Quaid e Azam did NOT have a British Passport

[Saint Gujjar]

the only thing that really matters is where your loyalty is,doesnt matter what clothes you wear or what apperance you have brought out to show the world,if your intention is true people will respect you,and if your intention is false,people will know it even if you try to hide it in a million words and apperances,it is said that the perfume will escape no matter where it is and no matter how hard you try to conceal.people know who is sincere and who never will be.

 

[curioususer]

Thread kahna se kahna agaya?

 

[Chak Bamu]

@Mav3rick, Points noted and differences accepted. I lost my cool back there - sorry for that. I have a great deal of respect for my Urdu-speaking brothers as long as they do not actively abuse my ethnicity. Heck, they can eve do that - but please do not raise stupid controversies just to explain what AH did or said.

Re. the quota thing. I agree its elimination is long overdue. Perhaps a merit-based percentage should be put in place and expanded each year until quota becomes something akin to seats reserved for minorities and such. Complete elimination would not go down well. I hope you would agree that on a merit basis our Urdu-speaking brothers would have heavily predominated in government services. Punjabis by the virtue of having old and well-established educational institutions would have perhaps held their own, but Pashtuns, Sindhi, & Balochi brothers would have been badly excluded. Such a situation could have generated enough centrifugal force to threaten out country. If our Urdu-speaking brothers have felt cheated and thus MQM has gained acceptance based on that factor (among others), then imagine three other MQM like parties vying for power based on their respective parochial constituencies. What might have happened to the country then? It is quite clear that a strictly merit-based policy would not have been the best option.

PPP has the unique distinction of being the most widespread party in Pakistan who can win seats throughout the country. PML has been badly fragmented, most recently by efforts from Musharraf. PML(N) has widespread support in Norther Punjab, Hazara, and some other areas. The last elections went badly for them, since they could not make contacts, convince others, and build alliances. You know how it was for them. On that account, they may seem restricted to Punjab only, but that is only how things came out with Musharraf being in power.

Looking at just these two parties (not even talking about PTI, ANP, and others), tells you that they have a wider scope and agenda. As opposed to them, MQM has tried to make forays into other parts of Pakistan, but then has remained committed to its power base. Their agenda, tactics, and diction remains alien to the vast majority of Pakistanis. There is deep mistrust and suspicion. With the rise of PTI, the segment of population to whom the MQM might have appealed is in no mood to give MQM another chance.

The electoral failure of Fatima Jinnah was engineered by the sitting dictator. The descendants of Fatima Jinnah's supporters were found supporting another dictator who was actually much worse than Ayub Khan. If Musharraf's cultural background was a factor then why blame Pashtuns for supporting Ayub Khan? How come what Gohar Ayub did was bad and all that MQM has done is OK (12th May)? MQM practically lived in Musharraf's pocket, and he did just about everything MQM asked. Now when we find his doings being undone, MQM is huffing and puffing. You have found a reason to divide Sindh just because of that.

Have we pacified Balochistan yet? Have we dealt with our energy crisis? Have we dealt with Taliban? Do we have a solution to the rampant corruption? Do we have the energy and time to talk about dividing Sindh and compound our problems, on top of everything else?

Let us agree to disagree. And end it here. But do note that nobody (including me) has a monopoly on the truth in Pakistan of ours.

 

[somebozo]

Actually, let me put it the correct way, I am one of the Karachiites that calls a spade, a spade, and one who lived in Karachi throughout the operation, saw the dirty deeds of the military operation on false pretext of Jinnahpur and then saw Musharraf taking over. I am the one who saw everything before leaving for Australia for higher education and returning to Pakistan to serve the country where I serve the federal Government today.

I was also in Karachi during 91-92 and 95-96.
Operation was every bit good thing as it bought peace back to the city put an end to bori band lash and for a long time crime & bhatta was really down in the city.

 

[haviZsultan]

Let us say there is a person who is sure he can bash through a castle wall by punching and kicking. He doesn’t realize that he simply is incapable of doing so.

Unfortunately the person thinks he can bash through those stone defences. The only time he realizes he cannot is when sinister hands come out of the wall and slaps this person on the face... after which he runs off. I can draw striking parallels between this person and you.

The argument you are having with me now, W.11 and darkinsky and many others have had before and you can ask them how much luck they had. The only terrorist I spared who said partition was a mistake was Karachiite and that on account of things he told me about his own family history. There is nothing you can say to me... every other person understands that I do not leave someone who insults another ethnic group or community or advocates concepts such as loyalty to India, Afghanistan or any other state despite being a Pakistani citizen.

The fact I am a born urdu speaker, raised for 20+ years being told I am one and Karachite myself who can counter your rubbish hatred-filled Anti-Pakistani narrative in mere seconds destroys any claims of bias or discrimination you wish to make. Even the Pashtuns, the identity I am adopting have a greater right to ignore my comments as those of a wannabe with my weak unproven links but you simply cannot do that. There is no defense, no escape from a person with every statistic, every piece of information in his hands.

Maverick when someone attacks my country and its right to exist, especially a traitor who eats and drinks from this aziz mitti I forget everything.

You claimed that AH burned the national flag, please post proof of that or consider yourself a LIAR!

The problem is not that I don't have proof. There are 4 testimonies of various people to prove this, I can name the 4 people (I am an independent journalist) which I have learned from a SSP in Karachi but it is beyond a terrorist mind that calls my family's sacrifice to form this country a mistake to accept. You do not want to accept... this is your problem. You truly are Indian lovers, even @Karachiite, you guys can't comprehend the atrocities these MQM mass murderers have committed. What is stopping you from crossing the border? You are disgrace to every true migrant family anyway. I am not loyal to "Muhajirs" true or consider myself one but I am loyal to my family that passed through great ordeals, left property behind, left all wealth, brothers, parents and sisters behind just because they believed in Pakistan and their belief was unshakable, something which is impossible to relay to an Indian backed traitor like yourself.

Perhaps you forgot how we were killed by Indian mobs on the way and we had only and only a solid belief in Pakistan and its ideology when we crossed the borders not to add the Indians killed people we knew. In my case it is not just my grandfathers who know people who were murdered. In my case I personally know people who died.

You wanted a minority to rise up to the sea of people that Bhutto had gathered before '71? What would have that achieved? Were our families not first hand victims/witnesses for the support of our community to Fatima Jinnah? Did we need more of the abuse that was met out to our community as a punishment for supporting the sister of Quaid-e-Azam......who was betrayed by the country then and the same people have the guts to claim that they stand for Quaid-e-Azam when their families treacherously sold out Quaid's sister?? Why fall for the same lies again and again??

The victim mindset comes like a storm making debate impossible... "what could we poor oppressed people have done."

We could have risen up and became an example for the rest of the country just like today we could have fought the ethnic tensions, challenged ethnic identity and defended other ethnic groups or simply merged with them. But people like you were the reason I decided to have no link with you guys or with muhajir identity. A reply to this comes later-it is about how Urdu-speakers by refusing to recognize indigenous languages played a part in breaking Bengal.

I do not understand why you consider me a traitor, all I can say is that in 2001/02 when India had amassed almost a million troops at our border and war drums were beating I returned from abroad to ensure that I was present in the country before air travel was restricted in the even of a war, to ensure that I could participate and play my role in the defense of my country.

Save it. If you do not believe in Pakistan then how are you serving it, MQM target killer? There was a PPP thug in our family very much like you and he used to say the same things about the mistake of Pakistan's formation and other such rubbish. I used to get out of the room because if I stayed with him I might have slapped him despite his age.

But matters that we speak of today are different, I speak for unison and that can only happen when every community is given their freedom and their rights. Be it Karachiites, Baloch, Hazaras or Siraikis. If that means breaking up the provinces in to smaller provinces then so be it. All that I would say is that provinces should not be divided on ethnic lines or on sectarian lines but administrative lines and that we should eliminate the ethnic/sectarian divide.

Provinces is a different matter. Treason to Quaid E Azam and nation another thing. Do not try to divert the discussion. You talk about rights but I know how that goes. My uncle said "we urdu-speakers have no rights here" then went on to insult Balochs, Pashtuns. His exacts words "Its because of these pagals coming to our city." I have been hearing it almost daily in Karachi. Since you are part of the same thing don't you dare talk to me about rights. You are just a bigot, an ethno-chauvinist and being from your ethnic group unfortunately I know in our drawing room conversations insults are all that fly for the other ethnic groups. When we say Pathan meri juti key neechey in front of him do we think how that guy would feel? It is an honor to adopt Pashtun identity, that of a person who is really mazloom in karachi city than be among racists like you... thank you.

Figures for you about the Muhajir community. Rupees 13,000+ gdp per capita than the Punjabis who are at second, almost 30,000 more than the Balochs according to H&H research group. An HDI rating higher than any other community. Access to the best schools, colleges, hospitals, all a gift of being in the main cities of Pakistan-have you ever bothered to go to interior Sindh to see the utter penury the people live in? Now we are going to say we are oppressed? Is this a joke?

An old post:

Have you seen the list of directors for radio Pakistan About 30% of the directors are Muhajir (compare to Urdu-speaking population of 8% of total Pakistani-highly inflated that also because question asked in surveys is language NOT ethnicity) There were 2-3 Sindhis and Pashtuns. And guess what. NO BALOCH. So the Punjabi didn’t steal from the Baloch only-we did too.

Still, somehow to develop a political identity we need Altaf...
Good luck to that and killing every one else. I won't support it out of my duty to Pakistan.

So AH and MQM were behind '71 tragedy?

Their backers were with the same mindset they have today. Proof that Bangladesh happened because of Urdu speakers too and our wish to maintain urdu. 2) (Article heading 2) URDU endangered? (in 1952)

A strong reaction is emerging in the West wing to the East Bengal provincial assembly's decision to make Bengali second national language (along with Urdu), dubbing such language demands from Bengal as treason against Pakistan and a threat to the existence of Urdu.

A section of journalists has also demanded removal of two non-native Urdu speakers from the editorship of English newspapers including Dawn. (Now who is most interested in maintaining Urdu as a language-us Urdu speakers who had the same mentality we have today, MashaAllah. You threw away Bengal out of urdu-speaking chauvinism and now you dare to blame it on other communities! Not only that use it as a tool to claim partition a blunder. Shame on you. Altaf should be hanged for that speech as it is done in Turkey. Maybe if we had let the two urdu speakers be removed and not made everything an issue we could have saved 71 from occurring.)

I am by birth an urdu speaker by choice a Pashtun, every breathe of mine screams Pakistani Nationalism and I will die sword in hand but will never let another Bangladesh happen again and the potential for this to happen comes from Altaf Hussain. Pakistan first second and last.

I do not bash any ethnicity. If I say something which is a fact then it cannot be considered abuse. I think you are either most likely confusing me with someone else or that you have misunderstood something I posted.

Excuse me. Didn't you just attack my brother @Chak Bamu, Punjabis and Sindhis and belittle Chak Bamu's ancestors role in the formation of Pakistan? You MQM terrorists cannot take part in a single debate without bashing another ethnicity or looking at them down your nose and now you are saying you don't bash ethnicity? Let me pull out some of your posts and they will reveal the truth real quickly... I suggest you learn from @darkinsky... he stopped racist posts too for which I am truly thankful. I would also request him to reassess his loyalty to MQM. But of course I cannot force him.

And in front of me do not dare to insult the heritage and history of @Chak Bamu. If you had the ability to understand it you would know he idolizes Urdu despite his mother-tongue being Punjabi and once had high hopes with the MQM. Punjabis are the reason Urdu which is our language spread to every nook and corner in Pakistan. Instead of feeling for others and respecting them we criticize them and their history.

I do not know where you came up with the figure of 87% but lets analyse your assumptions:

My mind gets a little befuddled when someone says something about partition being a mistake. It is a test of my patience. You didn't ask which period this information was for but MQM supporters aren't known to be smart. They vote for Altaf because he is a Muhajir and they are the same, they are from Karachi and Altaf is too which doesn't really show a cultured or educated upbringing, sorry to say which serves as a primary example that a university graduate can be as illiterate as a villager. Its for 2012 by CPLC and Sindh police. You may not easily find it-a journalist can by making calls here and there.

1) 87% that have been murdered in Karachi were not affiliated with MQM.
2) 87% that have been murdered in Karachi were not supporters of MQM
3) 87% that have been murdered in Karachi were not from the urdu speaking community.
4) 87% that have been murdered in Karachi must have been murdered by MQM because of points 1,2 & 3 above.

I was checking the solved cases too. You can't escape a journalist, even an unsuccessful one like me. I have EVERY fact here.

