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Pakistan's likely response to an Indian Surgical strike !

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Deckingraj,

India has 2 options in case of another Bombay style attacks. 1. Either go for all out war or 2. Impose economic and cultural sanctions on a major scale. Let me explain - Coca-Cola had pulled out of Israel after Arab nations had asked it to. Coke did. Similarly, if India asked all major MNCs - automotive, FMCG, hospitality, IT to move out of Pakistan. Lastly, we all know after the IPL fiasco how much Pakistan is attached to cricket. India can use its muscle in the ICC to suspend Pakistan from the ICC till it gets in act in order.

Some of your points -

"Planning is all about" - War is a fluid situation. You can't prepare for all eventualities - least of all on your opponent's move.

My question is - irrespective of the success or failure of "surgical strikes" - would surgical strikes guarantee the prevention of future Bombay-style attacks? It might even encourage more suicide attacks.

No one wants 26/11 like attacks - I was fairly close to the attack sites and lost a few acquaintances in the attack. But surgical strikes are neither going to stop future attacks nor completely dismantle terror infrastructure.
 
Deckingraj,

India has 2 options in case of another Bombay style attacks. 1. Either go for all out war or 2. Impose economic and cultural sanctions on a major scale. Let me explain - Coca-Cola had pulled out of Israel after Arab nations had asked it to. Coke did. Similarly, if India asked all major MNCs - automotive, FMCG, hospitality, IT to move out of Pakistan. Lastly, we all know after the IPL fiasco how much Pakistan is attached to cricket. India can use its muscle in the ICC to suspend Pakistan from the ICC till it gets in act in order.

Some of your points -

"Planning is all about" - War is a fluid situation. You can't prepare for all eventualities - least of all on your opponent's move.

My question is - irrespective of the success or failure of "surgical strikes" - would surgical strikes guarantee the prevention of future Bombay-style attacks? It might even encourage more suicide attacks.

No one wants 26/11 like attacks - I was fairly close to the attack sites and lost a few acquaintances in the attack. But surgical strikes are neither going to stop future attacks nor completely dismantle terror infrastructure.

You missed the point. We want you to attack us. Sanctions are not what we are looking for instead "try" to give some crap. Lets see who wins..

Now yak starts!
:wave:
:blah: :blah:
 
Since we are going into argumentive mode so i will try to ignore provocative words....If possible reply in the same manner...

Lets analyse this.......who has the nigger economy and who has the bigger investment from foreigners...India. Like the 2001 confrontation, many investors will run, and knowing hat a full fledged conflict will break out, whether it does or not is beside the point, investors will dump and run. So in the sense of economical growth, India suffers dearly and its growth will take time again due to this fear of further confrontations spoiling business.

Again you are missing the point....That's why i gave you the example of 100 vs 10 rupees...which you choose to make fun of...Anyways even for the sake of argument say Indian economy will be hit badly but don't you think these are the factors that will be considered before surgical atrikes??? Here we are talking about what should be the Pakistani response...Indian econmoy getting crippled or not is not the deterant for Pakistan...her deterant would be how much damage she is willing to take to harm India....Am i making some sense???


You really think Pakistan is not going to launch attacks on the stock echange centres and electronic systems in India, wow, your living the dream....keep going my man, keep going....

Please don't be naive(that's the best word i can come up with for such a remark!!!!)....Do you honestly believe that Pakistan will launch attack on Stock Exchange of India???? what made you think that thereafter there will be any chance to limit the conflict??? Please understand pakistan Army is not a suicide squad whose aim is to destroy the opponent by killing themselves....Your's is a professional army who would like to give a fitting reply to India but by avoiding collateral damage.. don't you think so???

Secondly you are telling me again and again about your missiles...and how you have the ability to be offensive against India... This reminds of a similar video on one of the thread where some freak Indian channel is describing how India will ruin Pakistan in 10 steps without considering Pakistani response...My advice in you assessment please don't make the same mistakes....



This is rather dumn to say the least. You commented with

Dumn??? really???



Keep the theatre small, who the hell do you think India is, the US. Again, it will not decide how big the arena will be. Like I said in my post

Then you say my statement was being dumn....I have made it clear ample number of times that its not India who will dictate the theater of war....Let me repeat INDIA WONT DECIDE...I even gave you the example of Kargil..Did pakistan decide how much should be the theater of war...it was India...and what did India decide??? to keep the theater small....Now if you believe that India lacks guts..they don't have ability to launch offensive against Pak or the famous theory of 1 PA soldier = 20 IN soldier or anything like that then i can't help....

My point is that PA would not like to increase the theater of war for their own good... Not like someone dictating them....

