Pew Survey: Pakistanis Strongly Believe in Working Hard to Succeed

[jayron]

Even after these exaggerations, it's a long stretch to believe that a few privileged Indians in US are representative of India's population at large. If these exaggerations had any semblance of reality, then India wouldn't be among the poorest countries in the world...even poorer than sub-Saharan Africa.

The new multi-dimensional measure of poverty confirms that there is grinding poverty in resurgent India. It highlights the fact that just eight Indian states account for more poor people than the 26 poorest African countries combined, according to media reports. The Indian states, including Bihar, Chhattisgarh, Jharkhand, Madhya Pradesh , Orissa, Rajasthan, Uttar Pradesh, and West Bengal, have 421 million "poor" people, compared to 410 million poor in the poorest African countries.

Haq's Musings: New Index Finds Indians Poorer Than Africans and Pakistanis

why do you keep jumping from one subject to another? you wanted to show that Indians doing well in US is a lie. I disproved you. Now man up and answer on topic you started.

3million Indians in US is not a privileged few. we both live in US and my community is known for hard work and success while yours is still languishing.

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

I hear you.. But my question was that if Pakistan is so much better in these indicators, what are the indicators that lead to Pakistan moving to a low Human Development Index group last year.. Doe that mean that the socio-economic conditions in Pakistan are actually on a down ward trend?

he will never answer you directly , instead he will come up with some other crap data to dodge the question.

 

[RiazHaq]

Says you, india is hungrier, poorer, and what about the indian killing of dalit's etc.

They don't want to talk about Dalits because it's so shameful with India being the only country still practicing Apartheid.

Over 250 million people are victims of caste-based discrimination and segregation in India. They live miserable lives, shunned by much of society because of their ranks as untouchables or Dalits at the bottom of a rigid caste system in Hindu India. Dalits are discriminated against, denied access to land, forced to work in slave-like conditions, and routinely abused, even killed, at the hands of the police and of higher-caste groups that enjoy the state's protection, according to Human Rights Watch.

In support of its assertions of Dalit abuse in India, the Human Rights Watch has documented the following abuses:

* Over 100,000 cases of rape, murder, arson, and other atrocities against Dalits are reported in India each year. Given that Dalits are both reluctant and unable (for lack of police cooperation) to report crimes against themselves, the actual number of abuses is presumably much higher.

* India's own agencies have reported that these cases are typically related to attempts by Dalits to defy the social order, or demand minimum wages and their basic human rights. Many of the atrocities are committed by the police. Even perpetrators of large-scale massacres have escaped prosecution.

* An estimated forty million people in India, among them fifteen million children, are bonded laborers, working in slave-like conditions in order to pay off a debt. A majority of them are Dalits.

* According to government statistics, an estimated one million Dalits are manual scavengers who clear feces from public and private latrines and dispose of dead animals; unofficial estimates are much higher.

* The sexual slavery of Dalit girls and women continues to receive religious sanction. Under the devadasi system, thousands of Dalit girls in India's southern states are ceremoniously dedicated or married to a deity or to a temple. Once dedicated, they are unable to marry, forced to become prostitutes for upper-caste community members, and eventually auctioned into an urban brothel.

Haq's Musings: Dalit Victims of Apartheid in India

 

[INDIC]

This misrepresents the reality of total spending on education....the data you have is obviously deeply flawed...it claims 0.9% of GDP is the same as 0.58% of budget which makes absolutely no sense!

The not-for-profit private sector organizations, mostly NGOs, have stepped up to try to fill the gap. Last year, a Pakistani government commission on education found that public funding for education has been cut from 2.5% of GDP in 2007 to just 1.5% .

The number of private schools in Pakistan grew 10 fold from about 3000 in 1983 to over 30,000 in 2000. Primary school enrollment in 1983 has increased 937%, far greater than the 57% population increase in the last two decades.

Contrary to the incessant talk of doom and gloom, the fact is that the level of educational attainment has been rising in recent decades. In fact, Pakistan has been increasing enrollment of students in schools at a faster rate since 1990 than India, according to data compiled and reported by Harvard University researchers Robert Barro and Jhong-Wa Lee . In 1990, there were 66.2% of Pakistanis vs 51.6% of Indians in 15+ age group who had had no schooling. In 2000, there were 60.2% Pakistanis vs 43% Indians with no schooling. In 2010, Pakistan reduced it to 38% vs India's 32.7%.

