Pakistan needs to focus & spend more on its education sector which is lagging behind.

[Ssan]

Main problem is corrupt politicians and political Islam. Get rid of them both and everything will fix itself.

Nope, political Islam is from founders. Read objectives resolution. Main problem is this leftist brigade.

The leftists are the ones that gave us the bhuttoism that destroyed the economy- by replacing meritocracy with lackeying. And market economy with whatever it is that we have, ad hoc planism.

The leftists in Pakistan are cringe. They think that aping the west makes them modern. In truth, the highest leftist intelligentsia in Pakistan would be the lowest ranks of society anywhere in the west. Totally bankrupt. Morally, ethically and intellectually.

Some Islamists are indeed dumb too. That is because of Bhuttoism. This peer muradee nonsense. The founders including Iqbal in truth were also islamists.

 

[Ssan]

Also our liberal friends may not be aware of this, but the private Islamic schools in Karachi have very good standards in Pakistan. The kids (mainly middle class) get admissions abroad and do well on international standards.

The problem isn’t Islam or no Islam. The problem is that Bhuttoism, these feudals who are supposedly leftists, these liberals whose only liberal credential is peena peelana types are dumb as shit.

the truth is that you can have standards in religious schools easy. Look at the Islamic schools in Karachi, or better yet the Jesuit schools and yeshivas in the west.

But the liberal secular elite who are intellectually bankrupt don’t like that the founders envisioned an Islamic republic. And even if the 99% of the rest of us who want it, and succeed despite them, want it, it is somehow anathema to growth and progress. No, they are the blockers to our societal development in truth.

 

[_NOBODY_]

Can you please link the syllabus here? Frankly, I would put no weight into whatever Dawn says


Yes when I read Dawn articles, it is clear they are against nationalism in general but have a certain vitriol against religion being part of that nationalism. Clearly they are speaking from point of ideology- not of impartiality.

Those articles should be completely disregarded in this discussion.

If someone posts the syllabus, I would love to go through it.

I don't have the syllabus but I have gotten my hands on some of the books. There are like the current Federal Board books, all focused on memorization(ratta).

 

[TheSolution]

I don't have the syllabus but I have gotten my hands on some of the books. There are like the current Federal Board books, all focused on memorization(ratta).

The syllabus is in the article you sent me

Can you please link the syllabus here? Frankly, I would put no weight into whatever Dawn says


Yes when I read Dawn articles, it is clear they are against nationalism in general but have a certain vitriol against religion being part of that nationalism. Clearly they are speaking from point of ideology- not of impartiality.

Those articles should be completely disregarded in this discussion.

If someone posts the syllabus, I would love to go through it.

Social studies PDF

SNC - Social Studies Curriculum | PDF | Citizenship | Curriculum

Social Studies curriculum grade IV to V

www.scribd.com

Nope, political Islam is from founders. Read objectives resolution. Main problem is this leftist brigade.

The leftists are the ones that gave us the bhuttoism that destroyed the economy- by replacing meritocracy with lackeying. And market economy with whatever it is that we have, ad hoc planism.

The leftists in Pakistan are cringe. They think that aping the west makes them modern. In truth, the highest leftist intelligentsia in Pakistan would be the lowest ranks of society anywhere in the west. Totally bankrupt. Morally, ethically and intellectually.

Some Islamists are indeed dumb too. That is because of Bhuttoism. This peer muradee nonsense. The founders including Iqbal in truth were also islamists.

The pro-lgbt kind of leftists in Pakistan are definitely just inferiority complex ridden tbh - it doesn't align with Pakistan's cultural, traditional or religious values, it's just straight up copied and imported from the west and very drastically opposing to Pakistani culture. Only someone with a severe inferiority complex can just straight away accept and propogate such an ideology yet culturally be so further away.

It literally makes no sense growing up in such a society that is diametrically opposite to it but somehow you accept it. It's western imitation due to an inferiority complex. And you'll find this is true because these dame people desperately try to copy everything the white man does, they feel it gives them inherent value.

