Stone Age Soanian Culture (Ancient Pakistan II)

[U-571]

No, you had Aryans in Pakistan such as the Gandhari's:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gandhari_people

The Rig Veda was originally composed along the Indus River, specifically in the Punjab:

https://www.britannica.com/topic/Rigveda

what ever is the history of rigveda, i particularly have zero interests in mythological texts and even historians and archaeologists refrain from citing rigveda as historical texts and , rigveda may have been composed in Punjab according to linguists (which i perticularly would doubt as linguists during british era had special racial agenda at hand so what ever their conclusions would be based on their bias) but the rest of hindu mythology all deals with events in gangetic plains meaning, the indo aryans tribals moved and settled ultimately in gangetic plains and from there archeologists have first evidences of a vedic culture, kingdoms so far there are none in the indus valley and pakistan, gandhari grave culture has been debunked as vedic culture as well.

As the direct DNA samples of harappa people from india have shown zero links with central asian steps i would consider migration theory nearly debunked until and unless this study too is challenged by any newer study, the excavation of bronze chariots and swords also debunks the AMT since it seem to show presence of warrior races before the supposed warrior class migration from central asia.

 

[kalakaar]

No, you had Aryans in Pakistan such as the Gandhari's:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gandhari_people

The Rig Veda was originally composed along the Indus River, specifically in the Punjab:

https://www.britannica.com/topic/Rigveda

Rigveda, (Sanskrit: “The Knowledge of Verses”) also spelled Ṛgveda, the oldest of the sacred books of Hinduism, composed in an ancient form of Sanskrit about 1500 bce, in what is now the Punjab region of India and Pakistan. It consists of a collection of 1,028 poems grouped into 10 “circles” (mandalas). It is generally agreed that the first and last books were created later than the middle books. The Rigveda was preserved orally before it was written down about 300 bce.

This is what is said. Where does it say Indus? You liar! And the actual Punjab comprised Himachal Pradesh, Haryana, current Punjab and part of UP too.

 

[Hamza913]

what ever is the history of rigveda, i particularly have zero interests in mythological texts and even historians and archaeologists refrain from citing rigveda as historical texts and , rigveda may have been composed in Punjab according to linguists (which i perticularly would doubt as linguists during british era had special racial agenda at hand so what ever their conclusions would be based on their bias) but the rest of hindu mythology all deals with events in gangetic plains meaning, the indo aryans tribals moved and settled ultimately in gangetic plains and from there archeologists have first evidences of a vedic culture, kingdoms so far there are none in the indus valley and pakistan, gandhari grave culture has been debunked as vedic culture as well.

As the direct DNA samples of harappa people from india have shown zero links with central asian steps i would consider migration theory nearly debunked until and unless this study too is challenged by any newer study, the excavation of bronze chariots and swords also debunks the AMT since it seem to show presence of warrior races before the supposed warrior class migration from central asia.

Our modern understanding of the history of the region doesn't really on colonialist historians, also, not all of them were racist (in fact, some considered the Aryan migrations as an excellent argument against racism).

Wrong, the Rig Veda is literally integral to Vedic culture. Indo-Aryan culture started along the Indus River, as my previous map clearly showed.

No, it hasn't been debunked, the Gandhari people were almost certainly Vedic. In fact, the grave culture pretty conclusively proves the mixing between Aryans and non-Aryans mainly occurred along the Indus (since the grave culture has elements of Aryan and Harappan culture).

Wrong, you are horribly wrong. You are so wrong, it's actually mind boggling how you could even think such a thing:

https://www.thehindu.com/sci-tech/s...he-aryan-migration-debate/article19090301.ece

Rigveda, (Sanskrit: “The Knowledge of Verses”) also spelled Ṛgveda, the oldest of the sacred books of Hinduism, composed in an ancient form of Sanskrit about 1500 bce, in what is now the Punjab region of India and Pakistan. It consists of a collection of 1,028 poems grouped into 10 “circles” (mandalas). It is generally agreed that the first and last books were created later than the middle books. The Rigveda was preserved orally before it was written down about 300 bce.


This is what is said. Where does it say Indus? You liar!

Can you read?

