PDF Quality: We need to talk about this, fellow Pakistanis

[Xestan]

Not even the state though, there are just plain idiots on the forums now, who literally don't know what their talking about, outright lie, and pass their opinions off as facts.

It's why I barely log in anymore, because I can't stand the anti-intellectual lunacy that I end up reading.

If people remember, a lot of us TTs used to try and stir the narrative back to the topics, and at least get a fact based discussion going, but the amount of intellectual dishonesty has grown so much, most of us have pretty much given up on trying to moderate, without getting the actual mods involved (which always leads to either warnings or bans).

A guy said Maleeha Lodhi 'was in bed with the enemies of Pakistan' as the reason of her dismissal. I found it to be extremely disrespectful for a woman and a former ambassador. I simply asked him for any evidence to support his claim.

Guess what? That idiot countered it by asking me for evidence to reject his claim. Like, wtf!

It went on for a couple of posts while I was trying to understand the epic reasoning he had just given to his claim. I just wanted to shoot myself in the head for that. Reported his posts a couple of times; no action.

 

[PakistaniJunior]

A guy said Maleeha Lodhi 'was in bed with the enemies of Pakistan' as the reason of her dismissal. I found it to be extremely disrespectful for a woman and a former ambassador. I simply asked him for any evidence to support his claim.

Guess what? That idiot countered it by asking me for evidence to reject his claim. Like, wtf!

It went on for a couple of posts while I was trying to understand the epic reasoning he had just given to his claim. I just wanted to shoot myself in the head for that. Reported his posts a couple of times; no action.

That is exactly the behavior im referring to. These pakistanis love to compare how better they are than the Indian defence forums yet they do everything to defile the quality of this forum.

@Arsalan @Dubious @waz @Zaki @WAJsal @The Eagle @Jango @Horus @Irfan Baloch @Major Sam @WebMaster

Im tagging the mods available on the mod section of member's list. Hopefully you'll see this. This isn't something that should be ignored because Only swift Mod action is able to fix this.

 

[That Guy]

A guy said Maleeha Lodhi 'was in bed with the enemies of Pakistan' as the reason of her dismissal. I found it to be extremely disrespectful for a woman and a former ambassador. I simply asked him for any evidence to support his claim.

Guess what? That idiot countered it by asking me for evidence to reject his claim. Like, wtf!

It went on for a couple of posts while I was trying to understand the epic reasoning he had just given to his claim. I just wanted to shoot myself in the head for that. Reported his posts a couple of times; no action.

For people like that, I use their logic right back at them. I accuse them of something, and ask them to prove otherwise, or they are guilty. Essentially, letting them play themselves.

Very quickly, they tend to resort of screeching, until they realize their own stupidity, and either acknowledge it, or just stop replying.

 

[El Sidd]

I don't care much about people's political opinions. I don't mind reading about them. The only thing i'm against is having to see constant badmouthing, personal attacks and crude comments passed on almost every thread i read now, rather than a proper discussion.

I think the fish always rots from the top

 

[Dalit]

You're one of many members who have come out to show their concern over the quality of content been posted on PDF since last couple of years. In over a decade of my stay here, I have never seen the trolling, bad mouthing that has just recently started. PDF is more and more becoming a mouthpiece of the State, when in reality, it was supposed to be the place for discourse.

Difference of opinion is attacked here now. More and more members are branded 'traitors' for holding different political views.

Your beef is with Imran Khan and PTI. Your posts on this forum clearly reflect this. You are clearly a person who has a political bias.

You call out people who don't hold your views, but have no issues with imposing your own views.

Where on PDF have mods not intervened when members on both sides got banned for cussing and hurling abuse? You are being disingenuous. What you are essentially pleading for is impossible to provide at PDF.

The mods are doing a good job generally speaking.

Good morning to everyone on this forum.

I am a poster that mostly likes to stalk threads and as you can see from my profile , i've been here for a very long time. Throughout my time of stalking PDF, i've noticed a gradual but steep fall in the quality of this forum. I regret to say that it's been hijacked with people that don't know the etiquettes of posting.

