Pakistani corner

[I.R.A]

I think I am feeling dizzy coz of that quake. @Color_Less_Sky

The ground shook underneath me, I went like going sideways and it was the same feeling.

 

[Dubious]

compiled nearly 2.75 centuries

Not really....

However, there are many authentic narrations collected by the scholars of Hadith that prove that hadiths were recorded in writing even during the lifetime of the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him). For example, `Abdullah ibn `Amr said, “I used to write everything which I heard from the Messenger of Allah with the intention of memorizing it. However, some Quraishites forbade me from doing so saying, "Do you write everything that you hear from him, while the Messenger of Allah is a human being who speaks in anger and pleasure?" So I stopped writing, and mentioned it to the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings be upon him). He pointed with his finger to his mouth and said, "Write! By Him in whose hand is my soul, only truth comes out from it." (Abu Dawud)

And there are many other hadith here: Process of Hadith Compilation - Hadith Studies - Shari`ah - OnIslam.net

- Not the best website but these look ok

But compiling into 1 single book...maybe yes that took a while coz everyone was spread so it did take awhile to track them down and also to see if such people (narrators) really did narrate all that and if they were really truth speakers

also that it was Hazrat Abu Bakar and Hazrat Umer who gathered the Quran in one place, then why did not these Sahahba did the same for Ahadees?

1) The Quran was already gathered coz the oldest copy that we know of was with Prophet's wife Hafsa...(read that we know of)
2) Didnt gather hadith...well they probably didnt think people would start becoming SO divergent SO soon...or maybe they thought that since they are following (by living) as per the hadith, no one would actually divert from such a lifestyle...

Plus alot of the sahaba were moving = trading, working abroad, spreading Islam, posted (generals) in other lands so it wasnt too easy to collect all....I think the need to compile ONLY came when people started forgetting what the Islamic era looked like....

3) ALLAH took charge to safegaurd the Quran and it is a complete set of guide so maybe they didnt think that the hadith would make a BIG difference (like the sects now DIFFER coz of THEIR interpretation of the hadith rather than their understanding of the Quran)

@Irfan Baloch , app kidhar? everything alright?

He is busy spitting venom on dead people!

And considering Halaku Khan was a barbarian, him looting, pillaging and murdering Muslims in Baghdad is understandable but why throw books in river? What he had against books?

Jahal log in that era were all similar...the libraries of Egypt were burned so were soo many in Iraq when different powers came....

By burning or getting rid of the historical records, people were able to tell and write the history how they wanted it!

I think I am feeling dizzy coz of that quake. @Color_Less_Sky

what quake? where?

 

[I.R.A]

Massive earthquake in Pakistan | Page 2

@Akheilos

 

[Dubious]

Massive earthquake in Pakistan | Page 2

@Akheilos

Just read

I am in office but family friends are ok...trying to get in touch with sis and parents

 

[I.R.A]

Just read

I am in office but family friends are ok...trying to get in touch with sis and parents

I am trying too but this cell phone service won't connect, and right now I am angry because I received a promotional message but cannot call anyone. ALLAH sab ko apni hifz o aman may rakhy Ameen.

 

[Dubious]

I am trying too but this cell phone service won't connect, and right now I am angry because I received a promotional message but cannot call anyone. ALLAH sab ko apni hifz o aman may rakhy Ameen.

Ameen

 

[Zibago]

Just read

I am in office but family friends are ok...trying to get in touch with sis and parents

36 casulaties , 160 injured

 

[Mutakalim]

@SaG E Jillani88 @Akheilos

I have a question in context of discussion regarding Ahadees. I have read Ahadees were compiled nearly 2.75 centuries after departing of messenger Muhammad (Peace be upon him), and also that it was Hazrat Abu Bakar and Hazrat Umer who gathered the Quran in one place, then why did not these Sahahba did the same for Ahadees? And what about those Muslims who lived during the time after departing of messenger Muhammad (Peace be upon him) and time when Ahadees were…… well written or gathered?

And considering Halaku Khan was a barbarian, him looting, pillaging and murdering Muslims in Baghdad is understandable but why throw books in river? What he had against books?

I will reply in detail just need a little time.

