Pakistan can no longer sustain cost of war, says expert

[arbit]

Afterthought

DroneMailini.

Pakistan needs to start thinking like a nation state. We are a small economy and do not have the capacity to project power even on a regional level. First and last thing that should matter for Pakistan now is economy. Economy > F.relations. Everyone salutes the rising sun.

Glad someone understands its importance more than anything.

Pakistan needs to allow India to take over Afghanistan and become its best friend, regardless of how damaging it might be to us. In a situation where we get attacked from both sides at the same time, we have what matters. We can turn both "friends" into a radio active waste land. Worst we expect from an Indian stooge Afghanistan would be logistical, intelligence, training and financial support to terrorist groups in Pakistan. Therefore we need to bolster our security and get used to with watching the west. Which in return will result in favor being returned to India with a reasonable % of interest.

Do you realize your precious Pakistan would cease to exist if such a situation arises. You will end up achieving exactly what you set out to prevent.

If, India sees its benefit in doing that, then we would be happy to play the same theory from Kashmir to Asaam, to Manipur and 20 other insurgent groups who see India as an enemy. Hopefully it will give food for thought to Indian policy makers [Speak of proxy war.]

You are saying that if we withdraw from Baluchistan/Afghanistan then you would stop with this proxy war on us. Inspite of what your think tanks like Zaid hamid keep harping on Kashmir.
Yeah I thought so.

In, the end India will use Afghanistan as a condom against Pakistan for and until it seems necessary, it will provide billions in FDI, pay to train its non Pashtun Army [indoctrinating them to be Anti Pakistan] even when its own population starves, to fulfill its obsession. Leaving Afghanistan where it was 30 years ago and only then they will realize their REAL spot and interests.

Surprised this statement came from you. what ever extra expenditure we incur on such activates, rest assured, wont come from cutting on social programs. For this we have folks who pay tax, deductions can also be made elsewhere. Our economy s growing. But then perhaps you already know this. your statement shows frustration of a guy who hopes things would turn out this way.

 

[Mav3rick]

Can you share what difference do you see between them.

It's quite simple really.....Talibaan fight for the freedom of Afghanistan from illegal occupation of the west whereas TTP carries out acts of terrorism in Pakistan. 1 is a terrorist organization (TTP) that has been denounced by the freedom fighters (Talibaan).

 

[Mav3rick]

Fair enough. Lets break your to do list into two parts. First relates to your own country. Like sealing borders and shooting anybody that comes through along with revoking passports. Good idea. I in fact concur with your plan of action. Just one question. Whats stopping ya?

Afghanistan!

Please don't ask me to wait till 2014 when US withdraws. If you want a perfect time to do everything then you might as well wait till eternity.

The US forces are going to retreat from the small area that they currently hold, after their departure things would change.....we will not have to intervene for any positive outcome in Kabul. If you did not know that then you are in terms with reality.

Secondly about threats.
I touched upon it partially in my opening post. In a curious case, what you are threatening to do you have already done before. That too When you were stronger. when your economy could perhaps take it. When a superpower was your fast friend. All that has changed. This WOT has taken a pretty heavy toll on you not only in terms of present state economy but future prospects as well.

This is probably the first time that an Indian as actually accepted that the so called terror war has cost Pakistan dearly. But while we were friends of 1 super power, you were not only friends and allies but also the immediate neighbour of the other super power, the scenario of support was entirely in your favour so what could do to us? And with our ally comes its strings and conditions. However, everything will be taken care of in due time, that you can rest assured.

On the other hand we have more capability to deal with any thing you throw at us.

How do you plan to surprise or overwhelm us enough to cause irreparable harm? that's my question.

You are like the child who runs around in the neighbourhood boasting of things that his father may or may not get him. We, on the other hand, acquire quietly and keep many of our secrets actual 'secrets'!

 

[fatman17]

Fair enough. Lets break your to do list into two parts. First relates to your own country. Like sealing borders and shooting anybody that comes through along with revoking passports. Good idea. I in fact concur with your plan of action. Just one question. Whats stopping ya?

ya! the US ya! musharraf planned to fence and mine the border ya! US stopped him ya!

