No J-10B for PAF | A.C Khalid, calls for a focus on 5th generation platform instead.

[IND151]

About the ADF. These are planned to go through MLU to get it equal to all other F16's. With that these planes are the cheapest ever block52's And since block 52 is pretty good plane I think it is no longer question whether these assets will be valuable or not. To remind you of the reality. PAF non MLU f16's were able to stop MKI with all the goodies during encounter near the borders. When we had F7's they Indians entered the Pakistani area but returned before they were contacted.

Kindly provide source for claim.

 

[Windjammer]

That response was to another member who confused BVR tech being post 2000s .... Still i do not see the logic behind bringing LCA when talking of R77s and Sparrows. For the sabre slayer, to each his definition after the battle of Boyra.

Coming to f16s and Jf17s, as i have stated, jf17s were the only viable option with BVR back in the day,,this was before the US congress approved the sale of amraams ..PAf realised that JF17 along with the SD10 may be the only BVR capable aircrfat in its inventory. Plus , also the aging f7s and mirages have to go, what better than a poor mans viper.


I find many enthusiastic pakistani members quoting such a cute incident. Can i have a non pakistani source?

Poor man's vipers . eh.... do you keep referring to JFT as such since it's destined to shoot down some poorly trained pilots or is it that by demeaning others, gets your ticker going. In any case some internet warriors frivolous comments are obsolete however those pitted against the JFT do matter and thus hold regards. Basically you have no knowledge about how PAF operates or it's capabilities...here's a hint, in the middle of 2002 stand off, PAF inducted a squadron of F-7PGs, if it just wanted an aircraft to shoot guns or sidewinders, it could have stuck with the 7P version which it already was quite familiar with. work on that.

 

[IND151]

If pakistan industrial capablity is behind india, and it still achieve to produce MF-17 super mushak, K-8, Jf-17 and even export it, then shame on india whose product can't get more than a prototype. If india can afford to not induct Tejas until it is fully mature, it doesn't mean he's capable to built one, get the difference?Yes, pakistan get help from china, so does india, everything is imported, even the disign is imported, and you guys are still incapable to make a 4th generation aircraft after 30 year.

We had problem with Tejas and Arjun, but most of them are solved.

If pakistan industrial capablity is behind india, and it still achieve to produce MF-17 super mushak, K-8, Jf-17 and even export it.

Pakistan's industrial capacity is behind ours and in aerospace sector we are eons ahead.

We have flag on moon and are exploring mars.

Let me ask you; we are building our own satellite navigation system, testing sophisticated SLBMs with 3,000 KM plus range, have developed MR SAM like Akash which has been ordered in thousands by IA and IAF.

What does this suggest?

Jf-17 is JV not entire Pakistani product while Tejas has been developed solely by India with consultancy from foreign firms, but the India remains sole developer.

I am not denying that Pakistan has made contribution in JF-17. PAC has made significant contribution in JF-17 and will utilize the expertise they gained in future projects.

But fact is Jf-17 is JV while in case of Tejas, India is sole developer, which had no experience of developing fighters before Tejas, faced sanctions; on other hand China had much more expertise of developing fighters, which it gained through various means.

So before comparing both projects consider this facts too.

India has developed many critical subsystems like FBW in Tejas, has Pak done same in JFT?

Remember "produced" is not "developed."

When Tejas gets IOC 2 and other certificates it will be introduced in large numbers in IAF.

At the end of the day JF-17 remains a JV while Tejas remains the product solely developed by India.

 

[Windjammer]

Kindly provide source for claim.

The Day PAF Routed Out IAF

 

[IND151]

The Day PAF Routed Out IAF

Give me the neutral source or Pakistani source backed by neutral sources.

 

[acetophenol]

If pakistan industrial capablity is behind india, and it still achieve to produce MF-17 super mushak, K-8, Jf-17 and even export it, then shame on india whose product can't get more than a prototype. If india can afford to not induct Tejas until it is fully mature, it doesn't mean he's capable to built one, get the difference?Yes, pakistan get help from china, so does india, everything is imported, even the disign is imported, and you guys are still incapable to make a 4th generation aircraft after 30 year.

Both K-8 and Jf-17s are JVs. If you want to compare,use India's JV with Russia,Su-30MKI. India has own made HT-2,HJT-16 "Kiran" and HPT-32 "Deepak" which formed the back bone of IAF training fleet. India also produces/produced multiple aircrafts in India.

 

[Windjammer]

Give me the neutral source or Pakistani source backed by neutral sources.

What's a neutral source, India was the offender and PAF the defender, surely it wasn't a warlike situation that you would have foreign observers/ correspondence reporting from the ground. One could argue, what neutral source is there to confirm that US indeed killed OBL.

 

[IND151]

What's a neutral source, India was the offender and PAF the defender, surely it wasn't a warlike situation that you would have foreign observers/ correspondence reporting from the ground. One could argue, what neutral source is there to confirm that US indeed killed OBL.

Whcih means you dont have nuetral source.

