PAF has requested for an increase of 1.5 billion dollar in the budget.

[danger007]

another 40 pages based upon pure one main speculation
we do day dream alot

people are able to decide price of aircraft and which one is better just like that.... whereas experts from Airforce, auditing etc spend months to examine the jet or the compute price of the aircraft.. am not talking about Jet ability but too much speculation... like one guy said mki rcs is 20++ and hence Jft can take out just like that.. i have seen excellent debate between seniors, years ago...now a days every kid commng with loads of speculations...

 

[ZedZeeshan]

I have got a gut feeling it might be for the M2K we are discussing in another thread..!!

 

[fatman17]

need the money to payoff the Chinese loan for the 50 Block Is and now to pay for the 50 Block IIs. remember the defense budget doesn't include capital investments.

 

[tarrar]

PAF needs a good budget to strengthen its airforce. Corruption at massive level has really damaged Pakistans economy because of PD's budget is lower than required. PD should do whatever is necessary to increase its defence budget so that they can make sure the defence balance is maintained in the region.

Now what could this request really mean? Is PAF in process of acquiring new air craft, radars, air defence system, other required hardware & costly Jf17 Block 3 along with future blocks? We will find out with the passage of time.

 

[A2Z]

Brother my answer is little different in approach as strategist as well as history student i have different point of view on procurements as well as its role . e.g IAF has at the moment multiple platforms it provides diversity but if you see the amount of vendors as well as countries its really amazing as well as astonishing to see how these birds are flying or will fly in an event all out war .
If i say some thing about these platforms it will be mere speculations but in order to make it more tangible following variables I will be considering before making any buy

J10 B/C J11D
Availability rate
Amount per sortie
Foreign dependence
Adversary facing
Numbers we can afford
TOT (tech transfer)

On paper what you suggest is good but IAF has similar flankers but in large amount so there is no point in going for same as we cant match one on one ,J10 B/C can be good option till J31 replaces F16s as i always believe IAF problem has out of the box solution ,J10B/C with AESA/IRST /HOBS and large numbers is as deadly as any thing IAF has ,Just my thought and i hope this can bring something new to you or to the people

I totally agree with your point about the Flankers, IAF has similar jets and we can't match them on 1 on 1 criteria. However in past our air chief has made it clear that PAF wont go for any more new 4th generation aircrafts and neither 4.5 gen but will directly take the leap to 5th generation. I believe that was the moment J-10B's chapter was closed and decided to beef up Jf-17 to J-10B's standard tech wise.

Now if we talk about 5th gen neither of the option is available for us at the moment. F-22/35 will never happen and neither will T-50 and as far as J-31/20 and TFX are concerned they are a long way from production. So the most sensible thing to do with the money is get the ammunition and support equipment or procure long range air defence systems as a stop gap and even PAF means the same as well. We now have around 70 JF-17 and and they need spares and ammunition as well. May be we are getting some used F-16 from someone (possible more ex-Jordanian) because our love story with f-16 never seems to end.

 

[Talon]

Bhai andar k bandey hi to nahi miltey

Mtlb ap wikipedia waly bandy ho..no offense ...

 

[volatile]

I totally agree with your point about the Flankers, IAF has similar jets and we can't match them on 1 on 1 criteria. However in past our air chief has made it clear that PAF wont go for any more new 4th generation aircrafts and neither 4.5 gen but will directly take the leap to 5th generation. I believe that was the moment J-10B's chapter was closed and decided to beef up Jf-17 to J-10B's standard tech wise.

Now if we talk about 5th gen neither of the option is available for us at the moment. F-22/35 will never happen and neither will T-50 and as far as J-31/20 and TFX are concerned they are a long way from production. So the most sensible thing to do with the money is get the ammunition and support equipment or procure long range air defence systems as a stop gap and even PAF means the same as well. We now have around 70 JF-17 and and they need spares and ammunition as well. May be we are getting some used F-16 from someone (possible more ex-Jordanian) because our love story with f-16 never seems to end.

Brother JF17 will not win you a war / cant protect and as you mentioned earlier 5th Gen is little away .In my last comments i have mentioned may be this money is needed for partnering the J31 program remmember J31 is looking an international partner .In my view PAF is evaluating things but considering F16 and JF17 = 150 is not a deterrent force ,till 2025 F16A/B MLU will need another service extension or simply we have to ground them .

Numbers by 2020
JF17 = 150
F16 = 80-100
Still room for 100 fighters and at the same time F16`s need replacements in my view

2020 - need 200 fighters (Jf-17 150 )
2025 - need 50 fighters brand new (replacement of F16 better to replace with single engine 4++)
2030 - All F16s needed to be replaced by platform

 

[Muhammad Omar]

Mtlb ap wikipedia waly bandy ho..no offense ...