Some posts made by fellow Pakistanis , that are embedded with Racial-shaming and suggestive posts are a embarrassment to read. They are very distasteful and made with poor intentions to just score some rookie points and low blows. I am someone that loves to read about politics and such-related topics and i usually expect fruitful and respectful discussion to follow. However reading such responses makes one feel exasperated. How do you expect anyone to take your narrative seriously if you post it in such a immature manner? I'm sure this is why majority of the well esteemed and level-headed individuals have left PDF or rarely come on here anymore. The new posters should be given a list of rules on how they should operate on the forum. if not, they should get reported and banned.

This is a International-Pakistani forum, and so by extension, this forum represents us Pakistanis too. There isn't much awareness of us in the outside world. Therefore , people that come here to learn about us, and for them to understand our concerns and problems, these rampant bad threads leaves a lasting bad impression of us. If i was a newcomer here, and the first thing i saw was a sensationalist headline that is filled with self-satisfactory delusions, i'd immediately leave without a second thought.

I request to the majority of Pakistanis that post here, please put on a more sophisticated and serious attitude. Do not fall in slurs and swears easily. Have patience despite your overwhelming hatred for the things you dislike. If you don't like something? report it and be done with it. Don't fall to new lows as the one that's enraging you.This is a defense forum, not a forum where you discuss openly about "women" and pass inappropriate messages around. Do it in the "members club" section, but refrain from doing so on other areas of the forum that require a more serious approach. Do not call others ugly, do not instigate disgusting comments nor resort to personal attacks on the other person. Show them you're better than that.

I also dislike rampant rape-related threads on the forum. I'm not saying that people shouldn't post this for raising awareness. But please make a single thread titled as such, and all those cases should be reported there.

What PDF was in the past, the current state is a mere shell of that.
Those that do decide to post their say here, kindly do it with well thought , and without trolling.

Regards

You have to remember that the world has changed, keeps changing and will continue to change. PDF is affected by these changes.

The topics that are discussed on this forum are related to international events taking place all around the world. Most of what is happening today in the world is not fun. The world is indeed at times a very disgusting and a not so happy place. PDF is by no means the only forum where such heated discussions take place. The internet is filled with far worse atrocious garbage I can assure you.

I hate to bring it to you, topics that are related to these events are bound to unleash nasty discussions which is going affect the mood and at times decorum of PDF. These are nasty topics which lead to heated exchanges. The mods are doing their utmost best to keep up with moderating discussions as far as I can judge. Also remember that mods don't get a fee to perform their duties. This is all based on goodwill and patriotism. We need to appreciate that.

Indian rape related threads are mostly a tit for tat. Although you cannot deny that India has a serious problem when it comes to rape crimes. The high profile rape cases in the past few years reflect this very clearly. We should be allowed to have a genuine debate without insulting anyone.

As for political topics, those are indeed the most explosive. Let's not pretend that politics is fun. Whatever is happening in the political scene wordwide is divisive, racist and plain ugly. People are bound to have biases and certain affiliations. The Americans even have a definition i.e. political correctness. Yes, people are short-tempered and nasty. Unfortunately this is the day and age we live in now. This is not an exception atPDF.s

I agree that mods should tackle racism, insults, discrimination, ethnic division etc. Although this is already happening as soon as members hit the report button. You should also try to use this button. It really helps.

Apart from that there is also a natural evolution where old members leave and new ones take their place. PDF doesn't belong to one group of mods or members.

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

I think that due to some Indian trolls who constantly abuse Pakistanis, Pakistan, or our sacred symbols like founder, faith, heroes, etc. That Pakistani members have become more fierce against Indians in response. Patience has worn thin when these Indian trolls keep ruining the forum.

Mods have stepped up after Feb, but more toughness is needed. I try to report Indian trolls when I can.

Other than that, some Patwaris constantly abuse Imran Khan. It gets old very fast. Ofcourse, this makes most members who are pro-PTI ready to attack any such posts.

Lastly, some members play sectarian wars by taking Iranian or Arab sides in debates. Alot of animosity between Pakistanis is because of this.

 

[Xestan]

Your beef is with Imran Khan and PTI. Your posts on this forum clearly reflect this. You are clearly a person who has a political bias.

You call out people who don't hold your views, but have no issues with imposing your own views.

