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Partition of Afghanistan

Instead of acknowldging POWER OF RESILENCE of Afghanistani people, instead of accepting ISAF's bankruptcy of ideas, morals and ethics, instead of abstaining from splitting the innocent blood of Afghans and NATO soldiers, these morons are trying to give thier incompetence a new dimension.

Down with BlackWill and his BRAIN(DEAD) WAVES :tdown:

Really?..perhaps the Taliban should have thought of that before they harbored criminals who brought down the twin towers.
I have lots of sympathy for Iraqi's as it was a misguided war to go in there but Afghanistan is a necessary war.

The war will end when "Emir" Mullah Omer and his esteemed buddy and guest Bin Laden are hanging from the end of a rope.
 
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Really?..perhaps the Taliban should have thought of that before they harbored criminals who brought down the twin towers.
I have lots of sympathy for Iraqi's as it was a misguided war to go in there but Afghanistan is a necessary war.

The war will end when "Emir" Mullah Omer and his esteemed buddy and guest Bin Laden are hanging from the end of a rope.

Do not look good from a SUPER POWER(As arrogant as ever) guy, lament the wishful-fate of Omar and Bin Laden!

With 1500 thousand troops, entire NATO AT YOUR DISPOSAL, all technology under your belt, nine years of full reign and control of terror in Afghanistan AND against SOME CAVE-MEN, you still get an alibi to S H I T out! :chilli:

Inocent blood would never go in vain!
 
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Do not look good from a SUPER POWER(As arrogant as ever) guy, lament the wishful-fate of Omar and Bin Laden!

With 1500 thousand troops, entire NATO AT YOUR DISPOSAL, all technology under your belt, nine years of full reign and control of terror in Afghanistan AND against SOME CAVE-MEN, you still get an alibi to S H I T out! :chilli:

Inocent blood would never go in vain!

Yes.. Innocent blood of the people who died in the WTC will not go in vain.

And no government in the world will ever again willingly harbor terrorists who may attack the US thinking that there will not be any consequences.
 
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Pakistan has shown opposition to the idea of division of Afghanistan but if ever there was a question of division of Pakistan, afghans ( along with india an even iran ) would all be the biggest supporters of this idea

You can read the commets of citizesn of all three places on other forums and see the bile and venom they spit against Pakistan.

The ultra nationalist afghan pashtoons are the worst enemies of Pakistan , they dont consider Pakistan to be a brotherly/friendly country they have always worked against our interests.

And speaking of Iran , they are happily in bed with india againt Pakistan but still , it beats me though , we in Pakistan some how support them , same goes for afghanistan.

I suggest we seriously look into the idea of dividing afghanistan
 
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Paksarzameen


You are exactly right, but Pakistan has her own reasons for this support and in my opinion, they are sound reasons - irrespective of the facts created by assertion, that are US friends engage in, namely that Pashtun are not a majority, they are the majority among all other groups - and from a Pakistani perspective, the fact that there are more pashtun in Pakistan than in Afghanistan means that there is pressure on Pakistani policy to recognize this - Some Afghan Pashtun, most from a marxist outlook, do not as yet understand that Pakistan, given it's multi-ethnic population, does not want to absorb the Pashtun population of Afghanistan, in fact they are nothng but trouble - but then again, there is the question of the Pakistani pashtun who think that Pakistan must look out for this group.

So Pakistan is the last country to want ot see a partition in Afghanistan - if you thought Wazisistan is bad, if this Afghanistan is partitioned along ethnic lines, the problem represented by Waziristan will oincrease ten fold.
 
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well to whom Afghanistan rightfully belongs?
An approximate distribution of ethnic groups based on the CIA World Factbook[1] is as following:

42% Pashtun
27% Tajik
9% Hazara
9% Uzbek
4% Aimak
3% Turkmen
2% Baloch
4% Other

Yep, its the Pushtoons. So its effectively invading sovergien land of Pushtoon, maining it and dividing it to conquer. Then installing minorities in power. Another Israel in the making perhaps?? The Tajiks have Tajikistan, Uzbecks to Uzbeckistan, Turkemen to Turkamanistan, Baloch to Baluchistan so where is the land for Pukhtoon??