"Rigveda, (Sanskrit: “The Knowledge of Verses”) also spelled Ṛgveda, the oldest of the sacred books of Hinduism, composed in an ancient form of Sanskrit about 1500 bce, in what is now the Punjab region of India and Pakistan."

Do you know where the Punjab is? Along the Indus river you numpty.

 

[kalakaar]

o you know where the Punjab is? Along the Indus river you numpty.

What Nonsense!! Are you mad???
The Punjab starts from Sindhu and Ends at Yamuna. With sub divisions.

 

[Hamza913]

What Nonsense!! Are you mad???
The Punjab starts from Sindhu and Ends at Yamuna. With sub divisions.

The Punjab is part of the Indus Valley, IVC had it's biggest settlements in the region and tributaries of the Indus River do flow through it.

 

[kalakaar]

The Punjab is part of the Indus Valley, IVC had it's biggest settlements in the region and tributaries of the Indus River do flow through it.

Yamuna and Saraswati are not tributaries of Sindhu nadi
The mightiest rivers was Saraswati which dried up and went underground this is what we are told since childhood and Next was Sindhu nadi.
You literally have no idea about vedic civilization. You are a Muslim!!

In many occasions when we are at the Ganga banks we do the Nadistuti as given in rigveda.

It's not the region, but traditions which we have developed we are continuing them. What you have to do with Nadi stuti?? It's not allowed in Islam

 

[U-571]

Our modern understanding of the history of the region doesn't really on colonialist historians, also, not all of them were racist (in fact, some considered the Aryan migrations as an excellent argument against racism).

Wrong, the Rig Veda is literally integral to Vedic culture. Indo-Aryan culture started along the Indus River, as my previous map clearly showed.

No, it hasn't been debunked, the Gandhari people were almost certainly Vedic. In fact, the grave culture pretty conclusively proves the mixing between Aryans and non-Aryans mainly occurred along the Indus (since the grave culture has elements of Aryan and Harappan culture).

Wrong, you are horribly wrong. You are so wrong, it's actually mind boggling how you could even think such a thing:

https://www.thehindu.com/sci-tech/s...he-aryan-migration-debate/article19090301.ece



Can you read?

"Rigveda, (Sanskrit: “The Knowledge of Verses”) also spelled Ṛgveda, the oldest of the sacred books of Hinduism, composed in an ancient form of Sanskrit about 1500 bce, in what is now the Punjab region of India and Pakistan."

Do you know where the Punjab is? Along the Indus river you numpty.

zero evidence of your BS.

if you have a single Punjabi vedic culture sites, please point out, gandhari grave culture has already been disproven as vedic culture

 

[Hamza913]

zero evidence of your BS.

I provided you with ample evidence (there is even more out there).

If you wish to dig your head in the sand, be my guest.

Yamuna and Saraswati are not tributaries of Sindhu nadi
The mightiest rivers was Saraswati which dried up and went underground this is what we are told since childhood and Next was Sindhu nadi.
You literally have no idea about vedic civilization. You are a Muslim!!

In many occasions when we are at the Ganga banks we do the Nadistuti as given in rigveda.

It's not the region, but traditions which we have developed we are continuing them. What you have to do with Nadi stuti?? It's not allowed in Islam

Irrelevant, the Punjab is still part of the Indus region, not the Gangetic one like most of Hindustan.

Funny, whenever we champion our Muslim identity, you claim we are Hindu converts. Then, when we show interest in this region's pre-Islamic history you say we are Muslims who are irrelevant to this region's history. Make up your mind!

Again, irrelevant. In fact, it's even sadder that a Muslim knows your own history better than you do.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

You don't even know that Haryana is situated near Yamuna basins not Ganga. And you are a PDF Think Tank

Mmm. People like you are the reason why Gangadesh has low IQ. Look at this map below. River Yamuna is a tributary river of Ganga therefore is in the Ganga Basin.