Where on PDF have mods not intervened when members on both sides got banned for cussing and hurling abuse? You are being disingenuous. What you are essentially pleading for is impossible to provide at PDF.

The mods are doing a good job generally speaking.

It's like you're obsessed with people not liking Imran Khan.

I voted for Imran Khan twice, last time in 2018, even though I was still critical of how things were going at that moment. I have travelled hundreds of miles on the polling day to vote for this guy, I deserve the right to criticise my government when it's in the wrong. That's what democracy is, that's what I believe in. But these things would be alien to you since to you, boot is always right. Carry on!

 

[Dalit]

It's like you're obsessed with people not liking Imran Khan.

I voted for Imran Khan twice, last time in 2018, even though I was still critical of how things were going at that moment. I have travelled hundreds of miles on the polling day to vote for this guy, I deserve the right to criticise my government when it's in the wrong. That's what democracy is, that's what I believe in. But these things would be alien to you since to you, boot is always right. Carry on!

Feel free to criticise the government, but you clearly have a political bias. It is very easy to notice. LOL I don't like or dislike you on the basis of being pro Imran Khan. I do however observe and you can be rest assured that most members on this forum understand that you are politically biased. That is also perfectly fine, but don't come here to lecture how things ought to run on PDF.

 

[PakistaniJunior]

Your beef is with Imran Khan and PTI. Your posts on this forum clearly reflect this. You are clearly a person who has a political bias.

You call out people who don't hold your views, but have no issues with imposing your own views.

Where on PDF have mods not intervened when members on both sides got banned for cussing and hurling abuse? You are being disingenuous. What you are essentially pleading for is impossible to provide at PDF.

The mods are doing a good job generally speaking.



You have to remember that the world has changed, keeps changing and will continue to change. PDF is affected by these changes.

The topics that are discussed on this forum are related to international events taking place all around the world. Most of what is happening today in the world is not fun. The world is indeed at times a very disgusting and a not so happy place. PDF is by no means the only forum where such heated discussions take place. The internet is filled with far worse atrocious garbage I can assure you.

I hate to bring it to you, topics that are related to these events are bound to unleash nasty discussions which is going affect the mood and at times decorum of PDF. These are nasty topics which lead to heated exchanges. The mods are doing their utmost best to keep up with moderating discussions as far as I can judge. Also remember that mods don't get a fee to perform their duties. This is all based on goodwill and patriotism. We need to appreciate that.

Indian rape related threads are mostly a tit for tat. Although you cannot deny that India has a serious problem when it comes to rape crimes. The high profile rape cases in the past few years reflect this very clearly. We should be allowed to have a genuine debate without insulting anyone.

As for political topics, those are indeed the most explosive. Let's not pretend that politics is fun. Whatever is happening in the political scene wordwide is divisive, racist and plain ugly. People are bound to have biases and certain affiliations. The Americans even have a definition i.e. political correctness. Yes, people are short-tempered and nasty. Unfortunately this is the day and age we live in now. This is not an exception atPDF.s

I agree that mods should tackle racism, insults, discrimination, ethnic division etc. Although this is already happening as soon as members hit the report button. You should also try to use this button. It really helps.

Apart from that there is also a natural evolution where old members leave and new ones take their place. PDF doesn't belong to one group of mods or members.

I was always well aware of the fact politics are never fun, no matter what generation or decade. However you're missing the point here. Politics continuously change, does that justify people-bashing and degrading slurs i see here? or the arrogance and ignorance?

I agree that horrendous Indian rape cases should be posted to raise awareness, but when i see multiple threads every few days, then we have a problem. It's a very serious issue, no doubt about that. But seriously, seeing multiple threads regarding indian rape on a defence site?

 

[jaibi]

Venting makes it worse. Resolution makes it easy, from a psychological pov.

Given the events of the past year between our two nations, it's not surprising that the anger has to come out somewhere.

If it's just venting, it can be healthier than supressing it albeit it has a negative effect on post quality, but within limits it's not a bad thing in of itself.

It's those members who take it immaturely and post simply for point scoring that bring the average post quality down.

Revising rules to specifically address this new trend that's crept up into this forum. It's disgusting to use a victim's pain in order to propel one's agendas. I pity the women in the lives of members who do this.