 

[Mutakalim]

@SaG E Jillani88 @Akheilos

I have a question in context of discussion regarding Ahadees. I have read Ahadees were compiled nearly 2.75 centuries after departing of messenger Muhammad (Peace be upon him), and also that it was Hazrat Abu Bakar and Hazrat Umer who gathered the Quran in one place, then why did not these Sahahba did the same for Ahadees? And what about those Muslims who lived during the time after departing of messenger Muhammad (Peace be upon him) and time when Ahadees were…… well written or gathered?

Some illiterate people reached that conclusion due to their incompetence, inadequate knowledge and lack of in-depth analysis of the subject. I am refereeing to thoughts and ideas of those people who want to get rid of authenticity and authoritativeness of Hadees just on the basis of this wrong conception that it was done centuries after Rasool Allah. This is one of the greatest misguiding Fitnah in Deen. Bukhari Muslim and Siha sitta doesn’t mean that these were first books of Hadees.


Ahadees were written and compiled in front of holy prophet under his own instruction and supervision. Companions used to write down Ahadees in form of groups.


Rasool Allah ordered to write down his Ahadees
Ref: Al Mustadrak Vol-1, P-187 H-4614


There were approximately 100 Hadith books and Compendiums compiled before Imam Bukhari and Muslim. There was no gap between the period of Holy prophet and Imam Bukhari.There were many companions who prepared their own collection of Ahadees. Just few of those are listed below.


1. Collection of traditions by Ameer ul Momeneen Ali A.s named as Sahifa e Ali

2. As Sahifa tus Sadiqa by Abdullah bin Amar bin Al’aas

3. Collection/Sahifa of Samura bin Jundab

4. Collection of Atta bin rubah Taabaei hisham bin al ghaaz student of aata

5. Iibn e umar used to dictate Ahadees to his students like Hazarat nafae. Nafae was Tabaei

6. Collection of Abdullah bin masood

7. Humam bin Munabae compiled Al Sahifa tus Sahi’ia collection of Ahadees narrated by Abu Huraira. This complete Sahifa was then taken into Musnad Ahmad by Imam Ahmed bin Hambal

8. Sahifa Ibn e Abbas compiled by Saeed Bin Jubair
Ref: Darmi, As sunan J-1 P-139

 

[I.R.A]

Some illiterate people reached that conclusion due to their incompetence, inadequate knowledge and lack of in-depth analysis of the subject. I am refereeing to thoughts and ideas of those people who want to get rid of authenticity and authoritativeness of Hadees just on the basis of this wrong conception that it was done centuries after Rasool Allah. This is one of the greatest misguiding Fitnah in Deen. Bukhari Muslim and Siha sitta doesn’t mean that these were first books of Hadees.


Ahadees were written and compiled in front of holy prophet under his own instruction and supervision. Companions used to write down Ahadees in form of groups.


Rasool Allah ordered to write down his Ahadees
Ref: Al Mustadrak Vol-1, P-187 H-4614


There were approximately 100 Hadith books and Compendiums compiled before Imam Bukhari and Muslim. There was no gap between the period of Holy prophet and Imam Bukhari.There were many companions who prepared their own collection of Ahadees. Just few of those are listed below.


1. Collection of traditions by Ameer ul Momeneen Ali A.s named as Sahifa e Ali

2. As Sahifa tus Sadiqa by Abdullah bin Amar bin Al’aas

3. Collection/Sahifa of Samura bin Jundab

4. Collection of Atta bin rubah Taabaei hisham bin al ghaaz student of aata

5. Iibn e umar used to dictate Ahadees to his students like Hazarat nafae. Nafae was Tabaei

6. Collection of Abdullah bin masood

7. Humam bin Munabae compiled Al Sahifa tus Sahi’ia collection of Ahadees narrated by Abu Huraira. This complete Sahifa was then taken into Musnad Ahmad by Imam Ahmed bin Hambal

