Nobel committee warned not to award peace prize to Chinese dissident

[below_freezing]

you mean it is an asian logic or a chinese logic
to consider one parti = democracy?

asian logic is democracy = no starvation, low corruption, good life.

we do not care about politics if the politics are good. japan = democracy even though it was a 1 party state until last year. why? it is rich, corruption is acceptable and no one starves.

phillipines = no democracy even though there are elections, multiparty, and "freedom" because the people don't even have freedom from hunger and disease.

 

[huzihaidao12]

pls try to stop either propaganda or use your brain. pls.

your governement is filtering means they didn't want democracy.
it doesn't mean the chinese people were not allowed to find way to get informations. it is good to know your people are smart. it is nothing to do with the decision above them that this or this is not allowed.
understand?

1, you do not know the methods the Chinese government control of information, more clever. In fact, it has a lot to relax, not to mention the BBS. I do not deny that we are not democratic, but we have more to care about others, we're not interested to care about God, ah, democracy, now.

2, do not deliberately ignore the fact that we know enough for the West, not because of government propaganda, but the long experience and deep understanding. Then, you have agreed?

 

[huzihaidao12]

Iran, you really need more exchanges with China, not the "Chinese intellectuals", but really ordinary people.

 

[Hussein]

2, do not deliberately ignore the fact that we know enough for the West, not because of government propaganda, but the long experience and deep understanding. Then, you have agreed?

i understand this point.
thanks

 

[Tuahaa]

They only reward prizes to those who serve their purpose...

 

[Tuahaa]

PS. Hussein, I cannot agree about your view on democracy...

America preaches democracy, and they use it as a means to install puppet governments. This should be clear, being in Iran.

See, now they preach their mindset where 'Sharia/Communism/Dictatorship/What not = evil and Democracy/Capitalism = all that is good and right'.

I praise china for resisting America's democracy. To hell with democracy. China is one of the world's fastest growing nations, they did it without democracy- why? Because they used their minds and had control of their own country, so that they weren't exploited by the singers of democracy.

US doesn't let a squeak out about Saudi Arabia, or U.A.E- they are both countries running on dictatorship, the latter being truly successful and not only because of oil. Why doesn't America preach its democracy there? Because its leaders are friendly towards America! Oil? Yep. Investments? Yep. Trade? You got that too!

 

[gpit]

internet is not filtered
and it is not only one parti in China
sorry we are not speaking about the same country then

Friend, stop behaving like a clown.

Who doesn't filter internet? US? Russia? Australia?

...

Russia has been pushing a proposal in The United Nations agency for information technology, which describes the greatest cyber-threat not as hacking or stealing but as using the Internet to spread ideas that might undermine a country. Russia wants any such use of the Internet classified as “aggression,” and hence illegal under the UN Charter.

Sounds like China right? Yes, but check out this awfully teal map of countries that agree. It seems that a lot of the world seems more aligned with the Chinese view of controlling any information that may be considered subversive than they’re aligned with the high-minded Western ideals of freedom of speech and access to information. Most notably they include the other BRICs: India, Brazil and Russia. In fact, it’s Brazil that has asked Google to remove more content from the Web than any other nation this year. Brazil made more than double the requests of the next closest country, Libya.

...

It’s a delicate issue for the US diplomatically and inside the US– way bigger than “Googlegate” because, well, I refer you again to the map. The issue doesn’t seem to be about different political systems, but rather different levels of stabilization in more chaotic emerging markets. Near-unfettered Internet freedoms aren’t always as high a priority in these countries, not because they’re evil, but because there are more pressing problems of gun violence, terrorism, or a paucity of food, water, jobs and basic infrastructure.

Internet Control Issues: It’s Not Just China

A new U.S. Senate bill would grant the president far-reaching emergency powers to seize control of or even shut down portions of the Internet.

Read more: Senators propose granting president emergency Internet power | Politics and Law - CNET News

US concern over Australian internet filter - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

The internet filter coming to the US — with barely any dissent
by freelance journalist Harley Dennett in Washington DC

The US Congress spent yesterday packing up and heading home for mid-term re-election campaigns, having failed its most important job — passing the annual budget. But even this deadlocked Congress is capable of doing what the Australian Labor Party cannot — pass a mandatory ISP-based Internet filter — and do so before the end of the year.

