Reasons why J-20 isn't PAF's requirement

[STEVEN囧]

J20 will be updated in the near future in terms of engine.Now we are using WS-10B and the capacity is not enough.We are developing WS-15 and will equip in the near future.We have a long way to materialize the mass production.Some friends said that J20 is equipped with Russia engine.Our major general has made the conclusion that our J20 is using Chinese domestic engine now.But if J20 really want to compete with F22 or surpass it to some extent,we must equip WS-15 at least.
It is impossible to export J20 to Pakistan in the near future because it is not a consummate platform so far.IMHO,J31 is not possible in the near future.Because PLA airforce still doesn't deploy it and we need to test it fully.Except it may happen that Pakistan has severely potentional warfare with some nations.
But I think if possible,China and Pakistan could jointly develop a 5th-generaion aircraft suitable for Pakistan.The assembly line and R&D center is in Pakistan.Now Pakistan has JF-17 ,why not 5th-generation aircraft.

In addition,actually I think J10-B is a good platform and what is your idea,my friend?J10-B play a critical role in Chinese airforce now.

 

[Zain Malik]

I think you didn't read my post clearly...i clearly said we should manage the numbers...i.e. we should get both J-31 and J-20...more squadrons of J-31 and less of J-20. so that we don't give our opponent any advantage..but actually it is a dire need of PAF to have this combo...
Your sole logic is based on budget..but you couldn't deny my reason why we should have J-20....if money is the only problem money can be managed and spend wisely to acquire both assets in reasonable numbers so that we maintain a qualitative edge on our enemy.

this can happen.... Good point you raised probably i misread your previous post.

 

[ghauri05]

Now as for deep strike ,PAF needs a highly maneuverable 5th gen platform so that it can evade SAMs while J-20 may have less chances of getting past soo many SAMs. As mentioned by our bro Aliyusuf above that PAK fa is lacking stealth capabilities so by chance even if pakfa lands in india , they wont give them edge...PAF has its own plans of air superiority 5th program according to some high level analysts...F-35 has high chances according to my views to enter india but dont forget , something even bigger might happen as MIG is working secretly on a 5th gen stealth platform so there is a possibility india might go for it . PAK FA needs serious help now and i have read in chinese forums that china will help russia now in making pak fa perfect so in that case bye bye indian dreams of pak fa...do u have any idea why russia agred for S400 and all the other high level deals? simple. russia has 0 mood of giving pak fa to india (maybe coz of its tech ) and in compensation of the pakfa money invested from indian side, s400 ,supersukhoi and many other deals will take place....note this

To underestimate your enemy is the biggest mistake...PAKFA may be facing 100 problems today..but with time they will be sorted out and India is official partner in this program...the only strength india has been playing for last decade is money it got and russia won't say no to that money. the fact is,may be PAKFA is not a good plane today but after 10-15 years it will be and very much available to IAF...even if that doesn't happen IAF might get the other russian plane you mentioned by MIG..
The question is..should we focus on our preparations or should we wait india's accusitions and waste time and opportunities..he way we did with their Rafael deal..we waited 10 years...now they actually are gonna get Rafaels and what are we gonna do about it...nothing ..there were possibilities lost by PAF in the past when PAF could procure Rafael and get Avionics for JF-17....look at our policy of "wait and watch"...and see where do we stand today.

u have raised an excellent point bro.
Now here's the thing :
Country like india which will have s400 air defence systems plus that country is heavily armed with air defences all accross...do u think that 5th gen jet could so easily reach delhi or deeper? The simple answer is NO. Till the jets reach some where 200km inside (if get past the air defences) , another defensive squadrons of IAF would arrive soon to counter them in numbers. So the idea of deep strike using air force is according to my thoughts weak (off course i may be wrong and i may have some something to keep in mind) .Even J-20 wont survive too many defensive layers. This is where we get to use our strategic forces armaments such as ballistic missiles or tactical.

If a stealth plane can't pass through undetected and attack enemy..then what's the point f being stealthy????
And even for stand off weapons..e.g Raad...shouldn't it be more favourable by a stealth plane to carry it n enter enemy's air space than a non-stealth plane???

 

[WarFariX]

In addition,actually I think J10-B is a good platform and what is your idea,my friend?J10-B play a critical role in Chinese airforce now.

J-10B wont give us any big boost. Thunder 3 will be similar in capabikities to it . Only thing thunder lacks as a lightweight fighter when compared to a medium weight J10B is payload capacity and less hardpoints. J10B is a beast but as mentioned by others througout the thread , it wont give any deep strike capability[emoji12] [emoji12] [emoji12] ......Furthermore , J10 airframe maintainence would be hazardous for paf and given its short life which poor budgeted PAF cant manage while PLAAF given its huge budget can.

To underestimate your enemy is the biggest mistake...PAKFA may be facing 100 problems today..but with time they will be sorted out and India is official partner in this program...the only strength india has been playing for last decade is money it got and russia won't say no to that money. the fact is,may be PAKFA is not a good plane today but after 10-15 years it will be and very much available to IAF...even if that doesn't happen IAF might get the other russian plane you mentioned by MIG..
The question is..should we focus on our preparations or should we wait india's accusitions and waste time and opportunities..he way we did with their Rafael deal..we waited 10 years...now they actually are gonna get Rafaels and what are we gonna do about it...nothing ..there were possibilities lost by PAF in the past when PAF could procure Rafael and get Avionics for JF-17....look at our policy of "wait and watch"...and see where do we stand today.