 

[Fracker]

Looks like TTP are rich, or atleast their sponsers are rich as compare to Pakistan

 

[VCheng]

Fair enough. Lets break your to do list into two parts. First relates to your own country. Like sealing borders and shooting anybody that comes through along with revoking passports. Good idea. I in fact concur with your plan of action. Just one question. Whats stopping ya?

ya! the US ya! musharraf planned to fence and mine the border ya! US stopped him ya!

Correction: Musharraf wanted USA to pay for all of what he proposed, to which USA did not agree. What stopped Musharraf were the empty pockets of the State, and this is what is true still.

 

[Fracker]

Self Delete

 

[arbit]

Afghanistan!

your think-tank thinks US. Make up your mind. Btw Afghanistan isn't stopping you. Reasons lie elsewhere.

The US forces are going to retreat from the small area that they currently hold, after their departure things would change.....we will not have to intervene for any positive outcome in Kabul. If you did not know that then you are in terms with reality.

My friend YOU think that. US is withdrawing militarily not abandoning it. As long as US interests exists in that region you will be tied down. Also you are dependent on US to some extent for financial assistance and military support. what are you gonna do about that?

one notable exception worth mentioning is the closure of supply lines that you did after massacre of your soldiers.. if you can do that again then we are talking. But that was a one off thing.

This is probably the first time that an Indian as actually accepted that the so called terror war has cost Pakistan dearly. But while we were friends of 1 super power, you were not only friends and allies but also the immediate neighbour of the other super power, the scenario of support was entirely in your favour so what could do to us? And with our ally comes its strings and conditions. However, everything will be taken care of in due time, that you can rest assured.



You are like the child who runs around in the neighbourhood boasting of things that his father may or may not get him. We, on the other hand, acquire quietly and keep many of our secrets actual 'secrets'!

yeah your secrets. Have heard this way too often. you guys act like a bird which flaps its wings to appear more threatening than it really is. Go live in Narnia dude you don't belong here.

ya! the US ya! musharraf planned to fence and mine the border ya! US stopped him ya!

Sir you come from the land of Ticker why take umbrage over a little word play. However you went all out on that one I give you this. lol

and as for the real reason please read below.

Correction: Musharraf wanted USA to pay for all of what he proposed, to which USA did not agree. What stopped Musharraf were the empty pockets of the State, and this is what is true still.

 

[junaid1]

Looks like TTP are rich, or atleast their sponsers are rich as compare to Pakistan

Probably some of our neighbors are paying them more then $100/month each men .You know what i mean

 

[Fracker]

Probably some of our neighbors are paying them more then $100/month each men .You know what i mean

Not only that but also night vision automatic weapons, snipers, fully modern riffles, and also training to operate such weapons.

 

[Tshering22]

Not only that but also night vision automatic weapons, snipers, fully modern riffles, and also training to operate such weapons.

Well now that you know, you also should know the objective behind it.

 

[Mav3rick]

Correction: Musharraf wanted USA to pay for all of what he proposed, to which USA did not agree. What stopped Musharraf were the empty pockets of the State, and this is what is true still.

Correction: Both sides of the border were supposed to be mined, Pakistan is responsible only for its side of the border and we even mined and installed barbed fence over 35km's of the border. US backed off the project leaving us hanging again and then Afghanistan brought up the issue of the Durand line not being the international border!

 

[Mav3rick]

your think-tank thinks US. Make up your mind. Btw Afghanistan isn't stopping you. Reasons lie elsewhere.

It is Afghanistan and ofcourse Afghanistan cannot move an inch without US Authorization......A simple google on Pakistani plans to mine Afghan border would give you all the information that you need.

My friend YOU think that. US is withdrawing militarily not abandoning it. As long as US interests exists in that region you will be tied down. Also you are dependent on US to some extent for financial assistance and military support. what are you gonna do about that?

one notable exception worth mentioning is the closure of supply lines that you did after massacre of your soldiers.. if you can do that again then we are talking. But that was a one off thing.