Here I will bring 7 cases you can check in the database of Sindh police (I wrote them down) which were solved and found out to be by MQM target killers. I will only mention first names as I do not trust you as you could be a target killer. Shahzeb, murdered at restaurant-MQM worker arrested. Sohaib-murdered by MQM target killer. Abbas murdered, his brother injured in targeted attack-the name of killer Shafi Alias Bilal who was in contact with Ajmal Pahari but he may escape as the prosecution is very weak (haven't checked on progress of case), next Salim whose target killer was killed in an encounter-was from orangi, next Adil his target killer was just a paid person-he wasn't affiliated with MQM but confessed in court of having been paid, next Mohammed and finally Qasim both killed in a shooting at some roundabout.

Also I checked out the case of Syed Salahuddin, editor of Takbeer who was killed by target killer Ajmal Pahari who is responsible for 100+ murders. He is out of jail yet again just like Malik Ishaq. This is who my beysharam people of Karachi vote for. Now before denying this... go to the police and find out about these cases.

Do note when the constable helping me make sense of the information showed be the file and I noticed for the first 7 solved cases it had been MQM workers or MQM paid target killers that had been used I stopped looking though yes I will admit in some older pages there were cases against PPP workers as well.

A high profile case would be Wali Babar and murder of the Chief architects of operation clean-up. Wonder why anyone else would kill him? Here is what happened to those who participated in 92 operation against MQM terror gang.:

What happened to the 92 cops who disappeared after 1992? – The Express Tribune

Now I am thinking if you had the ability to not copy and paste the words about thinking objectively and critically then you would not have posted what you did. I mean you just want to blame MQM even though you have no tangible proof or even suspicions that would arise from benefits of such terrorism that MQM would gain except a bad name and abuse in general which I do not believe MQM want any more.

You do not need to copy my exact words. Didn't I say objectively and critically first... but proves that basically Altaf says kill all other ethnic groups and you jump on his lap like a little kid and let him ruffle your hair while you shout the same thing.

Do note, I cannot believe anyone can be so objective in Pakistan to condemn his own ethnic group of birth so severely and its behavior in Pakistan for the purpose of ethnic unity and Nationalism which you lack. You want me to accept a terrorist organization as a constant presence in this city. It will never happen. That above is a load of proof. Another proof. MQM hosted in 1984 as the Muhajir Quami movement. Figures from 1985-1990, no surpise here! 3000 deaths in Karachi. That is what the MQM is.

Can you explain why the so called supporters of Quaid-e-Azam denounced Fatima Jinnah, the mother of the nation, in favor of Ayub Khan?? Can you furthermore explain why the country stood silent spectator when Ayub's son wreaked havoc of his revenge on Karachiites for support of Fatima Jinnah?

Who denounced Fatima Jinnah? Lol. It was a vote in the assemblies, the parliament and village council members which was full of crooked politicians- he was a military strongman with all power in his hands for Godsake and he could bribe anyone. You are trying to tell me Pakistani people are responsible for this? Because thats what you mean when you say this act was purposely done against muhajirs.

Country never stood silent but explaining this is very hard to someone taught selective history. You are being fed MQM version of history which destroys your ability to question and challenge things. According to the MQM narrative, you, despite being a very Anti-Pakistani individual supporting Altaf's speech will always somehow have been oppressed.

1) (Article heading one) November 7, 1968. A college student was shot dead by police as fire opened on a procession of students demonstrating on Peshawar Rd, Rawalpindi, against the new education policy summarised in University Ordinance. (Starts a student insurgency)

Following the student insurgency in November, factory workers have joined in the protest against the policies of the present regime (Ayub Khan's), which has withdrawn the right to strike and clamped down on trade unions.

Go and read the history of Khan of Kalat and that of Badshah Khan and many others. You have picked names where as I have picked leaders for this debate. Hur Movement? Hurs did not fight for the overall freedom struggle, they fought for their own personal selves, for their leader, for their own tribes! You must not compare struggles motivated by self interests to the overall and larger movement aimed at the creation of a country for the whole Muslim nation.

Lol. what a beautiful logic. One case is going to mean all Pashtuns were traitors and only migrants were the ones who worked for Pakistan. Meer Ahmed Yar Baloch is a Khan of Kalat and he stated that in a dream it came to him that Balochistan should be merged with Pakistan.

The only person motivated by self-interest here is you. Didn't you say you were in government. How many people massacred to get there and preach anti-Pakistanism in the parliament?

Since I did not know that Chak Bamu is from Indian Punjab I must not be using my brain? And also because I am posting facts, I must be an MQM members and by extension a terrorist too. And now that I know Chak Bamu is actually a Punjabi from Indian side, I know that he was accepted in the Punjabi community and so were Punjabi Kashmiri. Nobody cared about the urdu speaking community and the initial welcome fast diminished as realization dawned that the highly elite in education would challenge the Sindhi claim to Government jobs and so on.

Rubbish. Did you try to integrate? Did you ever think of calling yourself Sindhi. I call myself a Pashtun and not one person has ever said I have no right to call myself one as I am by birth the son of a low migrant (discounting those backed by Afghanistan on internet forums). Do not sell this rubbish. This is a member Rafay saying he will accept anyone as a Sindhi who wants to call himself one:

Yes i will accept you as a sindhi, you live in sindh, you speak either sindhi or urdu but you will adopt the culture of sindh and learn History of Sindh, You are truly a sindhi, I infact consider all muhajirs Of karachi Urdu speaking Sindhis cuz they all live in sindh, Pushtoons And balochs are also Muhajirs in karachi same as muhajirs from India migrated they migrated from Sarhad now KPK and baluchistan in search of jobs, Its their Right Cuz we all live in same Nation and we should tolerate each other.

Being from such a family myself I know very well that we refuse to integrate not that they don't want us to. It is a lie perpetuated by the MQM. Your days are over "Mr I am a terrorist of Altaf in the government".

Also if you get time consider how foolish you are. @Icewolf is a Muhajir... he migrated from a region that is now in Indian Gujrat I believe. He now calls himself a Sindhi but the proper term Muhajir is supposed to mean all migrants. Now in migrants there are Pashtuns, Sindhis and Punjabis. Aren't you insulting yourself and fellow muhajirs? Also do think about how foolish all of this is. Muhajirs all have a different culture-I am a lucknowi muhajir who knows nothing about the dhoti of a madrasi muhajir or the Bihari kababs that Biharis eat-mine is the Kakori kabab-so how we can unite with him but look down at Punjabis and Sindhis?

How are we all muhajirs when we don't even share the same culture yet for this one false identity you can't stop voting for terror chief just because he is one like you? This shows the entire problem. I will be surprised to find anyone outside Karachi supporting Altaf.

I don't know what our forefathers thought when they decided it was some izzat ka mamla to maintain a biased term like Muhajir that meant pilgrim but I will undo the mistake. We were supposed to merge with other ethnicities and that is what Quaid E Azam wished.

Whatever dude....

Listen, learn something. I am writing a paper that can go to something like 50 pages on ethnic relations and issues in Pakistan. I have the ability to write a report on Muhajir identity and its falsity too. You are incapable of debating with me here. I have every figure, every fact, every statistic, and as a journalist I can find out pretty much anything. There is no debating with a person like me. Instead what you can do is change your thinking because if you continue believing partition was a blunder we have every right to refer to you as a traitor and the only place that will be left to you may be the terror camps Ajmal Pahari trained in, in India.

No one will divide one Pakistani from the other. I will defend every other ethnic group if it is attacked my bigots like you. You spat on our sacrifice anyway by calling partition a mistake.

 

[Mav3rick]

I was also in Karachi during 91-92 and 95-96.
Operation was every bit good thing as it bought peace back to the city put an end to bori band lash and for a long time crime & bhatta was really down in the city.

You consider the 15k dead in those early 3-4 years to be peace? Then I guess peace to you is very different then what it is to me. There were ethnic issues much before APMSO was established, there was a reason MQM attracted such a massive supporter base in Karachi/Hyderabad. Either all MQM supporters were terrorists/traitors or there was a crucial need for MQM.

Anyhow, if you only had any idea how history at all. The military and para military forces (including police) had tried their utmost for peace and had warned all political parties to end support for their ethnic militant wings. For this reason, PPP severed ties with Al-Zulfiqar and MQM expelled Afaq Ahmed & Amir Khan, both had armed youth loyal to them who were inclined more towards armed struggle against the victimization of Urdu speaking rather then to indulge in dialogues. Thus MQM-H was born, sort of at the behest of Military but the Military was not supporting any militant wings at this junction.

Soon after the retirement of Army Chief Mirza Aslam Baig, General Asif Nawaz Janjua was made the army chief. Asif Janjua always held a grudge against MQM ever since he was the corp commander of Karachi and had prayed on many occasions to the military and civilian establishment to start military operations against MQM and MQM alone. Anyway, in 1992 a military operation was launched in interior Sindh against dacoits which soon turned anti MQM after the military raid on Nine-Zero which took even the prime minister Nawaz Sharif by surprise who flew to meet Altaf Hussain in London. The Military was out of Nawaz's control for this operation by now.

Pretty soon there was a case uncovered in interior Sindh when Army/Rangers personnel were found guilty of murder of several innocent men who were claimed as dacoits as it was found that the men were killed by the forces to support land grabbing. The operation in interior Sindh was immediately stopped. While operation in Karachi was expanded even further despite similar cases reported by HRW and other neutral agencies.

The reality is quite bitter mate and when you dig deep enough MQM will come out looking like the better side!

 

[Chak Bamu]

Closer to topic. Here is Hamid Mir with an excellent column in Urdu on our Quaid, Freedom struggle, Passport, Oath as Gov. Gen., and Altaf's Bakwas.

Jang Multimedia
@Mav3rick, interesting twist in logic mate. But that does not change facts. I honor and respect you as a fellow Pakistani who actually does care enough to participate in discussions. But frankly, MQM is now standing at a cross-roads. This year or the next shall see major re-organization within MQM. Altaf is a liability, so are the MQM-linked goons. I hope doves in MQM come out on top. With time MQM could reclaim its rightful place. There are some exceptional people in MQM and I hope they would be able to participate fully in Pakistan's political space to highlight issues of their constituency as well as play a positive part in our National politics.

 

[Mav3rick]

Let us say there is a person who is sure he can bash through a castle wall by punching and kicking. He doesn’t realize that he simply is incapable of doing so.

Unfortunately the person thinks he can bash through those stone defences. The only time he realizes he cannot is when sinister hands come out of the wall and slaps this person on the face... after which he runs off. I can draw striking parallels between this person and you.

And I can draw a parallel of someone who lives in a fairyland and dreams up stuff. The resemblance is quite uncanny.

The argument you are having with me now, W.11 and darkinsky and many others have had before and you can ask them how much luck they had. The only terrorist I spared who said partition was a mistake was Karachiite and that on account of things he told me about his own family history. There is nothing you can say to me... every other person understands that I do not leave someone who insults another ethnic group or community or advocates concepts such as loyalty to India, Afghanistan or any other state despite being a Pakistani citizen.

I honestly do not understand where I have insulted any ethnicity, anywhere. Furthermore, listen and listen well, your loyalty and patriotism cannot even imagine to match that of mine! I, unlike the likes of you who would flee the country the first chance they get, am a dual citizen living and serving my country in no other city then Karachi and serving the federal Government in the capacity that does actually make the country better. It's time to come out of the la la land!!

The fact I am a born urdu speaker, raised for 20+ years being told I am one and Karachite myself who can counter your rubbish hatred-filled Anti-Pakistani narrative in mere seconds destroys any claims of bias or discrimination you wish to make. Even the Pashtuns, the identity I am adopting have a greater right to ignore my comments as those of a wannabe with my weak unproven links but you simply cannot do that. There is no defense, no escape from a person with every statistic, every piece of information in his hands.

Maverick when someone attacks my country and its right to exist, especially a traitor who eats and drinks from this aziz mitti I forget everything.

Honestly, your blabbering and rubbish statements do not make an iota of sense! Your logic is flawed and your post is most likely referring to someone you just imagined! As far as Karachi is concerned, I have spent over 25 years in this city, raised and born amongst friends and family belonging to all ethnicities and I have tasted the good, the bad and the ugly of this city. I am intimiate not only with the city but also the city politics including that of MQM, PPP and ANP. And I am a realist who speaks what is true and I am a witness to the city's decline unlike wannabe's like you who have no real idea of ground realities as you have either never lived in Karachi or have lived in some posh area under protected environment. I know the basis and realities of stories that were made up by the media, JIT, political parties etc. and advertised through PTV throughout the early 90's! People like you want to believe what they are fed instead of trying to open up their minds in an attempt to find the other side of the stories as well. Keep down the biased opinions, they only spread hatred.

