PAF going for MI-35 attack helicopters?

[Alphacharlie]

You do realize that this isn't the Miss World Competition that we're talking about !

Wonder then what comments will pour in then for X 32, Flying Dustbin!!

 

[MastanKhan]

Mastan Sahib, thats the thing isn't it ? Pakistan, usually, is embarrassingly bad at playing her cards right ! I don't what happened to the people whom some of the more capable guys in the Muslim League cadre groomed to take over for the next generation because between the Indus Water Treaty, Tashkent, Simla and a whole host of other things we appear to never deliberate the repercussions of our actions. The only two good things that I can think of, in International Politics, that we managed to do right were - China and maybe..just maybe our relation with KSA ! Pataa nahin whats wrong with our diplomats...they can't be, in all reason, be expected to play our cards right !

Hi,

You may not believe me or may not agree with---but it is the lack of public libraries for one---. Secondly---the people that you are talking about---they were not arrogant---but rather very conscious of their position in the world order. Their thinking were on a different pleateau than the current day men of action.

Those guys understood the weaknesses that the nation had and played according to the game plan. The current day men----don't understand the weakness---they have very little or no exposure to other cultures.

I remember my uncle when he came for training at georgia nuc reactor---he was a phd---he wasn't living with pakistani families---rather his host family were americans---our older generation had assmilated with the americans and europeans more so due to their educated background as compared to the generation that went abroad and found refuge in the pakistani / indian enclaves.

You asking what's wrong---well look at this board---this is a miniature pakistan---. It gives great oppurtunities for young pakistanis to interact and learn newer things and different view points---but when you look back at what they write---I get shocked at the level of ignorance and a lack of learning abilities.

Tragically these young men and kids are so programmed to be set in their ways and beliefs---that it gets astounding and I wonder what happened to those times when the young wanted to learn rather than give heir opinions.

Also---good people want to be treated with respect and want to be rewarded as well---but when merit is taken away and capabilities are forgotten and the ordinary rule the roost---the nation become a tragic case of multiple failures happening all the time every time.

When warriors can't even protect the most expensive assets that have been given to them to fight with----then the future of that nation is doom.

I think that india at this stage is in a terrible dilemma---it chose to please two lovers at the same time and got entangled so bad in that web that it does not understand which way to go if power juxta positioning allies russia with pakistan.

Russia has reached that stage of isolation in this last one year that it is also extremely confused as to what has happened with its allies worldwide---. It cannot live on the promises of alliances by india---as india cannot give it anything back in return except for some more orders of weapons systems.

Russia is in desperate need of open waters and open borders to the south---the choke hold that russia is in now---is becoming extremely unbearable for the bear. With russias alliance with pakistan---the threat of war between pakistan and india would sort of fizzle out---and as I stated in my earlier [post---the biggest loser out of all this would be Barak Obama----once the alliance is listed---that would be the proverbial nail in the coffin---. The short lived legacy of Osama would be forgotten in the face of this massive geo political power shift.

Pakistan ending up in the russian house of influence---would be a historical matter of shame for the american foreign office and political punditary with Barak Obama leading the house of shame.

 

[ASQ-1918]

Tshering22, first you need to be able to make a distinction between Mi-35M and basic Mi-35P. Mi-35M with its new VK-2500 engines (which is also used on Mi-28) are good enough for mountains and has a improved ceiling and maneuverability, it uses the same rotor system from Mi-28. Actually, service ceiling have been increased to 5,700m.

 

[tarrar]

I don’t know if it is true but what I think is Pak Army needs a proper heavy weight attack helicopters, that to in huge quantity & they should go for MI 28 attack helicopters, if they are planning to buy MI 35 then they should be for SSG group only or Pak Army should buy Z 9 from China.

This is a good move by Pak Army to buy Military hardware from Russia because Europe & US will not sell anything to Pakistan now, Pak Army should also & always stay close to China because Russian’s at the end of the day we don’t know if they will sell anything to Pakistan, practical results are required.

Pakistan Army requires both transport & attack helicopters very badly & that to in huge quantity.

 

[danger007]

calm down friends..... let us wait for a while .... it is too early to decide Russian stance.... such declarative sentence not needed.....

Russia neva been on pakistan side until now...... and we don't have such kinda problems with Russia..... like Pak and USA ....

 

[Tshering22]

Tshering22, first you need to be able to make a distinction between Mi-35M and basic Mi-35P. Mi-35M with its new VK-2500 engines (which is also used on Mi-28) are good enough for mountains and has a improved ceiling and maneuverability, it uses the same rotor system from Mi-28. Actually, service ceiling have been increased to 5,700m.

Mi-35M still isn't structurally built to do the job of an AW-129 or a K-52. You must understand that there is a lot more to a helicopter's movements and capabilities than a new rotor or a new engine.

Engine generates power and rotors channelize this power more efficiently. However, the aerodynamicity, the maneuverability etc depends on the way a helicopter is designed. Mi-35 structurally is a plains-based attack helicopter that is good for the taiga plains of Russia or relatively open spaces where a helicopter doesn't have to twist and turn too much.

Now check out the Himalayan terrain in northern Pakistan. I am saying this with so much conviction because I am myself from a Himalayan province of India that has the world's third highest peak and one of the most hostile terrains.