...

The internet filter coming to the US — with barely any dissent | Crikey

In addition, you know nothing about China's multi-party system:

...

The political party system China has adopted is multi-party cooperation and political consultation under the leadership of the Communist Party of China (CPC) (hereinafter "multi-party cooperation system"), which is different from both the two-party or multi-party competition systems of Western countries and the one-party system practiced in some other countries.

White paper on China's political party system -- china.org.cn

Indeed you were talking a different country: one is a real country, the other is one distorted by your knowledge deficit brain.

 

[Hussein]

Friend, stop behaving like a clown.

Who doesn't filter internet? US? Russia? Australia?





US concern over Australian internet filter - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)



In addition, you know nothing about China's multi-party system:



Indeed you were talking a different country: one is a real country, the other is one distorted by your knowledge deficit brain.

Seems except insulting you didn't know how to use your brain

Using filtering doesnt mean that filtering is the same level of avoiding informations to come . for exemple facebook is forbidden in China and they asked filtering google because they don't want any political idea different than the 'strandard' to be welcomed.
In US for exemple or Europe, they allow even the websites that they insult directly the government even the people of the government.

be ok with that or believe it is better to avoid is a possible talk to have.
but the difference of censorship is big .

it is easy to say other know nothing
but it is another thing to give some credit to your insults.

about multi parti matter
lol you're really a joke. just get some education before speaking.
all minor (and about minor it is really minor) partis are under control of CPC
you were funny.. or not

 

[below_freezing]

Seems except insulting you didn't know how to use your brain

Using filtering doesnt mean that filtering is the same level of avoiding informations to come . for exemple facebook is forbidden in China and they asked filtering google because they don't want any political idea different than the 'strandard' to be welcomed.
In US for exemple or Europe, they allow even the websites that they insult directly the government even the people of the government.

be ok with that or believe it is better to avoid is a possible talk to have.
but the difference of censorship is big .

it is easy to say other know nothing
but it is another thing to give some credit to your insults.

about multi parti matter
lol you're really a joke. just get some education before speaking.
all minor (and about minor it is really minor) partis are under control of CPC
you were funny.. or not

because in the US, people know that violent revolution will be put down in the most brutal way. so the government does not care. whoever you vote, the US military is not going away, and its guns are aimed inwards as well as outwards. police in the US carry guns and shoot at the slightest provocation; in china, police guns are locked in a cabinet that can only be opened in an emergency and police go on patrol with no lethal weapons, just a radio and a stick, just like in britain.

chinese people are very free in their thinking and will revolt and riot if they're too angry. some news cause too much anger, in everyone, and logically, for my and my fellow citizens, good, they should be censored in the name of stability. i am AGAINST that, but i acknowledge there is a very valid reason behind it. no one personally gains from this censorship. the communist party is not 1 person, it is 1/9 chinese adults. we do not have a dictatorship, we change leaders regularly every 10 years. our society, while not perfect, is not plagued by violence, starvation and instability, unlike certain middle eastern countries, and we'd like to keep it that way.

 

[Brotherhood]

Seems except insulting you didn't know how to use your brain

Using filtering doesnt mean that filtering is the same level of avoiding informations to come . for exemple facebook is forbidden in China and they asked filtering google because they don't want any political idea different than the 'strandard' to be welcomed.
In US for exemple or Europe, they allow even the websites that they insult directly the government even the people of the government.

be ok with that or believe it is better to avoid is a possible talk to have.
but the difference of censorship is big .

it is easy to say other know nothing
but it is another thing to give some credit to your insults.

about multi parti matter
lol you're really a joke. just get some education before speaking.
all minor (and about minor it is really minor) partis are under control of CPC
you were funny.. or not

Oh, poor baby, don't you dare cry for insult when you intentionally poke your nose into someone else business which you know nothing at all , damn well you deserve a slap back natually.

Come on, what about your stupid claim he never said China should be colonize for 300 yrs? did i bust your fairy tale with "facts" and you still shamelessly keep trolling with baseless rants.