 

[_NOBODY_]

Nope, political Islam is from founders. Read objectives resolution. Main problem is this leftist brigade.

The leftists are the ones that gave us the bhuttoism that destroyed the economy- by replacing meritocracy with lackeying. And market economy with whatever it is that we have, ad hoc planism.

The leftists in Pakistan are cringe. They think that aping the west makes them modern. In truth, the highest leftist intelligentsia in Pakistan would be the lowest ranks of society anywhere in the west. Totally bankrupt. Morally, ethically and intellectually.

Some Islamists are indeed dumb too. That is because of Bhuttoism. This peer muradee nonsense. The founders including Iqbal in truth were also islamists.

Political Islam is very wrong, political Islam leads to the abuse of religion for selfish purposes and fascism. Political Islam a vile tool to bend the masses to your will. Any person who truly practices Islam will always condemn it. Also, who's Islam are we talking about? Are you going to pick one sect and offend the followers of the rest or are you going to create a new sect by combining all the sects and offending everyone?

The syllabus is in the article you sent me

That doesn't tell you the whole story, read the books to see how atrocious it is.

 

[TheSolution]

Any person who truly practices Islam will always condemn it. Also, who's Islam are we talking about? Are you going to pick one sect and offend the followers of the rest or are you going to create a new sect by combining all the sects and offending everyone?

Why would they condemn it? And what alternative system do you propose?

On the topic of sects though, a single sect should covertly be made mainstream across the country for social cohesion and harmony. You don't have to offend anyone in the process just work towards it covertly by making it the dominantly propogated one.

 

[Ssan]

Political Islam is very wrong, political Islam leads to the abuse of religion for selfish purposes and fascism. Political Islam a vile tool to bend the masses to your will. Any person who truly practices Islam will always condemn it. Also, who's Islam are we talking about? Are you going to pick one sect and offend the followers of the rest or are you going to create a new sect by combining all the sects and offending everyone?

That doesn't tell you the whole story, read the books to see how atrocious it is.

Politics is the art and practice pursuing selfish purposes.

What exactly do you mean by political Islam? If you mean

Political Islam is very wrong, political Islam leads to the abuse of religion for selfish purposes and fascism. Political Islam a vile tool to bend the masses to your will. Any person who truly practices Islam will always condemn it. Also, who's Islam are we talking about? Are you going to pick one sect and offend the followers of the rest or are you going to create a new sect by combining all the sects and offending everyone?

That doesn't tell you the whole story, read the books to see how atrocious it is.

I don’t believe that there should be religious parties in Pakistan. Useless discussion. We should be an Islamic republic and the laws should be in line with Islam, simple as. Currently we are commonwealth law. Which is based on German philosophies of morality. This is stupid as shit. Replace this with a maqasid based system of Islamic law.

We already have an Islamic advisory council that has buy in from all the sects. You could do it easily. Sectarianism is not the concern.

 

[TheSolution]

Except Urdu, Islamiat and Pakistan Studies, all other subjects should be OUTSOURCED to the UK Education system IMMEDIATELY. AKA the Cambridge System.

Part of the cost to be borne by GoP and donors who would happily promote western system of education.

Ministry of Education should become a FEDERAL SUBJECT because emphasis is more on local / provincial preferences rather than National priorities.

THERE IS NO IMMEDIATE FIX TO THE LOCAL EDUCATION PROBLEM / SYSTEM.

WE NEED TO TAKE HELP FROM ABROAD.

Yeah I agree, STEM should have just all been outsourced tbh UK/China/US/Europe anywhere would have worked fine, and we focus on the subjects unique to Pakistan only

Can you please link the syllabus here? Frankly, I would put no weight into whatever Dawn says

Try downloading it here

https://snc.gov.pk/DownloadSNC

I haven't read it but let me know what it's like when you're done

 

[VCheng]

I don’t believe that there should be religious parties in Pakistan. Useless discussion. We should be an Islamic republic and the laws should be in line with Islam, simple as. Currently we are commonwealth law. Which is based on German philosophies of morality. This is stupid as shit. Replace this with a maqasid based system of Islamic law.