Throughout the thread i mentioned that F22 F35 and J20 are fighters of today while Pak fa TFX KFX MITSUBISHI are fighters of tommorow....i would definitely agree with ur point that once all problems sorted out , pak fa would be terrible machine for enemies....Now lets say INDIA orders officially PAK Fa , till then i know that PAF might already have 60-70% completed its own work on an air superiority platform by the help of china or maybe TFX, so basically what my mind's PAF is :
○Thunders : interceptors , fighters
○J-31 : Fighters in 3 squadrons specifally for RAFALEs(believe it or not but FC-31 will be deadly machine by 2023)
○JH-7B : Long range bombing mission deep inside enemy territory escorted by Thunders
○F-16s : Fighters against MKIs
○TFX/PAF-5th gen : Replace F-16 and primary role to be air superiorty in region.

 

[ghauri05]

J-10B wont give us any big boost. Thunder 3 will be similar in capabikities to it . Only thing thunder lacks as a lightweight fighter when compared to a medium weight J10B is payload capacity and less hardpoints. J10B is a beast but as mentioned by others througout the thread , it wont give any deep strike capability[emoji12] [emoji12] [emoji12] ......Furthermore , J10 airframe maintainence would be hazardous for paf and given its short life which poor budgeted PAF cant manage while PLAAF given its huge budget can.



Throughout the thread i mentioned that F22 F35 and J20 are fighters of today while Pak fa TFX KFX MITSUBISHI are fighters of tommorow....i would definitely agree with ur point that once all problems sorted out , pak fa would be terrible machine for enemies....Now lets say INDIA orders officially PAK Fa , till then i know that PAF might already have 60-70% completed its own work on an air superiority platform by the help of china or maybe TFX, so basically what my mind's PAF is :
○Thunders : interceptors , fighters
○J-31 : Fighters in 3 squadrons specifally for RAFALEs(believe it or not but FC-31 will be deadly machine by 2023)
○JH-7B : Long range bombing mission deep inside enemy territory escorted by Thunders
○F-16s : Fighters against MKIs
○TFX/PAF-5th gen : Replace F-16 and primary role to be air superiorty in region.

If u put TFX/J-20..i have no issue here as both are air superiority fighters....but I am not sure about ingenuously made 5th gen...as for once..we don't know anything about it and secondly i presume it will be a single engine...and again of the size of Jf-17 or at maximum F-16....the size puts limits to the aircraft's capabilities and that's my point of concern

 

[WarFariX]

If u put TFX/J-20..i have no issue here as both are air superiority fighters....but I am not sure about ingenuously made 5th gen...as for once..we don't know anything about it and secondly i presume it will be a single engine...and again of the size of Jf-17 or at maximum F-16....the size puts limits to the aircraft's capabilities and that's my point of concern

Not until PAF get overhaul facility for EJ200 , PAF wont go for tfx as maintainence of twin engine would become headache...but forget all this..inshaAllah the rich times are ahead and our hopes are on complete functionality of CPEC..IMO after cpec functionality, military budget would be first rise and navy would get a greater share as well as air force caps will be raised

 

[ghauri05]

Not until PAF get overhaul facility for EJ200 , PAF wont go for tfx as maintainence of twin engine would become headache...but forget all this..inshaAllah the rich times are ahead and our hopes are on complete functionality of CPEC..IMO after cpec functionality, military budget would be first rise and navy would get a greater share as well as air force caps will be raised

That's the best thing we can hope for...inshallah...hard times are over n Pak will thrive economically n militarily.

 

[Hassan Guy]

We need F-35's.

 

[saad ahmad]

I don't know really. What else you want? No J10 No need for J20. And J20 is superior in all aspect to J31 at least by words of Chinese media. U keep buying JF-17 good? Happy now?

No Tejas is best fighter ever we want that

 

[WarFariX]

We need F-35's.

No Tejas is best fighter ever we want that

no trolling both of u plz [emoji12] [emoji12] [emoji12] [emoji12] [emoji12]

 

[Hassan Guy]

no trolling both of u plz [emoji12] [emoji12] [emoji12] [emoji12] [emoji12]

F-35 is the best.

 

[Ultima Thule]

F-35 is the best.

USA wont give us F-16 and you are thinking F-35 and where are $$$$$$$$ to get i it get real kid

 

[Hassan Guy]

USA wont give us F-16 and you are thinking F-35 and where are $$$$$$$$ to get i it get real kid

USA isn't giving F-16's, exactly. Maybe if we paid for them we would actually get them.

 

[Ultima Thule]

USA isn't giving F-16's, exactly. Maybe if we paid for them we would actually get them.

But no chance to get F-35, we should stick to J-31 or home grown 5th generation fighter jet

 

[Hassan Guy]

But no chance to get F-35, we should stick to J-31 or home grown 5th generation fighter jet

What do you mean by no chance? The F-35 is the best 5th gen fighter out right now. It will be way better then the Su-50's and Rafales India has bought.

J-31 isn't as good as the F-35, and we are still far from building our own fighter.