The problem is not that I don't have proof. There are 4 testimonies of various people to prove this, I can name the 4 people (I am an independent journalist) which I have learned from a SSP in Karachi but it is beyond a terrorist mind that calls my family's sacrifice to form this country a mistake to accept. You do not want to accept... this is your problem. You truly are Indian lovers, even @Karachiite, you guys can't comprehend the atrocities these MQM mass murderers have committed. What is stopping you from crossing the border? You are disgrace to every true migrant family anyway. I am not loyal to "Muhajirs" true or consider myself one but I am loyal to my family that passed through great ordeals, left property behind, left all wealth, brothers, parents and sisters behind just because they believed in Pakistan and their belief was unshakable, something which is impossible to relay to an Indian backed traitor like yourself.

That is not the real problem, it is a fact that there indeed is no proof of any such incident. Had that been the case, AH would have been eaten up by Karachiites who are more loyal to the country than anybody else. And when you cannot post proof you bring up stories. I wonder why you even believe something that is hearsay. I was wondering whether your stories are only stories and my belief is further strengthened as your words are words that I have written and put across with just lines changed but of similar essence. You are merely posing to be a family member of a migrant who decently and in the highest acts of patriotism and self sacrifice, left everything behind for Pakistan.....that is the definition of your average migrant!!

Perhaps you forgot how we were killed by Indian mobs on the way and we had only and only a solid belief in Pakistan and its ideology when we crossed the borders not to add the Indians killed people we knew. In my case it is not just my grandfathers who know people who were murdered. In my case I personally know people who died.

I did not forget, my fore fathers were a part of the migration and the freedom struggle before that!

The victim mindset comes like a storm making debate impossible... "what could we poor oppressed people have done."

We could have risen up and became an example for the rest of the country just like today we could have fought the ethnic tensions, challenged ethnic identity and defended other ethnic groups or simply merged with them. But people like you were the reason I decided to have no link with you guys or with muhajir identity. A reply to this comes later-it is about how Urdu-speakers by refusing to recognize indigenous languages played a part in breaking Bengal.

Not including you, we were and still are an example for the whole country. We started from nothing and now we have everything, by the grace of Allah and because of our faith in hard and honest work.Urdu was chosen to be the National Language by none other then the founding fathers of this nation. You want to know why Urdu was made the the official language? It was because it was a neutral language that was affiliated with Muslims, it was the official language of the Mughal emperors and it was most widely understood throughout the sub continent. There are many other reasons too. Urdu was supposed to do exactly the opposite of dividing Pakistanis into language based ethnicity. It was meant to unite Bengalis (who wanted Bangla to be the official language), Punjabis (who supported Punjabi) and so on.

Your understanding is a pathetic joke and you are a miserable student of history/journalism!!!

Save it. If you do not believe in Pakistan then how are you serving it, MQM target killer? There was a PPP thug in our family very much like you and he used to say the same things about the mistake of Pakistan's formation and other such rubbish. I used to get out of the room because if I stayed with him I might have slapped him despite his age.

This is getting quite personal now. I am not one who wants to get personal on some forum as then the real mettle of the person is not tested. You want to get personal, get personal in person! I live in Karachi and can take this up with you in any part of the city you wish. This is not a threat, just an invitation to understand me in person.

Provinces is a different matter. Treason to Quaid E Azam and nation another thing. Do not try to divert the discussion. You talk about rights but I know how that goes. My uncle said "we urdu-speakers have no rights here" then went on to insult Balochs, Pashtuns. His exacts words "Its because of these pagals coming to our city." I have been hearing it almost daily in Karachi. Since you are part of the same thing don't you dare talk to me about rights. You are just a bigot, an ethno-chauvinist and being from your ethnic group unfortunately I know in our drawing room conversations insults are all that fly for the other ethnic groups. When we say Pathan meri juti key neechey in front of him do we think how that guy would feel? It is an honor to adopt Pashtun identity, that of a person who is really mazloom in karachi city than be among racists like you... thank you.

No pathan or any other ethnicity is under anybody's joota. That's pure BS and words of an illiterate fool! The founding father of ANP once stated in his speech that Pathans do what Mohajirs cannot do and Mohajirs do what Pathans cannot do. This is a fact. You look realistically at what Pathans do, what Baloch do, what Punjabis do, what Sindhi do, what Urdu speaking do and there are differences. Pathans are usually hard physical workers, laborers and businesses, Baloch are not much into anything except to be left alone to their culture, Punjabis & Sindhis are into farming predominantly and in education, business etc., Mohajirs are mostly job and education oriented and also in business. Even the businesses of different communities usually differ in nature.

And then you bring in Afghans, I don't even wanna go into that.

Figures for you about the Muhajir community. Rupees 13,000+ gdp per capita than the Punjabis who are at second, almost 30,000 more than the Balochs according to H&H research group. An HDI rating higher than any other community. Access to the best schools, colleges, hospitals, all a gift of being in the main cities of Pakistan-have you ever bothered to go to interior Sindh to see the utter penury the people live in? Now we are going to say we are oppressed? Is this a joke?

Owners of interior Sindh formed Governments and had serving Prime Ministers for over 12 years, 7 of those years were with absolute power yet fate of interior Sindh has not changed. You speak of Hospitals, Colleges, Universities and other facilities in the city of Karachi, well it is the biggest city to start with and most of these facilities are private owned and established and operated by the residents of this city!!!

When we speak of oppression we are speaking of the quota system that brings in an undeserving person to an important post just because his community votes for the powers that continue to keep them in these conditions. And the more these undeserving people get these jobs, the more their hold grows stronger and the country weaker. There have been instances where jobs have been advertised which clearly stated that people with domicile from Karachi should not apply!!!

Perhaps it is time to read up the condition and state of affairs of the country and bureaucracy in general before and after Bhutto!!!

An old post:


Still, somehow to develop a political identity we need Altaf...
Good luck to that and killing every one else. I won't support it out of my duty to Pakistan.

Did you bother to confirm the stats of that post? I highly doubt you did because the last I checked there was strict quota compliance on all Government jobs! But people like you, self declared journalists and what not, would rather jump on posts that reflect their own notion rather then cross checking the post and fact finding!

Their backers were with the same mindset they have today. Proof that Bangladesh happened because of Urdu speakers too and our wish to maintain urdu. 2) (Article heading 2) URDU endangered? (in 1952)

A strong reaction is emerging in the West wing to the East Bengal provincial assembly's decision to make Bengali second national language (along with Urdu), dubbing such language demands from Bengal as treason against Pakistan and a threat to the existence of Urdu.

A section of journalists has also demanded removal of two non-native Urdu speakers from the editorship of English newspapers including Dawn. (Now who is most interested in maintaining Urdu as a language-us Urdu speakers who had the same mentality we have today, MashaAllah. You threw away Bengal out of urdu-speaking chauvinism and now you dare to blame it on other communities! Not only that use it as a tool to claim partition a blunder. Shame on you. Altaf should be hanged for that speech as it is done in Turkey. Maybe if we had let the two urdu speakers be removed and not made everything an issue we could have saved 71 from occurring.)

I am by birth an urdu speaker by choice a Pashtun, every breathe of mine screams Pakistani Nationalism and I will die sword in hand but will never let another Bangladesh happen again and the potential for this to happen comes from Altaf Hussain. Pakistan first second and last.

O Hero, drame band ker de!! Khuda ka wasta hai!

Aur pehle samajh to le AH ne kaha kia tha us ko latkane se pehle!!

Excuse me. Didn't you just attack my brother @Chak Bamu, Punjabis and Sindhis and belittle Chak Bamu's ancestors role in the formation of Pakistan? You MQM terrorists cannot take part in a single debate without bashing another ethnicity or looking at them down your nose and now you are saying you don't bash ethnicity? Let me pull out some of your posts and they will reveal the truth real quickly... I suggest you learn from @darkinsky... he stopped racist posts too for which I am truly thankful. I would also request him to reassess his loyalty to MQM. But of course I cannot force him.

And in front of me do not dare to insult the heritage and history of @Chak Bamu. If you had the ability to understand it you would know he idolizes Urdu despite his mother-tongue being Punjabi and once had high hopes with the MQM. Punjabis are the reason Urdu which is our language spread to every nook and corner in Pakistan. Instead of feeling for others and respecting them we criticize them and their history.

Read his post above yours aur agar itni si bhi ghairat ho to stop posting rubbish again.

My mind gets a little befuddled when someone says something about partition being a mistake. It is a test of my patience. You didn't ask which period this information was for but MQM supporters aren't known to be smart. They vote for Altaf because he is a Muhajir and they are the same, they are from Karachi and Altaf is too which doesn't really show a cultured or educated upbringing, sorry to say which serves as a primary example that a university graduate can be as illiterate as a villager. Its for 2012 by CPLC and Sindh police. You may not easily find it-a journalist can by making calls here and there.



I was checking the solved cases too. You can't escape a journalist, even an unsuccessful one like me. I have EVERY fact here.

Here I will bring 7 cases you can check in the database of Sindh police (I wrote them down) which were solved and found out to be by MQM target killers. I will only mention first names as I do not trust you as you could be a target killer. Shahzeb, murdered at restaurant-MQM worker arrested. Sohaib-murdered by MQM target killer. Abbas murdered, his brother injured in targeted attack-the name of killer Shafi Alias Bilal who was in contact with Ajmal Pahari but he may escape as the prosecution is very weak (haven't checked on progress of case), next Salim whose target killer was killed in an encounter-was from orangi, next Adil his target killer was just a paid person-he wasn't affiliated with MQM but confessed in court of having been paid, next Mohammed and finally Qasim both killed in a shooting at some roundabout.

Also I checked out the case of Syed Salahuddin, editor of Takbeer who was killed by target killer Ajmal Pahari who is responsible for 100+ murders. He is out of jail yet again just like Malik Ishaq. This is who my beysharam people of Karachi vote for. Now before denying this... go to the police and find out about these cases.

You forgot the couple of goats and a chicken that were killed by Ajmal Pahari in 1941 for the British!! This Ajmal Pahari must be the real james bond and must have a license to kill indeed. Sheep, led by sheep indeed.

Do note when the constable helping me make sense of the information showed be the file and I noticed for the first 7 solved cases it had been MQM workers or MQM paid target killers that had been used I stopped looking though yes I will admit in some older pages there were cases against PPP workers as well.

A high profile case would be Wali Babar and murder of the Chief architects of operation clean-up. Wonder why anyone else would kill him? Here is what happened to those who participated in 92 operation against MQM terror gang.:

What happened to the 92 cops who disappeared after 1992? – The Express Tribune

There were roughly 259 police officers involved in the operation out of which 254 have been murdered (according to Jang a week or so back). I won't speak of who murdered them because many would have been motivated for such a task especially those who lost family members to the extrajudicial executions that were being carried out by these police officials on ethnic basis.

You do not need to copy my exact words. Didn't I say objectively and critically first... but proves that basically Altaf says kill all other ethnic groups and you jump on his lap like a little kid and let him ruffle your hair while you shout the same thing.

You are not very smart. I had posted that you were merely copying and pasting words like "objectively and critically" without having the intelligence to actually use the 2 traits as if you had used them you would not have posted what you did. What you understood from my post proves to me how smart you actually are.

Do note, I cannot believe anyone can be so objective in Pakistan to condemn his own ethnic group of birth so severely and its behavior in Pakistan for the purpose of ethnic unity and Nationalism which you lack. You want me to accept a terrorist organization as a constant presence in this city. It will never happen. That above is a load of proof. Another proof. MQM hosted in 1984 as the Muhajir Quami movement. Figures from 1985-1990, no surpise here! 3000 deaths in Karachi. That is what the MQM is.

People like you have no value to the real Karachiites and MQM's support will continue to grow whether you like it or not. It is because there is no alternate to MQM.

* Will continue when have more time *

 

[haviZsultan]

And I can draw a parallel of someone who lives in a fairyland and dreams up stuff. The resemblance is quite uncanny.

A person with a brain can usually think... but I believe you do not have that ability with the worm in the head. Altaf is like a worm in the head. If he appears there very little can be done to take him out. You are very much like a cancer patient with a disease-in this case your mental issues prevent you from recognizing their is a problem with how you think and you continue denying and shifting blame, shifting blame being a feature of an ethno-fascists.

There is an indisputable link between MQM supporters and Taliban sympathizers. Both of them no matter faced with what monumental evidence continue denying and stating there is no issue when there is a huge issue. Those were police reports I gave you for godsake. Information from CCP and Sindh police!

I honestly do not understand where I have insulted any ethnicity, anywhere. Furthermore, listen and listen well, your loyalty and patriotism cannot even imagine to match that of mine!

Laughable statement for someone who does not believe in Pakistan? If so why are you justifying the speech of Altaf? Partition being a mistake means actually wishing Pakistan wasn't formed. I don't believe with Altaf dancing in your head you can understand that.