I have read similar type of story where Pakistani F-16s intruded in Indian airspace and one of then was locked on by Mig 29.

https://www.google.co.in/url?sa=t&r...Yrc3Vhke458tx26SpmT97xw&bvm=bv.66330100,d.c2E

 

[Munir]

Both K-8 and Jf-17s are JVs. If you want to compare,use India's JV with Russia,Su-30MKI. India has own made HT-2,HJT-16 "Kiran" and HPT-32 "Deepak" which formed the back bone of IAF training fleet. India also produces/produced multiple aircrafts in India.

Where did the engine's come from? Who designed the HT-2? What did India do exactly in MKI? Let me be simple. You can call it JV but there is hardly JV in your case. You do not have the capability to produce a turboprop trainer, not a decent 3 th gen fighter and your JV with PAKFA is as much JV as it was with Brahmos or any other "JV". You guys are funny.

 

[Kompromat]

Stick to the topic guys.

 

[acetophenol]

Where did the engine's come from? Who designed the HT-2? What did India do exactly in MKI? Let me be simple. You can call it JV but there is hardly JV in your case. You do not have the capability to produce a turboprop trainer, not a decent 3 th gen fighter and your JV with PAKFA is as much JV as it was with Brahmos or any other "JV". You guys are funny.

The engines for HT-2 was sourced from UK,later license made in India. It was designed by V.M Ghatge. Some of the direct contributions of India in the MKI project includes the "Tarang" RWR and MFDs by HAL-SAMTEL. Apart from that 150+ Indian vendors supply components,from the Aeromuscle tyres to the license built engines. We have license built multiple 3rd generation combat jets,upgraded them ourselves to cutting edge status and have our own aircrafts as well. Now what exactly is Pakistan's contribution in Jf-17 project?

 

[Irfan Baloch]

Stick to the topic guys.

I am secretly happy about this cancellation
call it my lack of information but I suspect that future blocks of JF-17 will provide us everything that J-10 family has at the moment.

furthermore our F-16s both MLU and block 52 pretty much more than cover for what J-10 has at the moment.

so I hail that decision to ditch J-10 consolidate focus and resources on JF-17 and future 5th generation platforms.

its a mirror image of what China did... it has frog leaped to J-10 from its F-7s and hence its understandable it doesnt need JF-17s for its airforce as it has its own J-11, J-16 and 2 other 5th generation aircraft's to cover for everything.

I understand J-17 and J-10 are not like for like comparison but I am looking at their role viz a viz the country they are operated by.

indirectly I dare say JF-17 has done more than expected.

comments?

ps. please open up a conversation with me thx

 

[he-man]

I am secretly happy about this cancellation
call it my lack of information but I suspect that future blocks of JF-17 will provide us everything that J-10 family has at the moment.

furthermore our F-16s both MLU and block 52 pretty much more than cover for what J-10 has at the moment.

so I hail that decision to ditch J-10 consolidate focus and resources on JF-17 and future 5th generation platforms.

its a mirror image of what China did... it has frog leaped to J-10 from its F-7s and hence its understandable it doesnt need JF-17s for its airforce as it has its own J-11, J-16 and 2 other 5th generation aircraft's to cover for everything.

I understand J-17 and J-10 are not like for like comparison but I am looking at their role viz a viz the country they are operated by.

indirectly I dare say JF-17 has done more than expected.

comments?

ps. please open up a conversation with me thx

j-10b is just at another level vs jf-17,,,,and thats the brutal truth.

but i can understand pakistan wanting a 5 gen fighter and not j-10,,,,but comparing jf-17 with j-10b is pure madness

 

[Windjammer]

I am secretly happy about this cancellation
call it my lack of information but I suspect that future blocks of JF-17 will provide us everything that J-10 family has at the moment.

furthermore our F-16s both MLU and block 52 pretty much more than cover for what J-10 has at the moment.

so I hail that decision to ditch J-10 consolidate focus and resources on JF-17 and future 5th generation platforms.

its a mirror image of what China did... it has frog leaped to J-10 from its F-7s and hence its understandable it doesnt need JF-17s for its airforce as it has its own J-11, J-16 and 2 other 5th generation aircraft's to cover for everything.

I understand J-17 and J-10 are not like for like comparison but I am looking at their role viz a viz the country they are operated by.

indirectly I dare say JF-17 has done more than expected.

comments?

ps. please open up a conversation with me thx

I don't know why it surprises people on the cancellation news, read my opening post in the four year old thread, even then Alan Warnes was of the opinion that if ever the J-10 is a long time in coming.

Alan Warnes Discloses

 

[Informant]

The engines for HT-2 was sourced from UK,later license made in India. It was designed by V.M Ghatge. Some of the direct contributions of India in the MKI project includes the "Tarang" RWR and MFDs by HAL-SAMTEL. Apart from that 150+ Indian vendors supply components,from the Aeromuscle tyres to the license built engines. We have license built multiple 3rd generation combat jets,upgraded them ourselves to cutting edge status and have our own aircrafts as well. Now what exactly is Pakistan's contribution in Jf-17 project?

More than 50%. Designing phase was mostly our initiative. I know a few people on the original team who were in China ( team of 30+ engineers) and have a very good understanding of our contribution. And the SD-10 BVR was active a solid year before it was disclosed. Quite a lot of tidbits that we dont release for a reason. Makes it fun when you guys guess or put it down.