Kargil : Indian Army's operation "Vijay" was ineffective

[313ghazi]

You now comparing Pakistani Armed Forces to rebels in a civil war?

You're now ignoring the Syrian army in its own civil war?

 

[The Maverick]

this is the bitter truth from.pakistanis who are in media military politics and the know
I believe this more than any one in the forum.

you sent thousands,of northern.infantry to peaks,with out supply lines or support or resupply or even exit strategy.

India bofars and mirages pounded them.to smithereens.

you left their bodies on the peaks

no proper plan

your own people's words,

disaster

 

[VkdIndian]

Stop avoiding my question.

Did India succeed in operation vijay?

You will have to stop twisting a fact to make it believe that India lost an operation because one peak has remained disputed.

It has been clarified by the then Chief of the Army Staff of India. So stop behaving as of you have made a discovery and India lost the entire operation.

Pakistan was comprehensively beaten by the Indian Defence Forces.
Pakistan PM went running to US.

Yes, Op Vijay was the reason for all this and it was a great success.

 

[PradoTLC]

Two Decades After Kargil: Lasting Legacies for Pakistan – South Asian Voices

Pakistan’s conduct during Kargil has had lasting legacies for the country’s politics, its image in the world, and Indo-Pak relations.

southasianvoices.org

A successful and winning army that left its dead behind.

indians lied a lot during Kargil, every thing from accusing PA using chemical weapons, to doing prayer for the dead (PTV caught you on that) to claiming we don't claim our dead.

only a fool believes any thing out of india

Pakistan was comprehensively beaten by the Indian Defence Forces.

in your heads sure.

then again your PM modi claimed nothing happened in Gulwan...

Op Vijay was the reason for all this and it was a great success.

in the words of Brain Cloughly " a horrible failure"

 

[VkdIndian]

indians lied a lot during Kargil, every thing from accusing PA using chemical weapons, to doing prayer for the dead (PTV caught you on that) to claiming we don't claim our dead.

Ok. Indian media is lying. What about your generals and the international media.

Strategic Analysis: Pakistans Fourth War

ciaotest.cc.columbia.edu

A big problem with you all is that you are all opportunists. When a media report is same as your propaganda amd narrative, it becomes a good source. Otherwise entire world is against you all.
In the entire international media everyone has said clearly the status of Kargil amd its impact on your country.

Creating these threads amd spreading lies would work only for your own population. Kargil took your nations credibility into the ground. By creating these threads and spreading lies you hope to change that fact?

We will see. Good luck.

 

[The Maverick]

kargil.is,celebrated as a victory in India
in pakistan it lead to.a military coup within cease,fire of kargil
and we get vedio like this by Pakistani politicians openly admitting ideas a,botched mushraff plan who did not even inform.the entire govt or air Force

 

[VkdIndian]

indians lied a lot during Kargil

Ohh. That was so bad.

Pakistan was playing such a pious and pure game and India didn’t play it in the same spirit. Pakistan was caught lying and with its pants down by the entire world to see and here you are accusing India of lying?

You are a nation in which your Army Chief lied to the PM and kept him in dark. They lied to other services about the extent of that operation. They lied to the entire world about the irregulars fighting the war.
And here you are accusing India of lying.

Dont make people laugh some more by making foolish comments.

 

[PradoTLC]

Ok. Indian media is lying.

correction.. your state also

You are a nation in which your Army Chief lied to the PM amd kept him in dark.

a narrative believed by fools...

Nawaz had fully supported the operation, when indian planes where shot down like flies and indian infantry getting raped left right and centre he was all there to cash in the popular wave of rally....

only when American turned on the heat did he his U turn begin and his famous blame game....

Dont make people laugh some more by making foolish comments.

I agree... Indians of all people have plenty of experience in this field

India : We shot an F-16

World: No...

 

[PradoTLC]

They lied to other services about the extent of that operation

so did the indian army tell indian navy there were going to seize Pakistan's Siachen?....