I know how you guys start this entire race war in every debate by insulting another ethnic group. Others who came here never noticed but I noticed this insult to Chak Bamu caused him to defend his ancestors, heritage and sacrifices. It was a direct insult to his sacrifice. You start things, then blame others. It is an MQM tactic:

The Mohajir identity was not coined by the urdu speaking Mohajirs, neither were the problems that rooted out of their loyalty and support for Fatima Jinnah (instead of Field Marshal Ayub Khan). I have posted many informative things from the sacrifices the migrants made to the freedom struggles where most of the residents of Punjab & Sindh had no participation and Khan of Kalat (ANP) etc. openly voted against Pakistan. Your outburst, whether you understand it or not, is actually against urdu speaking migrants, whom I consider more of a claimant then those who never lifted a finger for this freedom!!!

In the last part you state the belief that Urdu-speakers are better, sacrificed more (which is a myth) something which is being covered as chauvinistic self-gratification in my paper on ethnic issues and hence is one of the issues from which a lot of other problems are born. Your mindset is the problem.

I, unlike the likes of you who would flee the country the first chance they get, am a dual citizen living and serving my country in no other city then Karachi

Lol. I go outside and bring thousands of dollars for hungry Pakistanis at home, in Pakistan I raise only 10000 rupees, there I raise thousands of dollars. You have no idea that since you people are too busy killing each other in the name of ethnicity and religion or supporting terrorist groups, corrupt parties or militant parties like MQM the overseas Pakistanis usually do not fall for these foolish things and think only of their country. 80% of the funding for our movement came from overseas Pakistanis while the majority of members were in Pakistan.

and serving the federal Government in the capacity that does actually make the country better. It's time to come out of the la la land!!

I knew that you were in government which is the only reason you can so shamelessly defend your terrorist party. My relative in Canada was the same thing... he served in the government under the PPP which has developed a record of producing traitors and said Muhajirs were superior to everyone else. Was it a surprise he did not believe in Pakistan at all? You don't either do you since you call partition a mistake. Why don't you take your words back?

You just slapped my family on the face by the way telling them that their moving across the border sacrificing everything from home, property, jewellery and even links to brothers and sisters in our ancestral area was a mistake. All of us migrants deserve an apology for that.

By the way why do all people in government think they are better than everyone else?

Honestly, your blabbering and rubbish statements do not make an iota of sense! Your logic is flawed and your post is most likely referring to someone you just imagined! As far as Karachi is concerned, I have spent over 25 years in this city, raised and born amongst friends and family belonging to all ethnicities and I have tasted the good, the bad and the ugly of this city. I am intimiate not only with the city but also the city politics including that of MQM, PPP and ANP.

I bet. As a person in the federal government how many body guards do you keep when you walk around the city? Have you stepped behind the walls of your castle? There are no go areas for MQM supporters and no go areas for PPP and ANP supporters. Everyone knows this very well.

And I am a realist who speaks what is true and I am a witness to the city's decline unlike wannabe's like you who have no real idea of ground realities as you have either never lived in Karachi or have lived in some posh area under protected environment.

Are you for real? My grand-father left his entire house and support of his family to arrive in Pakistan and here he rode a cycle, his kids didn't have money for lunch or taking a bus-instead trekked to school every day for an hour to go back and forth. How dare you, an MQM terrorist sitting in federal government attack the sacrifices of my family. Karachi is my home and in case you didn't notice this is where I am now. You spent lots of years in Australia too which I must say is a base for CIA activity. Have to wonder why you called partition a mistake. Someday when migrants will realize your real purpose-boy-is the MQM going to suffer.

You have not once spoken about one statistic I revealed. Can you explain those 3000 deaths and how the rise of the MQM was proportional to the rise of target killings and ethnic tensions?

But being in the federal government-probably there due to MQM. Which ministry are you in by the way? And how are you serving Pakistan? By keeping any other ethnicity out of "your" ministry.

I know the basis and realities of stories that were made up by the media, JIT, political parties etc. and advertised through PTV throughout the early 90's! People like you want to believe what they are fed instead of trying to open up their minds in an attempt to find the other side of the stories as well. Keep down the biased opinions, they only spread hatred.

Personally now knowing you work for this corrupt government made up of terrorists, criminals, rapists and thieves I am not very surprised that you deny solid evidence that include names of the ones killed and their target killers. You are like a suicide bomber brought on tv by Saleem Safi. You will keep defending these terrorists no matter what they do. It is unfortunate that people like you sitting in federal government and looking down their noses at others including fellow muhajirs like a poor family from lucknow that struggled to get where it is today.

It is even more surprising that a person sitting in federal government justifies Altaf's speech which automatically reveals he wishes Pakistan wasn't formed at all and looks down on other ethnic groups. If you want to look at why our country is where it is take a mirror and look at yourself... but when you do I know you will only grin like an idiot taking pride over what you have done to this country because like any politician you think the country cannot survive without you despite being like a leech who leeches life from this great nation. You guys have made Pakistanis captive in their own land.

I talked to a Haqiqi guy and you know what he said. He hopes that an urdu-speaker one day shoots Altaf dead. I would like to say a lot of urdu speakers agree with him (both muhajir and urdu speaker however are incorrect or discriminatory terms though)

That is not the real problem, it is a fact that there indeed is no proof of any such incident. Had that been the case, AH would have been eaten up by Karachiites who are more loyal to the country than anybody else.

The issue is lack of awareness and the ethnic identity obfuscating or being used against the National identity. That was a case in Altaf's speech as well. Karachites will eventually get rid of Altaf. Ask the police who have every bit of evidence... if they investigate they may even find someone like you in the "federal government" supporting the killers which is the reason for your keen-ness to defend them.

And when you cannot post proof you bring up stories.

Is that a brain in there or has the worm eaten all of it? Those were reports of cases, entire files I shared. But federal government... right...

I wonder why you even believe something that is hearsay. I was wondering whether your stories are only stories and my belief is further strengthened as your words are words that I have written and put across with just lines changed but of similar essence. You are merely posing to be a family member of a migrant who decently and in the highest acts of patriotism and self sacrifice, left everything behind for Pakistan.....that is the definition of your average migrant!!

Lol. A patriot does not take part in the ethnic tensions... he rises above them, defends his brothers of other ethnicities and has a National mindset not an ethnic mindset. He doesn't try to keep all resources to himself, make Karachi his personal jageer and say no one else has a right to come here. Our past was once glorious. We hosted leaders like Hasrat Mohani and Muslim League leaders in our house in Lucknow... now we are in decline. There is no history of us after 1947 except the rubbish imposed on us by MQM. We are not muhajirs but Lucknowites, Biharis, Hyderabadis, Madrasis and others. That is the real culture anyway. If someone tells me I can unite with a Bihari whose urdu is almost not understandable for me then why should I look for an excuse to divide with a Punjabi or Sindhi and develop a separate identity?-its hypocrisy and an attempt to divide from my country.

I suggest you be a real son of a migrant and stop creating hate between communities and stop supporting terror chief. By far the average migrant today is in decline. I see it in my family, my relatives, everyone... and it is painful to see people who once so strongly believed in Pakistan now keen only to maintain this stupid terminology and their privileged position.

I am from Lucknow and the muhajir identity has by birth been imposed on me. I refuse to call myself one but that won't change the fact that I am the son of someone who crossed the border and came from Lucknow. You however may be an Indian agent sent by Modi? Where are you from? Which state?

I did not forget, my fore fathers were a part of the migration and the freedom struggle before that!

And how proud they must be that their son is a traitor who called the partition a mistake and hence their movement to Pakistan the same.

Not including you, we were and still are an example for the whole country.

I have educated many kids and been the leader of a Nationalist front. You have no clue who I am. A person who divides his people, his nation by ethnicity or religion can never be a hero or an example. The only thing you are an example of is a person whose brain has stopped working due to the Altaf worm crawling within it.

We started from nothing and now we have everything, by the grace of Allah and because of our faith in hard and honest work.

That is our history... not a terrorist like yours. If you remember correctly you and your people were shooting people in the streets since APMSO days. Our city has now become the murder capital of the world as MQM has risen. If that is hard, honest work then I believe I want no part in it.

Urdu was chosen to be the National Language by none other then the founding fathers of this nation. You want to know why Urdu was made the the official language? It was because it was a neutral language that was affiliated with Muslims, it was the official language of the Mughal emperors and it was most widely understood throughout the sub continent.

The official language initially of the mughals was Persian and was spoken in the courts and throughout by royalty and nobles. That ensured its neutrality as none of the subjects spoke it. But I agree with this point and have stated it regularly.

However Urdu would have remained a neutral language only if urdu-speakers themselves had merged with local communities and therefore it could be claimed by no one that Urdu was favorable to a select group. So in a way you are claiming that by refusing to call ourselves Sindhis, Pashtuns and Punjabis or merging we caused the ethnic problems in the country. Thanks for admitting. But at least I plan to set things right by merging as a Pashtun and defending other ethnic groups from MQM terrorists like you and refuting your claims of being victims.

There are many other reasons too. Urdu was supposed to do exactly the opposite of dividing Pakistanis into language based ethnicity. It was meant to unite Bengalis (who wanted Bangla to be the official language), Punjabis (who supported Punjabi) and so on.

Punjabis whole-heartedly supported urdu during and after... but that is a separate debate. But in any case with urdu-speakers becoming a separate ethnic group this purpose became an obscure one. So we basically stepped on Jinnah's grave... that wouldn't matter to you since Altaf burned the flag and called partition a blunder which indirectly meant both that Jinnah was a fool and Pakistan's formation a mistake.

Your understanding is a pathetic joke and you are a miserable student of history/journalism!!!

This guy remind anyone of @Sher Malang. This comment:

Yours is a Muhajir version of Pashtun history!!

Are you Sher Malang's brother?

This is getting quite personal now. I am not one who wants to get personal on some forum as then the real mettle of the person is not tested. You want to get personal, get personal in person! I live in Karachi and can take this up with you in any part of the city you wish. This is not a threat, just an invitation to understand me in person.

It was nothing personal, I compared you to a relative who really got me angry. What is personal is calling partition a blunder and being surrounded by those thick walls of your house and burly bodyguards in a posh defense home while not knowing how an average urdu speaker on the street will react to this when he sees it.

There is a woman called Sana. Check her case out. Entire family murdered in Hyderabad, India. We moved members of her family. This is what happens to our people in India... there is nothing more insulting to those of us who lost family members there than a callous person like you calling partition a mistake. I seek an apology.

No pathan or any other ethnicity is under anybody's joota. That's pure BS and words of an illiterate fool!

Then it would be wise to try and stop anyone like Muhajirs from saying it. They have always said things like this or worse.

The founding father of ANP once stated in his speech that Pathans do what Mohajirs cannot do and Mohajirs do what Pathans cannot do. This is a fact. You look realistically at what Pathans do, what Baloch do, what Punjabis do, what Sindhi do, what Urdu speaking do and there are differences. Pathans are usually hard physical workers, laborers and businesses, Baloch are not much into anything except to be left alone to their culture, Punjabis & Sindhis are into farming predominantly and in education, business etc., Mohajirs are mostly job and education oriented and also in business. Even the businesses of different communities usually differ in nature.

I feel that is a childish way to look at things... there is no guarantee a Sindhi will always be a farmer. Also Muhajirs are job and education oriented. Again perpetuating the same thing-that my family and others like it are and have a right to be at the top while the rest suffer. I would rather reduce the suffering of the Sindhi or Pashtun than be a part of this.

And then you bring in Afghans, I don't even wanna go into that.

No Afghans (nation) mentioned in the part of the post you quoted.

Owners of interior Sindh formed Governments and had serving Prime Ministers for over 12 years, 7 of those years were with absolute power yet fate of interior Sindh has not changed. You speak of Hospitals, Colleges, Universities and other facilities in the city of Karachi, well it is the biggest city to start with and most of these facilities are private owned and established and operated by the residents of this city!!!

Stop blaming others. The population of Sindh is 63% Sindhi 18% urdu speaking and other races make up the rest. Now a bigot like you wants a so-called Muhajir on every top position? What does it matter? Is a Sindhi not a Pakistani? I am very proud of them. I hope each and every chief minister is a sindhi and no one ever comes from my migrant communities. They want one phool, I will give them a dozen. That is how u build love. If they ask for a phool when you have 20 and you make it a lungi affair it creates division which MQM excels at.

Realities again will prove you a fool working to divide Pakistan by fomenting ethnic tensions. Despite the majority being Sindhi 60% of governors for Sindh were urdu-speakers and Ishrat Ul Ibad is perhaps the longest serving governor in the history of Pakistan and Sindh. Stop belittling fellow Pakistanis sacrifice to perpetuate the myth that you are the only one who sacrificed.

We all know in your eyes the sacrifice doesn't count since you call partition a blunder meaning it was a mistake for us to migrate. Don't you dare talk about sacrifice about which you don't give a damn.