8. Sahifa Ibn e Abbas compiled by Saeed Bin Jubair
Ref: Darmi, As sunan J-1 P-139

Thanks for the detailed reply but you forgot to mention Sahifa e Fatima and knowledge of Imams regarding future past and every event that will happen. Now how do you look at events like where it is mentioned that messenger Muhammad (Peace be upon him) asked for a piece of paper and pen sometime before his departing from this world, so that he (peace be upon him) could write an advice that will guide Muslims after him, but companions of messenger divided into two and started arguing, one group was in favor and the other headed by Hazrat Umer (RA) was against this saying messenger is sick and we have Quran that is enough for guidance? At this messenger told them to leave because it is not appropriate for them to fight in front of Messenger of ALLAH?????? Or how do you justify when these Imams try to tell us that Hazrat Ayesha was around nine years old when she got married to messenger of ALLAH, whereas Quran says وَابْتَلُوا الْيَتَامَىٰ حَتَّىٰ إِذَا بَلَغُوا النِّكَاحَ ?????? I am trying to learn here, so please bear with me . There are various accounts of Ahadees which when read carefully are full of Tabarah involving companions of messenger (Peace be upon him), Umhat ul Momineen and in some cases messenger himself, then there are other ahadees which make you think as many times as you can that how is it possible or how can messenger say something like this because it is totally against what little we know as Muslims and these accounts are deprived of any logic or are negating Quran...........................

 

[Mutakalim]

knowledge of Imams regarding future past and every event that will happen

Which Imams? Further elaboration needed.

 

[I.R.A]

Which Imams? Further elaboration needed.

Refuse to do so on a public forum, don't want to hurt sentiments of many here. Mushkil may mat dal yar.

 

[Mutakalim]

Thanks for the detailed reply but you forgot to mention Sahifa e Fatima and knowledge of Imams regarding future past and every event that will happen. Now how do you look at events like where it is mentioned that
-messenger Muhammad (Peace be upon him) asked for a piece of paper and pen sometime before his departing from this world, so that he (peace be upon him) could write an advice that will guide Muslims after him, but companions of messenger divided into two and started arguing, one group was in favor and the other headed by Hazrat Umer (RA) was against this saying messenger is sick and we have Quran that is enough for guidance? At this messenger told them to leave because it is not appropriate for them to fight in front of Messenger of ALLAH?????? Or how do you justify when these Imams try to tell us that
-Hazrat Ayesha was around nine years old when she got married to messenger of ALLAH, whereas Quran says وَابْتَلُوا الْيَتَامَىٰ حَتَّىٰ إِذَا بَلَغُوا النِّكَاحَ ?????? I am trying to learn here, so please bear with me .
-There are various accounts of Ahadees which when read carefully are full of Tabarah involving companions of messenger (Peace be upon him), Umhat ul Momineen and in some cases messenger himself
- then there are other ahadees which make you think as many times as you can that how is it possible or how can messenger say something like this because it is totally against what little we know as Muslims and these accounts are deprived of any logic or are negating Quran...........................

Let’s divide this into four parts and discuss them one by one. Before commencing to next step I would like to know, what conclusion you draw from these things. What results are derived through these points?

Refuse to do so on a public forum, don't want to hurt sentiments of many here. Mushkil may mat dal yar.

Little hint will do the job i think

 

[I.R.A]

Let’s divide this into four parts and discuss them one by one. Before commencing to next step I would like to know, what conclusion you draw from these things. What results are derived through these points?

Okay let us divide it into four phases, I have not reached any conclusion yet there is lot of confusion and lots of contradictions I am facing, things mind and heart is not ready to accept, our current state and motives of people who wanted all this make sense to me pretty much but then again when it comes to knowledgeable people I find it hard that how did they or how do they keep on accepting it? The state of my mind right now is that I am reading a book "Farooq e Azam" by Hussnain Haikal and I cannot understand if the writer has tried explaining the Umer that we know of or he is trying to malign his personality, Hazrat Ali (RA) had to fight wars against Muslims?????? Not ready to accept all this because infighting would have made Muslims weak and there is no way that they could have controlled a territory of 3.5 million sqm. Quran's verses are there but historical accounts keep on negating those verses.

Little hint will do the job i think

Answered.

 

[Mutakalim]

I have not reached any conclusion yet there is lot of confusion and lots of contradictions I am facing, things mind and heart is not ready to accept, our current state and motives of people who wanted all this make sense to me pretty much but then again when it comes to knowledgeable people I find it hard that how did they or how do they keep on accepting it?

Contradictions and confusion are always there in the minds of common people like us. But again we have to divide these contradictions in two categories.
Contradictions which directly affect our core beliefs and we are answerable to God about these beliefs. These confusions should be cleared immediately. For example status of Hadees and Sunnah and its authoritativeness in Islam. Secondly, those which are not part of core Islamic beliefs and we will not be asked about these on judgment day. It’s not obligatory to resolve all these contradictions.