even after decades ur LCA aint ready yet and will it be completely inducted till 2020??
About ur being certain of 250 Mrca buddy are u PM of india?
Try understandin this :
Your first MRCA jet may arrive till 2015?
2020 is deadline set by ur gov to completely induct LCA....If it fails? and it will
It will take another 10 years to induct more mrcas and till then who knows what happens

 

[DMLA]

ever heard of VIXEN offer from UK?French offers?
The chinese AESA is an option if its better and in time of the BlockII.



Please buddy any real confirmed news that its ready?its still in testin


Nice joke buddy.....acordin to ur govt LCA will be ur backbone till 2020.But ever wonder that even after decades ur LCA aint ready yet and will it be completely inducted till 2020??
About ur being certain of 250 Mrca buddy are u PM of india?
Try understandin this :
Your first MRCA jet may arrive till 2015?
2020 is deadline set by ur gov to completely induct LCA....If it fails? and it will
It will take another 10 years to induct more mrcas and till then who knows what happens

Vixen???? Are you talking about captor? No I haven't heard of any offers from any of the sources you mentioned. The fact is those same countries are still not ready with an AESA on their own birds. And you are trying to tell me the road ahead for JF-17 is crystal clear? My contention was that options for LCA are well known unlike JF-17.

Dude do tell me what should we do if the LCA is not ready? sit on our ***** and wait till china bombs us?

If LCA doesn't come through, we have MMRCA to FALL BACK ON. Even vendors in fray for MMRCA are betting on the order being expanded as was the case with some interviews during the recent Defexpo. So we do not need to PM to give you that answer

Please understand that I am not saying the jf-17 will not get an AESA radar. I am saying I have absolutely no idea of any source at this stage!

Frankly I don't care to talk about LCA till the time it gets inducted. I have no idea about the mk-II but LCA in its present form includes 40 aircrafts. We should wait for 2-3 years to see the actual deployment of the said aircrafts and further developments!

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Have fun live in fantasy land.I dont need to reply to some ego satisfing fanboy.

 

[sab]

LCA ka paida hone me der ho raha hai.

JF-17 paida jaldi hua but bahut sara operetion se guzaar na parega usko. EX- Heart (read engine as PAF is not happy with present Kemov engine); Eyes (read radar-they are searching for more capable radar); Brain (read -avionics to be sourced from UK or Italy changing the chinese avionics); skin (composite material to be used more ). Agar itana hi defect or inefficiency hai to jaldi paida honese faidaa kya????

 

[xman]

delete this thread!

 

[sancho]

bullchit! provide me a credible source not a fanboy claim that IAF will have 150-200 LCAs by 2020? Infact only by 2024 will their be a LCA version ready with AESA radar etc for production while a 4.5 gen version of JF-17 will be operational.

Sorry to interupt the gravy train we didnt ask about indian plans?
We already have an active sqadron and ur nowhere in even induction.Its so far for u guys to talk about AESA and stuff.Even different India sites talk about the proper induction of lca till 2020(back bone to be precise)Under these circumstances im not even sure if u induct them completely by 2025
Till then we might be looking on something new.As the plan of induction of all Blocks of Thunder is by 2014-15

Sad, but I expected this! The only point you get from my post is LCA!

However, I am not going to argue with you about LCA, or it's capabilites in this thread, there is a dedicated LCA news and discussion thread for this. I only pointed out that JF will offer the same techs, weapons and capabilities like the low end of IAF so is comparable to them and not to MKI.

 

[Parashuram1]

Haven't you discussed this topic to death? Warring of words between Indian, Pakistani and Chinese members and then the whole comparison of economy, military strength, infrastructure continues on the thread.

I think this thread should be closed. Apart from the obvious nonsensical content, this thread is so old that even a 4 year old could become a Su-30 MKI or JF-17 pilot after reading the entire thread.

 

[MZUBAIR]

Guys plz this debate is so old.