 

[Windjammer]

The other side of Kargil story which the Indians are never shown or don't want to see.

Smoke rises from Indian telecommunications relay center in Kargil after getting hit by Pakistani artillery shelling. 1 June 1999

Bullseye. Indian artillery guns position on fire after getting hit by Pak artillery fire. 6 July 1999

Pak artillery shell strikes Indian supply barracks as Indian Army trucks pass through. 6 July 1999

Indian supply road comes under Pakistani shelling. The capture of different strategic Indian posts had cut off their supply route to Siachen glacier.

Smoke rises from Indian Army post hit and destroyed by Pak artillery. June 1999

Pak artillery strikes Indian Army barracks. June 1999

Indian soldiers carry the body of Lt Col R Vishwanathan of 18 Grenadiers who was killed in an attack on Point 4590 on 2 June 1999.

Captured and abandoned weapons of Indian Army at display.

 

[Rakesh]

correction.. your state also



a narrative believed by fools...

Nawaz had fully supported the operation, when indian planes where shot down like flies and indian infantry getting raped left right and centre he was all there to cash in the popular wave of rally....

only when American turned on the heat did he his U turn begin and his famous blame game....


I agree... Indians of all people have plenty of experience in this field

India : We shot an F-16

World: No...

If your country's establishment was in mess and you army and PM was not on the same page it was not our fault.
Musharaff was head of state for many years, how many operations did he plan to liberate Kashmir ?

 

[PradoTLC]

lease explain what these Pakistanis are saying

these Pakistanis on other topics also said Indian Army is a criminal organisation which mass murders, rapes, oppresses, tortures, forces people in sham election (all true).

do you accept that also?..

please confirm.

Musharaff was head of state for many years, how many operations did he plan to liberate Kashmir ?

he put forth many proposal to finalize a soiution , india as always never wanted peace.

make no mistake we have no regrets about Kargil..... 2000+ indian soldier were removed from Kashmir , that mean 2000 less soldiers available to murder Kashmiris and at least billions $ lost to india.

 

[Tornado23]

You will have to stop twisting a fact to make it believe that India lost an operation because one peak has remained disputed.

It has been clarified by the then Chief of the Army Staff of India. So stop behaving as of you have made a discovery and India lost the entire operation.

Pakistan was comprehensively beaten by the Indian Defence Forces.
Pakistan PM went running to US.

Yes, Op Vijay was the reason for all this and it was a great success.

Finally. You answered my question. How hard was that? Not very?

1) we currently hold 4 out of the 8 peaks we captured to this day, namely

Point 5353 (as you know)
Aftab 1
Bunker ridge
Saddle ridge

2) operation vijay was aimed at retaking ALL the posts that were occupied by Pakistan and to expel the Pakistani prescense in the vicinity.

You havent taken back all posts as 4 out of the 8 are in our control, which ultimately means you haven't expelled our prescense from the area. Which means both objectives of operation have failed.

Pakistan to date has those peaks and is currently sitting on top of them.

Thus operating vijay was a failure which ultimately means India did NOT win the kargil war.

If we talk about causalties

Pakistan NLI suffered some 453 shaheed during the war

Indian military suffered 549+ (official Indian account, to be taken with a mountain of salt) upto 3000+ casualties (as per the book Kargil: between the fault lines (can't remember the proper name of the book if that isn't it) with another 4000 receiving permanent disabilities, alongside 2 iaf fighters shot down/lost and another heli shot down...