The US may not be abandoning Afghanistan like it did last time, but it is still 'retreating' and that's the blunt version. Tired and exhausted after 8-10 years of war, the US wants to 'negotiate' with the Talibaan and hell bent on bringing Mullah Omer to the table. They have tried every coercion tactic in the book and some outside it to force Pakistan to in turn force Mullah Omer to negotiations.

Negotiations are on going, you will find out when they reach a conclusion but the outcome is what you have feared for a long long time now......Afghanistan will fall back to Talibaan, if you are good at indications then read up on the comments of the Afghan Election Commission on Talibaan taking part in the upcoming elections!

yeah your secrets. Have heard this way too often. you guys act like a bird which flaps its wings to appear more threatening than it really is. Go live in Narnia dude you don't belong here.

Yours is a typical Indian fall-back when an actual response is not available. You don't have to post here but I know that we all know how Pakistan proceeds on National Secrets and how India proceeds

 

[arbit]

It is Afghanistan and ofcourse Afghanistan cannot move an inch without US Authorization......A simple google on Pakistani plans to mine Afghan border would give you all the information that you need.

So you are implying that after US moves out 'militarily' Afghanistan will be free to take unhindered political decisions! and you will achieve utopia!
Afghanistan govt is American proxy now. the only way that will change is if the govt. falls and Taliban takes over.. but then again you are screwed.

The US may not be abandoning Afghanistan like it did last time, but it is still 'retreating' and that's the blunt version. Tired and exhausted after 8-10 years of war, the US wants to 'negotiate' with the Talibaan and hell bent on bringing Mullah Omer to the table. They have tried every coercion tactic in the book and some outside it to force Pakistan to in turn force Mullah Omer to negotiations.

Negotiations are on going, you will find out when they reach a conclusion but the outcome is what you have feared for a long long time now......Afghanistan will fall back to Talibaan, if you are good at indications then read up on the comments of the Afghan Election Commission on Talibaan taking part in the upcoming elections!

Of course that is a possibility. But if you think that Taliban taking over will work out well for you then LOL. A stable neutral nation is a better bet than a bunch of fickle armed lunatics. Your entire energy will be spent managing various factions rather than dealing with a single entity which your foreign ministry or ISI can well handle. But then its just me who thinks that.

Yours is a typical Indian fall-back when an actual response is not available. You don't have to post here but I know that we all know how Pakistan proceeds on National Secrets and how India proceeds

Ours run on collective decision making while your country runs on whims and fancies of a few individuals. Some differences are obvious but you are overplaying your 'secrets'. In these times and age not much remains secret. Those days are long gone.

By the way Happy Diwali to friends and foes alike

 

[Mav3rick]

So you are implying that after US moves out 'militarily' Afghanistan will be free to take unhindered political decisions! and you will achieve utopia!
Afghanistan govt is American proxy now. the only way that will change is if the govt. falls and Taliban takes over.. but then again you are screwed.

First of all let me tell you that it will be a win-win situation for Afghanistan and Pakistan when Talibaan take over. And this is what the US is so derperate about, they know they would not be able to protect their puppet regime in Afghanistan post departure and now want to deal with the Talibaan.......a group which the US says is not their enemy!

Of course that is a possibility. But if you think that Taliban taking over will work out well for you then LOL. A stable neutral nation is a better bet than a bunch of fickle armed lunatics. Your entire energy will be spent managing various factions rather than dealing with a single entity which your foreign ministry or ISI can well handle. But then its just me who thinks that.

What you consider lunatics are freedom fighters and heroes of Afghan-Soviet war! And all entities under Talibaan answer to their supreme leader Mullah Muhammad Omer, including the ever powerful Haqqani network. And it's not about us being able to control them but rather our satisfaction as long as they can control Afghanistan and prevent **** from Afghanistan spilling into Pakistan all the time.

Ours run on collective decision making while your country runs on whims and fancies of a few individuals. Some differences are obvious but you are overplaying your 'secrets'. In these times and age not much remains secret. Those days are long gone.

By the way Happy Diwali to friends and foes alike

Happy Diwali to you you too and let call it a day as further argument will force us to run in circles