Education and development efforts are beginning to bear fruit even in remote areas of Pakistan, including Federally Administered Tribal Areas. The Guardian newspaper recently reported that FATA's Bajaur agency alone has 616 school with over 60,000 boys and girls receiving take-home rations. Two new university campuses have been approved for FATA region and thousands of kilometers of new roads are being constructed. After a recent visit to FATA, Indian journalist Hindol Sengupta wrote in The Hindu newspaper that "even Bajaur has a higher road density than India"

Haq's Musings: Upwardly Mobile Pakistan on 66th Independence Day

Please watch this documentary. Its from Pakistan.

 

[RiazHaq]

Please watch this documentary. Its from Pakistan.

Read this. It's from your own academic and media:

Pakistan may soon join China in giving India serious competition in science. “Science is a lucrative profession in Pakistan. It has tripled the salaries of its scientists in the last few years.” says Prof C.N.R. Rao, Chairman of the Prime Minister’s Scientific Advisory Council.

In a presentation to the Prime Minister, Rao has asked for a separate salary mechanism for scientists. The present pay structure, he says, is such that “no young technical person worth his salt would want to work for the Government or public sector”.

He adds, “You needn’t give scientists private sector salaries, but you could make their lives better, by say, giving them a free house.”

Giving his own example, he says, “I have been getting a secretary’s salary for the last 35 years. But I have earned enough through various awards.

But I can raise a voice for those who aren’t getting their due.” Last year, Rao won the prestigious Dan David Award, from which he created a scholarship fund. So far, he has donated Rs 50 lakh for scholarship purposes.

The crisis gripping Indian science seems to be hydra-headed. “None of our institutes of higher learning are comparable with Harvard or Berkeley,” points out Rao. The IITs, he says, need to improve their performance: a faculty of 350 produces only about 50 PhD scholars a year. “That’s one PhD per 5-6 faculty members,” says the anguished Professor.

Rao fears that India’s contribution to world science would plummet to 1-1.5 per cent if we don’t act fast. At present, India’s contribution is less than three per cent. China’s is 12 per cent.

“We should not be at the bottom of the pile. When I started off in the field of scientific research at 17-and-a-half, I had thought that India would go on to become a top science country. But now, 55 years later, only a few individuals have made it to the top grade,” he laments.

Pak threat to Indian science - Hindustan Times

 

[INDIC]

Read this. It's from your own academic and media:

Pakistan may soon join China in giving India serious competition in science. “Science is a lucrative profession in Pakistan. It has tripled the salaries of its scientists in the last few years.” says Prof C.N.R. Rao, Chairman of the Prime Minister’s Scientific Advisory Council.

In a presentation to the Prime Minister, Rao has asked for a separate salary mechanism for scientists. The present pay structure, he says, is such that “no young technical person worth his salt would want to work for the Government or public sector”.

He adds, “You needn’t give scientists private sector salaries, but you could make their lives better, by say, giving them a free house.”

Giving his own example, he says, “I have been getting a secretary’s salary for the last 35 years. But I have earned enough through various awards.

But I can raise a voice for those who aren’t getting their due.” Last year, Rao won the prestigious Dan David Award, from which he created a scholarship fund. So far, he has donated Rs 50 lakh for scholarship purposes.

The crisis gripping Indian science seems to be hydra-headed. “None of our institutes of higher learning are comparable with Harvard or Berkeley,” points out Rao. The IITs, he says, need to improve their performance: a faculty of 350 produces only about 50 PhD scholars a year. “That’s one PhD per 5-6 faculty members,” says the anguished Professor.

Rao fears that India’s contribution to world science would plummet to 1-1.5 per cent if we don’t act fast. At present, India’s contribution is less than three per cent. China’s is 12 per cent.

“We should not be at the bottom of the pile. When I started off in the field of scientific research at 17-and-a-half, I had thought that India would go on to become a top science country. But now, 55 years later, only a few individuals have made it to the top grade,” he laments.

Pak threat to Indian science - Hindustan Times

Did you read the article properly. Its about increasing salary of scientists as par with private sector, not about Pakistan has started giving tough competition to India and left India far behind.

 

[INDIC]

Regardless of literacy rates, the fact remains that India has the world's largest population of illiterates.

India has the dubious distinction of being among the top ten on two very different lists: It ranks at the top of the nations of the world with its 270 million illiterate adults, the largest in the world, as detailed by a just released UNESCO report on education; India also shows up at number four in military spending in terms of purchasing power parity, behind United States, China and Russia.

Haq's Musings: India Tops in Illiteracy and Defense Spending

There are 900 million literates in India, second highest in the world.