It wasn't a victory for you... At all

 

[Windjammer]

​ ​

Pakistan occupying six Indian peaks, claims MP ​ Josy Joseph in New Delhi Pakistan is occupying at least six strategically located Indian peaks in the Kargil sector along the Line of Control, claimed Rajya Sabha member and senior criminal advocate R K Anand. Basing his arguments on several documents and "authoritative sources", Anand said on Wednesday that these are strategic peaks from where Pakistani forces have a commanding view of the Srinagar-Leh highway, Drass helipad and several other military installations. There was no immediate reaction from the army headquarters. Anand named the Pakistan occupied Indian peaks as: Point 5353 (Map reference: 490644), Point Aftab-I (499642), Point Saddle Ridge (525638), Point Bunker Ridge (548639), Shangruti and Dhalunag. "Point 5353 is very strategic. In 1992-93, the then corps commander (of India) decided to make a shift pocket on this point and sent personnel there by helicopter. The officers posted there successfully cut off the entire supply to the Pakistani pockets along the LoC for nearly two months," he said. The capture was in retaliation of Pakistani attacks on several Indian posts including the national highway from Srinagar to Leh. He said the Indian Army then claimed that point 5353 is "within our LoC and that we have every right to patrol the area." He said this point offers a 40-kilometre view of the Pakistan side and from the Indian side an attack could be launched on Drass and the Drass-Kargil road. However, in January-February of 1999, Pakistan troops occupied Point 5353, along with several other strategic posts. These intrusions led to last year's Kargil war. He said Indian troops had tried to capture Point 5353 on May 18, 1999 when army operations were beginning in Operation Vijay in Kargil last year. But it failed. He said, the operation was carried out by a team of soldiers led by Major Navneet Mehta. He gave reporters a copy of the two-page report prepared by the young officer for his seniors on the failed operation. In that report the major has explained the reasons why an attack on Point 5353 was difficult. "It is not possible to carry out an assault from the northwestern, western and south western approaches," the officer pointed out. Anand also made available a wireless message of May 19, 1999 where it says "attack on 5353 called off due to bad weather" and that "13 OR (other ranks) injured in Maj Navneet's Pl (platoon) due to difficult trn (terrain)". If the army's argument that Point 5353 was never India's is to be accepted, then "why did they launch the attack?" he asked. Recent media reports about Pakistan occupying Point 5353 on Indian side of LoC was rubbished by the army headquarters and Defence Minister George Fernandes. Both refused to acknowledge that any Indian post is in Pakistani control. Anand, who was elected to the Upper House as a member of the Jharkhand Mukti Morcha, said, even Parliament has been told that there are no peaks under Pakistani occupation. He said Point 5353 is "300 to 500 metres inside our territory". "It looks like our army commanders are wrongly briefing the defence minister," he said when Fernandes' statement was pointed out. "The defence minister mislead Parliament on the basis of the briefing by army officers," Anand said, while demanding action against senior army commanders. He said the Director General of Military Operations had no idea what was happening along the LoC. Similarly the corps commander during Operation Vijay too had no idea of the dimensions of the Pakistani gameplan. The army chief too is unaware of the situation, he said. "Instead of holding them responsible, you promote them and give them awards," he said. Whe asked why the army and government was allowing Pakistan to occupy the peaks, and did not regain it last year, Anand said there were various reasons. "They wanted to finish the war as early as possible as elections were coming. And they thought nobody will come to know," he said. On the army's reluctance, he said if they launch operations to take back these peaks, there will be a full-fledged war with Pakistan. However, he said Indian forces should take immediate steps to protect national integrity. Besides, a fact-finding team of five Parliamentarians should be constituted to go to the LoC to verify the facts. Anand has repeatedly served notices for calling attention motions, special mentions in the Rajya Sabha on these intrusions by Pakistan. But despite repeated attempts the matter was not taken up for discussion, he said. Anand said he also wrote to Fernandes calling his attention to the matter. But he did not get any reply. The army too has been struggling to convince the media that Pakistan does not occupy even a single post on the Indian side of the LoC. In fact senior army officers have been holding special briefings for select groups of journalists after reports appeared that Point 5353 of India is with Pakistan. Officials at army headquarters said they were studying Anand's statement.

 

[PradoTLC]

not pretty or glory for your country clearly

Najam sehti also said when NLI was withdrawing as per the Clinton plan, india army being the rascal force it is open fired on them. The bulk of NLI casualties was because of that... thank you for confirming that to us.