And give me a break, the last thing we need is some Iranian lecture us regarding freedom and human right, a backward country still carry out some barbarian stoning punishment, what a joker.
Iranian Woman Sentenced to Stoning Now Faces 99 Lashes

Since you are so fond of American style so-called democracy, becareful what you wish for, US is just looking for some more excuses to break up your country piece by piece, hopefully you will able to enjoy your western democracy freedom soon. Good luck, may your dream came true.
PS: btw, who is actually ruling your country?

 

[below_freezing]

Oh, poor baby, don't you dare cry for insult when you intentionally poke your nose into someone else business which you know nothing at all , damn well you deserve a slap back natually.

Come on, what about your stupid claim he never said China should be colonize for 300 yrs? did i bust your fairy tale with "facts" and you still shamelessly keep trolling with baseless rants.

And give me a break, the last thing we need is some Iranian lecture us regarding freedom and human right, a backward country still carry out some barbarian stoning punishment, what a joker.
Iranian Woman Sentenced to Stoning Now Faces 99 Lashes

Since you are so fond of American style so-called democracy, becareful what you wish for, US is just looking for some more excuses to break up your country piece by piece, hopefully you will able to enjoy your western democracy freedom soon. Good luck, may your dream came true.
PS: btw, who is actually ruling your country?

harsh but true. sometimes, people believe torture is a form of culture while censorship of ugly things is a violation of right to speech.

i am so glad we have things like gender equality, no lashing with whips, no stoning, little "morality" laws and women wearing short skirts and bikinis that iran does not enjoy.

 

[Hussein]

Oh, poor baby, don't you dare cry for insult when you intentionally poke your nose into someone else business which you know nothing at all , damn well you deserve a slap back natually.

Come on, what about your stupid claim he never said China should be colonize for 300 yrs? did i bust your fairy tale with "facts" and you still shamelessly keep trolling with baseless rants.

And give me a break, the last thing we need is some Iranian lecture us regarding freedom and human right, a backward country still carry out some barbarian stoning punishment, what a joker.
Iranian Woman Sentenced to Stoning Now Faces 99 Lashes

Since you are so fond of American style so-called democracy, becareful what you wish for, US is just looking for some more excuses to break up your country piece by piece, hopefully you will able to enjoy your western democracy freedom soon. Good luck, may your dream came true.
PS: btw, who is actually ruling your country?

another insult without quoting me to say what was wrong.
this is typically propaganda educated people who write like you.

let me answer about your out of topic points .

about what he said. if there is another source than the given one, which i can give more credit.

i disagree with stoning like large majority of Iranians. Well let me explain me . hopefully you can understand. in Iran a small part of the population believes that whatever "Islam" says (local mullah for exemple) it should be respected. only these people can accept such a thing. whatever during many years no stoning case and now there are sadly some.

you didn't need to insult my country now to answer me.
i respect your great civilization and you should respect ours.
what is the matter here is that we speak about nobel prize man. and the wish for the nobel prize commity that china can improve human rights. nobody said human rights are perfect in europe or usa.

for exemple the associations for human rights and even the european commity for human rights .. is severely condemning France for many matters . First of all, many times they condemn state of jails. It is a disaster here.
Second about some subjects like roms.

Democracy is not US origin.
How many times i need to explain this to people like you?
I am not fan of USA. So stop always saying this bullshit. I never lived there and i am not looking to live there.
Democracy is a human principle.
Here they believe everything comes from their civilisation. Maybe i exagerate abou this ... many people are open minded...
What i mean is for exemple in Iran we had the human rights principles far before the european and greek.
But they don't care about that.
In China as well you are the source of many good involvments on human society.

WHAT is the matter here is HUMAN. Not being US or Europe civilized like. I am myself not at all european like. We have in our country our civilizations, all, we have the elements to make a better country.

THIS IS THE POINT.
could you understand this before always saying that when we speak democracy then we are US minded.

Who is ruling my country? I don't understand what you mean?
Khamenei is ruling my country. And?

 

[Brotherhood]

harsh but true. sometimes, people believe torture is a form of culture while censorship of ugly things is a violation of right to speech.

i am so glad we have things like gender equality, no lashing with whips, no stoning, little "morality" laws and women wearing short skirts and bikinis that iran does not enjoy.

