Pakistan Denies Operation in N. Waziristan

[singhvivek73]

now i wonder what Indians want ?? if we dont carry operation in NWA then bharatis aka Indians come crying with their propaganda that Pakistan is playing and now when we have decided to carry out operation in North Waziristan, the same Indians are again at it coming up with air strikes on own people like emotional blackmail.



anyway FYI India is the only country in the world who had carried out air strikes against own citizens in Mezoram for the first time in the history.


so atleast you have no moral right to even speak about it

Jana - short memory eh..forgot air strikes, helicopter gunships at work in FATA, South wazirastan and Balochistan for so many years ! First country in the world..right?

 

[F86 Saber]

And I strongly disagree - this NWA operation is not necessary at this time and it will be a huge failure, in the sense that the Pakistan government will again let the people of the area down, because the Pakistan government will not be able to provide services and the whole rubbish will start all over and this time become a more focused rebellion.

The real problem is not in NWA, the real problem is how the Pakistani state is ambiguous about terrorism and terrorists, and this attitude carries over in the general population, in fact the entire political and social framework is built around a radical extremist narrative -- it is this that must be targeted by the Pakistani state - laws to deal with religious political activism, laws to define the limit thereof, laws that outline clearly what is the good and what is not -- we go into NWA for the US, do you think fo r a minute that the US will stand with us when we will have to go in there again, this to cure Pan-Pashtun-ism married with radical marxist thought??

Lets solve the problem where it really exists - in the NWA, the problem is the failure of the state to deliver services and this problem requires significant resources and will - neither avialbale in Islamabad nor Rawalpindi .

Sir, people who understand your logic also know (i believe including you) that the implementation of the proper solution of this problem is not possible at the moment. The political framework represents the general public, and the fact is that 70% of our general public cannot even write their names yet believe that they have enough knowledge of Islam to understand it. If only there was a way to change the mindset of 15 million people overnight.

 

[Pioneerfirst]

This operation can be a success or a failure,it depends upon US and NATO.When PAk Army usually operates the US and NATO vacate thne neighbouring posts on Afghan border to saves the lives of their own and Taliban enter Afghanistan or use afghan land to enter anyother area of PAkistan tribal region.NWA accomodates most of the afghanand arab terrorist so it is not against Pakistani people.Our enemies are hidding their so we are acting.

 

[F86 Saber]

What Jana means is that India was the first ever country to bomb it's own citizens and in case you are unaware of your history it happened in 1966....

People Seek Apology From Indian Govt For Aizawl Airstrikes | Sinlung

 

[muse]

Sir, people who understand your logic also know (i believe including you) that the implementation of the proper solution of this problem is not possible at the moment. The political framework represents the general public, and the fact is that 70% of our general public cannot even write their names yet believe that they have enough knowledge of Islam to understand it. If only there was a way to change the mindset of 15 million people overnight.

Your point would be valid were it not for the fact that it is not the illiterate but the so called educated who the grist for the Islamist religio-political parties mill -- the increasing infiltration of the armed forces by Islamists highlights this fact.

 

[macnurv]

Well its about time, BUT are we ready for such an endeavor? I dont think that the public opinion is uniform about such an operation. Most of the Pakistani's are still confused about Good Taliban & Bad Taliban. There is only type and that is the evil type. Make no mistake if Pakistani's think these people will just roll up their bags and move back to Afghanistan. They are addicted to power and will do any thing to cling on to it. The GOP must develop a consensus among the populace and then launch a full scale operation. We are at war but it does not seem we realize that. The behavior of both political and civil leadership is aloof, putting it mildly. Until and unless the whole nation gets onboard do not expect any miracles.
The TTP terrorists will strike back with more ferocity, causing more havoc. No one should have any delusions about that. A joint strategy along with American troops should be employed, if the fleeing terrorists are allowed to just run on the other side of the border, that will do more harm then good for Pakistan. Americans & NATO must engage the ones fleeing thus not providing and safe exit to them. If not then Pakistan should stay clear of any such ventures until a broader consensus is reached among the people of Pakistan.

 

[Developereo]

Three thoughts off the top of my head:

- the seminal event here was not Abbotabad per se but PNS Mehran. I suspect the investigations have revealed something very disturbing.
- while the military offensive is absolutely overdue, we should keep in mind that there is no military solution to this problem. We can't kill the entire network there; some negotiations will have to take place eventually.
- It is absolutely essential to beef up law enforcement nationwide in anticipation of the expected retaliation. Failure to do so is a criminal oversight -- our civilians will pay the price once again for this government's incompetence.

 

[Oldman1]

Well its about time, BUT are we ready for such an endeavor? I dont think that the public opinion is uniform about such an operation. Most of the Pakistani's are still confused about Good Taliban & Bad Taliban. There is only type and that is the evil type. Make no mistake if Pakistani's think these people will just roll up their bags and move back to Afghanistan. They are addicted to power and will do any thing to cling on to it. The GOP must develop a consensus among the populace and then launch a full scale operation. We are at war but it does not seem we realize that. The behavior of both political and civil leadership is aloof, putting it mildly. Until and unless the whole nation gets onboard do not expect any miracles.
The TTP terrorists will strike back with more ferocity, causing more havoc. No one should have any delusions about that. A joint strategy along with American troops should be employed, if the feeling terrorists are allowed to just run on the other side of the border, that will do more harm then good for Pakistan. Americans & NATO must engage the ones fleeing thus not providing and safe exit to them. If not then Pakistan should stay clear of any such ventures until a broader consensus is reached among the people of Pakistan.

