Pak acts tough: seeks 38demands, India-like civil nukedeal

[OrionHunter]

1. An end to CIA-operated drone strikes.

A tricky issue as these strikes have helped diminish the Al Qaeda and their affiliates to a considerable degree. In other words, drone strikes would continue.

2. A civil nuclear deal similar to the Indo-US agreement besides 38 other demands.

Difficult if not impossible seeing that the majority of U.S. congressmen see Pakistan as an insecure state which cannot be trusted with fissile material. However, I feel that Pakistan has enough Plutonium to build 200 plus nukes which is an adequate deterrent. So they probably wouldn’t require more. What they need is nuclear energy for power generation. And they need lots of it. Provision of fissile material and building nuclear reactors for power generation should be par for the course provided these reactors come under IAEA safeguards. But would Pakistan allow IAEA inspectors to be prowling around their reactors?

3. No hot pursuit or boots on Pakistani territory and the activity of foreign private security contractors must be transparent and subject to Pakistani law.

The moot question is, why is Pakistan allowing these private contractors to operate on its soil? Why is Pakistan allowing hundreds of CIA sleuths to operate with impunity in Pakistan? On the one hand the government allows them to do so (WOT and so on) and on the other they are demanding operational transparency which is impractical. The CIA’s dirty tricks department will always operate according to SOPs related to their cloak and dagger operations. They will and can never be subject to Pakistani law. Period!

4. Taxes and other charges must be levied on all goods importing in or transiting through Pakistan which experts have estimated could amount to $1 million a day.

Isn’t NATO/U.S. already paying taxes/duties/levies to Pakistan for such transition of Goods/military hardware through Pakistan? The CIS Republics of the NDN are being paid $500 million annually. I wonder how much Pakistan is being paid for the favour? In any case, Pakistan has agreed to re-open routes that allows U.S. and NATO forces to transport goods and military material into and out of Afghanistan. The decision was taken on 14th Mar by after a high-level meeting among Pakistani officials in Islamabad, attended by Pakistan President Asif Zardari, Prime Minister Yousef Raza Gilani, Army Chief General Ashfaq Parvez Kayani, and Foreign Minister Hina Ribbani Khar.

Cheers!

 

[lem34]

dont forget we have handled pakistan well in past (u can ask bangladeshis here )..dont allow me to go offtopic troll..

China handled you well and assisted us with nukes. Back to topic Indians just cant handle the fact Pakistan has backbone and is standing up to white man

 

[rajnikant]

1. An end to CIA-operated drone strikes.

A tricky issue as these strikes have helped diminish the Al Qaeda and their affiliates to a considerable degree. In other words, drone strikes would continue.

2. A civil nuclear deal similar to the Indo-US agreement besides 38 other demands.

Difficult if not impossible seeing that the majority of U.S. congressmen see Pakistan as an insecure state which cannot be trusted with fissile material. However, I feel that Pakistan has enough Plutonium to build 200 plus nukes which is an adequate deterrent. So they probably wouldn’t require more. What they need is nuclear energy for power generation. And they need lots of it. Provision of fissile material and building nuclear reactors for power generation should be par for the course provided these reactors come under IAEA safeguards. But would Pakistan allow IAEA inspectors to be prowling around their reactors?

3. No hot pursuit or boots on Pakistani territory and the activity of foreign private security contractors must be transparent and subject to Pakistani law.

The moot question is, why is Pakistan allowing these private contractors to operate on its soil? Why is Pakistan allowing hundreds of CIA sleuths to operate with impunity in Pakistan? On the one hand the government allows them to do so (WOT and so on) and on the other they are demanding operational transparency which is impractical. The CIA’s dirty tricks department will always operate according to SOPs related to their cloak and dagger operations. They will and can never be subject to Pakistani law. Period!

4. Taxes and other charges must be levied on all goods importing in or transiting through Pakistan which experts have estimated could amount to $1 million a day.

