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Secret Memo of Zardari to Adm. Mike Mullen

ZAB was the Gamal Abdel Nasr of Pakistan, simply put


on every level --economic and political.....charismatic, well-spoken, nationalistic ---- but implementing some of the most disastrous policies for the country which left it in a precarious situation (nationalization of industries being among them)
 
The memo brazenly accuses the Pakistan Army leadership of "brinkmanship aimed at bringing down the civilian apparatus in Pakistan" and calls the time it was written in May 2011

Z.Mirza, zardari's almost half brother said today that he was told by a certain someone that army and isi are about to overthrow the govt and that American intervention is required. And he said that if the civilian govt has completed its 3 1/2 years the credit goes not to zardari or Gilani or the entire PPP but to the army and gen. Kiyani.

This was the advice from a very close friend and still these shameless, ******, treasenous, I don't wanna utter profanity, politicians played with the nation, its security. I'm disgusted and outraged. I wouldn't hold it against the army if they decided to make an example out of zardari. As much as I know its illegal and unconstitutional, it would still bring me some calm.
 
-not all nations are ready for democracy----.

Quite disagree,
"not all nations are ready for democracy" it should be "not all nations need democracy"?

The democratic resource needs to start from the top to bottom----.

Theories are made according to the temperament of nation, people. Their skill of understanding, literacy rate and power of perception & balance of positive & negative reaction so in my point of view democratic resources needs to start from bottom to top. Actually theory of democracy wasn't designed for South Asians; i think you understand what i am talking about.

Simple example; fluctuation rate of our politics/government is not because of incompetent politicians but incompetence of our people.

Our people are used to say "Teri yad ayi ter janey ke baad" the phrase they said after Musharraf. People could block Zardari but they supported him and now crying for electric, gas and water. Now they all caught into Imran Phobia, let's see.

Back to topic; what is missing from people? Consistency, There are two methods bringing consistency; 1. Either people will bring consistency in government through election and will force to maintain it or 2. A dictator will bring consistency by power.
History is in front of you, which option suitable for Pakistan?

Decision is up to you.
 
ZAB was the Gamal Abdel Nasr of Pakistan, simply put


on every level --economic and political.....charismatic, well-spoken, nationalistic ---- but implementing some of the most disastrous policies for the country which left it in a precarious situation (nationalization of industries being among them)


Removing English & place urdu in all Subjects too ..
 
What would you have him do? Overthrow the elected govt, throw zardari and haqani behind bars and become an unconstitutional president? How many times have we not done that and how long are we going to keep repeating the same insanity.

Let's make one thing clear to everyone right now. Gen. Kiyani has no authority over this matter constitutionally. The burden lies on the parliment and supreme court to pursue a legal case against the perpetrators and punish them.

I mentioned earlier zardari made a hasty and idiotic decision when he assumed there'd be a coup. Army was caught by surprise and was on damage control, coup was the last thing on their mind.

But right now they have a legitimate reason. I would have attempted a coup given the president is going under my nose and against me to outsiders. But army is still not attempting such an adventure. It should be clear as a day now to zardari that army is not interested in power. So now sit quietly you greedy, ******, traitorous dog (zardari) and do something good for nation, if its not too much trouble.

Hi,

For starters---I would have wanted Kiyani to stand upto his american counterpart---Mullen trashed him in front of the world---in front of the u s congress and the u s media---Kiyani should have smacked right back at him----. Should have talked aboput the screw ups of the american forces right from day one till this day---he should have used the same tone---but he cannot---he doesnot have the personality---so he needs to find a spokesman to talk on his behalf----.

Pakistan was raked on white hots coals bu Mullen and Kiyani stayed quite----. Pakistan's image has been destroyed by Mullen and Kiyani chose to keep quiet----warriors have to lkearn to fight wars on more than one front---in this day and age---if a general cannot fight his wars in front of the TV cameras---he is next to uselesss.

---------- Post added at 05:19 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:17 PM ----------

Quite disagree,
"not all nations are ready for democracy" it should be "not all nations need democracy"?



Theories are made according to the temperament of nation, people. Their skill of understanding, literacy rate and power of perception & balance of positive & negative reaction so in my point of view democratic resources needs to start from bottom to top. Actually theory of democracy wasn't designed for South Asians; i think you understand what i am talking about.

Simple example; fluctuation rate of our politics/government is not because of incompetent politicians but incompetence of our people.

Our people are used to say "Teri yad ayi ter janey ke baad" the phrase they said after Musharraf. People could block Zardari but they supported him and now crying for electric, gas and water. Now they all caught into Imran Phobia, let's see.