Almost all of Haryana falls in the Ganga Basin. The border between Haryana and Indian Punjab is where it tips over into Indus Basin. Therefore Indian Punjab and Sikhoo's can claim and indeed are Indus people. That leaves 95% of India either Ganga or Dravid. Basically mostly Aboriginal shudra, Austroloid aboriginal stock with few drops of purity from our part of the world brought through people migrating. That 5% cream is what you show as 'face' of India including Bollywood. But we know what rest of India is. Ganga slumdogs and Dravid pygmies who until recently were walking about half naked and still just poop on the streets as matter of habit. Because of this primitive nature of your people we see this yearning to be part of the mighty Indus or somehow to link yourself to or associate with it.

 

[U-571]

Mmm. People like you are the reason why Gangadesh has low IQ. Look at this map below. River Yamuna is a tributary river of Ganga therefore is in the Ganga Basin.

Almost all of Haryana falls in the Ganga Basin. The border between Haryana and Indian Punjab is where it tips over into Indus Basin. Therefore Indian Punjab and Sikhoo's can claim and indeed are Indus people. That leaves 95% of India either Ganga or Dravid. Basically mostly Aboriginal shudra, Austroloid aboriginal stock with few drops of purity from our part of the world brought through people migrating. That 5% cream is what you show as 'face' of India including Bollywood. But we know what rest of India is. Ganga slumdogs and Dravid pygmies who until recently were walking about half naked and still just poop on the streets as matter of habit. Because of this primitive nature of your people we see this yearning to be part of the mighty Indus or somehow to link yourself to or associate with it.

Punjabi people are quarter bred westerm asia after being bastardised by successive invasions of the western asian empires, to think Punjabi people are therefore superior would be very misleading, Punjabi people were also conquered and bastardised three quarters from the eastern asian empires by successive indo aryan empires and thus they became indo aryans themselves.

your racial purity notion is nothing but laughable, because you are far from being racially pure, if you were racially pure, you would never support AMT in the first place, it means, the west asians over ran your dravidian ancestors bastardised you. your paler skin tone compared to indians in nothing but the impact of successive bastardisations happening over 2000 years by western empires which is the least pure to be honest.

the biggest proof your indic root is your mother tongue which is punjabi, which is not iranic but indo aryan, second hint of your indic bastardisation is your culture clothes, cuisines etc, all are heavily influenced by gangadeshi cuisine and very minutely influenced by iranic bastardisation.

Punjabi people have zero empires or zero kingdoms to boast, they were always under the shadow of indo aryan epmires, to think of yourself as superior is nothing but delusional.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

dravidian ancestors bastardised you

I have no Dravidian ancestors. Further IVC was NOT Dravidian. That is Dravid Aboriginal fantasty dream that they get wet on. My interest relates to the peoples of Indus Basin - that is Pakhtuns, Punjabi, Baloch, Sindhi, Kashmiri. I have no interest in Ganga or Dravid India. There is no harm in taking pride in your own.

I would strongly suggest you also take pride in where ever you are from., the Ganga; the Dravidia and feel pride in your land instead making yourself cheap by clutching at our heritage. I am a son of the soil from the banks of River Indus in Attock district and take pride in the land that gave civilization to the world. I have no further wish to pollute myself in a useless discussion with a Gangadeshi.

Evidence points to IVC having been influenced from Western Asia. Sites in Iran and Afghanistan like Mundigak point to the west/east movement of ideas. Mehr Garh in Balochistan and Rehman Dehri in Khyber Pakhtunkwa were precursors to IVC.

http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0095714

Ps. This should bust your Dravidian myth. Can you not understand that Dravidians were only slightly above Africans and simply not able to bear any civilization.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

Punjabi people are quarter bred westerm asia after being bastardised by successive invasions of the western asian empires, to think Punjabi people are therefore superior would be very misleading, Punjabi people were also conquered and bastardised three quarters from the eastern asian empires by successive indo aryan empires and thus they became indo aryans themselves.

your racial purity notion is nothing but laughable, because you are far from being racially pure, if you were racially pure, you would never support AMT in the first place, it means, the west asians over ran your dravidian ancestors bastardised you. your paler skin tone compared to indians in nothing but the impact of successive bastardisations happening over 2000 years by western empires which is the least pure to be honest.

the biggest proof your indic root is your mother tongue which is punjabi, which is not iranic but indo aryan, second hint of your indic bastardisation is your culture clothes, cuisines etc, all are heavily influenced by gangadeshi cuisine and very minutely influenced by iranic bastardisation.