With regards to 1971, What would be Pakistan's position if it had east Pakistan today, hell no where near the teachnology we have today.
Please educate yourself on this matter..if i go by your logic then we should have divided india into smaller states and we would have easily become super power by now...

Do you know the difference between Bangladesh currency vs Pakistan currency??? So your logic that Bangladesh was a liability for Pak is flawed...Anyways upto you i have no intentions to debate on this with you...lets stick to topic in hand....



We would have been drained out and defenceless. Hence, I don;t disagree Pakistan lost the War whether India won with the help of Bangladeshi soldiers deserting or mutiniering or not, it lost, simple as.

Again as i said that Vitory has many fathers and defeat is an orphan....People give this logic that Pakistan lost because mukhti bahini helped India otherwise they would not have succeeded...but very conveniently they forget that who provided logictic support to them...who trained them...who provided amunitions etc etc....Don't you think we have enough men on our side to have inflicted the same damage?? Anyways the results of the war is there for all of us to see and learn from it...I don't want to take anything from Mukhti Bahini people who fought for their country's freedom...So let's leave it there...



However, we are not at 1971......thats the difference here. Like you think China is superior only in numbers,

Well exactly i think China is superior to us in numbers to say the least...and that's why i will be living in fools paradise to say that India can be offensive against China in a full fledge war...our best bet would be a defensive posture and let them attack....


That is how we do not think India to be superior in any way either other then numerically. :azn:
Then you are plane wrong...Period....I am nobody to bring you out of this dream...With due respect you have less knowledge about your country's defense might vs Indian Army..so my suggestion read more on this....There are plenty of threads here from which you can grasp lot of knowledge(in case you wan't to)....


Now please lets continue a discussion rather then trying to win the debate with "your getting emotional" crap as this is nothing but your frustration showing. :pdf:

My frustration??? Do you really see that i am frustrated when i am countering your points with Logic??? When i say emotions i mean statements like we have this we have that and completely ignoring the other party also have similar things if not better....I hope i made my point clear...
 
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Thanks for sharing your thoughts Jackdaws.. Now let me try to show you some of the flaws in it...


Deckingraj,India has 2 options in case of another Bombay style attacks.
Lets drill the options...



1. Either go for all out war or
Negative...We both are nuclear nations...an all out war is not an option for either party...That's why our general said that a limited war is a possibility under nuclear umbrella...I am surprised that you think an all out war is an option but not surgical strikes...because an all out war surely means the loosing party will opt for nukes...Do you see the graveness???

Now if we have to act militarily the best option is to keep the theater limited...Again there is graveness in it..because you are counting on International pressure and pak's response to be limited....


2. Impose economic and cultural sanctions on a major scale. Let me explain - Coca-Cola had pulled out of Israel after Arab nations had asked it to. Coke did. Similarly, if India asked all major MNCs - automotive, FMCG, hospitality, IT to move out of Pakistan.

I appreciate you putting a thinking cap and try to come up with options.. However my friend it is flawed... If we had that much influence do you see any reason we have not done that yet??? Do we really need another mumbai attack to put economic sanctions against Pakistan??? That's where diplomacy works and unless and untill Pak is declared a terrorist nation(i don't see it happening) by International body this cannot be achieved....Though i am not aware of Coke doing anything like that but even for the sake of argument let's assume this happened even then you can't compare the influence of Arab world with that of India....they are the oil hub...i don't think more need to said after that....


Lastly, we all know after the IPL fiasco how much Pakistan is attached to cricket. India can use its muscle in the ICC to suspend Pakistan from the ICC till it gets in act in order.

Negative ... the maximum we can do is boycott our bilateral series which we did...Ban Pakistani players to play in India or private corporates like IPL...Just after mumbai Sri Lanka choose to tour pakistan even after strong opposition from GOI....

Most important how can you force GOP to act against so called non-state actors by depriving their players of cricket???? Do you believe that people will come on roads and put pressure on GOP to act so that they can see cricket flourishing in Pakistan?? That would be naive to think....

Some of your points -

"Planning is all about" - War is a fluid situation. You can't prepare for all eventualities - least of all on your opponent's move.

My question is - irrespective of the success or failure of "surgical strikes" - would surgical strikes guarantee the prevention of future Bombay-style attacks? It might even encourage more suicide attacks.

No one wants 26/11 like attacks - I was fairly close to the attack sites and lost a few acquaintances in the attack. But surgical strikes are neither going to stop future attacks nor completely dismantle terror infrastructure.

You are absolutely right....Surgical strikes will not stop anything and that's one of the reasons we have not popted for it...... However you can't just take hits without hitting back....You can't just let your people die and simply close your eyes..... Just look at what Pakistan premier said a few days back...We can't prevent mumbai like attacks...So if i write it in my words it is like saying..