Back to topic; what is missing from people? Consistency, There are two methods bringing consistency; 1. Either people will bring consistency in government through election and will force to maintain it or 2. A dictator will bring consistency by power.
History is in front of you, which option suitable for Pakistan?

Decision is up to you.

DV,

Where are you going to find a dictator----there are not too many of them hanging around at this time---and on top of that---a dictator with some ballz and courage to whip the nation in line---that is a tall score.
 
Have you guys seen / read excerpts of chat between Mansoor Ijaz and Hussain Haqqani? They are extremely shocking. This govt is literally f.u.c.k.e.d
 
Hi,

For starters---I would have wanted Kiyani to stand upto his american counterpart---Mullen trashed him in front of the world---in front of the u s congress and the u s media---Kiyani should have smacked right back at him----. Should have talked aboput the screw ups of the american forces right from day one till this day---he should have used the same tone---but he cannot---he doesnot have the personality---so he needs to find a spokesman to talk on his behalf----.


.

ok that is fine, but what would have him do about Zardari and Haqani? the topic at hand. That drama was two months ago now we have a new play at hand.
 
Hi,

It is not the millitary that is the issue---it is a lack of character amongst us pakistanis that is a problem. We beg the millitary to come into power---then we kick them out----.

So---analyze it---what was bad about Musharraf---being a general---he was more honest and democratic than these elected members----. He gave them every oppurtunity to be democratic and honest---. The pakistani public did not want it---they did not want democray---.

Musharraf may have had many screwups, but democracy was not one of them---. The politicians should have had the gunption to move forward.

The biggest problem my countrymen have is that they want to start from 0 everytime----they want to start all over---which keeps them chasing the tail.
But Sir! U forgot one important factor/US within our politics and its highly important and covert role against our Military or Civilian rulers.....:smokin:
 
Hi,

For starters---I would have wanted Kiyani to stand upto his american counterpart---Mullen trashed him in front of the world---in front of the u s congress and the u s media---Kiyani should have smacked right back at him----. Should have talked aboput the screw ups of the american forces right from day one till this day---he should have used the same tone---but he cannot---he doesnot have the personality---so he needs to find a spokesman to talk on his behalf----.

Pakistan was raked on white hots coals bu Mullen and Kiyani stayed quite----. Pakistan's image has been destroyed by Mullen and Kiyani chose to keep quiet----warriors have to lkearn to fight wars on more than one front---in this day and age---if a general cannot fight his wars in front of the TV cameras---he is next to uselesss.

---------- Post added at 05:19 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:17 PM ----------

I guess Kiyani is doing excellent job and his moves will be very surprising for the US or the countries not sincere with us.The game is that he wanna keep all his cards secret upto the last moment...:eek:
 
Cyril Almeida made an interesting observation, that for an administration that won't officially acknowledge drone strikes or the 14 page report Kayani delivered to Obama, outlining Pakistan's position on Afghanistan, Mullen acknowledged the existence of the memo rather quickly.

Could the US actually be hoping for a military coup to 'shake things up' regionally, and give it more leverage over Pakistan by rallying the international community against 'military dictatorship in Pakistan'?

I don't know if the US wants a coup but it's interesting to see how the various players fit into this drama.

The US: their involvement is purely passive and ends at Mansoor Ijaz -- a US citizen -- anyway.

Ijaz: he elevates his profile and marketability to the US administration, with maybe even a book deal in the offing.

Haqqani: he knows his days as ambassador are limited anyway so he transitions into a new role. With asylum in the US, he can now go on a lucrative lecture circuit telling the 'inside scoop' about Pakistan's workings. A book deal is also a distinct possibility. Don't be surprised if he 'reluctantly' acknowledges the memo at some point.

Zardari: maybe hung out to dry by the US because his (well-deserved) unpopularity makes him worthless as an American stooge anyway. Was he also complicit in this scheme and did he actually endorse the memo? that's almost a side show given the larger drama being played out. Maybe he did write the memo to portray himelf as a besieged victim of everyone's favorite bogeyman: Pakistan army and ISI.

Kayani: he is the main target of this drama. The worst thing he can do is to take the bait and make Zardari an international martyr. Let Zardari fail on his own because of bad governance -- there's plenty of reason to boot him out democratically, regardless of this drama.
 
Big Game is going on by lollypop's they don't even know how to run a single institute and playing with most powerfull institute. Haqqani can't do this alone and has no authority. Every thing is under Zardari control. First FIRE zardari!
 
Hi,

It is not the millitary that is the issue---it is a lack of character amongst us pakistanis that is a problem. We beg the millitary to come into power---then we kick them out----.