Isn’t NATO/U.S. already paying taxes/duties/levies to Pakistan for such transition of Goods/military hardware through Pakistan? The CIS Republics of the NDN are being paid $500 million annually. I wonder how much Pakistan is being paid for the favour? In any case, Pakistan has agreed to re-open routes that allows U.S. and NATO forces to transport goods and military material into and out of Afghanistan. The decision was taken on 14th Mar by after a high-level meeting among Pakistani officials in Islamabad, attended by Pakistan President Asif Zardari, Prime Minister Yousef Raza Gilani, Army Chief General Ashfaq Parvez Kayani, and Foreign Minister Hina Ribbani Khar.

Cheers!

They could have avoided embarrassment by mentioning India in there 2 point it seems more like begging now..

 

[lem34]

China handled you well and assisted us with nukes. Back to topic Indians just cant handle the fact Pakistan has backbone and is standing up to white man

. Btw why are most Indians not watching cricket today and are absent from cricket thread??

 

[rajnikant]

China handled you well and assisted us with nukes. Back to topic Indians just cant handle the fact Pakistan has backbone and is standing up to white man

are u china..have u surrendered to china(partly its right..ur new master)..lol u guys are so insecure..

 

[lem34]

They could have avoided embarrassment by mentioning India in there 2 point it seems more like begging now..

What is it to you what we do with America anyway. Go to cricket thread. Oh India is not in final what a shame

 

[Nelson]

Pakistan should stand up against the whites rather than keep on demanding things from them. Its high time. They should stand on their own feat. Keep on demanding from whites won't take them anywhere.

 

[humanfirst]

Backto topic Indians just cant handle the fact Pakistan has backbone and is standing up to white man

Lol..begging for deal "like the one given to india"is not exactly standing up to the white man.And backbone?You should stop fighting white mans war before claiming backbone..Or atleast you should stop the drones from violating your sovereignity,which nations with backbone consider precious..

 

[VCheng]

Anybody know of a source to the complete list of 38 points?

 

[anonymus]

Yes you are in the commonwealth, lol

We are in UN also.lol

 

[AbhimanyuShrivastav]

Back to topic Indians just cant handle the fact Pakistan has backbone and is standing up to white man

Make that claim when either the drone attacks stop or you shoot down a drone which kills your civilians/strategic assets/military men with impunity.. Till then Pakistan is just a white man's _________

Back to topic Indians just cant handle the fact Pakistan has backbone and is standing up to white man

We already thrashed the Final Winner.. last time as well..

Pakistan should stand up against the whites rather than keep on demanding things from them. Its high time. They should stand on their own feat. Keep on demanding from whites won't take them anywhere.

I remember reading a great joke by VCheng about this situation ... Its a George Bernard Shaw Joke.. Cant repeat here else I will get banned.. Search it up.. fits the situation like a glove

 

[VCheng]

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I remember reading a great joke by VCheng about this situation ... Its a George Bernard Shaw Joke.. Cant repeat here else I will get banned.. Search it up.. fits the situation like a glove

That is actually quite a famous old joke.

 

[Tshering22]

I think Pakistani leaders are only degrading their own international position by asking for "India-like" treatment. By doing this, they put us onto a preferential pedestal while lowering themselves down. This only hurts their image while raises ours. It makes the West think all the more that how right they were in rewarding us and not you.

If Pakistani leaders do indeed have the intention, they'd have framed a policy by now without even mentioning our name.

 

[VCheng]

This story in the Tribune has a good critique of several asepcts of the parliamentary review:

Excerpts from: A report without substance – The Express Tribune

A report without substance
By Syed Talat Hussain
Published: March 22, 2012

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Far from being a document that could inspire healthy, forward-looking debate on important facets of the country’s diplomatic challenges, it is confusing to read and even more difficult to comprehend from the point of view of its eventual implementation. Let us have a look at its fatal flaws.

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Out of its 41 main points and sub-points, 31 are focused directly or indirectly on the US. The rest of the ‘general foreign policy’ has been covered literally in 135 words. This includes relations with Russia, China, India, the Islamic countries and Kashmir.

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Instead of proposing fundamental principles of engagement, the draft is a litany of desires and apprehensions. The bullet point wisdom of the parliamentarians does not address the fundamental question as to what sort of strategic centrality should Washington enjoy in Pakistan’s foreign policy. The details of how much the road-use tax on Nato containers should be is of no importance if more black and white issues are left untackled.

