Military's role in the identity of Pakistan

[Shahmir]

This map is 100% wrong for Dogra speakers, to much area of west punjab included. Here is proper map of Punjabi dialects.

In central punjab, around our areas. There is group of people, others call them "changers" i think. They collect kachra, nomadic life style? Have very light features, speak punjabi. Which caste/tribe they belong to?

May be they are some kind of gypsies. Gypsies have diverse origins , they are tribes that lost their prestige at some point of time in the history and became nomadic and were regarded outcastes according to hindus I believe. Ranjeet singh also belonged to Sansi gypsy tribe, there are still many sansis in Gujranwala but are muslims and now claim to be jatts. Sansis trace their origin from bhatti rajputs though.

 

[Informant]

These dogras are better looking than any Punjabi or Pakistani I've ever seen

Then you havent seen Pakis yet

We are a sexy people, jk!

Hahah NOT

 

[Shahmir]

Yeah his eye shape is strange but his complexion would make him blend in. The girls looks like a typical punjaban though. They would probably be recognized once they speak though.

Aren't dardics more related to Tibettan and Central Asians? So they would have some mongoloid features no doubt.

Dardics (Gilgit, Chilas, Kohistan) are not related to tibettans. Only Baltis are mix of Dardics and tibetans. Dardics of Gilgit are related to dardics of Chitral (khowar people). Ironically kashmiris (from valley) are also dardics but they are the most desified dardics.

 

[Armstrong]

So @Informant do you speak Urdu like that Farooq Sattar meets Altaf Bhai kinda accent or do you speak Urdu like Punjabis do ?

Aur Bhai seh naraaaz haiii na tuuu ?

 

[jandk]

This guy look is quite common in dogras but no in Punjabis. Maybe little bit of mongloid? Kashmiri dogras are what 2 millon?

Dogras seem to have larger eyelids than punjabis or Kashmiris. Look at the girl's eyelids and the other people I have posted.

 

[Shahmir]

These dogras are better looking than any Punjabi or Pakistani I've ever seen

Some dogras are mixture of kashmiris (valley) and punjabis, but most are not different than pakistani punjabis from Gujranwala/Gujrat/Sialkot region. I have watched Doordarshan jammu since childhood, I know very well how dogras of jammu look like.

 

[Informant]

So @Informant do you speak Urdu like that Farooq Sattar meets Altaf Bhai kinda accent or do you speak Urdu like Punjabis do ?

Aur Bhai seh naraaaz haiii na tuuu ?

Urdu both styles. Though Karachi wali banani pardhti hai. If you hear me speaking Urdu then im Urdu speaking. If you hear me speaking Punjabi then I'm paindu.



Bhai bc Amreeka hogaya mere state nahin gaya. Afsoos.

 

[Armstrong]

Urdu both styles. Though Karachi wali banani pardhti hai. If you hear me speaking Urdu then im Urdu speaking. If you hear me speaking Punjabi then I'm paindu.



Bhai bc Amreeka hogaya mere state nahin gaya. Afsoos.

California bohat dooor thaaa !

 

[JammuWarrior]

May be they are some kind of gypsies. Gypsies have diverse origins , they are tribes that lost their prestige at some point of time in the history and became nomadic and were regarded outcastes according to hindus I believe. Ranjeet singh also belonged to Sansi gypsy tribe, there are still many sansis in Gujranwala but are muslims and now claim to be jatts. Sansis trace their origin from bhatti rajputs though.

Majority of Dogras are of Rajput origin.

 

[pakdefender]

aaah! thank you so much for letting me know this!
i didnt mean any connotation, but yes now i realize it...

@pakdefender

I do NOT hate Punjab, how can i???

Im sorry but i am not about to give my advisor's name here...

but, against my common sense, here's my university's card
there's this part "situación: pasante" pasante means i have finished all my classes, but I don't have a degree

you can edit your post and remove any personnel information or you can ask the mods to remove any personal information , its not required

as for your adviser, he is obviously an idiot

you should understand that the afghans just like Indians have animosity against Pakistan stemming from the birth of Pakistan , these two countries opposed Pakistan's creation and therefore they try to stir ethnic issues in Pakistan.

But your people wear dhoti, like hindus.

following is a very typical picture of farmers in Pakistani Punjab

the guy on the extreme left is wearing a lungi , which is not quite the same as how Hindus wear it , he is easily distinguishable from Indians , other in the picture are wearing shalwar kameez , which is the most commonly worn dress in Pakistan

 

[ghoul]

Azad Kashmiris are basically just dogras who happen to be muslim. Potoharis are also an extension of Azad Kashmiris as Potohari and Pahari languages are part of a single dialect continuum. I say this because majority of Potoharis and Azad Kashmiris are rajputs like the dogras, and the languages are pretty similar. Raja Rental from Gujjar Khan is a full blown dogra belonging to the minhas clan. Chakwal city was also founded by a guy from jammu called "chaudhary chaaku", and he too belonged to the minhas clan. His descendants are now known as "mair minhas" in Chakwal.

 

[JammuWarrior]

@waz
You may be interested in the last few pages of this thread.

 

[Shahmir]

Azad Kashmiris are basically just dogras who happen to be muslim. Potoharis are also an extension of Azad Kashmiris as Potohari and Pahari languages are part of a single dialect continuum. I say this because majority of Potoharis and Azad Kashmiris are rajputs like the dogras, and the languages are pretty similar. Raja Rental from Gujjar Khan is a full blown dogra belonging to the minhas clan. Chakwal city was also founded by a guy from jammu called "chaudhary chaaku", and he too belonged to the minhas clan. His descendants are now known as "mair minhas" in Chakwal.

Again BS, Azad kashmiris are either pothohari or hindkowan depending on whether they are from southern or norhtern parts of Azad kashmir. You dont know the dogri dialect, it is quite different from pothohari or hindko.

 

[jatt+gutts]

May be they are some kind of gypsies. Gypsies have diverse origins , they are tribes that lost their prestige at some point of time in the history and became nomadic and were regarded outcastes according to hindus I believe. Ranjeet singh also belonged to Sansi gypsy tribe, there are still many sansis in Gujranwala but are muslims and now claim to be jatts. Sansis trace their origin from bhatti rajputs though.

ranjit singh wast a sansi...sansis are like mirassis in Punjab.

 

[Shahmir]

ranjit singh wast a sansi...sansis are like mirassis in Punjab.

But they are not mirasis in Gujranwala. Different tribes have different social status in different places. You said the same about low status of Gujjars in indian punjab, but in Gujranwala division Gujjars are quite numerous and have same social status as jatts with respect to land holding.