That depends on what the Pakistani military will do. If they are really serious and willing to coordinate with ISAF then the terrorists can be sandwiched. No guarantees. Its hard to cover the whole entire border. Not to mention all they have to do is ditch their weapons and flee looking like refugees.

 

[Ajaxpaul]

To go for offensive or not is in the hands of GoP. There can be an endless debate whether it will yield results or not. But looking at the current situation in pakistan GoP is in pressure to act. It cannot look away as thousands of people are dieing. GoP cannot wait for the day people start revolting against them due to inaction and apathy.

There is going to be massive collateral damage in this operation. GOP should approach with a carrot and stick policy. Use local media extensively towards educating people why there should be a cleanup. Use strikes in short bursts so the effect can be analysed and if needed, offensive measures must evolve according to situation. Eventually non state actors should be kept on their toes and not be allowed to plan.

Keep the security tight in other areas and hunt down the escaping terrorists.

 

[macnurv]

Three thoughts off the top of my head:

- the seminal event here was not Abbotabad per se but PNS Mehran. I suspect the investigations have revealed something very disturbing.
- while the military offensive is absolutely overdue, we should keep in mind that there is no military solution to this problem. We can't kill the entire network there; some negotiations will have to take place eventually.
- It is absolutely essential to beef up law enforcement nationwide in anticipation of the expected retaliation. Failure to do so is a criminal oversight -- our civilians will pay the price once again for this government's incompetence.

This could be possible or a mere speculation, we will never know. What could be bigger sign of incompetency then lack of a "Counter Terrorism Strategy", which we have been unable to develop over the last 8 years. Its about time the GOP along with Army and other instituions develops one. Every possible intelligence agency is present right now in NWA, yet I read here some members claiming we have a better network then the Americans. I would not be surprised if the strings of PNS Mehran attack were pulled from NWA. Pakistan must develop a comprehensive plan, where the government takes every on board and then throw full support at Armys Back. Its a huge gamble other wise. Intelligence will be the key to this whole operation and beyond.

 

[foxbat]

This could be possible or a mere speculation, we will never know. What could be bigger sign of incompetency then lack of a "Counter Terrorism Strategy", which we have been able to develop over the last 8 years. Its about time the GOP along with Army and other instituions develops one. Every possible intelligence agency is present right now in NWA, yet I read here some members claiming we have a better network then the Americans. I would not be surprised if the strings of PNS Mehran attack were pulled from NWA. Pakistan must develop a comprehensive plan, where the government takes every on board and then throw full support at Armys Back. Its a huge gamble other wise. Intelligence will be the key to this whole operation and beyond.

Very true.. These decisions like ops in NWA are not taken overnight. This was probably in disucssion since 2nd May after Osama was tagged. AT would have known and would have done Karachi as a warning..The Modus operandi was so similar to these attacks in Afghanistan

 

[macnurv]

That depends on what the Pakistani military will do. If they are really serious and willing to coordinate with ISAF then the terrorists can be sandwiched. No guarantees. Its hard to cover the whole entire border. Not to mention all they have to do is ditch their weapons and flee looking like refugees.

Actually its not that simple. GOP and Army have made People of Pakistan more Anti-American then they should be. Many here will see this actually as fighting with the invaders in murdering freedom fighters (which we actually are since we became a part of WOT). Again the people are confused, and we can all thank the duel policy of Pakistani politicians and generals they say one thing in private and a completely another in public. They have created so much resentment among the people even if now they want it to dilute they can not do any thing.
BUT during SWA operation the NATO and Americans cleared most of the checkposts along the border region thus enabling terrorists to move to Afghanistan, so only if this time they man their posts. We have lost well over 35,000 people to this war, one can not get any more serious then that.

 

[Developereo]

What could be bigger sign of incompetency then lack of a "Counter Terrorism Strategy", which we have been able to develop over the last 8 years.

That's exactly right.

Look at the way the West in general, and America in particular, got their act together to fight terrorism. The religious militias in the US make the Taliban look like boy scouts, but they don't dare commit terrorism because they know the consequences.

 

[macnurv]

That's exactly right.

Look at the way the West in general, and America in particular, got their act together to fight terrorism. The religious militias in the US make the Taliban look like boy scouts, but they don't dare commit terrorism because they know the consequences.

Not all the Militias in America have religious doctrine or consists of Religious Zealots. They call themselves Patriots besides that militas have played a vital role in American War of Independence. So comparing them with Taliban is a bit unfair I think.

 

[Developereo]

Not all the Militias in America have religious doctrine or consists of Religious Zealots. They call themselves Patriots besides that militas have played a vital role in American War of Independence. So comparing them with Taliban is a bit unfair I think.

The war of independence was over 200 years ago. I was referring specifically to the religious nutjobs and, yes, they are in the same league as the Taliban: David Koresh and the Branch Davidians, Timothy McVeigh, the Unabomber, etc..