Pakistan F-16 Discussions 2

[khanasifm]

Good example BAE won Taiwan upgrade and then it was cancelled because where will they go I mean BAE to lm to get upgrade kits and then perform upgrade anyway Oem will make everything to keep business eventually BAE order was cancelled and lm got it again

 

[VCheng]

Anyone who works in this field knows that once you get hold of any system, the first thing you have to get done is to dump their entire code and understand what it is doing; it is not quantum physics.

If only it were that easy. How many millions of line of code does an F-16 have, Sir, and in how many different systems that interact with each other?

 

[CriticalThought]

which direct us back to basic question, why did PAF opted for new f-16s back in 2006-07 if f-16 was having so many restrictions, there should have been a better negotiated deal with more freedom back in 2007

Because, even with all the restrictions, just flying Thunder against the Block 52 allows you to learn a lot and shows you how to improve the Thunder. This is true wrt dog fighting, radar evasion, ECCM. And for air to surface role, it shows you what a modern fighter can achieve, so you have a benchmark for Thunder.

All this talk of treason is absolute BS and hogwash.

Even today, if they can get their hands on Block 60+ I'd say go for it. Restrictions and all.

If only it were that easy. How many millions of line of code does an F-16 have, Sir, and in how many different systems that interact with each other?

You obviously have no knowledge of reverse engineering.

 

[VCheng]

You obviously have no knowledge of reverse engineering.

And you obviously are underestimating the safeguards built into the entire system.

 

[CriticalThought]

And you obviously are underestimating the safeguards built into the entire system.

You obviously don't know what tools hackers can wield.

 

[VCheng]

You obviously don't know what tools hackers can wield.

Is that why Pakistani F-16s cannot fly a mission with the DTCs containing valid encryption keys provided by a US representative?

 

[CriticalThought]

Is that why Pakistani F-16s cannot fly a mission with the DTCs containing valid encryption keys?

It's because PAF doesn't want to.

 

[VCheng]

It's because PAF doesn't want to.

Of course. How law-abidingly nice of them.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

which direct us back to basic question, why did PAF opted for new f-16s back in 2006-07 if f-16 was having so many restrictions, there should have been a better negotiated deal with more freedom back in 2007

The official explanation is that "relations were good" when they finalized the Peace Drive contract in 2006. These supply-side problems really began after the OBL raid, around the time Obama made the Pivot to Asia move, which resulted in strengthening India and basically relegating defence assistance to Pakistan to COIN only.

The PAF also didn't foresee a long five-year PPP government (in 06), which dried procurement resources. So even the FC-20, which was intended to be the F-16 alternate, had to be dropped.

All that said, the PAF leadership seems to agree that an interim 4+ gen fighter is necessary, and that the "leading options" are in China and Russia. Let's see... J-10B/C, Su-35, Su-30SME and MiG-35?

 

[CriticalThought]

The official explanation is that "relations were good" when they finalized the Peace Drive contract in 2006. These supply-side problems really began after the OBL raid, around the time Obama made the Pivot to Asia move, which resulted in strengthening India and basically relegating defence assistance to Pakistan to COIN only.

The PAF also didn't foresee a long five-year PPP government (in 06), which dried procurement resources. So even the FC-20, which was intended to be the F-16 alternate, had to be dropped.

All that said, the PAF leadership seems to agree that an interim 4+ gen fighter is necessary, and that the "leading options" are in China and Russia. Let's see... J-10B/C, Su-35, Su-30SME and MiG-35?

@Zarvan bookmark this post and if anyone gives you grief in the future, just post a link to it

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

@Zarvan bookmark this post and if anyone gives you grief in the future, just post a link to it

The 'Zarvan effect' (upon new rifles, new SPH, T129s, MILGEM, new tank, etc)

 

[MastanKhan]

The official explanation is that "relations were good" when they finalized the Peace Drive contract in 2006. These supply-side problems really began after the OBL raid, around the time Obama made the Pivot to Asia move, which resulted in strengthening India and basically relegating defence assistance to Pakistan to COIN only.

The PAF also didn't foresee a long five-year PPP government (in 06), which dried procurement resources. So even the FC-20, which was intended to be the F-16 alternate, had to be dropped.

All that said, the PAF leadership seems to agree that an interim 4+ gen fighter is necessary, and that the "leading options" are in China and Russia. Let's see... J-10B/C, Su-35, Su-30SME and MiG-35?

Hi Bilal,

Thank you for your post---what you are writing is just the tip of the imcompetence---.

The Paf is a totally incompetent organization when it comes to procure the right aircraft for the defense of the nation---.

Its role should be left just to plan for war and be ready to support and fight---procurement should be taken away from it---.

I guarantee---whatever aircraft is shoved down their throats they will fly it good---.

The mentality of the Paf generals is like a kid in a candy shop with a quarter in his hands and cannot decide what candy to buy---.

If only it were that easy. How many millions of line of code does an F-16 have, Sir, and in how many different systems that interact with each other?

Syed,

That guy is a pro---. Paf cannot do it---because it does not have a fall back plan.

When the idiots in the blue uniform openly state that the F16 is the best and the J10 is not that good---in layman terms you are handing out your ballz to the other party and telling them---you can squeeze them anytime that you want to.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

Hi Bilal,

Thank you for your post---what you are writing is just the tipped of the imcompetence---.

The Paf is a totally incompetent organization when it comes to procure the right aircraft for the defense of the nation---.

Its role should be left just to plan for war and be ready to support and fight---procurement should be taken away from it---.

I guarantee---whatever aircraft is shoved down their throats they will fly it good---.

The mentality of the Paf generals is like a kid in a candy shop with a quarter in his hands and cannot decide what candy to buy---.



Syed,

That guy is a pro---. Paf cannot do it---because it does not have a fall back plan.

When the idiots in the blue uniform openly state that the F16 is the best and the J10 is not that good---in layman terms you are handing out your ballz to the other party and telling them---you can squeeze them anytime that you want to.

Generally speaking, decisions as to whom Pakistan has (or will have) "good relations" with should be left to the government. However, the situation in Pakistan is such that GHQ, AHQ and NHQ are quasi-foreign affairs offices and have taken upon themselves to make decisions that should be left to the Prime Minister or Foreign Minister. I mean, USAF is pretty friendly with the PAF, but I don't think the White House or DoD give a hoot about what USAF thinks.

 

[Zarvan]

Deals will take place soon the crap political situation resulted in delay

 

[ziaulislam]

The official explanation is that "relations were good" when they finalized the Peace Drive contract in 2006. These supply-side problems really began after the OBL raid, around the time Obama made the Pivot to Asia move, which resulted in strengthening India and basically relegating defence assistance to Pakistan to COIN only.

The PAF also didn't foresee a long five-year PPP government (in 06), which dried procurement resources. So even the FC-20, which was intended to be the F-16 alternate, had to be dropped.

All that said, the PAF leadership seems to agree that an interim 4+ gen fighter is necessary, and that the "leading options" are in China and Russia. Let's see... J-10B/C, Su-35, Su-30SME and MiG-35?

what i am saying is not purely the supply issue but the customization options
the french gave PAF complete independence in procurement its own weapon systems on mirage 5 Rose but this was not the case for F 16s. even today all the weapons including GPS kits are from outside, limiting use for strike missions. PAF should have forseen this and probably not opted for spending 2+ billion dollars 18 new instead went for just upgrading the older ones may be