Pak Army ready to launch targeted operation in NWA

[VCheng]

It will be a targeted operation against the elements who are attacking the PA troops, as such attacks have increased in recent months and lots of casualties suffered. And i believe local help from the so called good guys would be used to make such targeted operations successful.

We can't take on the whole of NWA, we don't have the resources nor the capability to do such a feat. its a huge task and a very very big backlash would be expected. Such an operation in the short run will cost us hundreds of lives and in the long run, meaning in 1 year to 2 year time period, thousands of soldiers dead. You have no idea how these guys fight and they are very very effective and efficient fighters and our guys will be in a very bad position against them. Plus, you need atleast 100K troops minimum to take on everyone in NWA.

So, this is going to be an operation against the militants who have run from SW, Orakzai & Kurram Agencies and taking refuge there.

So the operation will be according to what I said above already:

Clearly they are playing for time to reduce the US pressure. The chances are that a limited operation will be launched to claim that they are doing "all they can" so the heat is turned down a little which, of late, is getting to be more than a bit uncomfortable to take. Smart strategy, if it works.

 

[TaimiKhan]

I note it has taken five years for the PA to prepare even limited operations in NWA: link Doesn't that sound like foot-dragging to you, TaimiKhan?

Solomon, before you comment on your military operations, why don't you first see how the operations have fared on the Afghanistan side. Huge deployments, thousands of soldiers deployed in operations and what would be the result. These militants have their homes, villages. Its their turf, its their homeland. They won't tolerate an outsider, especially who comes to kill them. Why don't you guys understand tribal traditions and culture of these people. for you guys its easy to say that we should go in with all our guns blazing, but these are our own people and we can't do that. It makes people hate the military. take example of Swat, one of the largest internal displacement happened in the history of Pakistan, then we were able to dislodge those fighters, same case with SW, 400-500K people displaced to this day, and now if take out the population of NW, where are we gonna put them ??

So, kindly understand the limitations we have. Its not just about culture and tribal traditions we have to take into care, its their homeland which we are talking about. They are our own people. Its a huge area, you need hundreds of thousands of troops and then again thousands of them to keep the area clean, its been 3 years since Swat was cleared, we have nearly the same number of troops so far.

Its a huge huge task, which requires lot of money, resources and thousands of lives, which we are not ready to give. We can't sustain such huge looses.

Ask you military commanders in iraq and afghanistan, they will tell you how difficult it is to fight in such an environment where the villages are the homes of these militants. You guys have not been able to take ground from the Taliban, how can you expect us, low tech army to take on their own people who know this land, who have grown on this land and know it by heart.

Its not foot-dragging, its not having the will to do so.

 

[TaimiKhan]

So the operation will be according to what I said above already:

Nops, it not to please the US, rather it is for the objective of PA itself, since the groups which had taken refuge from other tribal areas in SW have in recent months become powerful enough to start attacking PA in broad daylight, and it may be causing some trouble for the local fighters also, thus the operation would be to target the groups which are attacking PA and they have nothing to do with US, in other words TTP guys which attack only PA and not US.

 

[RazPaK]

Most people have no idea how the TTP fights. They spend months on end constructing bunkers and underground tunnels from which they fire from small slits. Basically they hide in cracks and crevices. Although air support is very important, in the end it's going to come to boots on the ground clearing area to area. This is something the Americans have yet to understand.

 

[Solomon2]

Why don't you guys understand tribal traditions and culture of these people. for you guys its easy to say that we should go in with all our guns blazing, but these are our own people and we can't do that.

It was Rafi, not I, who suggested a comprehensive "hammer and anvil" operation.

...they will tell you how difficult it is to fight in such an environment where the villages are the homes of these militants. ...how can you expect us, low tech army to take on their own people who know this land, who have grown on this land and know it by heart. Its not foot-dragging, its not having the will to do so.

So the PA is "weak-willed"? If the enemy was Indian the will would be there, right?

These are value choices, TaimiKhan. This is an admission that Pakistani ethics are too weak to take on terrorists in its midst. To establish the will you'll have to change that by re-arranging your hierarchy of values, adding new ones if necessary.