I am not questioning the capability of the new Mi-35; Just comparing it with what Pakistan actually needs.

 

[Tshering22]

You have wasted SO MUCH time and effort (as a typical Indian response) to an unbiased analysis that actually has roots. I'll leave it at that. I'll let you maintain your opinion. You should come re-read my post about five years from now. I'd love to see your moth wide open thinking, wth happened?

Peace. I won't respond to he-said, she-said. If you have a problem with what I post. You are welcome to go get in the bathroom and cry in front of the mirror. No hard feelings!

You my friend, clearly lack insight into geopolitics. I would suggest you to attain more knowledge on this forum before testing the understanding of other members.

Five years down the lane or fifty years, the point is, what you are claiming to offer Russians is something a few other countries in the region already have on offer.

But yes, there is no harm in building a positive foreign policy between the two of you.

 

[ASQ-1918]

Why do you repeat the same thing while you obviously don't even have an idea of what your talking about.

 

[IND151]

As i feel, best option for Pakistan will be to arm some Mi-17s for the time being, and then look forward to buy some specialized attack helicopter from Chinese or Turkish stable.

Mi-17s can be customized according to the role.

still mi 17 is not dedicated attack heli

Pak needs a dedicated attack heli

probably Pak will go for T 129 or WZ 10 because these are medium weight attack choppers

Mi 35 amd Mi 28N on other hand are heavy attack choppers and if i am not wrong Pak doesn't prefer Heavy Attack Choppers

 

[IND151]

Right now only one country which has biggest production line of attack and transport helicopter, is Russia. They are the only one who meet supply deadlines. Non country in the world can even come to close to production line of Russia. Russian are way ahead in Helicopter technology then any country. Russian has one stop shop for spare parts, rest helicopter manufacturer receive parts delivery from other countries, some countries even receive engines too. So, obviously every supplier meets its customer demand first then supply part to other independent manufacturers .

kindly provide link for bolded part.thanks

 

[INDIAISM]

Thing that will be interesting to know is wether Pakistan will ask for New Mi35 or used Mi35 because i don't find any reason for Pakistan to invest huge amount in 70ies platform in 2014 which they will use till 2035 atleast....

 

[Viper0011.]

How it is unbiased analysis??? You said pakistan will offer road connect between china and central asia. He mentioned that Russia itself very well connected with Asia and china.. Nothing gonna happen in 5 years.... Stop day dreaming...

You know there are fools and there are wise fools. I think the response to the analysis was a wise fool response. Unbiased analysis meant that it didn't take anyone's side nor did it offend anyone (wasn't an India vs. Pakistan) analysis. It also took into account the US, Russian and other people's interests. So that what makes it 'unbiased', directed towards no one in a negative way but It does explain the situation.

Now if I take your wise fool explanation into consideration that "Russia is already connected to China and the warm waters", why on the planet earth they went to Afg and then wanted to hit Pakistan and eventually Iran or someone else, JUST to have some control over to the Arabian sea????
They took a HUGE risk and as a result, got destroyed into fragments called the Russian states.......do you even understand the importance of it or how intense it is for a country to risk its own integrity to get to a place?
A super power threw its own structural integrity (former USSR) to attain a strategic goal. Knowing VERY WELL that there will be resistant (they may not have thought about SO MUCH resistant) but they knew there will be casualties.
Knowing the U2's flew from Pakistan...they also knew the US is involved at different levels so marching towards the Arabian sea will involve US somehow trying to stop the Russians....knowing ALL this...they decided to reach the Arabian ocean. They attacked Afg and then went into a cluster fu** situation and got fragmented.
I'll leave my argument at that. If you or ANYONE else reading this statement or the analysis on the top can't understand the importance of the Arabian sea (from a strategic standpoint) for the Russians, I think you should learn about global trade routes, oil and the future first. That'll give you a perspective of what I meant.

Lastly, it's my personal belief now that any post that shows Pakistan making ONE extra dollar as a profit or anything, results in half the Indian community on this forum having third degree burns. It's so sad. You guys are here like the rest of us, be a man and agree to what makes sense and disagree with what has fact based reasons. No need to get into high school, girl fight bs!

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

100 MI-35 , would make a great addition to Pakistan Military , Air Support

Also point to note that if Pakistan Military had MI-35 perhaps situations like Kamra attack or attack on Navy base , these helicopters could have patrolled the air , and taken out any Terrorist running across buildings or towards parked airplanes

I would imagine that these units would be equipped for Night Vision capabilities from air


I mean realistically we can`t wait till 2020 to get 10 helicopters from USA , we should just buy them from Russia

100 Helicopters and spare part support


For a country size of Pakistan we should have 100 Mi-35
and another 50 Troops transport helicopters

And this is the best part that you can even transport troops in the Russian Helicopters duel purpose


Talk of Sukhoi Fighter Jets , perhaps its far fetched , we already have JF17 and J10B to procure and that should keep us busy for good while

Not to mention , these helicopters can also be used in situation where Terrorist execute hit and run like operations on train lines or gas Pipelines etc or even people hiding in mountains

 

[DARKY]

This one is from IAF.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

This one is from IAF.

Daddy mommy , we want the same helicopter too , go get it for us .. when you go to Russia