- we have terrorists in our country who are loose and we cannot control them...So if these non-state actors plan such attacks in Pakistan...Facilitate those attacks from Pakistan and kill people in your country, still we are not responsible

- Though we cannot control these people but in case you try to act against them then we will reply back with a full-fledge war...

So in essense India should keep mum and let terrorist do whatever they want to do....Pakistan can't stop them and will not let India stop them either....

How ridiculous that sounds to you???
 
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Stop Off Topics !!!!

I hope you are not pointing to my replies....because i believe the thread is talking about Pakistan's likely response against India's surgical strike and that's exactly what i am discussing...
 
Again you are missing the point....That's why i gave you the example of 100 vs 10 rupees...which you choose to make fun of...Anyways even for the sake of argument say Indian economy will be hit badly but don't you think these are the factors that will be considered before surgical atrikes??? Here we are talking about what should be the Pakistani response...Indian econmoy getting crippled or not is not the deterant for Pakistan...her deterant would be how much damage she is willing to take to harm India....Am i making some sense???

Speaking to you is like :hitwall:

Well if damaging or crippling economy was not a deterrent for Pakistan then why did Vajpayee not go to war or limited war in 2001. As this is a definite thing Pakistan would exploit, why. Well quite simply because if we really are going into a war, limited or not, may as well do whatever damage that can be done to India militarily and economically. Who is to decide that such an attack on the Indian economical sector will bring about a full fledged war leading to nukes.


Please don't be naive(that's the best word i can come up with for such a remark!!!!)....Do you honestly believe that Pakistan will launch attack on Stock Exchange of India???? what made you think that thereafter there will be any chance to limit the conflict??? Please understand pakistan Army is not a suicide squad whose aim is to destroy the opponent by killing themselves....Your's is a professional army who would like to give a fitting reply to India but by avoiding collateral damage.. don't you think so???

Secondly you are telling me again and again about your missiles...and how you have the ability to be offensive against India... This reminds of a similar video on one of the thread where some freak Indian channel is describing how India will ruin Pakistan in 10 steps without considering Pakistani response...My advice in you assessment please don't make the same mistakes....

Again, you just simply do not understand someone elses post, its again like :hitwall:

With regards to attacking Indian economy, please see above first paragraph, and also based on the 2001 scenario, it appears that many investers will be leaving willingly before any Pakistani attempt anyway, why would Pakistan not do something to hit India where it hurts, you need to come out of this fantasy dream. seriously, all options are on the table, to you hitting so called terror camps, or freedom fighter camps is acceptable but for Pakistan to hit Indian targets as well as other targets, is a no no becuase Indian forum members think so, well ok

You have said Pakistan would not like to increase the theatre of war. You seem to assume Pakistan will sit in a defensive mode......sorry, 40 years have past since the last war, you dont know how Pakistan is going to react, but my point is, and please read this again ans=d again to comprehend......Pakistan has the means for offensive attacks, as proven by the missile names given (those names were given to hopefully get you to understand) and Kargil is an example and is the General Majids comment I mentioned earlier that Pakistan has the ability and stomach to do so.

Then you say my statement was being dumn....I have made it clear ample number of times that its not India who will dictate the theater of war....Let me repeat INDIA WONT DECIDE...I even gave you the example of Kargil..Did pakistan decide how much should be the theater of war...it was India...and what did India decide??? to keep the theater small....Now if you believe that India lacks guts..they don't have ability to launch offensive against Pak or the famous theory of 1 PA soldier = 20 IN soldier or anything like that then i can't help....

??????????????????????????????????????

My point is that PA would not like to increase the theater of war for their own good... Not like someone dictating them....

for their own good..........When a strike is launched, that is it, it is an attack and it is a declared war. Pakistan is not going to sit for a tit for tat and wait for India to hit a target in Pakistan and respond with hitting a target in India....I mean, who the hell do you think you Indians are.....we will target what we like in war, not India.

Please educate yourself on this matter..if i go by your logic then we should have divided india into smaller states and we would have easily become super power by now...

Do you know the difference between Bangladesh currency vs Pakistan currency??? So your logic that Bangladesh was a liability for Pak is flawed...Anyways upto you i have no intentions to debate on this with you...lets stick to topic in hand....

Yes I believe Bangladesh was a liability, my view, talk about educating oneself, I have been educated, just my education from my Pakistan's point of view and yours, well your is Indian so quite obviously it MUST be correct...as India is the only one that can be.

Again as i said that Vitory has many fathers and defeat is an orphan....People give this logic that Pakistan lost because mukhti bahini helped India otherwise they would not have succeeded...but very conveniently they forget that who provided logictic support to them...who trained them...who provided amunitions etc etc....Don't you think we have enough men on our side to have inflicted the same damage?? Anyways the results of the war is there for all of us to see and learn from it...I don't want to take anything from Mukhti Bahini people who fought for their country's freedom...So let's leave it there...