Punjabi people have zero empires or zero kingdoms to boast, they were always under the shadow of indo aryan epmires, to think of yourself as superior is nothing but delusional.

Where is the evidence of your claims? You say alot without a shread of credible evidence. Therefore you are lying wholeheartedly.

 

[kalakaar]

Almost all of Haryana falls in the Ganga Basin. The border between Haryana and Indian Punjab is where it tips over into

Being in Ganga basin doesn't make Punjab less Punjab . Only fools like you make such statements who believe in Arabic supremacy. All the big empires of vedic era were located in this side and had influence till Afghanistan. Mahabharath is the evidence. And the punjab you are talking about is also ours illegally occupied by descendants of Invaders or those Hindu who got forcefully converted and forgot their traditions.

Invasion and Islamisation by a particular belief of the west Indian region now known as Pakistan made the people there started to believe in western powers and invaders and have started to speak their language of history. (I know you would favor Greeks but not Purshottam). And now they believe that culture moved from west to east. Poor chaps.

I again invite you back to the tradition of Advaita Vedanta follow the vedic tradition and keep your name Indra Kumar as given in the Vedas.

Funny, whenever we champion our Muslim identity, you claim we are Hindu converts. Then, when we show interest in this region's pre-Islamic history you say we are Muslims who are irrelevant to this region's history. Make up your mind!

It's tough to say whether Pakistani is an Arabi syed, or a converted pandit or a a mongol Origin or turkic. They are anything but not well followers of Vedas. The constant invasion of the North west Indian sub continent led to the destruction of many Vedic rituals. And now the Inhabitants there are identity less left overs.

 

[U-571]

I have no Dravidian ancestors. Further IVC was NOT Dravidian. That is Dravid Aboriginal fantasty dream that they get wet on. My interest relates to the peoples of Indus Basin - that is Pakhtuns, Punjabi, Baloch, Sindhi, Kashmiri. I have no interest in Ganga or Dravid India. There is no harm in taking pride in your own.

I would strongly suggest you also take pride in where ever you are from., the Ganga; the Dravidia and feel pride in your land instead making yourself cheap by clutching at our heritage. I am a son of the soil from the banks of River Indus in Attock district and take pride in the land that gave civilization to the world. I have no further wish to pollute myself in a useless discussion with a Gangadeshi.

Evidence points to IVC having been influenced from Western Asia. Sites in Iran and Afghanistan like Mundigak point to the west/east movement of ideas. Mehr Garh in Balochistan and Rehman Dehri in Khyber Pakhtunkwa were precursors to IVC.

http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0095714

Ps. This should bust your Dravidian myth. Can you not understand that Dravidians were only slightly above Africans and simply not able to bear any civilization.

lmao, you yourself prove your harappan dravidian ancestors couldn't bear any civilizations and thus technology and ideas flowed from west asia to indus valley and the article discusses nothing about genetics of indus valley people.

you people are trying to rape your own history dear

there have been many attempts to link mesopotamia with indus valley with the cradle of civilization notion, but all ultimately it was decided to put indus valley as a separate civilization, and cradle of civilization BS has been debunked since discovery of mayan mesoamerican and inca civilizations.

the article only proposes link but doesnt established and in their own words, the C14 data is lacking and not carbon dated to establish this as fact.

in reality indus valley sites are older than mesopotamia

https://www.dawn.com/news/1261513

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Being in Ganga basin doesn't make Punjab less Punjab

You Ganga swamp creature I said Indian Punjab falls in Indus Basin. Have a look at the freakin map again. Haryana is in Ganga but when yopu cross into Indian Punjab you are entering Indus Basin.

there have been many attempts to link mesopotamia with indus valley with the cradle of civilization notion

Only banana munching Dravid with nothing but their naked a*ss cling on the myth of IVC being Dravidian. I already posted the link which shows IVC was influenced by the Near East. Now piss of to the South India with some unprounceable name like Tiriciripullissilypillitillgoooli.

http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0095714