JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 7]

[MastanKhan]

DSI hides engine blades making for a very low frontal RCS as most reflections are due moving engine blades and most air to air BVR engagement are head on it matters

Hi,

People are just talking down the JF17 more out of habit than tactical / engineering design reasons---.

Some people have compared it to the upgraded mig21 or the russian single engine design or the super 7---and that is far from the truth---. And many of these people are engineers or engineering students---.

What they don't understand is that there is an inherent difference in flight characteristics of a FLY BY WIRE AIRCRAFT and a NON FLY BY WIRE 50 years old design---.

When Gripen's flight characteristics and design is considered---it is compared to the Rafale and Eurofighter---and not even the Viggen because of different flight characteristics---. Even though the Viggen preceded Gripen.

The Jf17 is an excellent aircraft for its size and utility and could not have given a bigger bang for the buck than it did---.

Even though I would rather have a 25% larger aircraft---but that does not diminishes the utility and function of what the JF17 can do---.

 

[razgriz19]

What do they mean by ‘commercial’ standards?

https://www.thinkdefence.co.uk/2012/10/naval-v-commercial-shipbuilding-rules-2/

 

[syed_yusuf]

Hi,

People are just talking down the JF17 more out of habit than tactical / engineering design reasons---.

Some people have compared it to the upgraded mig21 or the russian single engine design or the super 7---and than is far from the truth---. And many of these people are engineers or engineering students---.

What they don't understand is that there is an inherent difference in flight characteristics of a FLY BY WIRE AIRCRAFT and a NON FLY BY WIRE 50 years old design---.

When Gripen's flight characteristics and design is considered---it is compared to the Rafale and Eurofighter---and not even the Viggen because of different flight characteristics---. Even though the Viggen preceded Gripen.

The Jf17 is an excellent aircraft for its size and utility and could not have given a bigger bang for the buck than it did---.

Even though I would rather have a 25% larger aircraft---but that does not diminishes the utility and function of what the JF17 can do---.

I totally agree with you well said but I still think that this plane is missing 1-2 hard points. This plane should have been 100% made in Pakistan at least the airframe. Engine should have been assembled in Pakistan to start with and gradually replacing all parts with home grown ones. Pakistan should have the intellectual right on the engine too . All of the above is achievable and should have been achieved too. If not now but definitely in near future if possible

 

[StormBreaker]

I totally agree with you well said but I still think that this plane is missing 1-2 hard points. This plane should have been 100% made in Pakistan at least the airframe. Engine should have been assembled in Pakistan to start with and gradually replacing all parts with home grown ones. Pakistan should have the intellectual right on the engine too . All of the above is achievable and should have been achieved too. If not now but definitely in near future if possible

The real deal would be a Turkish Block of Thunder having everything of Turkish origin except for Maybe AAMs and HMDs. Something like that should happen, this will prove Pakistan’s equal rights over the program.

 

[ghazi52]

 

[ABBASIA]

I totally agree with you well said but I still think that this plane is missing 1-2 hard points. This plane should have been 100% made in Pakistan at least the airframe. Engine should have been assembled in Pakistan to start with and gradually replacing all parts with home grown ones. Pakistan should have the intellectual right on the engine too . All of the above is achievable and should have been achieved too. If not now but definitely in near future if possible

Dear China is still struggling in some domains you mentioned above, with Pakistan's current industrial base and R&D culture, this is what we could do presently.

 

[Tipu7]

100 meter ships , 4 ready ships , we can equip the Herba and other Local Ammo on the Ships in few months and these would be operational very quickly

@Tipu7

Difficult to not consider these

Installing Pakistan's made systems on ship is easier to do

• Installation of Herba missiles (Cruise Missile)
• Installation of Locally made Radar for Ships
• The ships already have existing Air Defences

Integration of modern systems on an outdated non modular platform is not a practical idea.
The age of ship is too little to justify the purchase even if its free of cost as its operational costs will far exceed than our budgetary limits.
There is no "extreme emergency" for adding surface vessels just for sake of giving sailors ride in sea.

Yes, its very easy to ignore away such outdated piece of equipment.

 

[Talon]

New tail art,old one was better imo.This is just a picture from Google I think.

 

[Windjammer]

The high standard of workmanship is evident in this headshot of the JF-17.

 

[Armchair]

well overall I think workmanship can improve to Gripen level if Kamra tries a little harder.

 

[Adam_Khan]

New tail art,old one was better imo.This is just a picture from Google I think.

View attachment 608279

True that,looks like there is no creativity left.

 

[Windjammer]

well overall I think workmanship can improve to Gripen level if Kamra tries a little harder.

Gripen > SAAB Founded 1937....Over a dozen types produced including, 105, Draken, Viggen, Gripen and Erieye .
JF-17 > PAC Founded 1971....Mashak, K-8 and JF-17.
Let's just override 35 years of experience difference.

 

[araz]

Gripen > SAAB Founded 1937....Over a dozen types produced including, 105, Draken, Viggen, Gripen and Erieye .
JF-17 > PAC Founded 1971....Mashak, K-8 and JF-17.
Let's just override 35 years of experience difference.

I think it is more than that.Pakistanis in general do not pay attention to details and consequently just lag behind the curve when it comes to their products. It has always been the quality vs quantity debate.However they hare reducing the numbers of Block3s to 12. Let us see whether it improves their quality any further.Either case we have come a long way since we started along this route in early 2000s

 

[StormBreaker]

I think it is more than that.Pakistanis in general do not pay attention to details and consequently just lag behind the curve when it comes to their products. It has always been the quality vs quantity debate.However they hare reducing the numbers of Block3s to 12. Let us see whether it improves their quality any further.Either case we have come a long way since we started along this route in early 2000s

Not 16 per year ?
That’s sad !!!
I think it has got to do with production costs being much higher than Block 2, per unit.

 

[MastanKhan]

I totally agree with you well said but I still think that this plane is missing 1-2 hard points. This plane should have been 100% made in Pakistan at least the airframe. Engine should have been assembled in Pakistan to start with and gradually replacing all parts with home grown ones. Pakistan should have the intellectual right on the engine too . All of the above is achievable and should have been achieved too. If not now but definitely in near future if possible

Hi,

That is a UTILITY & DESIGN function---. Basically it is what it is---.