Have you even read my post with diggin a hole for yourself........I have already said, whether Bangladeshis deserted tjeir platoons or whatever had happenned which caused Pakistan to loose the war, it doesn;t matter, Pakistan lost, it is as simple as that......which part of this did not just not understand......

Well exactly i think China is superior to us in numbers to say the least...and that's why i will be living in fools paradise to say that India can be offensive against China in a full fledge war...our best bet would be a defensive posture and let them attack...

Well we differ in that............Israeli/Arab war shows otherwise. Launchinf an offensive can open up many options and keep the enemy on their toes.......how many battles have you taken part in deckingraj...other then the armchair expert one


Then you are plane wrong...Period....I am nobody to bring you out of this dream...With due respect you have less knowledge about your country's defense might vs Indian Army..so my suggestion read more on this....There are plenty of threads here from which you can grasp lot of knowledge(in case you wan't to)....

Well according to your Generak he can fight both Pakistan and China........You again are living in a superioty complex, I am getting tired of using this word just as much as I am getting tired of hearing the word terrorist. India thinks its has a better force, and in some ways like technology it does, however, all depends heavily also on ground forces and I believe our ground troops are second to none. My view, you have your...........

My frustration??? Do you really see that i am frustrated when i am countering your points with Logic??? When i say emotions i mean statements like we have this we have that and completely ignoring the other party also have similar things if not better....I hope i made my point clear...

Logic, well Indian logic is not logic altogether, its sheer lunacy. Reminds me Sri Sri Ravi Shankars view like kutarka

Kutarka means wrong logic or illogical, where the intention is not right. Logic is applied here with the sole purpose of finding fault. One knows deep inside that it is not right, but still, logically you prove that it is right. This is called Kutarka.
For example: The door is half open means the door is half closed. Therefore, the door is fully open means the door is fully closed!......This can only happen in India
 
Gazzi,

Don't wanna go off track. However - according to international law if Pakistan asks for consular access to Kasab - India has to comply. Actually, India would love to comply and Pakistan is also required to provide the legal defense for Kasab.

Pakistan would give consular access but to do that it must first accept him as a Pakistani citizen, which it will not do....Pakistan has sadi that some, some of the Mumbai attack was possibly planned in Pakistan.

However, Indian evidence on this issue is pathetic at best and Indians are going by emotion and by beating the drums loud thinking it will become a fact. Sorry but our courts have rejected Indias evidence.
 
Pakistan would give consular access but to do that it must first accept him as a Pakistani citizen, which it will not do....Pakistan has sadi that some, some of the Mumbai attack was possibly planned in Pakistan.

However, Indian evidence on this issue is pathetic at best and Indians are going by emotion and by beating the drums loud thinking it will become a fact. Sorry but our courts have rejected Indias evidence.

Here you go sir.. Some developments

Pak corroborates Kasab's statements, LeT behind 26/11 - Pakistan - World - The Times of India

Pak admits LeT behind Mumbai terror attack-News-Videos-The Times of India

Looks like Lakhvi is getting sacrificed and Saeed being saved
 
Last warning for all off topic posts ie: Mumbai attacks , yada yada. Mention them but do not Discuss as it covers the whole Topic.
 
^^ BB Sir.. just go ahead and report the posts that you find off topic. Deciding whether they are or not, let the mods take that call
 
^ I do not want any one's work (post) deleted so it is a soft warning , either i would have to do report them but i do not want to as long as it goes on.

thanks
 
^ I do not want any one's work (post) deleted so it is a soft warning , either i would have to do report them but i do not want to as long as it goes on.

thanks

Its one way for the Indian members to derail this thread and get it closed.

Anyway, just a quick note Karan

(1) This is the prosecution who have agreed to go with a threshold test of a possible prosecution, not the court result. Two things, totally different, let wait and see the court result.

(2) I couldn;t care less, India committed a genocide in Kashmir and freedom fighters paying you back in full. I don't see a problem with it

Now back to Pakistan response to surgical strikes ...... deckingraj, should we continue
 
Its one way for the Indian members to derail this thread and get it closed.

Anyway, just a quick note Karan

(1) This is the prosecution who have agreed to go with a threshold test of a possible prosecution, not the court result. Two things, totally different, let wait and see the court result.
True.. And the prosecution in this case is the govt of pakistan.. So you are right that court will eventually decide, but at this time the govt of pakistan has taken a stand that these people are responsible for 26/11

(2) I couldn;t care less, India committed a genocide in Kashmir and freedom fighters paying you back in full. I don't see a problem with it

So help me understand.. Are you supporting 26/11 incident and the likes??
 
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