JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 5]

[araz]

Sir,

I just saying that we as a Nation, abslutly not investing in Research & Development of New Ideas in all the Fields of Milltary!

Danish

Danish.
Do you have any idea what the budget of big companies involved in R&D is and how much money is involved in getting a new product to the stage of maturity so it can be inducted . To give you an example, China has just invested 20-30 billion into engine research in the last 3-5 yrs and we are still 3-5 yrs away from producing a reliable engine which can compare favourably with the western engines. Even a small item like a new missile would easily set you back a couple of Billion if not more. Then you have to have the necessary infrastructure and metallurgical and composite base to manufacture. Then there is a problem of taking risks as the product may not be up to the mark and may need to be ditched in favour of a readily available product.
One odf the reasons why JFT has been a success is because PAF has chosen a risk averse design without any adventurism and utilized of the shelf technologies.Compare that with the J10 which has been 15 yrs in the making and then too without a local engine.
It is easy to say that we should be inbvolved in research but when it comes to the nitty gritty you realize ythat till you establish the base technologies, your overheads will be so much that the product may not be worth the effort. So in theory it is good, in practice we are a long way away from that stage. Lets talk again in 20 yrs or so with sustained and positive developments.
Regards
Araz

we are doing research in the field of miltary .........the new jf17 block 3 is also going to have a stealth coting....slowly this research will also expand in other fields............for now , we also have some other problems to finish like terrorism..corruption....and foreign egressions...u see india daily fires on borders and afghanistan on saying of india fires on our border....u know we have to first finish these things from our country then we should go for education and research.

Usman.
Sorry to burst your bubble but the problems facing Pakistan are far more complex and will not be anywhere near a solution even in a decade. Unless we have a radical change in Governments and a sustained and constant direction of movement and that in its own self may not be allowed, we will still be here discussing the same old things in a decade. By the way a lot of what you are saying will be done in China for us and we may not be able to progress as much as you seem to htink although I do admit we are doing things very sensibly and systematically.
Araz

 

[FunkyGen]

Sir,
I just saying that we as a Nation, abslutly not investing in Research & Development of New Ideas in all the Fields of Milltary!
Danish

Lol I put forward a suggestion of developing surveillance and armed quadcopters..... They call me crazy

 

[Chak Bamu]

Lol I put forward a suggestion of developing surveillance and armed quadcopters..... They call me crazy

@FunkyGen , if I were you I would be embarrassed by that conversation. Icarus 'owned' you in that one and your ego just did not allow you to admit that you were wrong in your assertions. Bringing that in this thread just dropped you a couple of notches in my view.

Please everyone quit OT. This conversation has nothing to do with the thread. I need not go on. Should someone wish to go on with this conversation, another thread should be used, not this one.

 

[FunkyGen]

@FunkyGen , if I were you I would be embarrassed by that conversation. Icarus 'owned' you in that one and your ego just did not allow you to admit that you were wrong in your assertions. Bringing that in this thread just dropped you a couple of notches in my view.
Please everyone quit OT. This conversation has nothing to do with the thread. I need not go on. Should someone wish to go on with this conversation, another thread should be used, not this one.

Owned.... yeah..... Embarrassed..... NO.....
MY idea flawed..... Yeah...... The whole thing Impossible..... NO......
I do accept that i'm egoistic which is something i actually don't want to be but i guess i'm just born that way, hard wired. But there is something that i know about myself, i accept reality. Reality IS given the kind of non innovative atmosphere in our country proposals like these are made fun of, which ain't that bad. But the reality is also that armies saw countries develop nukes, they wanted it,armies saw countries develop helicopters, they wanted them, now unless some country or military does it, we're gonna be in the dark about the said tech. and it's uses. But if we put some R&D who know something might come out of it.... but yeah i'm not the right kind of person to talk about it, i was just hoping i would find that "innovator" here and maybe we could talk, sadly it turned out the opposite.
I accept my knowledge about that particular subject is flawed but harbouring an idea even if flawed doesn't embarrass me. Back to the topic, any news about the JF being used in ops? any videos?