Pakistan on otherhand hosts the largest Pukhtoon population outside Afghanistan and is right in its course of supporting the people who rightfully belong to the land of Afghanistan.
 
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well to whom Afghanistan rightfully belongs?


Yep, its the Pushtoons. So its effectively invading sovergien land of Pushtoon, maining it and dividing it to conquer. Then installing minorities in power. Another Israel in the making perhaps??

Yet again another pathetic post regarding Afghanistan from you. Afghanistan belongs to all citizens of Afghanistan no matter which ethnicity they belong to. How do you feel if I say Pakistan belongs to the Panjabis only and Pakistan's name should be Panjabistan? You should try to know about the history of Afghanistan, its people, ethnics, each ethnic group's role in the course of history of afghanistan etc, if you dont want to learn then please stop talking non sense.
 
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Pakistan has shown opposition to the idea of division of Afghanistan but if ever there was a question of division of Pakistan, afghans ( along with india an even iran ) would all be the biggest supporters of this idea

You can read the commets of citizesn of all three places on other forums and see the bile and venom they spit against Pakistan.

The ultra nationalist afghan pashtoons are the worst enemies of Pakistan , they dont consider Pakistan to be a brotherly/friendly country they have always worked against our interests.

And speaking of Iran , they are happily in bed with india againt Pakistan but still , it beats me though , we in Pakistan some how support them , same goes for afghanistan.

I suggest we seriously look into the idea of dividing afghanistan



Afghans have to take responsibility to their own actions. They blame everything on Pakistan,Iran or The Saudi/Arabs. I don't think i've ever seen people as pathetic and ungrateful as Afghans.
 
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well to whom Afghanistan rightfully belongs?


Yep, its the Pushtoons. So its effectively invading sovergien land of Pushtoon, maining it and dividing it to conquer. Then installing minorities in power. Another Israel in the making perhaps?? The Tajiks have Tajikistan, Uzbecks to Uzbeckistan, Turkemen to Turkamanistan, Baloch to Baluchistan so where is the land for Pukhtoon??


Pakistan on otherhand hosts the largest Pukhtoon population outside Afghanistan and is right in its course of supporting the people who rightfully belong to the land of Afghanistan.

to the Admins/Mods: Please take action and remove this irresponsible post.
 
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well to whom Afghanistan rightfully belongs?


Yep, its the Pushtoons. So its effectively invading sovergien land of Pushtoon, maining it and dividing it to conquer. Then installing minorities in power. Another Israel in the making perhaps?? The Tajiks have Tajikistan, Uzbecks to Uzbeckistan, Turkemen to Turkamanistan, Baloch to Baluchistan so where is the land for Pukhtoon??


Pakistan on otherhand hosts the largest Pukhtoon population outside Afghanistan and is right in its course of supporting the people who rightfully belong to the land of Afghanistan.

To the bolded part: Can you prove any of those rubbish? otherwise shut the **** up. Tajiks are one of the oldest inhabitants of Afghanistan, they were dominant force during the good past of history of Afghanistan-perhaps you have forgotten Mahmoud Ghaznavi, if you fail to know this, then please try to read a bit of history of AFghanistan. Since you guys(pakistanis) have population of Pashtoons in your land, it doesnt mean you analyze everything on that perspective in a wrong manner, try to ethnicize the issue of afghanistan? go and do it, it will affect you as well.
 
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Afghans have to take responsibility to their own actions. They blame everything on Pakistan,Iran or The Saudi/Arabs. I don't think i've ever seen people as pathetic and ungrateful as Afghans.

I quite agree with you that we should stop blaming everything on the others and take some of the responsibility ourselves. But interfere in internal issue of AFghanistan especially the super powers plus the neighbors notably pakistan have left afghanistan in a postion of cant do anything.
 
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well to whom Afghanistan rightfully belongs?


