PN mini-submarine fleet

[Lefa]

Thank you for this assist!
These submarines were designed to carry E14 and E15 533 torpedoes, produced by Sintra Alcatel (now in DCNS).
To be noted, that this weapon its not dual purpose, the E version got anti ship capabilities, so for many years these plattforms were not ssk capable.
This could be due to two reasons (in my opinion): or PN focused on ship interdiction or they didnt had a dual purpose torpedo to fit in (likely the second).
Later, I think in 1995 these submarine recived an upgrade, and report says that the new weapons installed on board were AEG's SUT torpedo, this time a dual purpose weapon with both capabilities.

In 1995 you've lost (and brightly recovered) one of your three "x-craft" due to a chicken bone..

Any updated pictures?
If you want detailed infos, of cuorse the ones not classified, I'll be pleasured to answere.

 

[Arsalan]

What torpedos will be used and what are the ranges???
SLBM included??

these are not nuclear subs friend,,
no SLBM

 

[Arsalan]

The Naval Special Services Group (SSGN), numbering 1,000 marines, is responsible for conducting unconventional operations at sea and along the shoreline. Delivery or insertion of maritime special forces includes fixed- wing/helicopter low-level parachuting, light craft beaching and underwater conveyance, for which the navy operates at least three Cosmos Class MG110 miniature submarines (SSI) and some swimmer- delivery vehicles.

On the basis of design developed by PN Dockyard, this type of mini submarine has been constructed at PN Dockyard. These mini-submarines can be used for various purposes like attacking enemy units in harbour with Frogmen/Charriots, at sea with torpedoes, at shore installations by commandos etc. other uses include mine laying, defensive barrier in shallow waters, advance pickets duties, intelligence gathering etc.

Although the Italian Navy pioneered the use of human torpedoes (known today as swimmer delivery vehicles or SDVs), in today's Italian Navy there are no midgets. However Cosmos of Livorno has sold a number of midgets abroad. The SX 404 type sold to Pakistan in the early 1970s have been replaced by three [or possibly four] Italian-built SX-756-class midget submarines, delivered in 1988. These displace 40 tons and are capable of diving to a depth of 100m. They can carry six swimmers and two SDVs, as well as 2 tons of explosives.



Length overall 27.28 meters
Height overall 5.59"
Pressure Hull Diameter 2.30"
Pressure Hull Length 19.10"
Displacement 102 tons (surfaced),
110 tons (sub-merged)

Operation Depth In excess of 100 m
Test Depth In excess of 100 m
Max. speed (surfaced) 9 KTS (on diesel engine)
Max. speed (submerged) 6 KTS (on batteries)
Endurance Over 1000 NM on diesel engine, Over 40 NM on batteries
Complement 14 (6 operators + 8 commandos)
Armament Torpedo Firing Tubes, Mine Laying Hooks

 

[Arsalan]

Thank you for this assist!
These submarines were designed to carry E14 and E15 533 torpedoes, produced by Sintra Alcatel (now in DCNS).
To be noted, that this weapon its not dual purpose, the E version got anti ship capabilities, so for many years these plattforms were not ssk capable.
This could be due to two reasons (in my opinion): or PN focused on ship interdiction or they didnt had a dual purpose torpedo to fit in (likely the second).
Later, I think in 1995 these submarine recived an upgrade, and report says that the new weapons installed on board were AEG's SUT torpedo, this time a dual purpose weapon with both capabilities.

In 1995 you've lost (and brightly recovered) one of your three "x-craft" due to a chicken bone..

Any updated pictures?
If you want detailed infos, of cuorse the ones not classified, I'll be pleasured to answere.

i read in another forum that these were perhaps fitted with some sort of external torpedo tubes, not sure about it but will search for this upgrade and update it here in this thread.

 

[TOPGUN]

How many do we have in the fleet?

 

[Lefa]

i read in another forum that these were perhaps fitted with some sort of external torpedo tubes, not sure about it but will search for this upgrade and update it here in this thread.

Thats a factory option, indeed.
These submarines used to have (I'm talkin with past because Cos.Mo.S. (Costruzioni Motoscafi Sottomarini - Underwater Motorboard Construction) went in default in 2003 after some problems with export) several lodaout options, like external torpedo tubes (2), mine layng systems (up to 12 if I'm not wrong, I should check) or swimmer delivery vehicles (2).