When we speak of oppression we are speaking of the quota system that brings in an undeserving person to an important post just because his community votes for the powers that continue to keep them in these conditions. And the more these undeserving people get these jobs, the more their hold grows stronger and the country weaker. There have been instances where jobs have been advertised which clearly stated that people with domicile from Karachi should not apply!!!/QUOTE]

You are speaking about nothing. Whatever MQM barks-woof woof! You do the same without thinking that this is the first step to cutting out the land, especially when one instead of calling for Altaf sahib to be hanged when he makes the speech, defends him.

By the way which party has backed you. You work for the federal government. Do you hold a position of importance? Did MQM help in getting you where you are or is it just a normal lower level staff job?

Perhaps it is time to read up the condition and state of affairs of the country and bureaucracy in general before and after Bhutto!!!

My job is not to defend Bhutto. It is to tell you that you sir, are a bigot!

Did you bother to confirm the stats of that post? I highly doubt you did because the last I checked there was strict quota compliance on all Government jobs! But people like you, self declared journalists and what not, would rather jump on posts that reflect their own notion rather then cross checking the post and fact finding!

I never talked either against the qouta system not for it. You being a highly educated person who believes everyone else should be cleaning your posts failed to read the post clearly. It was for Radio Pakistan that I posted statistics and radio Pakistan is run by the government. There is no qouta for the directors. Altaf is dancing like a demon in your brain which makes it impossible for you to use it.

O Hero, drame band ker de!! Khuda ka wasta hai!

Aur pehle samajh to le AH ne kaha kia tha us ko latkane se pehle!!

Uski speech defend karna band kar warna ham sab tujhey ghaddar bolengey.

Read his post above yours aur agar itni si bhi ghairat ho to stop posting rubbish again.

I read not only that post but the post before it in which you provoked him. You MQM supporters somehow happen to provoke or take part in about 90% of the ethnic abuse and insults that fly here on PDF. Am I surprised?

You forgot the couple of goats and a chicken that were killed by Ajmal Pahari in 1941 for the British!! This Ajmal Pahari must be the real james bond and must have a license to kill indeed. Sheep, led by sheep indeed.

This is not a Taliban propaganda video... step out of the "victim syndrome" and this vehement "denial" aimed at defending life hero Altaf Hussain. He is not God as is taught to MQM workers and confirmed by Saulat Mirza in his confession tape. He is a terror chief with how many, 3576 cases filed against him ranging from bombings, firebombings, terrorism, murders, torture, rape, land grabbing, bori bund lashein and other unspeakable brutality. Man there is a video of Ajmal Pahari's confession!

There were roughly 259 police officers involved in the operation out of which 254 have been murdered (according to Jang a week or so back). I won't speak of who murdered them because many would have been motivated for such a task especially those who lost family members to the extrajudicial executions that were being carried out by these police officials on ethnic basis.

Lol. By this brilliant logic then with 3000+ cases against him before the NRO there would be thousands motivated to shoot Altaf Hussain which is why he hides in London. By the way that article was about those who disappeared. I have this statistic. But there are constables as well. That operation was the best thing ever done in Karachi and violence dropped for a long period.

You are not very smart. I had posted that you were merely copying and pasting words like "objectively and critically" without having the intelligence to actually use the 2 traits as if you had used them you would not have posted what you did. What you understood from my post proves to me how smart you actually are.

Talk about objectivity with a bigot.

People like you have no value to the real Karachiites and MQM's support will continue to grow whether you like it or not. It is because there is no alternate to MQM.

Unless the MQM shoots me like they shot the Bihari Qaumi Movement president who caused grievous losses to you guys, I and many other true Karachites like Oscar and dozens of others here will stand against this terrorist party. You ignored every piece of evidence in that post. Clearly if Altaf will try to merge with India you will support him. This is how Bangladesh was formed.

* Will continue when have more time *

Good way to deny uncomfortable realities... deflecting the blame on to X and Y, claiming yourself the victim oppressed by the others, self gratification that you did more... all covered in my report. Only a true hero of Pakistan can look within and identify his faults. Pakistan is for all of us and this land means more to me than anything else.

 

[Mav3rick]

Before I begin the post I would like to explicitly state that I am neither a member of APMSO/MQM neither am I an outright diehard fan/supporter. My defense of certain things pertaining to MQM is purely driven by a desire to show you all the other side of the picture. Only when you truly have both sides of the story, can you actually make up your mind....that is if you are not biased and brainwashed already.

I am an open critic of MQM, on issues that should be criticized and I support things that should be supported, much like I am with all other political parties and even the Military. Anyway, here we go:

A person with a brain can usually think... but I believe you do not have that ability with the worm in the head. Altaf is like a worm in the head. If he appears there very little can be done to take him out. You are very much like a cancer patient with a disease-in this case your mental issues prevent you from recognizing their is a problem with how you think and you continue denying and shifting blame, shifting blame being a feature of an ethno-fascists.

Your posts are full of personal attacks. It's most likely because you do not have proof of any wrong doing of MQM but have been brain washed with media propaganda.

There is an indisputable link between MQM supporters and Taliban sympathizers. Both of them no matter faced with what monumental evidence continue denying and stating there is no issue when there is a huge issue. Those were police reports I gave you for godsake. Information from CCP and Sindh police!

2 things I would like to speak of here, first is that the Talibaan are freedom fighters who are fighting for their country and as instructed by their religion. If tomorrow, God forbid, Pakistan is attacked then all patriots will take up arms and will defend the country.....that would make us terrorists to the invaders, however we will be patriots to our country and countrymen. And please do not confuse Talibaan with TTP terrorists.

Secondly, it is quite frustrating for me when people give me police reports despite the fact that police is the most corrupt and politically driven force in the entire country. Today, no citizen trusts the police department; we all know how infected they are with corruption, political victimization, dacoity, street crimes, abuse of power etc. Actually, a person enters the police force only for the haraam ki kamai in it. How many honest police officers are there in the police force is anybody's guess! This is a force that will register an FIR against any xyz on any number of charges if some abc paid them (or forced them if in power)! I know this intimately because of what I do.

Laughable statement for someone who does not believe in Pakistan? If so why are you justifying the speech of Altaf? Partition being a mistake means actually wishing Pakistan wasn't formed. I don't believe with Altaf dancing in your head you can understand that.

I know how you guys start this entire race war in every debate by insulting another ethnic group. Others who came here never noticed but I noticed this insult to Chak Bamu caused him to defend his ancestors, heritage and sacrifices. It was a direct insult to his sacrifice. You start things, then blame others. It is an MQM tactic:

I have no answer to your continued abuse and personal attacks. As I said earlier, you cannot even imagine contesting my patriotism. And when I say that partition was a mistake, I stand by it as the statement has been proved through history. Only the biggest of idiots can still consider partition in that manner to be justified after half the country broke away from us. Partition should have been 1 piece Pakistan on this side and 1 piece India, unlike what happened where there existed 2 Pakistans on either side of India!!

In the last part you state the belief that Urdu-speakers are better, sacrificed more (which is a myth) something which is being covered as chauvinistic self-gratification in my paper on ethnic issues and hence is one of the issues from which a lot of other problems are born. Your mindset is the problem.

I have claimed that migrants sacrificed more than anyone who was already here and that many of those migrants actively participated in the freedom struggle. Those migrants left family, friends, culture, heritage, goods, land and belongings behind for Pakistan. And yes, they have more of a claim on Pakistan then those who got Pakistan sitting idle as the migrants earned freedom after struggle and sacrifice! Those who do not understand that are the real problem. But today, Pakistan belongs to everyone equally as it should be, and then be it even Urdu speaking migrants!

Lol. I go outside and bring thousands of dollars for hungry Pakistanis at home, in Pakistan I raise only 10000 rupees, there I raise thousands of dollars. You have no idea that since you people are too busy killing each other in the name of ethnicity and religion or supporting terrorist groups, corrupt parties or militant parties like MQM the overseas Pakistanis usually do not fall for these foolish things and think only of their country. 80% of the funding for our movement came from overseas Pakistanis while the majority of members were in Pakistan.

So you say.....but how do I confirm that unless you tell me who you are? Should I just believe every random tom, dick and harry who claim such things on the internet? For all I know you could be some Indian trying to stir up things. Tell me what you do and who you are so that I can confirm your claims.

I knew that you were in government which is the only reason you can so shamelessly defend your terrorist party. My relative in Canada was the same thing... he served in the government under the PPP which has developed a record of producing traitors and said Muhajirs were superior to everyone else. Was it a surprise he did not believe in Pakistan at all? You don't either do you since you call partition a mistake. Why don't you take your words back?

I am not in the Government! There is a big difference in being in the Government and being an officer of the federal Government! Learn the difference before posting comments that are stupid otherwise.

And for the last time, my love for my country cannot be paralleled! You and most other make statements, I actually do something to make a difference for my country. I will not repeat this again!

You just slapped my family on the face by the way telling them that their moving across the border sacrificing everything from home, property, jewellery and even links to brothers and sisters in our ancestral area was a mistake. All of us migrants deserve an apology for that.

On the one hand you state that I consider the migrants to be above others and then you post this, what am I to make of you except seriously consider whether you are insane!

By the way why do all people in government think they are better than everyone else?

Do you have any idea of the process we have to go through during recruitment? Only those who have 'sifarish' get in easily. Others, like me, have to succeed in multiple challenges to complete the recruitment process. But I do not think I am better then 'everyone' else. There may be others better than me.

I bet. As a person in the federal government how many body guards do you keep when you walk around the city? Have you stepped behind the walls of your castle? There are no go areas for MQM supporters and no go areas for PPP and ANP supporters. Everyone knows this very well.

I am not entitled any guards so I venture outside alone and without protection.

I know there are no-go areas defined by all political parties; furthermore I know that there are now no-go areas defined by gali's and mohallas. Everybody has his/her own no-go area in Karachi today and it's pathetic and deplorable. If you lived in Karachi, you would have known that. Anyway, what have you done to fix that?

Are you for real? My grand-father left his entire house and support of his family to arrive in Pakistan and here he rode a cycle, his kids didn't have money for lunch or taking a bus-instead trekked to school every day for an hour to go back and forth. How dare you, an MQM terrorist sitting in federal government attack the sacrifices of my family. Karachi is my home and in case you didn't notice this is where I am now. You spent lots of years in Australia too which I must say is a base for CIA activity. Have to wonder why you called partition a mistake. Someday when migrants will realize your real purpose-boy-is the MQM going to suffer.

I spent a few years in Australia so I much be in cahoots with CIA, what logic!!

You have not once spoken about one statistic I revealed. Can you explain those 3000 deaths and how the rise of the MQM was proportional to the rise of target killings and ethnic tensions?

But being in the federal government-probably there due to MQM. Which ministry are you in by the way? And how are you serving Pakistan? By keeping any other ethnicity out of "your" ministry.

Which 3000 deaths? MQM began fighting PPP militants and other political factions that were suppressing and killing urdu speaking migrants, all sides suffered losses but a de facto status was achieved in an undeclared ceasefire. The military then, afraid of the rise of MQM, began a military operation against MQM and actually gave strength to the 2 leaders who were expelled from MQM because of their militant ways in MQM-H. MQM-H already had the baddest of the bad and with support of the Army they started taking out MQM supporters/activists etc. MQM-H was also supported by other LEA's in these activities while the senior most leadership had "Wanted: Dead or Alive" on their heads and most had head money too! You need more than that?

Personally now knowing you work for this corrupt government made up of terrorists, criminals, rapists and thieves I am not very surprised that you deny solid evidence that include names of the ones killed and their target killers. You are like a suicide bomber brought on tv by Saleem Safi. You will keep defending these terrorists no matter what they do. It is unfortunate that people like you sitting in federal government and looking down their noses at others including fellow muhajirs like a poor family from lucknow that struggled to get where it is today.

It is even more surprising that a person sitting in federal government justifies Altaf's speech which automatically reveals he wishes Pakistan wasn't formed at all and looks down on other ethnic groups. If you want to look at why our country is where it is take a mirror and look at yourself... but when you do I know you will only grin like an idiot taking pride over what you have done to this country because like any politician you think the country cannot survive without you despite being like a leech who leeches life from this great nation. You guys have made Pakistanis captive in their own land.

I talked to a Haqiqi guy and you know what he said. He hopes that an urdu-speaker one day shoots Altaf dead. I would like to say a lot of urdu speakers agree with him (both muhajir and urdu speaker however are incorrect or discriminatory terms though)

I think I have clarified my position above on all these things. About activities of LEA's and my personal role as an officer in the federal Government.

The issue is lack of awareness and the ethnic identity obfuscating or being used against the National identity. That was a case in Altaf's speech as well. Karachites will eventually get rid of Altaf. Ask the police who have every bit of evidence... if they investigate they may even find someone like you in the "federal government" supporting the killers which is the reason for your keen-ness to defend them.