Yep, its the Pushtoons. So its effectively invading sovergien land of Pushtoon, maining it and dividing it to conquer. Then installing minorities in power. Another Israel in the making perhaps?? The Tajiks have Tajikistan, Uzbecks to Uzbeckistan, Turkemen to Turkamanistan, Baloch to Baluchistan so where is the land for Pukhtoon??


Pakistan on otherhand hosts the largest Pukhtoon population outside Afghanistan and is right in its course of supporting the people who rightfully belong to the land of Afghanistan.

Are you Pashtun or Punjabi?
 
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I quite agree with you that we should stop blaming everything on the others and take some of the responsibility ourselves. But interfere in internal issue of AFghanistan especially the super powers plus the neighbors notably pakistan have left afghanistan in a postion of cant do anything.

Yes,i agree with you. Our Government must stop support for the Neo-Nazi Taliban/Pashtuns. Because this is the most shameful for Punjabis.
 
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Yes,i agree with you. Our Government must stop support for the Neo-Nazi Taliban/Pashtuns. Because this is the most shameful for Punjabis.

brother, pakistan can only have a sustainable and good relationship with AFghanistan if they try to establish relationship with afghanistna as a country not just one ethnicity. Ironically the same ethnicity that pakistan is surpporting, is one of the biggest enemy of pakistan and wishes the disintegration of pakistan.
 
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Partition of Afghanistan should be unacceptable and all regional powers will oppose it. It will server none of their interests. A strong neutral Afghanistan is the only way forward no matter how hard it may seem. Here is a good article on this viewpoint.

The Hindu : Opinion / Lead : Afghan problem: for a regional approach
Ambassador Robert Blackwill is well known among the ‘strategic' community in India as a person who contributed to the development of India- United States relations during his stay in New Delhi as the American ambassador to India, which also made him knowledgeable about what is now referred to, unfortunately, as the AfPak region. He is known for his bold, often unconventional and ‘out of the box,' thinking on issues of peace and security. Hence, his views on how the U.S. should tackle the Afghan quagmire must be taken serious note of.

In an article in the Financial Times of July 21, Mr. Blackwill has argued that the current strategy of counter-insurgency will fail and the U.S. will not succeed in persuading enough and weighty Taliban leaders to join in a reconciliation exercise. Since the U.S. can neither win the war nor withdraw precipitously, the only alternative is to arrange for what he calls a de facto partition of Afghanistan. The southern and eastern parts of the country would be surrendered to the Pashtuns which, in effect, would mean the Taliban. The U.S. and a coalition of “like-minded countries” would establish a separate regime in the non-Pashtun north and west of the country. The U.S. and others would maintain a more or less permanent presence of about 50,000 troops and air power to continue to harass the al-Qaeda elements in the other half and across the Durand Line as well as prevent the Pashtun and the Taliban from conquering the north and the west.

Such a solution, he admits, will leave many non-Pashtuns at the mercy of the Pashtuns in the southern part but he writes that off as an “unfortunate but unavoidable” consequence, as he does the complete denial of human rights to women in Pashtunland. He even treats the fragmentation of Pakistan, a possible result of his solution, with equanimity. Why should the U.S., he asks, be more concerned with Pakistan's territorial integrity than General Kayani and his colleagues? And so on.

Mr. Blackwill's diagnosis of the ailments afflicting Afghanistan contains many ground truths, but his proposed cure — a de facto partition of the country between the Pashtun south and the non-Pashtun north and west — is infinitely worse than the disease. Firstly, it smacks of a colonial attitude. Instead of the classic “divide and rule,” he is recommending “divide and depart;” the British practised them both in the sub-continent with disastrous consequences. Ahmed Rashid writing in an article in Financial Times on August 4 says: “Partition will lead to worse horrors than witnessed at India's division in 1947.”

