JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 7]

[Tempest II]

Systems like SNIPER and ASELPOD are based on mid-IR optics, optimized for air-to-ground and limited air-to-air stuff as mid-IR detects engines in afterburners only. Long-IR in contrast works both for afterburn phase as well metal body glow/friction heat. So long-IR is the material for advanced IRSTS aboard modern Western jets. Russian and Chinese are not there so far . In my opinion, going for a mid-IR sensor is no-no and if PAF has decided against it for JF-17 Block3, it's a wise decision.!

Can you quote the frequencies of wavelength for the various systems coz what I am finding suggests the are all (Russian and European) in the 3-5 and 8-12 range?

https://defenseissues.net/2015/06/16/airborne-irst-properties-and-performance/

... PIRATE is a dual-band system (3-5 and 8-10 microns) ...
... OSF is an optical sensors suite used by Dassault Rafale. It consists of an IRST sensor and a video camera. Like PIRATE, its IR sensor is dual-band, using 3-5 and 8-12 micron bands. ...

 

[MastanKhan]

Systems like SNIPER and ASELPOD are based on mid-IR optics, optimized for air-to-ground and limited air-to-air stuff as mid-IR detects engines in afterburners only. Long-IR in contrast works both for afterburn phase as well metal body glow/friction heat. So long-IR is the material for advanced IRSTS aboard modern Western jets. Russian and Chinese are not there so far . In my opinion, going for a mid-IR sensor is no-no and if PAF has decided against it for JF-17 Block3, it's a wise decision.!

Hi,

---where did that come from---.
All modern 4 - 4.5 gen aircraft have a dedicated IRST right in front of the canopy on the nose---part of the aircraft and not modular.

The Paf had already stated that when they were designing the aircraft 15 years ago---they did not think it would be important and they did not acknowledge its utility and its importance---. This was stated over 10 years ago---.

and we have discussed it to death for a decade.

 

[Dazzler]

KLJ-7A AESA, estimated T/R modules = 1100

Comparison with other notable Aesa radars..

 

[volatile]

IRST offers a stealth mode of detection against enemies as you dont need to switch on the radar and avoid detection , IRST and is tactics are pioneered by Russians and when Sukhoi platforms were engaged with EFT (If my memory serves me right) the IRST play havoc on typhons since Flankers switched off there radars and enjoy tracking EFT each and every move ,after that Europ realizes the significance of IRST system and now they are trying to incorporate ,US has different tactics and they work more on network centricity concept for them an individual plane is as good as system and they have many alternate source of detection , PAF i guess made a mistake by not incorporating this as fixed above radar as doctrine is missing and we are going to see a repeat of JFB

Here is an example how IRST can passively detect

An other example is stealth detection

 

[graphican]

KLJ-7A AESA, estimated T/R modules = 1100

View attachment 445820




Comparison with other notable Aesa radars..

View attachment 445821

I find the shape of radar is that of F-16 C/E Pattern instead of FA18. Modules could be 1500 in number instead.

 

[CombatSurgeon]

Hi,

WTF---where did that come from---. My apologies in advance--.

All modern 4 - 4.5 gen aircraft have a dedicated IRST right in front of the canopy on the nose---part of the aircraft and not modular.

The Paf had already stated that when they were designing the aircraft 15 years ago---they did not think it would be important and they did not acknowledge its utility and its importance---. This was stated over 10 years ago---.

and we have discussed it to death for a decade.

Hi
First, you didn't need open your comment with a WTF.
Second, not all modern fighters carry IRSTS since birth. Some do get it after plastic surgery. E.g F-14D, F-16 Block60, F-15s for Korea and KSA, late variants of Super Hornets, Gripen E/F etc. So we could call them modular. Check Legion pod, btw.
Third, PAF had no plans for an IRSTS originally. Ditto for Pressure Breathing System, CFTs, HMS and Gen 5 Heaters. Some current trends dictate otherwise, however. Let's see if we alter our thinking in response or if money available, or both!
Another matter is, no PAF jet carries a Gen 5 IR missile. If it's not been acquired yet despite ops requirements, who'd order an IRSTS, that too a limited capability one?