Is that a brain in there or has the worm eaten all of it? Those were reports of cases, entire files I shared. But federal government... right...

AH was acquitted of all those allegations by none other the High Court of Sindh where the AG himself admitted that there were many ambiguities in the claims against AH! There were lies and propaganda and those usually are not followed by proof in third world countries like us where proof cannot be fabricated of such major accusations.
Furthermore, you may have gathered stories from different sources where as I am a part of a federal intelligence agency. I am most confident that I have access to things that you cannot dream of.

Lol. A patriot does not take part in the ethnic tensions... he rises above them, defends his brothers of other ethnicities and has a National mindset not an ethnic mindset. He doesn't try to keep all resources to himself, make Karachi his personal jageer and say no one else has a right to come here. Our past was once glorious. We hosted leaders like Hasrat Mohani and Muslim League leaders in our house in Lucknow... now we are in decline. There is no history of us after 1947 except the rubbish imposed on us by MQM. We are not muhajirs but Lucknowites, Biharis, Hyderabadis, Madrasis and others. That is the real culture anyway. If someone tells me I can unite with a Bihari whose urdu is almost not understandable for me then why should I look for an excuse to divide with a Punjabi or Sindhi and develop a separate identity?-its hypocrisy and an attempt to divide from my country.

I suggest you be a real son of a migrant and stop creating hate between communities and stop supporting terror chief. By far the average migrant today is in decline. I see it in my family, my relatives, everyone... and it is painful to see people who once so strongly believed in Pakistan now keen only to maintain this stupid terminology and their privileged position.

I am from Lucknow and the muhajir identity has by birth been imposed on me. I refuse to call myself one but that won't change the fact that I am the son of someone who crossed the border and came from Lucknow. You however may be an Indian agent sent by Modi? Where are you from? Which state?

I was born in Karachi so I am a Sindhi. My parents were migrants.

And how proud they must be that their son is a traitor who called the partition a mistake and hence their movement to Pakistan the same.

Explained above.

I have educated many kids and been the leader of a Nationalist front. You have no clue who I am. A person who divides his people, his nation by ethnicity or religion can never be a hero or an example. The only thing you are an example of is a person whose brain has stopped working due to the Altaf worm crawling within it.



That is our history... not a terrorist like yours. If you remember correctly you and your people were shooting people in the streets since APMSO days. Our city has now become the murder capital of the world as MQM has risen. If that is hard, honest work then I believe I want no part in it.



The official language initially of the mughals was Persian and was spoken in the courts and throughout by royalty and nobles. That ensured its neutrality as none of the subjects spoke it. But I agree with this point and have stated it regularly.

However Urdu would have remained a neutral language only if urdu-speakers themselves had merged with local communities and therefore it could be claimed by no one that Urdu was favorable to a select group. So in a way you are claiming that by refusing to call ourselves Sindhis, Pashtuns and Punjabis or merging we caused the ethnic problems in the country. Thanks for admitting. But at least I plan to set things right by merging as a Pashtun and defending other ethnic groups from MQM terrorists like you and refuting your claims of being victims.



Punjabis whole-heartedly supported urdu during and after... but that is a separate debate. But in any case with urdu-speakers becoming a separate ethnic group this purpose became an obscure one. So we basically stepped on Jinnah's grave... that wouldn't matter to you since Altaf burned the flag and called partition a blunder which indirectly meant both that Jinnah was a fool and Pakistan's formation a mistake.



This guy remind anyone of @Sher Malang. This comment:



Are you Sher Malang's brother?



It was nothing personal, I compared you to a relative who really got me angry. What is personal is calling partition a blunder and being surrounded by those thick walls of your house and burly bodyguards in a posh defense home while not knowing how an average urdu speaker on the street will react to this when he sees it.

There is a woman called Sana. Check her case out. Entire family murdered in Hyderabad, India. We moved members of her family. This is what happens to our people in India... there is nothing more insulting to those of us who lost family members there than a callous person like you calling partition a mistake. I seek an apology.



Then it would be wise to try and stop anyone like Muhajirs from saying it. They have always said things like this or worse.



I feel that is a childish way to look at things... there is no guarantee a Sindhi will always be a farmer. Also Muhajirs are job and education oriented. Again perpetuating the same thing-that my family and others like it are and have a right to be at the top while the rest suffer. I would rather reduce the suffering of the Sindhi or Pashtun than be a part of this.



No Afghans (nation) mentioned in the part of the post you quoted.

I cannot explain things again and again.

Stop blaming others. The population of Sindh is 63% Sindhi 18% urdu speaking and other races make up the rest. Now a bigot like you wants a so-called Muhajir on every top position? What does it matter? Is a Sindhi not a Pakistani? I am very proud of them. I hope each and every chief minister is a sindhi and no one ever comes from my migrant communities. They want one phool, I will give them a dozen. That is how u build love. If they ask for a phool when you have 20 and you make it a lungi affair it creates division which MQM excels at.

I say that the most capable person should get the position and not some illiterate who gets the job just because his ethnicity has more quota. Only then can our country truly progress, we cannot afford such compromises anymore and all Government departments are proof of what I say.

Realities again will prove you a fool working to divide Pakistan by fomenting ethnic tensions. Despite the majority being Sindhi 60% of governors for Sindh were urdu-speakers and Ishrat Ul Ibad is perhaps the longest serving governor in the history of Pakistan and Sindh. Stop belittling fellow Pakistanis sacrifice to perpetuate the myth that you are the only one who sacrificed.

Do you even know what a Governor can do in Pakistan? Governor is just a representative of the president for provinces; he holds no power unless Governor's rule is imposed. Chief Minister holds the real power in the province and that seat has never been occupied by any Urdu speaking!

We all know in your eyes the sacrifice doesn't count since you call partition a blunder meaning it was a mistake for us to migrate. Don't you dare talk about sacrifice about which you don't give a damn.

When we speak of oppression we are speaking of the quota system that brings in an undeserving person to an important post just because his community votes for the powers that continue to keep them in these conditions. And the more these undeserving people get these jobs, the more their hold grows stronger and the country weaker. There have been instances where jobs have been advertised which clearly stated that people with domicile from Karachi should not apply!!!/QUOTE]

You are speaking about nothing. Whatever MQM barks-woof woof! You do the same without thinking that this is the first step to cutting out the land, especially when one instead of calling for Altaf sahib to be hanged when he makes the speech, defends him.

By the way which party has backed you. You work for the federal government. Do you hold a position of importance? Did MQM help in getting you where you are or is it just a normal lower level staff job?

Have you seen the police head office on I.I Chundrigar road? You can come visit me anytime (office hours) and witness whether I hold a position of importance or not. And I earned this job on merit.

My job is not to defend Bhutto. It is to tell you that you sir, are a bigot!

Good job. Keep it up. But I wasn't counseling you to defend Bhutto, I was merely trying to put forth the advise so that you may understand how the fabric of this society changed with Bhutto's rule.

I never talked either against the qouta system not for it. You being a highly educated person who believes everyone else should be cleaning your posts failed to read the post clearly. It was for Radio Pakistan that I posted statistics and radio Pakistan is run by the government. There is no qouta for the directors. Altaf is dancing like a demon in your brain which makes it impossible for you to use it.

Fortunately, as I am a Government officer, I am aware that the quota applies to all positions alike so quota would have been applicable on Directors positions as well. You are either incompetent or just a liar.

Uski speech defend karna band kar warna ham sab tujhey ghaddar bolengey.

I wasn't technically defending his 'speech'. I just called a spade, a spade.

I read not only that post but the post before it in which you provoked him. You MQM supporters somehow happen to provoke or take part in about 90% of the ethnic abuse and insults that fly here on PDF. Am I surprised?



This is not a Taliban propaganda video... step out of the "victim syndrome" and this vehement "denial" aimed at defending life hero Altaf Hussain. He is not God as is taught to MQM workers and confirmed by Saulat Mirza in his confession tape. He is a terror chief with how many, 3576 cases filed against him ranging from bombings, firebombings, terrorism, murders, torture, rape, land grabbing, bori bund lashein and other unspeakable brutality. Man there is a video of Ajmal Pahari's confession!

As I said there was also a case registered against AH for stealing a police constable’s cap!! If that is not height of ridiculous allegations, I don't know what is.

As for Ajmal Pahari's confession, did you know that confessions under duress are not applicable in any court of law? Do you know why that is? Did you know that CIA training manual states that every human has a breaking point? What's yours? I can guarantee that you would be begging to make any statement if just summoned to the police station and taken to the khanadari kamra!! Do you realize how much MQM activists and even suspected activists were tortured? Some could never recover from the torture that's how much! And there goes your confession! And there was only 1 way to stop the pain, to ‘confess’ what the LEA’s want them to confess.

Lol. By this brilliant logic then with 3000+ cases against him before the NRO there would be thousands motivated to shoot Altaf Hussain which is why he hides in London. By the way that article was about those who disappeared. I have this statistic. But there are constables as well. That operation was the best thing ever done in Karachi and violence dropped for a long period.



Talk about objectivity with a bigot.



Unless the MQM shoots me like they shot the Bihari Qaumi Movement president who caused grievous losses to you guys, I and many other true Karachites like Oscar and dozens of others here will stand against this terrorist party. You ignored every piece of evidence in that post. Clearly if Altaf will try to merge with India you will support him. This is how Bangladesh was formed.



Good way to deny uncomfortable realities... deflecting the blame on to X and Y, claiming yourself the victim oppressed by the others, self gratification that you did more... all covered in my report. Only a true hero of Pakistan can look within and identify his faults. Pakistan is for all of us and this land means more to me than anything else.

All MQM supporters have no doubts that there are many who would want to kill AH and that is why his supporters beg him not to return. You state that the operation was the best thing that happened to Karachi and I say that you would have sung a different tune had your family endured that period where the LEA & Military forces exercised shoot at sight powers. Where the kidnapped were returned on ransom and killed if ransom could not be secured by the LEA's. The 15k dead is no joke to any Urdu speaking and this is where I conclude that you are not a migrant

 

[haviZsultan]

Before I begin the post I would like to explicitly state that I am neither a member of APMSO/MQM neither am I an outright diehard fan/supporter. My defense of certain things pertaining to MQM is purely driven by a desire to show you all the other side of the picture. Only when you truly have both sides of the story, can you actually make up your mind....that is if you are not biased and brainwashed already.

Frankly this seems like a waste of time. Guys in federal agencies always have their noses in heavenly clouds while trying to walk in the world of men making every effort to storm on us little pathetic beings. They are arrogant, stubborn and hard-headed.

By the way there is a lot of sifarish that goes around. How did you end up there? You probably know some MQM people, did they pull strings?

I am an open critic of MQM, on issues that should be criticized and I support things that should be supported, much like I am with all other political parties and even the Military. Anyway, here we go:

Those who say they are critics of the MQM never seem to criticize a thing about them and are the most funny people, in fact happen to be their diehard supporters. Did you see the Ajmal Pahari video confession? I could post it... but when you ignored proper cases I provided then I believe there is no power that can make you look critically or objectively at this situation.

Your posts are full of personal attacks. It's most likely because you do not have proof of any wrong doing of MQM but have been brain washed with media propaganda.

Do note people will not take too kindly when their parents sacrifice to cross the border will be called a mistake, Pakistan's formation a mistake and Jinnah's ideology one as well. Don't say it in Karachi or you may not be able to bear the consequences.

2 things I would like to speak of here, first is that the Talibaan are freedom fighters who are fighting for their country and as instructed by their religion.

You have launched another bomb. Man what the hell are you doing in such an important position? This is why we are losing both on the ethnic front and on the religious front. Wolves dress up like sheep and join our agencies. This is a huge revelation. I don't think I can ever respect these so-called agencies. Didn't they know who they were hiring?

You know this talk has depressed me beyond everything.

If tomorrow, God forbid, Pakistan is attacked then all patriots will take up arms and will defend the country.....that would make us terrorists to the invaders, however we will be patriots to our country and countrymen.

And please do not confuse Talibaan with TTP terrorists.

We do not call those who call partition a blunder patriots. Sorry. And if we do take up arms to the invaders in this hypothetical situation we will never murder civilians... in your case inspired by MQM and Taliban you will be bombing every poor person you find in the name of your war for urdu speakers or jihad or whatever you call it.

I believe you have not received a marriage proposal from @Zarvan yet who will fall in love upon witnessing your posts. Look @Secur Zarvan has a twin brother here. 2 in 1 package of ethno-fascism and terrorist-sympathizer all in one which comes with unlimited warranty. You can confront him, smack him but nothing will come out of it in the end.

Secondly, it is quite frustrating for me when people give me police reports despite the fact that police is the most corrupt and politically driven force in the entire country. Today, no citizen trusts the police department; we all know how infected they are with corruption, political victimization, dacoity, street crimes, abuse of power etc. Actually, a person enters the police force only for the haraam ki kamai in it. How many honest police officers are there in the police force is anybody's guess! This is a force that will register an FIR against any xyz on any number of charges if some abc paid them (or forced them if in power)! I know this intimately because of what I do.