Secondly, while we do not speak for our respective governments, it is unthinkable that either the U.S. or India, or indeed any other “like-minded” country will look favourably at this plan and join in such blatant interference in Afghanistan's internal situation and become parties to a civil conflict. Thirdly, women in the Taliban territory will be doomed forever to a life of denial of all human rights. Fourthly, it completely ignores the fact that Afghans of all ethnicities have a strong sense of nationhood, despite ethnic divergences; if the Afghans wanted to partition their country, they would have done so long ago and on their own terms. Ahmed Rashid cites, in the same article, several previous attempts by the Soviet Union, Iran as well as by Pakistan to divide Afghanistan on ethnic lines, all turned down by Afghans of all ethnicities.

According to Rashid, in 1996, when the Taliban initially failed to take the north, Pakistan's ISI suggested that the Pashtun group create its own state in the south. But the Taliban refused, despite its dependence on the ISI. And lastly, a partition will hasten the very result that it is meant to delay and avoid, namely, a civil war-type situation. Afghanistan's immediate and near-neighbours would feel compelled to be dragged into the vortex. To quote Rashid again: “It would endanger Pakistan, encouraging some 40 million Pashtuns in Pakistan to link up with some 15 million Pashtun brothers in Afghanistan and forge an extremist state that gives refuge to terrorists.”

And the consequences for India will be simply intolerable.

Mr. Blackwill is conscious that his prescription is not ideal; he only offers it because he sees no better or less bad alternative. But there is another, practicable though not an easy alternative approach that we have advocated in the past. We are convinced that what is needed is a regional approach to Afghanistan's problems, to address the multiple crises emanating from the region — terrorism, crime, drugs, refugees. The solution lies in less or zero interference, not more, and certainly not military intervention, in Afghanistan's affairs.

It is a historical fact that Afghanistan enjoyed relative stability and even prosperity when it practised, and was allowed by its neighbours and external powers to practise, a kind of neutrality in its foreign policy. If somehow conditions can be created that would permit Afghanistan to once again revert to its traditional neutrality, it ought to help in significantly reducing tensions in the region. This might appear to be a difficult or impossible goal to achieve in the prevailing climate of hatred and suspicions, but that is no reason for not considering it and working for it.

We believe that someone, preferably the Secretary-General of the United Nations, should engage in a diplomatic exercise to hold talks with all the parties and states concerned to establish a consensus, however defined, on arriving at a compact of mutual non-intervention and non-interference among all of Afghanistan's neighbours. The 1962 Declaration on the Neutrality of Laos provides one possible model and there could be others. The Bonn Agreement of December 2001, which brought into being the provisional government headed by Hamid Karzai, specifically tasks the United Nations to ‘guarantee' non-interference in Afghanistan's internal affairs; thus the Secretary-General already has the necessary mandate to undertake the necessary consultations. The process, which would be quite protracted, should eventually consummate in an international conference where all the neighbours of Afghanistan would solemnly commit themselves not to interfere or intervene in its internal affairs, as well as not to support in any way — politically, materially or militarily — any group or faction within Afghanistan. Afghanistan, for its part, would solemnly undertake to abjure forever from inviting any foreign elements to intervene in its internal problems.

The final document would be witnessed by the five permanent members of the Security Council as well as by the relevant foreign powers and would be registered with the United Nations. In addition, the participants at the proposed conference would need to take one further step — to establish an international commission to supervise the implementation of the document. A monitoring group and/or a complaints procedure would need to be established. It would be essential to create some mechanism that could inspire confidence among the signatories about compliance by all of them with their commitments.

As mentioned above, the proposal which we are putting forward is not an easy one. It will call for a sustained effort over many months. The then special envoy of the then Secretary General took several years to persuade all the parties to agree to the terms of the Geneva Agreement of 1988 which brought an end to the Soviet occupation of Afghanistan. The challenges underlying our proposal must not deter the required effort and political will. We are convinced that it is definitely preferable either to the imposed and bloody partition, de facto or otherwise, of Afghanistan or to the alternative of precipitate withdrawal or open-ended military engagement of foreign forces in the country.

(Chinmaya R. Gharekhan served as India's special envoy for West Asia and is a former U.N. under secretary general. Karl F. Inderfurth served as U.S. assistant secretary of state for South Asian affairs from 1997-2001 and is a professor at the Elliott School of International Affairs at George Washington University.)
 
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