Nope Defence.pk ka

 

[Talon]

Nope Defence.pk ka

haha...sae hy
well there are chances of attack helis so......time will tell us

 

[Ultima Thule]

http://thediplomat.com/2015/06/why-chinas-air-force-needs-the-su-35/

they need to put some money in the pocket of Russian nothing else, within 5 to 10 years China will beats Russia and Europe in aerospace fields and J-16 is not under-powered compare J-16 with Su-35 on max takeoff weight and engine thrust take a look
J-16

• Max. takeoff weight: 35,000 kg (77,000 lb)
• Powerplant: 2 × WS-10A afterburning turbofans
  • Dry thrust: 89.17 kN (20,050 lbf) each
  • Thrust with afterburner: 135 kN (33,000 lbf) each

Su-35

• Max. takeoff weight: 34,500 kg (76,060 lb)
• Fuel capacity: 11,500 kg (25,400 lb) internally
• Powerplant: 2 × Saturn 117S (AL-41F1S) afterburning turbofan with 3D thrust vectoring nozzle
  • Dry thrust: 8,800 kgf (86.3 kN, 19,400 lbf) each
  • Thrust with afterburner: 14,500 kgf (142 kN, 31,900 lbf) each
  So how can it be under-powered please explain it to me with better engine as compare to Su-35

 

[A2Z]

Brother JF17 will not win you a war / cant protect and as you mentioned earlier 5th Gen is little away .In my last comments i have mentioned may be this money is needed for partnering the J31 program remmember J31 is looking an international partner .In my view PAF is evaluating things but considering F16 and JF17 = 150 is not a deterrent force ,till 2025 F16A/B MLU will need another service extension or simply we have to ground them .

Numbers by 2020
JF17 = 150
F16 = 80-100
Still room for 100 fighters and at the same time F16`s need replacements in my view

2020 - need 200 fighters (Jf-17 150 )
2025 - need 50 fighters brand new (replacement of F16 better to replace with single engine 4++)
2030 - All F16s needed to be replaced by platform

Partnership in J-31 program could be a sensible option however the only draw back it has is that its going to be a long term investment as in the race of 5th gen aircrafts J-31 is coming last. Even if we confirm our partnership today then still it would take at least 8-10 years before we get the first aircraft that too in case of Jf-17 like production otherwise Shengyang will fulfill PLAAF's needs first. On the other hand a joint venture will really help our learning curve.

As far as JF-17 is concerned yes it will not win us any war nor get us the air superiority but it was never meant to do that. If we look at the structure of PAF over the years we always have been a defensive force and in current scenario JF-17 suits our needs better than any other aircraft.

 

[Aawish]

For a half-billion more i.e. $2bn we can bu 50 MiG-35's just like Egypt.

http://en.yibada.com/articles/14448...-fighter-enter-service-egyptian-air-force.htm

 

[Ajit6333]

Bhai we are not competing India. Actually with our dwindling and aged fleet we do need at least 36-40 modern planes on the other hand India is going bonkers with all kind of buy. PAKISTAN has to retire around 150 planes by 2021 and by that time we can only produce around 64 Jf17s @16 per year

Ok but jf17 advanced version would be better option ...pakistan debt is increased to a dangerous level I was watching dunya news Rauf klasa explained it nicely also Mushbir lucman complained about CPEC anyways but I think petition should be signed in pakistan and to be given to GHQ and elected govt for decreasing defence budget you have to fight terrorist and have a detterence against India ...first make your backbone strong then start fighting or competing

 

[volatile]

Partnership in J-31 program could be a sensible option however the only draw back it has is that its going to be a long term investment as in the race of 5th gen aircrafts J-31 is coming last. Even if we confirm our partnership today then still it would take at least 8-10 years before we get the first aircraft that too in case of Jf-17 like production otherwise Shengyang will fulfill PLAAF's needs first. On the other hand a joint venture will really help our learning curve.

As far as JF-17 is concerned yes it will not win us any war nor get us the air superiority but it was never meant to do that. If we look at the structure of PAF over the years we always have been a defensive force and in current scenario JF-17 suits our needs better than any other aircraft.

Yes brother this is my point as well but in today world offense is best defense . J31 is last but it enjoys all the development work of J20 .

For a half-billion more i.e. $2bn we can bu 50 MiG-35's just like Egypt.

http://en.yibada.com/articles/14448...-fighter-enter-service-egyptian-air-force.htm

Although notoriously difficult to keep them fly worthy but RD 93 is plus point so hell yea a good option to have in this price tag

Ok but jf17 advanced version would be better option ...pakistan debt is increased to a dangerous level I was watching dunya news Rauf klasa explained it nicely also Mushbir lucman complained about CPEC anyways but I think petition should be signed in pakistan and to be given to GHQ and elected govt for decreasing defence budget you have to fight terrorist and have a detterence against India ...first make your backbone strong then start fighting or competing

Sir neither of these journalist know about economy nor i think (dont take it personally) Pakistan GDP to debt ratio is quite fine around 2.5%

 

[Talon]

Why dont we well our f16s and replace them double in quantity with j10 and also increase production of jf 17

u must be joking...its like replacing SUPERMAN with BOUNCING BOY..F-16 is a proven jet and has taken down J-10 in friendly engagements...why would we replace f16 with a lower aircraft?
And if quantity mattered then indians would have achieved air superiority in previous wars with PAK..