 

[persistent]

Oh ! ya Any one can make guess by condition of pak , How hard they are working to beg "Fokat Money" from all over world.

 

[Vinod2070]

why do you keep jumping from one subject to another? you wanted to show that Indians doing well in US is a lie. I disproved you. Now man up and answer on topic you started.

3million Indians in US is not a privileged few. we both live in US and my community is known for hard work and success while yours is still languishing.

He is incapable of engaging in a serious debate.

Just pathetic and robot like copy paste job is all he is capable of.

Not surprising though.

I doubt critical thinking was an encouraged activity in the institute he passed out from, before he escaped his country.

Bobbing the head up and down while learning by rote was more like it.

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

Dear Riaz!

I asking for the third time maybe , what do you call a Pakistani Sr. Software Engineer / Developer / Programmer who earns less than Indian code coolie ?

 

[RiazHaq]

Did you read the article properly. Its about increasing salary of scientists as par with private sector, not about Pakistan has started giving tough competition to India and left India far behind.

Is that what "Pakistan may soon join China in giving India serious competition in science" mean to you? Think again!

There are 900 million literates in India, second highest in the world.

India leads the world in hunger, poverty, illiteracy, caste Apartheid, bonded labor, child marriages, honor killings, female fetus killings, and open defecation.

Haq's Musings: BRIC, Chindia and the Indian Miracle

 

[INDIC]

Is that what "Pakistan may soon join China in giving India serious competition in science" mean to you? Think again!

"may join" not joined yet. He was talking about unknown future and salary disparity in Public vs Private sector giving an example of salary hike in Pakistan.

India leads the world in hunger, poverty, illiteracy, caste Apartheid, bonded labor, child marriages, honor killings, female fetus killings, and open defecation.

Haq's Musings: BRIC, Chindia and the Indian Miracle

Even Pakistan has these problems. So, when your own brother sleeps hungry, you love to laugh at your neighbour sleeping hungry.

 

[my2cents]

There have been 3 instances in a software company that my friend owns in Bangalore, where a free lance programmer picked up programming work from the company and subcontracted it to another free lancer in Pakistan for half the rate.. Looks like cyber coolies of India are turning into entrepreneurs and creating work for wanna be cyber coolies of Pakistan

So our cyber coolie jobs are getting outsourced.

 

[RiazHaq]

Even Pakistan has these problems. So, when your own brother sleeps hungry, you love to laugh at your neighbour sleeping hungry.

Pakistan has problems but nothing like India's.

There are many many foreign independent visitors, even some Indians, who offer anecdotal evidence of life of ordinary Pakistanis being better than those of ordinary Indians.

For example, here's Wiliam Dalrymple in The Guardian article titled "The Poor Neighbor": "On the ground, of course, the reality is different and first-time visitors to Pakistan are almost always surprised by the country's visible prosperity. There is far less poverty on show in Pakistan than in India, fewer beggars, and much less desperation."

Another recent book "Pakistan-A Hard Country" by Anatol Lieven: "Pakistan lacks the huge concentrations of absolute poverty to be found in India's cities and countryside."

In a recent piece titled "Failed state? Try Pakistan's M2 motorway", Alistair Scrutton of Reuters summed it up as follows:

"It (M2 motorway) puts paid to what's on offer in Pakistan's traditional foe and emerging economic giant India, where village culture stubbornly refuses to cede to even the most modern motorways, making them battlegrounds of rickshaws, lorries and cows."

Indian Planning Commission member Syeda Hameed.

"India is worse than Bangladesh and Pakistan when it comes to nourishment and is showing little improvement in the area despite big money being spent on it".

Haq's Musings: Poll Finds Pakistanis Happier Than Neighbors

So our cyber coolie job is get outsourced.

Indian coolies dominate the cyber coolie space but they certainly don't have a monopoly on it.

 

[Vinod2070]

"may join" not joined yet. He was talking about unknown future and salary disparity in Public vs Private sector giving an example of salary hike in Pakistan.

That is what I meant when I said "at best primary grade data interpretation skills".

He thinks cherry picking some random anecdotal quotes substitute for the hard reality that his country is lags behind on every meaningful social indicator.

And getting behind with every passing day. So much so, they are not even an issue in Pakistan, it is the increasing radicalization that is the only real issue.

Even Pakistan has these problems. So, when your own brother sleeps hungry, you love to laugh at your neighbour sleeping hungry.

Easier to do than actually doing something about his own countrymen by returning to his own country.