The corruption of the police not withstanding... this talk has worried me about the parhey likhey jahils working for our "federal government"...

By the way you are in a police office, most likely under them if you work for either the CID, Special Branch or Investigation branch. What are you complaining about. They are part of the police and work in conjunction with all other departments. I have no knowledge any other "federal agency" being there.

I have no answer to your continued abuse and personal attacks. As I said earlier, you cannot even imagine contesting my patriotism. And when I say that partition was a mistake, I stand by it as the statement has been proved through history. Only the biggest of idiots can still consider partition in that manner to be justified after half the country broke away from us. Partition should have been 1 piece Pakistan on this side and 1 piece India, unlike what happened where there existed 2 Pakistans on either side of India!!

It would be best for your own health that you do not bring this up if you do not wish me to lose my temper, there is no patriotism in someone suggesting Pakistan's existence is a mistake. If it was turkey you would be hanged. I explained that Urdu-speakers chauvinism was one of the reasons for the fall of Bangladesh. It was our family's lack of respect for other cultures that led to it. Even now we say Urdu should be promoted, never Pashto, Sindhi or any other language should be promoted. What about them-they are our cultures too, make Pakistan rich too.

When you had a part to play and could have stopped what happened in 71 then you have no right to open your mouth in this matter. You dare to blame our Pakistan's formation for your incompetence?

I have claimed that migrants sacrificed more than anyone who was already here and that many of those migrants actively participated in the freedom struggle. Those migrants left family, friends, culture, heritage, goods, land and belongings behind for Pakistan. And yes, they have more of a claim on Pakistan then those who got Pakistan sitting idle as the migrants earned freedom after struggle and sacrifice! Those who do not understand that are the real problem. But today, Pakistan belongs to everyone equally as it should be, and then be it even Urdu speaking migrants!

You are like a stuck clock its needles cursed to stay where they are in a cruel monotony. No force can come and move you from your original stand just as none can clean the grime, ***** and feculence that mires your mind like a mucky viscous pool. I explained to you this assessment is very wrong and is not something we should teach our kids but I believe your parents might have had links to terrorist groups either MQM, Taliban or perhaps even foreign intelligence due to which you have been taught this. Self-gratification or making claims that our ethnic group did more or sacrificed more than the others and others did nothing is the very beginning of the problem.

Even if true it should never be said. I gave you examples of personalities too. But there is nothing that can be done for you.

So you say.....but how do I confirm that unless you tell me who you are? Should I just believe every random tom, dick and harry who claim such things on the internet? For all I know you could be some Indian trying to stir up things. Tell me what you do and who you are so that I can confirm your claims.

There will be a gunman standing on my doorstep the moment I tell you who I am. Aren't you tired of torturing innocent people and bori band lashein?

An Indian would claim the partition was a mistake. A Pakistani would counter him and remind him that millions more of us would be dead if we were in one nation.Why is an MQM thug so interested in who I am? The only reason possibly could be that you are interested in murder of every other fellow who does not support the MQM.

I am not in the Government! There is a big difference in being in the Government and being an officer of the federal Government! Learn the difference before posting comments that are stupid otherwise.

You are in intelligence. So now chief? When is the next order coming from Altaf. What information do you pass off to him?

And for the last time, my love for my country cannot be paralleled! You and most other make statements, I actually do something to make a difference for my country. I will not repeat this again!

I am ex-lord of PNA. Strong support base. Right Wing Nationalist shifted to liberal nationalism. This statement is very similar to the abuse you inflicted on Chak Bamu-here u attack my loyalty to nation despite my strong statements in support of Pakistan, there you attacked a fellow Pakistanis background proving unfit for any role in a federal agency whatsoever.

I wonder why you guys think you have done more for the country than anyone else which is exactly what leads to idiots coming to power who believe they know everything. I don't boast about what I do and did.

On the one hand you state that I consider the migrants to be above others and then you post this, what am I to make of you except seriously consider whether you are insane!

It is better than being known as a traitor. You do not believe in Pakistan, you think the Taliban are good people. And we wonder how the country is being run. I don't understand when you do not admit anything can ever be wrong with MQM how you can deal with their criminals and murderers? You are to unobjective and primitive in thought. Too attached to a political party to be a good agent or cop.

Btw CID has rules since the rise in terrorism not to disclose identity. This sounds like wet farts to me.

Do you have any idea of the process we have to go through during recruitment? Only those who have 'sifarish' get in easily. Others, like me, have to succeed in multiple challenges to complete the recruitment process. But I do not think I am better then 'everyone' else. There may be others better than me.

I am supposed to believe you came there without sifarish? You don't believe in Pakistan, you support the taliban. Now I don't see any reason you should be in such a sensitive place if indeed you are not a liar with his pants on fire. What got you there?

I am not entitled any guards so I venture outside alone and without protection.

Better that way. You can shoot anyone you want, no questions asked and definitely no witnesses. Mission accomplished James bond style, or maybe Kalu style (lollywood political gangster movie) in your case.

I know there are no-go areas defined by all political parties; furthermore I know that there are now no-go areas defined by gali's and mohallas. Everybody has his/her own no-go area in Karachi today and it's pathetic and deplorable. If you lived in Karachi, you would have known that. Anyway, what have you done to fix that?

I LIVE IN KARACHI. I am here now. I am a journalist-currently sick. I have done all I could to fix every issue in Pakistan and that is why I challenge bigots like you. One thing I have done is build goodwill between the various groups instead of attacking every other ethnic group or demanding extra rights. Whatever is given to me I will accept in my nationalism. I do not err or cry, I hurt over how things turned out and my sacrifice may never be recognized but in Nationalism you ask nothing in return.

I spent a few years in Australia so I much be in cahoots with CIA, what logic!!

By the way Australia never bothered to check your background. Support for terrorism-both ethnic and religious including support for Taliban? While I was in Canada I wondered what these guys problem was with a bunch of secularist students for godsake. Why us Nationalists? It was because we were developing a political identity and that scared them out of their pants, made them piss right in those dirty pyjamas gifted by US of A.

If these countries spent half as much time dealing with people like you there wouldn't be a problem. But then I can see why Australia left you alone despite being a Taliban supporter. It hasn't got anything to do with them... as long as you guys go home and kill innocent Pakistanis in abundance-nothing to do with Australia, US or Canada. You can see the same with their foreign policy and how Allah Nazar is sitting outside as well at total ease. As long as the murderers attack Pakistanis everything is perfectly fine. No wonder a lot of people cheer when their soldiers die.

I even noticed one such guy. Was shocked. Never heard those useless canucks troubling him. Is the australian citizenship for quick escape in case the **** hits the fan for your political party?

Which 3000 deaths? MQM began fighting PPP militants and other political factions that were suppressing and killing urdu speaking migrants, all sides suffered losses but a de facto status was achieved in an undeclared ceasefire. The military then, afraid of the rise of MQM, began a military operation against MQM and actually gave strength to the 2 leaders who were expelled from MQM because of their militant ways in MQM-H. MQM-H already had the baddest of the bad and with support of the Army they started taking out MQM supporters/activists etc. MQM-H was also supported by other LEA's in these activities while the senior most leadership had "Wanted: Dead or Alive" on their heads and most had head money too! You need more than that?

Find a good, solid wall. Now paint all of it with rhino glue or construction adhesive glue. Stick your bum to this wall. Name the wall MQM. You will finally realize what your problem actually is. Even then you may not.

My job is not to defend those factions. All of them took part in killings. And don't blame the military for doing its job. We Karachites want the army to arrive and finish these MQM and other terrorists once and for all.

I think I have clarified my position above on all these things. About activities of LEA's and my personal role as an officer in the federal Government.

What is your role in providing guns to MQM?

AH was acquitted of all those allegations by none other the High Court of Sindh where the AG himself admitted that there were many ambiguities in the claims against AH! There were lies and propaganda and those usually are not followed by proof in third world countries like us where proof cannot be fabricated of such major accusations.

Only a fool can deny that NOT ONE of the 3576 criminal cases against Altaf Hussain and MQM are true. Not one? And you say you are impartial. It is a sad state of the Sindh police. Someone says hire this guy or the recruiter is as bigoted as you you will be hired immediately.

Furthermore, you may have gathered stories from different sources where as I am a part of a federal intelligence agency. I am most confident that I have access to things that you cannot dream of.

Now you are a part of a federal intelligence agency... this is a lot of fun. Which one? The office you told me about there is CID which is the only good one. It is actually under the Sindh police whichi itself is under the ministry of interior. Lol. You are criticizing the same police you work for later on?

You have said everything now why don't you tell us each and every thing? Sindh police comes under the ministry of interior but basically it is run almost completely by the Provincial and Local governments with influences from smaller political parties. IGP Sindh is Fayaz Ahmed Leghari who has relatives all over the Sindh government. A Leghari was also involved in ensuring the release of Zardari.

Also another thing. I am a journalist and that itself involves very heavy research so in other words am a researcher too. I have every statistic from every related department. You cannot beat me in a debate. Your job is to investigate if what you say is true. My job to find issues, write articles on them and work to solve them.

I was born in Karachi so I am a Sindhi. My parents were migrants.

Here you say this... then you say this:

Do you even know what a Governor can do in Pakistan? Governor is just a representative of the president for provinces; he holds no power unless Governor's rule is imposed. Chief Minister holds the real power in the province and that seat has never been occupied by any Urdu speaking!

Now you are a Sindhi-why is this affecting you? We were supposed to merge according to what Quaid E Azam actually said... so no issue if a Sindhi getting the role

I already gave you the population statistics. They make up more than 60%+ of the population of the province. Its very natural. Personally I believe, yeah no harm in having one Urdu-speaker but perhaps you don't know the chief minister is elected by the provincial assembly of Sindh which is dominated by PPP which your MQM is in an alliance with. If it was such an issue why didn't you quit? By the way Ishratul Ibad Khan is the longest serving governor in the history of Sindh. Average time for a governor is 1-2 years. Serving from 2002. Strange no?

I am seriously worried about your mentality. No wonder terrorists go free in this city. I thought usually an ethnic bigot was different from a religious one-you are a 2 in 1 package mistakenly imported from India. Why don't you shoot your parents who moved there. After all if partition was a mistake it was their mistake too. Why did they move? Being an MQM gun-slinger I believe this no major issue for you.

I say that the most capable person should get the position and not some illiterate who gets the job just because his ethnicity has more quota. Only then can our country truly progress, we cannot afford such compromises anymore and all Government departments are proof of what I say.

Lol. The qouta isn't implemented actually. You will notice this in the figures for people serving in Bangal government in 70's before it broke up. The population of Bengalis working for the federal government was lower than their real population percentage in the province.

Another thing is there is a 2% qouta for disabled people in government jobs. Lol. Try and find one person who meets the qouta. Who are you trying to fool, Chaundhry sahab of Australia? We know the rot. Chaudhry Aslam of anti-extremist cell of CID even hangs around with many girls and is drunk half the time. We know your life-style and how you look down on ordinary citizens.

Have you seen the police head office on I.I Chundrigar road? You can come visit me anytime (office hours) and witness whether I hold a position of importance or not. And I earned this job on merit.

Looks like you have made all plans to put me in jail and torture me. You don't need American imput for that... congratulations at least you make some decisions on your own MashaAllah being the Taliban/MQM supporter you are, Allah will surely reward you for your stupidity. Perhaps those that were involved the release of a number of TTP militants were from there too?

Stop sitting there with your legs on the table and ordering Sindhis and Pashtuns around. Personally I believe you are a wannabe CID guy.

Good job. Keep it up. But I wasn't counseling you to defend Bhutto, I was merely trying to put forth the advise so that you may understand how the fabric of this society changed with Bhutto's rule.

Bhutto's mistakes and stupid allegations left and right are not the topic of this debate. It is the comparison of terrorist Altaf with Quaid E Azam which would set any patriots hair on fire.

Fortunately, as I am a Government officer, I am aware that the quota applies to all positions alike so quota would have been applicable on Directors positions as well. You are either incompetent or just a liar.

Lol. Did your MQM boss tell you that? I checked. No qouta whatsoever has been applied for jobs in radio Pakistan. Stop posting rubbish. Please. You made me waste 45 minutes today. Also no Baloch at all for radio Pakistan. There is no qouta system for directors. They are brought forth on merit and capability alone.

I have a question, no ridicule, no mocking you despite being a terrorist. Lets suppose you aren't trying to copy Akshay Kumar and are indeed in a federal agency. You aren't disengaged from race so lets say there is an MQM terrorist who murders 10-20 people. He is arrested. Are you going to do your job without prejudice? You think Taliban are freedom fighters, are you going to arrest them or release them in dead of night just like in the reports I have been receiving? Serious question.