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However, if the goals clash fundamentally, the recommendations would take a different tone altogether. In that case, opening of road supply routes becomes a settled issue: Pakistan would not let the sinews of war pass through its territory if this cooperation ends up fuelling violence inside its own territory. Pakistan will not accept US aid. Cooperation in the war against terror would also end or will be gradually scaled back to point zero. The framework of assessing the quantum of harmony or conflict in Pakistan’s relations with the US should have been the core concern of the committee. Only after this assessment could policy guidelines be suggested. This element is totally missing from the document.

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We cannot expect the US to give us the kind of civil nuclear deal it has struck with India, if we also believe that Washington is conspiring to dismantle our nuclear arsenal. This thrust of thought should have been the prime focus of the document, which regrettably offers no clarity or guideline in this regard.

This poorly-conceived and lame review document has now furnished the basis of media and parliamentary debate in the country. The argument that this is just a ‘working draft’ and can be changed completely is disingenuous. The words spread on the sheets of the report are echoing everywhere: they are setting the tone and tenor of the discourse all around. It would require brave hearts and robust minds to inject substance and vision in this debate — something the parliamentary report should have done.

Published in The Express Tribune, March 23rd, 2012.

 

[VCheng]

Here is a story on PTI's take on the parliamentary review:

Excerpts from: PTI terms PCNS report as shameful attempt

PTI terms PCNS report as shameful attempt

Islamabad—”A shameful attempt to get parliamentary sanction for continuing in the debilitating and erroneous US ‘war on terror’ is how Dr Shireen Mazari, Central Vice President incharge Foreign and Security Policy, described the PCNS Report on revising Pak-US relations. In a press statement Wednesday, she criticised the PCNS Guidelines article by article. In Article 2, she points out, it is stated that “the US must review its footprints in Pakistan” which implies that an appeal is being made to the US. Instead, what should have been stated was that “Parliament must review the US footprint in Pakistan”.

In the same Article the appeal to the US continues by asking for a “cessation of drone attacks” which is seen as “counter productive, because loss of valuable lives and property, radicalize the local population, create support for terrorists and fuel anti-American sentiments.” Ironically, while drones do indeed have all this impact, but the most crucial factor legal for stopping them has been left out: that they are against international law and the violate the sovereignty of Pakistan.

Yet for the “unprovoked incident” of 25-26 Nov 2011in Mohmand Agency, this is the reasoning used for condemnation (Article 5). One really has to wonder why the PCNS was so reluctant to describe drones as counter to international law when international NGOs are filing lawsuits against governments like the UK on this very ground. According to Dr Mazari, the most absurd Article is Article 3 which suddenly declares that “Pakistan’s nuclear programme and assets including its safety and security cannot be compromised.”

Why do we need to make this point which should be a given to begin with, unless the government had discovered compromises being made with the US on this count? Dr Mazari expressed shock at what she stated was a factually incorrect statement on the FMCT in the same Article: “The strategic position of Pakistan vis-à-vis India on the subject of FMCT must not be compromised and this principle be kept in view in negotiations on this matter.”

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Articles 6, 7, 9, 10 and 11 all show that the decision has already been made to open up the NATO transit route on ground and it’s really all about arriving at a better money deal! Yet NATO transit route is not just about money but about being embroiled in an erroneous conflict where these supplies lead to further killings of Afghans and Pakistanis.

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Two crucial requirements have been left out here also according to Dr Mazari: One, amending the Constitution to bring all international agreements/treaties to Parliament for discussion and ratification. Two, making it compulsory for even one-on-one meetings to have a note taker present. Article 15 talks of a fast track for future payments in relation to the Coalition Support Fund and other “leviable” charges. This again reflects the fact that a decision seems to have already been taken to keep Pakistan in this damaging war on terror and bolster this destructive role for Pakistan by giving it Parliamentary sanction.

Dr Mazari made it clear that PTI totally rejects this document as a farce and an insult to the wishes of the people to extricate themselves from the US ‘war on terror’

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