That must be why you are flying TWO Stars and Stripes.

 

[_NOBODY_]

Why would they condemn it? And what alternative system do you propose?

On the topic of sects though, a single sect should covertly be made mainstream across the country for social cohesion and harmony. You don't have to offend anyone in the process just work towards it covertly by making it the dominantly propogated one.

Trust me it will offend everyone including me. That can never happen nor should it happen and the state has no right to do that. Freedom of religion is an integral part of our constitution. Being an Islamic republic in our case means a state primarily created for Muslims of South Asia and it welcomes people of other faith as well as indicated by the white in our flag.

 

[VCheng]

Politics is the art and practice pursuing selfish purposes.

What exactly do you mean by political Islam? If you mean

I love the irony in your not knowing you answered your own question above:

Nope, political Islam is from founders. Read objectives resolution.

 

[Ssan]

That must be why you are flying TWO Stars and Stripes.

yeah, I’m in your party.

I love the irony in your not knowing you answered your own question above:

Lol, if you read what I wrote carefully, you will get what I wrote.

I have a definition in my mind about what political Islam is. I don’t know what the other person understand this as. Political Islam is not the same thing as politics btw.

Hope you can differentiate between those three concepts.

That must be why you are flying TWO Stars and Stripes.

Btw, curiously, the first line of the American declaration is copied from the maqasid as shariah.

The idea that God has given sacred rights to everyone dealiting with the protection of their rights, namely, life, liberty and socioeconomic rights is from Islam.

 

[TheSolution]

yeah, I’m in your party.


Lol, if you read what I wrote carefully, you will get what I wrote.

I have a definition in my mind about what political Islam is. I don’t know what the other person understand this as. Political Islam is not the same thing as politics btw.

Hope you can differentiate between those three concepts.


Btw, curiously, the first line of the American declaration is copied from the maqasid as shariah.

The idea that God has given sacred rights to everyone dealiting with the protection of their rights, namely, life, liberty and socioeconomic rights is from Islam.

This would actually be a pretty interesting discussion but it would go off-topic.

You should open another thread and perhaps title it "What is political Islam and how it can be implemented in Pakistan"

Also did you read the cirriculum, what are your opinions on it?

Trust me it will offend everyone including me. That can never happen nor should it happen and the state has no right to do that. Freedom of religion is an integral part of our constitution. Being an Islamic republic in our case means a state primarily created for Muslims of South Asia and it welcomes people of other faith as well as indicated by the white in our flag.

If the thread above is created I'll discuss this further but I don't want to ruin this thread we need more people discussing the topic of this thread as it's valid

 

[Ssan]

This would actually be a pretty interesting discussion but it would go off-topic.

You should open another thread and perhaps title it "What is political Islam and how it can be implemented in Pakistan"

Also did you read the cirriculum, what are your opinions on it?

No I am going to do that this weekend.

If the thread above is created I'll discuss this further but I don't want to ruin this thread we need more people discussing the topic of this thread as it's valid

 

[VCheng]

Lol, if you read what I wrote carefully, you will get what I wrote.

I have a definition in my mind about what political Islam is. I don’t know what the other person understand this as. Political Islam is not the same thing as politics btw.

Hope you can differentiate between those three concepts.

You won't be the first genius to define this:

Politics is the art and practice pursuing selfish purposes.

... and then realize that calling it Political Islam means you get to do everything the same, with the might of the State enforcing such whims, plus as a bonus, call anyone objecting to your shenanigans as being against Islam itself, to be flogged in public at your pleasure, for some light entertainment. Please meet the Great Mustachioed Satan General Zia. You may like him.

I hope you can grasp that elegantly simple ONE concept.

Btw, curiously, the first line of the American declaration is copied from the maqasid as shariah.

The idea that God has given sacred rights to everyone dealiting with the protection of their rights, namely, life, liberty and socioeconomic rights is from Islam.

BTW, equally curiously, there is something called separation of church and State in the US Constitution. You may have heard of it, I can only presume so. I wonder what that could mean?