About this point (torpedo capability) its not clear to me, if the original boats ('88) were already cabable to fire torpedos.
As I wrote before, on paper they were E14/E15 ready, but images doest not help with that.
For sure, the upgraded boat (the one refeared as MG-110) got two new tubes.
Due to this, I think that the original SX-756 delivered in the 80s were not torpedo capable, because on a midget of that size there is no space for four tubes...
I would like to know more about this midlife upgrade!

@TOPGUN:

They should be 3 (N°1 boat was the one of the accident), in the past you used to have a older model, much smaller (project SX-404B, SX-404 were the ones for Korea).

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

The Naval Special Services Group (SSGN), numbering 1,000 marines, is responsible for conducting unconventional operations at sea and along the shoreline. Delivery or insertion of maritime special forces includes fixed- wing/helicopter low-level parachuting, light craft beaching and underwater conveyance, for which the navy operates at least three Cosmos Class MG110 miniature submarines (SSI) and some swimmer- delivery vehicles.

On the basis of design developed by PN Dockyard, this type of mini submarine has been constructed at PN Dockyard. These mini-submarines can be used for various purposes like attacking enemy units in harbour with Frogmen/Charriots, at sea with torpedoes, at shore installations by commandos etc. other uses include mine laying, defensive barrier in shallow waters, advance pickets duties, intelligence gathering etc.

Although the Italian Navy pioneered the use of human torpedoes (known today as swimmer delivery vehicles or SDVs), in today's Italian Navy there are no midgets. However Cosmos of Livorno has sold a number of midgets abroad. The SX 404 type sold to Pakistan in the early 1970s have been replaced by three [or possibly four] Italian-built SX-756-class midget submarines, delivered in 1988. These displace 40 tons and are capable of diving to a depth of 100m. They can carry six swimmers and two SDVs, as well as 2 tons of explosives.



Length overall 27.28 meters
Height overall 5.59"
Pressure Hull Diameter 2.30"
Pressure Hull Length 19.10"
Displacement 102 tons (surfaced),
110 tons (sub-merged)

Operation Depth In excess of 100 m
Test Depth In excess of 100 m
Max. speed (surfaced) 9 KTS (on diesel engine)
Max. speed (submerged) 6 KTS (on batteries)
Endurance Over 1000 NM on diesel engine, Over 40 NM on batteries
Complement 14 (6 operators + 8 commandos)
Armament Torpedo Firing Tubes, Mine Laying Hooks

SSG(N) are commandoes and there number is above 3000 but real strenght is classified....Marines are naval infantry!They are under command of PMC.

Researchers are there to research abt stuff.

 

[Lefa]

I think arsalanaslam was in good faith, after all, it was a quote from globasecurity.org, not thesun.uk

Here we go with two juicy pictures, a launch in Karachi and a midget in navigation during a celebration (I forget which one):

Both boats are from the early design, built under cosmos licence and supervision in Karachi.

 

[Arsalan]

SSG(N) are commandoes and there number is above 3000 but real strenght is classified....Marines are naval infantry!They are under command of PMC.

Researchers are there to research abt stuff.

thanks for pointing but we all know that,
the article was not a reserach by any means, just posted from another forum, answering Lefa, just the basic info.

@ TOPGUN:
looking for the numbers in operation, (reported at some sources to be 3 licinesed built at karachi ship yard).

Regarding Upgrades
also they have undergone upgrades and no official statement is available regarding these.
i have talked to a source of mine and what little i have got from him, there appears no significant structural change so perhaps all the upgrades were regarding electronics or perhaps at most a better Sonar. according to him, the upgrades are most likely to be in communication and control pannel electronics. he is checking and all info that is not harmfull for national security will be updated soon.

thank you!
regards!

 

[TOPGUN]

thanks for pointing but we all know that,
the article was not a reserach by any means, just posted from another forum, answering Lefa, just the basic info.

@ TOPGUN:
looking for the numbers in operation, (reported at some sources to be 3 licinesed built at karachi ship yard).