...Although air support is very important, in the end it's going to come to boots on the ground clearing area to area. This is something the Americans have yet to understand.

It's the PA, not the Americans, who keep demanding more attack helicopters rather than boots on the ground.

 

[zip]

Thats a good decision ..silence all the terrorists once for all .. No threat of bombs, no barbaric killings , no demand for secession...life will be easy for you people and for world ..
I hope india can help you people in this important task with some monetary means ..

 

[VCheng]

............... thus the operation would be to target the groups which are attacking PA and they have nothing to do with US, in other words TTP guys which attack only PA and not US.

How will the PA tell them apart, and if they can, does this not show that the state-supported distinction between "good" and "bad" Taleban continues? If so, that does not bode well.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

whatever it is, we must make sure we keep the locals on our side...that's how we win

we must learn from NATOs monumental blunders

I note it has taken five years for the PA to prepare even limited operations in NWA: link Doesn't that sound like foot-dragging to you, TaimiKhan?

says the Cohen who doesn't even know anything about COIN or how it is to be handled....

as i already told you quite clearly (i believe it was yesterday)

we will go about it how we see fit, whenever and wherever. It's been helpful to study NATOs failures to secure even Kabul.

 

[RazPaK]

whatever it is, we must make sure we keep the locals on our side...that's how we win

we must learn from NATOs monumental blunders



says the Cohen who doesn't even know anything about COIN or how it is to be handled....

as i already told you quite clearly (i believe it was yesterday)

we will go about it how we see fit, whenever and wherever. It's been helpful to study NATOs failures to secure even Kabul.

HAHAHA. Burn.

 

[laiqs@mi]

How will the PA tell them apart, and if they can, does this not show that the state-supported distinction between "good" and "bad" Taleban continues? If so, that does not bode well.

ok leave good and bad talban aside. we have amreki and raw supported talban and freedom fighters in afghanistan. it sounds better.

 

[Areesh]

It will be a targeted operation against the elements who are attacking the PA troops, as such attacks have increased in recent months and lots of casualties suffered. And i believe local help from the so called good guys would be used to make such targeted operations successful.

We can't take on the whole of NWA, we don't have the resources nor the capability to do such a feat. its a huge task and a very very big backlash would be expected. Such an operation in the short run will cost us hundreds of lives and in the long run, meaning in 1 year to 2 year time period, thousands of soldiers dead. You have no idea how these guys fight and they are very very effective and efficient fighters and our guys will be in a very bad position against them. Plus, you need atleast 100K troops minimum to take on everyone in NWA.

So, this is going to be an operation against the militants who have run from SW, Orakzai & Kurram Agencies and taking refuge there.

First of all we can't afford an operation in NW so it is better if they cancel it and if they are indeed conducting an operation in NW then it should be limited and targeted as you said.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

First of all we can't afford an operation in NW so it is better if they cancel it and if they are indeed conducting an operation in NW then it should be limited and targeted as you said.

almost every COIN op conducted since 2008 has been ''targetted''

unlike NATOs, we don't exactly just go in with guns blazing; we don't do night raids and humiliate families and pull them out from their homes

 

[razgriz19]

Hi,

The geography of North Waziristan is a night mare for any 'cleaning' offensive. The enemy is small, mobile and highly adapted to the region. Pakistan army cannot move in with Tanks and heavy armor.

PAF can be used, the JF-17s from Peshawar, but you can only use LGBs and rockets when you know where the enemy is. That's hard, as we don't have spy satellites. So either we have to get intelligence on the 'targets' from ground based human assets (which we may or may not be able to trust), or by flying Reconnaissance flights over the area, like using FLIR equipped Mirages. That takes time, money (jet fuel) and alerts the enemy of an incoming aircraft.

Tough spot. We can spend 100 years doing a 'targeted operation' in North Waziristan and it will still be back to square one. We kill them, they kill our troops, they run away, they re group across the border and keep thriving.

What we need is, cut off all routes in and out of North Waziristan and go all in. Heavy bombing. Carpet bombing.

thats why we badly need some UCAVs, they can patrol the area 24/7 with less expense.