I was always well aware of the fact politics are never fun, no matter what generation or decade. However you're missing the point here. Politics continuosly change, does that justify people-bashing and degrading slurs i see here? or the arrogance and ignorance?

I agree that horrendous Indian rape cases should be posted to raise awareness, but when i see multiple threads every few days, then we have a problem. It's a very serious issue, no doubt about that. But seriously, seeing multiple threads regarding indian rape on a defence site?

Every member should have a say. I heard you when you accused me of biases. Where were your notions of such humility then? Attack his ideas, if you disagree. This is just you virtue signalling. I agree with a lot of things he's written too. I don't care of his politics in this regard as the thread isn't about it.

Feel free to criticise the government, but you clearly have a political bias. It is very easy to notice. LOL I don't like or dislike you on the basis of being pro Imran Khan. I do however observe and you can be rest assured that most members on this forum understand that you are politically biased. That is also perfectly fine, but don't come here to lecture how things ought to run on PDF.

 

[Village life]

yes you are right what I have been seeing here since last two years or so are threads like , today Imran khan wore brown shoes, Imran Khan inaugurated citizen portal, imran said U turn is great quality, Imran said bozdar is wasim Akram aka charsi, Imran said he will sell Ns, s Buffalos, Imran said he will convert pm house in University, imran said he saw hoors, Imran said la ilaha ilAllah we will fight for Kashmir at UN, ,so low quality of PDF, why do we all taking Ik damn seriously,

 

[jaibi]

Such appeal to authority is, in my view, the root of our political stunting. If you're a supporter, you've to be 100% on board. The party doesn't matter. I'm not referring to the gentleman you're replying to but overall. Just my view.

It's like you're obsessed with people not liking Imran Khan.

I voted for Imran Khan twice, last time in 2018, even though I was still critical of how things were going at that moment. I have travelled hundreds of miles on the polling day to vote for this guy, I deserve the right to criticise my government when it's in the wrong. That's what democracy is, that's what I believe in. But these things would be alien to you since to you, boot is always right. Carry on!

 

[Valar.]

Many people only come to pdf just to kill time, myself included.

Most of the times guys like us give short comments based on general attitude of the day.

Management don't like us? They can always permanently ban us.

 

[jaibi]

Fire with fire is no good. I have seen the stats of the site. Pakistani members are just as abusive as Indian members who wish to just abuse each other. I don't know what it entails and, frankly, I don't see what gives you people the right to do this to each other either. If you're so convinced of the moral high ground you are supposed to have occupied why do you drag yourself so low. I've never experienced trolling here because my words reflect me, theirs reflect theirs. If someone slings mud then the first thing to get dirty are their hands.

I think that due to some Indian trolls who constantly abuse Pakistanis, Pakistan, or our sacred symbols like founder, faith, heroes, etc. That Pakistani members have become more fierce against Indians in response. Patience has worn thin when these Indian trolls keep ruining the forum.

Mods have stepped up after Feb, but more toughness is needed. I try to report Indian trolls when I can.

Other than that, some Patwaris constantly abuse Imran Khan. It gets old very fast. Ofcourse, this makes most members who are pro-PTI ready to attack any such posts.

Lastly, some members play sectarian wars by taking Iranian or Arab sides in debates. Alot of animosity between Pakistanis is because of this.

Why would your killing time be a problem for someone else? Not accusing you of anything but just asking.

Many people only come to pdf just to kill time, myself included.

Most of the times guys like us give short comments based on general attitude of the day.

Management don't like us? They can always permanently ban us.

Sharing official news is obviously going to happen but look around there's plenty of criticism happening too. These are your biases, can you please back it up? If you guys cannot control yourselves and mods have to intervene is it our fault?

You're one of many members who have come out to show their concern over the quality of content been posted on PDF since last couple of years. In over a decade of my stay here, I have never seen the trolling, bad mouthing that has just recently started. PDF is more and more becoming a mouthpiece of the State, when in reality, it was supposed to be the place for discourse.

Difference of opinion is attacked here now. More and more members are branded 'traitors' for holding different political views.

 

[B.K.N]

Why would your killing time be a problem for someone else? Not accusing you

If someone doesn't like his posts then he can ignore him. Ignore option is not without reason.