 

[MastanKhan]

Hi
First, you didn't need open your comment with a WTF.
Second, not all modern fighters carry IRSTS since birth. Some do get it after plastic surgery. E.g F-14D, F-16 Block60, F-15s for Korea and KSA, late variants of Super Hornets, Gripen E/F etc. So we could call them modular. Check Legion pod, btw.
Third, PAF had no plans for an IRSTS originally. Ditto for Pressure Breathing System, CFTs, HMS and Gen 5 Heaters. Some current trends dictate otherwise, however. Let's see if we alter our thinking in response or if money available, or both!
Another matter is, no PAF jet carries a Gen 5 IR missile. If it's not been acquired yet despite ops requirements, who'd order an IRSTS, that too a limited capability one?

@Khafee , @gambit what is your assessment of these comments.




Today at 12:29 AM#3919

 

[ziaulislam]

@Khafee , @gambit what is your assessment of these comments.




Today at 12:29 AM#3919

the answer to fifth gen seeker is easy
its not available for f16 and jf-17 doesn't has full capacity to take in such system without HMS and still its not avaiable but sooner or later chinese system will be here

are pakistani looking at south africa or turkey, i dont know both are in developments too

 

[CombatSurgeon]

For JF-17 Block 3, most things aren't ready or available despite all the hype! AESA, HMS, PL-10/A-Darter/Gokdogan, EW suite.
Lets see what turns up eventually.

 

[araz]

For JF-17 Block 3, most things aren't ready or available despite all the hype! AESA, HMS, PL-10/A-Darter/Gokdogan, EW suite.
Lets see what turns up eventually.

Firstly welcome to the PDF community. Secondly please write an introductory post which would be helpful for people to know your expertise. If you are ex forces personnel please indicate that so the necessary miltary professional status can be assigned to you.
Lastly a gentle request, please press reply to the post you are answering as it helps us old fogies getting what the post was in response to.
Kind regards.
A

 

[Amigator]

Mastan Khan Found in Pakistan Army.

Watch at 15:20
@MastanKhan @Zarvan @fatman17 @Horus @ziaulislam @Khafee @gambit

 

[Kompromat]

Block III is basically a sensor upgrade to bring the jet into 4+ generation category so it can integrate any off the shelf advanced weapon or accessory.

For JF-17 Block 3, most things aren't ready or available despite all the hype! AESA, HMS, PL-10/A-Darter/Gokdogan, EW suite.
Lets see what turns up eventually.

 

[CombatSurgeon]

Firstly welcome to the PDF community. Secondly please write an introductory post which would be helpful for people to know your expertise. If you are ex forces personnel please indicate that so the necessary miltary professional status can be assigned to you.
Lastly a gentle request, please press reply to the post you are answering as it helps us old fogies getting what the post was in response to.
Kind regards.
A

Sir, thank you for welcoming me. I'm a flight surgeon, and no, I'm not ex-service. Quite the opposite, I'd say.
I tried to reply to a few of my posts but I got the reply that since number of my posts are scarce I'd have to wait.

 

[Ultima Thule]

For JF-17 Block 3, most things aren't ready or available despite all the hype! AESA, HMS, PL-10/A-Darter/Gokdogan, EW suite.
Lets see what turns up eventually.

PL-10 is available and inducting into PLAAF (A-darter) in development AESA in advance phase of development, WS-13 (already tested on JF-17), and another option is RD-93MA offered by Russian and rest gadgets are in different phases of development

 

[princefaisal]

For JF-17 Block 3, most things aren't ready or available despite all the hype! AESA, HMS, PL-10/A-Darter/Gokdogan, EW suite.
Lets see what turns up eventually.

Of course everything would be of Chinese origin.