Regarding Upgrades
also they have undergone upgrades and no official statement is available regarding these.
i have talked to a source of mine and what little i have got from him, there appears no significant structural change so perhaps all the upgrades were regarding electronics or perhaps at most a better Sonar. according to him, the upgrades are most likely to be in communication and control pannel electronics. he is checking and all info that is not harmfull for national security will be updated soon.

thank you!
regards!

Thx brother that's what i had thought as well just wanted to make sure cheers.

 

[Lefa]

Regarding Upgrades
also they have undergone upgrades and no official statement is available regarding these.
i have talked to a source of mine and what little i have got from him, there appears no significant structural change so perhaps all the upgrades were regarding electronics or perhaps at most a better Sonar. according to him, the upgrades are most likely to be in communication and control pannel electronics. he is checking and all info that is not harmfull for national security will be updated soon.

thank you!
regards!

Thank you so much, looking forward for this juicy informations, I cant wait!

Lets go deeper with pictures comparison.
In this pic we see N°3 boat (original SX-756 design), the same project as the N°2 boat that I've posted above.
As you can see, the upper part of the light hull its flat.

In this "recent" picture (post '95), we see an upgraded boat.
If you look at the upper part of the light hull we can see two main differnces: there are two bulges, one that cover almost the whole fore (from the sail to the end) and one smaller but higher in the final fore part.
These bulges are light superstructures needed to cover the new boat's components, respectively two torpedo tubes and a new sonar array.

Thats why I think that the original project was not capable to shoot torpedos, its not possible to fit four tubes in such submarine, also because in this project most of the fore part its occupied from the special forces exit trunk..

Lets go even deeper!

 

[Arsalan]

Thank you so much, looking forward for this juicy informations, I cant wait!

Lets go deeper with pictures comparison.
In this pic we see N°3 boat (original SX-756 design), the same project as the N°2 boat that I've posted above.
As you can see, the upper part of the light hull its flat.

In this "recent" picture (post '95), we see an upgraded boat.
If you look at the upper part of the light hull we can see two main differnces: there are two bulges, one that cover almost the whole fore (from the sail to the end) and one smaller but higher in the final fore part.
These bulges are light superstructures needed to cover the new boat's components, respectively two torpedo tubes and a new sonar array.

Thats why I think that the original project was not capable to shoot torpedos, its not possible to fit four tubes in such submarine, also because in this project most of the fore part its occupied from the special forces exit trunk..

Lets go even deeper!

HI,
sorry can you repost the pics, these are not visible.

and yes, yesterday i went to fortress.
unfortunately it was at night time and my mobile cam is not good enough toget clear pics at night time. i need to take out time this weekend.
there is another issue aswell, due to security concerns, it might be difficult to get pics, it is a military area! so if i stop posting after this sunday, do look out for me in some jail!!

 

[Last Hope]

these are not nuclear subs friend,,
no SLBM

Can we modify them?
Like we did modify helicopters sent from US (maybe Cobras) and they could fight at night.

Our great engineers could do that!

 

[Lefa]

HI,
sorry can you repost the pics, these are not visible.

and yes, yesterday i went to fortress.
unfortunately it was at night time and my mobile cam is not good enough toget clear pics at night time. i need to take out time this weekend.
there is another issue aswell, due to security concerns, it might be difficult to get pics, it is a military area! so if i stop posting after this sunday, do look out for me in some jail!!

Ups...my bad..
I'm pretty sure that your info about outer torpedo tubes its correct, maybe thats why I've read somewhere that since '95 the tubes are doubled (2 up on the pressure hull inside the light hull and 2 under and external the hull as shown in the red circles od this picture).

Thank you for your the Fortress raid.....but I wont see you in jail!
If you'll go again this week end, make some detailed pics!!

 

[Arsalan]

Ups...my bad..
I'm pretty sure that your info about outer torpedo tubes its correct, maybe thats why I've read somewhere that since '95 the tubes are doubled (2 up on the pressure hull inside the light hull and 2 under and external the hull as shown in the red circles od this picture).

Thank you for your the Fortress raid.....but I wont see you in jail!
If you'll go again this week end, make some detailed pics!!

yeap its fine now,
thanks for the pics and info regarding external tubes.

if i am here in Lahore this weekend i will be going to fortress!
will check if i can get some pics.

regards!