I wasn't technically defending his 'speech'. I just called a spade, a spade.

Is it the same thing if someone else (lets say me-hypothetically) says he is calling an idiot an idiot?

As I said there was also a case registered against AH for stealing a police constable’s cap!! If that is not height of ridiculous allegations, I don't know what is.

I have never come across such a ridiculous case. But your knowledge on the matter is amazing-being the MQM's mole in the federal agencies, probably in spare time siphoning off classified information off to India.

As for Ajmal Pahari's confession, did you know that confessions under duress are not applicable in any court of law? Do you know why that is? Did you know that CIA training manual states that every human has a breaking point? What's yours?

Exactly. In that video he looked like he was about to burst out crying like a child, he was wounded and tortured brutally. By the way my source says he has been freed. Did you play a hand in that?

I can guarantee that you would be begging to make any statement if just summoned to the police station and taken to the khanadari kamra!! Do you realize how much MQM activists and even suspected activists were tortured? Some could never recover from the torture that's how much! And there goes your confession! And there was only 1 way to stop the pain, to ‘confess’ what the LEA’s want them to confess.

Stop warning everyone and trying to scare them being in a federal agency and all. We all know that police uses torture as a means of extracting confessions and solving cases. Usually 90% are right, they have no other means-thats at least what the police officers told me though it doesn't make it right. Also you are first under the Sindh police which is itself under the Federal government.

All MQM supporters have no doubts that there are many who would want to kill AH and that is why his supporters beg him not to return. You state that the operation was the best thing that happened to Karachi and I say that you would have sung a different tune had your family endured that period where the LEA & Military forces exercised shoot at sight powers. Where the kidnapped were returned on ransom and killed if ransom could not be secured by the LEA's. The 15k dead is no joke to any Urdu speaking and this is where I conclude that you are not a migrant

The 15K murdered have a larger population of Sindhis than urdu-speakers...

The Pashtuns chauvinists say i am not Pashtun, you and your gangsters say I am not a Muhajir. Perhaps I am not, I am a Pakistani Nationalist. What the hell are you? Clear proof that there are douches in federal agencies.

 

[Dubious]

quaid e azam lived in britain for a long time, got educated, practiced there i guess, had british life style, he must have british citizen ship

Back then Pakistan was not an independent nation! EVERYONE in living in BRITISH colonies had similar rights! They could easily waltz in and out of Britain anytime they wanted! And since Britain at that time ACTUALLY governed INDIA AND PAKISTAN back then, obviously their passport would be British!

HOWEVER, now PAKISTAN is an independent country not under the British empire...FURTHERMORE, For a Pakistani passpot holder, to get BRITISH CITIZENSHIP, you have to APPLY FOR IT! you do not get it BY CHANCE! MOREOVER, you HAVE TO pledge allegence to the BRITISH CROWN AND QUEEN!

Frankly speaking ANYONE with DUAL nationality and assets overseas should not hold ANY office in Pakistan because these people SERIOUSLY benefit from the other nation and JUICE Pakistan!!

 

[haviZsultan]

Back then Pakistan was not an independent nation! EVERYONE in living in BRITISH colonies had similar rights! They could easily waltz in and out of Britain anytime they wanted! And since Britain at that time ACTUALLY governed INDIA AND PAKISTAN back then, obviously their passport would be British!

HOWEVER, now PAKISTAN is an independent country not under the British empire...FURTHERMORE, For a Pakistani passpot holder, to get BRITISH CITIZENSHIP, you have to APPLY FOR IT! you do not get it BY CHANCE! MOREOVER, you HAVE TO pledge allegence to the BRITISH CROWN AND QUEEN!

Frankly speaking ANYONE with DUAL nationality and assets overseas should not hold ANY office in Pakistan because these people SERIOUSLY benefit from the other nation and JUICE Pakistan!!

I agree. This is not such a major issue. Voting rights for overseas Pakistanis or dual citizenship holders is a far different thing from someone in office being a dual nationality holder. It is not a big issue. We nationalists have always claimed that no office-holder can and should have any foreign passport. If a person wishes to serve the country it is his duty to sacrifice that passport.

Also giving up the passport and its benefits is a statement of loyalty to Nation and people. It is a very important if token gesture that makes a simple statement that the country comes before personal interest or loyalty to another state.

My sister too wants me to get Canadian citizenship, probably filed my papers and got my signatures too on some excuse or another but my life is Pakistan. I am not in government but will still reject it. I was a leader of a Nationalist movement. If I surrender it does not give a good image to my followers or past followers as now I have lost all the power and influence I had.

A lot of my life I have basically lived like Canadians... in the old days I used to walk in the streets of Karachi, mohawk hair, chain hanging from neck and another one from a wallet at times with friends both male or female... people would be like what kind of character is this kid. This is a simple decision. Loyalty to Pakistan or loyalty to self. One of the best ways to determine if the person is the right one for the job.

Also I have to ask @Mav3rick didn't you say you had dual citizenship of Australia? By law it is not allowed to serve anywhere in the police or in any federal agency most particularly some agency that has to deal with sensitive intelligence matters concerning foreign (possibly) hostile nations for someone who has dual citizenship. I can confirm this tomorrow, maybe rules have changed or you work for a branch or cell that is different. Can you tell me your name and your officer in charge? You have made this fact known so you are probably part of "overt" operations teams rather than covert though through a contact I know CID bigwigs has told every employee on account of terrorism situation to hide his identity and not be too open about it. Those guys have no uniform either.

Maverick I believe you may be a liar and I suspect your intentions on this website. Even @darkinsky has honor. He refused to defend the partition speech despite all his major flaws. You are different. Are you an Indian national? Liars get caught eventually. Many people here have been caught with dual accounts trying to bash Pakistan or accentuate ethnic/religious conflict.

 

[Chak Bamu]

[...]Punjabis (who supported Punjabi) and so on.

Wrong sir. Very wrong. You have no idea. Punjabis literally gave up their language for Urdu. This is a well-known fact. Only someone who is totally ignorant of post-partition Punjabi ethos can say this. Most unfortunate.

LO WOH BHI KEHTAY HAIN BE-NANG-O-NAAAM HAI
YEH JANTA TO KABHI GHAR KO NAH LUTATA MAIN.

In your replies you assert that you do not know where you have insulted any ethnicity. I can tell you for sure that you have done it. Does not matter much in grand scheme of things. But it does hurt nonetheless.

 

[haviZsultan]

Wrong sir. Very wrong. You have no idea. Punjabis literally gave up their language for Urdu. This is a well-known fact. Only someone who is totally ignorant of post-partition Punjabi ethos can say this. Most unfortunate.

LO WOH BHI KEHTAY HAIN BE-NANG-O-NAAAM HAI
YEH JANTA TO KABHI GHAR KO NAH LUTATA MAIN.

In your replies you assert that you do not know where you have insulted any ethnicity. I can tell you for sure that you have done it. Does not matter much in grand scheme of things. But it does hurt nonetheless.

Do not worry Chak Bamu. I know MQM let you down but why we were expecting anything of them-just because they said they are a middle-class party? Well they acted like the most jahil persons you ever meet and it was right from the start not something that changed later on. Its a dead party. People in their area of influence are rising up against it. when the Bihari Qaumi Movement president was killed and the people found out it was by MQM they were swearing for Altaf's blood. Do note why he had to kill Bihari Quami Movement president. Because these people could basically annihilate the MQM completely by wooing its votebank and when Ajmal Pahari was given the order his masters acknowledged this. They were doing one of the things I told you about in my earlier post. Reasserting their original ethnic identity which was Bihari... not some fake "Mahajir" identity which means a pilgrim. He is really going mad. I suspect @Mav3rick is a party worker which is why he is asking for my personal information. According to their manifesto and brainwashing Altaf is taught to be a God, and there is a very famous nara for them which goes like "Jo Qaid ka ghaddar hai, woh maut ka haqdar hai"... and obviously Quaid here is not Quaid E Azam.I am a journalist, I have seen every report, pictures of dead bodies, everything.

There will be a day that a Punjabi will not even have to defend himself from such abuse. Other ethnic groups will rise up and defend him. Eventually he or anyone else won't even feel the need to defend the identity. We all have a role to play in this but these terrorists sitting in "federal agencies" if he speaks the truth are the primary cause of the divisions we see today. Furthermore he is also a Taliban supporter. Can you believe that, in a federal agency?

You have told me about your loyalty to Urdu... this article further corroborates how huge a sacrifice Punjabis have made for Pakistan and for Urdu. Giving up language is not easy and is actually something that shouldn't happen. We should make efforts to protect these languages but our family may never talk about these things.:

There has been a growing realisation in the recent times that language is a significant political tool which is used by dominant groups to take control of marginalised groups. At the same time, language is a useful tool to put up resistance against hegemony. That is why post-colonial literature and feminist movements give central importance to language as they believe that language is an important constituent of social reality that may play a crucial role in titling the scale of power. Language is also viewed as a strong identity marker, both at an individual and societal level.The Punjabi language has always been a victim of social, political and economic circumstances even before the partition of United India. In India, because of Mughal kings, whose mother tongue was Persian, Persian became the language of power and was used in courts. Urdu was very close to Persian in terms of vocabulary and structure and was mutually intelligible with Hindi. It also had an affinity with the Punjabi language at a semantic level. These multiple associations of Urdu made it popular in certain parts of India in general and in Muslim communities in particular.The British as a part of their policy got rid of Persian language in Sindh by replacing Persian with Sindhi but surprisingly, in Punjab, Persian was not replaced by Punjabi. Instead, it was Urdu that took the place of Persian. One reason that was given by the British was that Urdu was a refined form of Punjabi. It is a sad fact that Punjabi was never viewed by the British decision makers as an independent language; rather it was looked down upon as a dialect or patois with relatively lower social standard. Why was Punjabi viewed as a dialect and not as a language? Does Punjabi have no literature? On the contrary, Punjabi has a rich tradition of literature both in poetry and prose. But languages, in contemporary times, are not evaluated on their linguistic merits or demerits. Rather they are assessed primarily on social, political, and economic grounds. The attitude towards Punjabi was essentially based on social criteria.Another milestone in the history of the Punjabi language was the Pakistan movement where three languages Hindi, Urdu, and Punjabi were used as identity markers for the three major population groups of India, i.e. Hindus, Muslims, and Sikhs. In this simplistic divide of languages (which was largely political in nature), Punjabi was the biggest casualty. A large number of Muslims whose mother tongue was Punjabi deserted it on political grounds as Punjabi was viewed as the language of Sikhs.After independence in 1947, the question of national language was raised and Urdu, which was a minority language, was given the status of national language. The two overwhelmingly majority languages i.e., Bengali, and Punjabi were totally ignored. There was a powerful protest from Bengali people but there was no voice heard in favour of Punjabi by the Punjabi population. One important reason for this was that Punjab had a large share in the army and was close to power centres. Having a good share in army and bureaucracy, the Punjabi elite wanted to be a part of the mainstream powerful groups and in the process deserted their own language, Punjabi. It is surprising that Sindhi is taught in schools as a subject. Similarly Pashto is taught as a subject in some schools in KP. But Punjabi has never been a part of school education in Pakistan. Why is it so? Is there something inherently wrong with Punjabi? It’s the social attitude of people that have associated Punjabi with informal and insignificant linguistic functions in life. The language desertion phenomenon is so visible in Punjabi urban families where parents speak with their children in Urdu which is considered to be a prestigious language. Another weakening factor for Punjabi is its low pragmatic value in terms of getting jobs on market. This factor is strengthened as Punjabi does not get any support from educational institutions.It is feared that a large number of families from Punjab would lose Punjabi language in a couple of generations. There are a number of researches available about the significant role of mother tongue in early education. If we want to reclaim Punjabi language, the first step is to provide it educational backing by teaching Punjabi as a subject in schools in Punjab. Also, there is a need of official patronage at least at the provincial level for the promotion of language. It is important to note that the Constitution of Pakistan, Article 251, clearly states about the potential measures of teaching and promotion of a provincial language, “Without prejudice to the status of the national language, a provincial assembly may by law prescribe measures for the teaching, promotion and use of language in addition to the national language.” The Khyber Pakhtunkhwa assembly has passed a bill declaring five local languages as educational languages. This is a welcome initiative. Can Punjab Assembly pass some bill for the teaching and promotion of Punjabi in the province? The writer is Professor & Director of Centre for Humanities and Social Sciences at Lahore School of Economics and author of Rethinking Education in Pakistan. He may be contacted at shahidksiddiqui@yahoo.com

Chak Bamu, tension nahi lenay ka. These guys will die out soon and in their place will come a new breed of Nationalists. I will protect every one of my Sindhi, Baloch or Punjabi brothers. This is about my countries unity.