Exactly, how dare those shameless fanatic lecture us on freedom and censorship while their country is on top of the list...
Internet censorship: How Iran is filtering out dissent | Technology | guardian.co.uk
Censorship in Iran and around the Globe | Azad Tribune
More Powerful Than the President, the Supreme Leader Holds Absolute Authority in Iran - ABC News
International Campaign for Human Rights in Iran – Shirin Ebadi: “Nokia Siemens’ Action a Major Accomplishment for Iranians and for People Of The World”
Now tell me who is talking?

 

[Hussein]

Exactly, how dare those shameless fanatic lecture us on freedom and censorship while their country is on top of the list...
Internet censorship: How Iran is filtering out dissent | Technology | guardian.co.uk
Censorship in Iran and around the Globe | Azad Tribune
More Powerful Than the President, the Supreme Leader Holds Absolute Authority in Iran - ABC News
International Campaign for Human Rights in Iran – Shirin Ebadi: “Nokia Siemens’ Action a Major Accomplishment for Iranians and for People Of The World”
Now tell me who is talking?

It is true.
I am suffering of that from all my heart. Like most Iranians i wish better times to come and these crazy acts stop.
We need the Chinese and the World to remind our country to respect its citizens.
Supporting us is remind us the basic human rights and stop the barbary as you said yourself.

I accept the critics. If you could accept yourself about some point in your country. Like putting in jail a dissident : we do. You do. It is not good. ok with that?

 

[below_freezing]

It is true.
I am suffering of that from all my heart. Like most Iranians i wish better times to come and these crazy acts stop.
We need the Chinese and the World to remind our country to respect its citizens.
Supporting us is remind us the basic human rights and stop the barbary as you said yourself.

I accept the critics. If you could accept yourself about some point in your country. Like putting in jail a dissident : we do. You do. It is not good. ok with that?

he is not a dissident. do you know what the charge he is in prison for? do you think that writing an article about democracy will reduce his crime? if so, then i can just steal something right now, write an article about democracy, and get a nobel peace prize.

you still do not understand our points of view. you are never put in jail for disagreeing with the government or exposing problems.

take a look at this:

http://bbs1.people.com.cn/postDetail.do?boardId=2&treeView=1&view=2&id=103625317

this is a post on the forum of People's Daily, the newspaper that has the highest readership in the world and is considered the official mouthpiece of the communist party.

"我们还可以想起习酒闻名的贵州省习水县的强迫学生卖淫，就有6名政府官员、司法干部、教师、县人大代表等公职人员涉案。据调查发现，2007年10月到 2008年8月期间，习水县辍学学生刘某、袁某采取在学校门口守候等方式，将11名女学生带往袁某某家中，再由袁某某联系嫖客进行嫖宿。受害者中，未满 14岁的幼女有3名，其余受害者均未满18岁。我们看到少女仍然是被某些高达贵人作为发泄兽欲的对象!"

You can use google translator if you want to know everything else (some strong language included), I'll just summarize the paragraph:

"We can also note that the home of famed wine, Guizhou province's Xishui county's case of schoolgirls being forced into prostitution, involving 6 government officials, judges, teachers, county representatives and other public employees. According to the investigation, 2007 october-2008 august, Xishui county high school dropouts Mr. Liu and Mr. Yuan waited at the doors of the school, brought 11 girls into the home of Mr. Yuan, and contacted clients for prostitution. Among the victims, 3 were below the age of 14; all were below the age of 18. Our girls are being used as the s* toys of corrupt fatcat officials!"

Liu Xiaobo was jailed because he is a criminal and a racist (which is also in violation of China's laws). Not one person is jailed for disagreeing with the government. The government allows people to criticize it on its own official mouthpiece forum and the censors won't even think about touching your post.

We criticize the government every hour, every day. It makes our society seem weak to Westerners, they always think we're on the verge of collapse. They think our government hates dissent, but it welcomes dissent. In reality, we are so confident in the strength of our nation that we dare put these topics into the open. We have proven them wrong by living our lives. Does the US dare have an honest discussion about its social problems? Does the US dare to try to fix its own social problems? Does it dare ask why so many blacks and latinos fall into drug use and prostitution while whites rise to become investment bankers and leaders?