So---analyze it---what was bad about Musharraf---being a general---he was more honest and democratic than these elected members----. He gave them every oppurtunity to be democratic and honest---. The pakistani public did not want it---they did not want democray---.

Musharraf may have had many screwups, but democracy was not one of them---. The politicians should have had the gunption to move forward.

The biggest problem my countrymen have is that they want to start from 0 everytime----they want to start all over---which keeps them chasing the tail.

Very nicely put...

Call it lack of character or media revolution.... any one who control the media in Pakistan control both the character and opinions. A tiny minority activists does the rest.
Pakistan is a classic case… where a very small minority of in-mates have hijacked.. a nation of top caliber.

There are many examples where revolutions and nations were lead by military generals. I name only two; China & Turkey, but non of either can match the all around revolution of Pakistan's Musharraf.

Actually, i wonder if i live to see a leader and patriot of Musharraf's stature.

When i analyze Musharraf's performance and his services to the nation,....i simply say he was one hell of a lucky dude.... there got to be divine hand in his successes... no human skills can achieve the turn around he brought about. So I only praise the Allah almighty for gifting him to us.

Analysing his screwups... we must remember; his intentions cannot be challenged and even today he stand by his calls.
Now, what some of us term screw ups actually were not, challenging any of his past decisions today.. raise suspicions on intentions behind.

More important today... is to know WHAT THE HELL IS WRONG WITH PAKISTAN’S FOREIGN MINISTRY.... why are we revolving around bhartis, Amrikis, and have forgotten rest of the world.
 
ISI official met Mansoor in Europe to verify evidence


Ansar Abbasi
Saturday, November 19, 2011

ISLAMABAD: The ISI conclusively authenticated the delivery of treasonous secret memo to Admiral Mike Mullen before Chief of the Army Staff, General Ashfaq Parvez Kayani recently took up the serious issue with all seriousness with President Asif Ali Zardari and Prime Minister Yusuf Raza Gilani.

Informed sources said that a key ISI official personally flew to Europe recently and met Mansoor, the man who caused the storm, to ascertain the authenticity of the evidence as claimed by him. It was only after the ISI’s satisfaction over the kind of evidence that Mansoor produced that the army chief decided to take up the matter with the president and prime minister.

Although, Pakistan’s Ambassador to Washington Husain Haqqani categorically denied his involvement in the memo issue in any manner, Mansoor showed to the ISI all the relevant messages, e-mails and other evidence to prove that Haqqani was the person who initiated and drafted the memo.

Of late Mansoor, an influential Pakistani-American businessman, had told Geo TV n an interview that he had already shared his evidence with some Pakistani officials. He, however, had not disclosed that the official(s) he met was from the ISI.

Husain Haqqani, however, pleads that he is innocent and has nothing to do with the memo as referred to by Mansoor and confirmed to have been received by Mike Mullen after his initial denial. Haqqani also assures that he would be in Islamabad in a few days time to explain his position before President Asif Ali Zardari.

The Presidency as well as the government insists that Haqqani would be here very soon to clarify his position but some believe that he might not come unless he is sure that he would not be arrested or interrogated.

Haqqani says that he has a lot of opposition in Pakistan for the reason that many in Pakistan do not like a civilian ambassador to serve Pakistan in Washington. He did not explain as to who precisely are against him in Pakistan, he is believed to be referring to the country’s Establishment that from day one was not happy with his appointment as Pakistan’s ambassador in Washington.

There are some who do suggest here in Islamabad that Haqqani should be taken into custody upon his arrival in Pakistan. The secret memo issue remained a non issue for the Presidency, prime minister, the regime and even the ambassador till the time the army chief took a clear stance that this is too serious an issue to be overlooked. Although the government has finally moved and sought an explanation from Haqqani, despite the publication of Mansoor’s article on the memo issue in the Financial Times on Oct 10, the Presidency, the Washington embassy or the government here have not issued a rebuttal to FT.

Before the memo issue, the Pakistan Army and the ISI have been extremely upset with Haqqani on the matter of visa issuance to hundreds of Americans without due prior-scrutiny of the Pakistani security agencies. Haqqani, however, denied this charge but despite the Establishment’s reservations the Gilani regime following US pressure authorised the Haqqani-led Washington embassy to issue visas on its own without referring their cases even to the FO and the ISI and other security agencies.

ISI official met Mansoor in Europe to verify evidence
 
for pak members asking for proof of pak's compliciity in mumbai...

is your president's admission valid enough ?


btw well done ISI...did a great job in making the people ask for a coup again....
 

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