 

[Chak Bamu]

Owned.... yeah..... Embarrassed..... NO.....
MY idea flawed..... Yeah...... The whole thing Impossible..... NO......
I do accept that i'm egoistic which is something i actually don't want to be but i guess i'm just born that way, hard wired. But there is something that i know about myself, i accept reality. Reality IS given the kind of non innovative atmosphere in our country proposals like these are made fun of, which ain't that bad. But the reality is also that armies saw countries develop nukes, they wanted it,armies saw countries develop helicopters, they wanted them, now unless some country or military does it, we're gonna be in the dark about the said tech. and it's uses. But if we put some R&D who know something might come out of it.... but yeah i'm not the right kind of person to talk about it, i was just hoping i would find that "innovator" here and maybe we could talk, sadly it turned out the opposite.
I accept my knowledge about that particular subject is flawed but harbouring an idea even if flawed doesn't embarrass me. Back to the topic, any news about the JF being used in ops? any videos?

Boundaries are important in life. Threads have boundaries dictated by their titles. I am sorry I caused you to write the above post by picking on you. Please do not reply to this post. Let us be done with OT.

 

[Drebin]

View attachment 38009

What missile is Thunder carrying? And thanks for the nice upload.

 

[TheFlyingPretzel]

What missile is Thunder carrying? And thanks for the nice upload.

CM-400 AKG

 

[nomi007]

 

[aliyusuf]

Does anybody have any information of the Rate of Roll of the Thunder?

 

[Bilal.]

To add to @aliyusuf's question, what are the instantaneous and sustained turn rates of JFT?

 

[Arsalan]

I am sorry may be i should not be posting it here but since it concerns JF-17 in a way, any android game lovers here? just came across a JF-17 game application for android, Thunder Rider and believe me, this is THE BEST air warfare game i have come across on android till now. Thumbs up to the developer and this is a mist play for all JF-17 and android game lovers

Does anybody have any information of the Rate of Roll of the Thunder?

This is not a statistic that will be available in form of a firm number. You can only compare the rate of roll of JF-17 with other aircraft and that will give you an idea of how good or bad it is. You will find some videos and can use them to have an idea. The rate of turn compared to F-16 video is very common and is available almost everywhere on the internet once you start looking for it.

As for my personal point of view, JF-17 is a quite maneuverable platform in its category/league. I mean, LCA with its delta wings in ought to be highly maneuverable and as per some video comparisons available, JFT is right up there. It can be seen out maneuvering F-16 in some comparison videos (Turn rate), this have also been stated by PAF pilots and sources on a couple of occasions.
Most importantly, the man that matters, the pilot or pilots flying JF-17 have been reported extremely satisfied by the agility and control of JF-17 on numerous occasions.

 

[Usman Ali 1999]

Danish.
Do you have any idea what the budget of big companies involved in R&D is and how much money is involved in getting a new product to the stage of maturity so it can be inducted . To give you an example, China has just invested 20-30 billion into engine research in the last 3-5 yrs and we are still 3-5 yrs away from producing a reliable engine which can compare favourably with the western engines. Even a small item like a new missile would easily set you back a couple of Billion if not more. Then you have to have the necessary infrastructure and metallurgical and composite base to manufacture. Then there is a problem of taking risks as the product may not be up to the mark and may need to be ditched in favour of a readily available product.
One odf the reasons why JFT has been a success is because PAF has chosen a risk averse design without any adventurism and utilized of the shelf technologies.Compare that with the J10 which has been 15 yrs in the making and then too without a local engine.
It is easy to say that we should be inbvolved in research but when it comes to the nitty gritty you realize ythat till you establish the base technologies, your overheads will be so much that the product may not be worth the effort. So in theory it is good, in practice we are a long way away from that stage. Lets talk again in 20 yrs or so with sustained and positive developments.
Regards
Araz


Usman.
Sorry to burst your bubble but the problems facing Pakistan are far more complex and will not be anywhere near a solution even in a decade. Unless we have a radical change in Governments and a sustained and constant direction of movement and that in its own self may not be allowed, we will still be here discussing the same old things in a decade. By the way a lot of what you are saying will be done in China for us and we may not be able to progress as much as you seem to htink although I do admit we are doing things very sensibly and systematically.
Araz

dear araz i agree that a good government is going to change all this ... and u will see that soon pakistan is going out of difficulties...u see problems r solved one by one not directly every problem is being solved......and one thing more that china is doing its best an ally can do ......its engineers r killed in pakistan and thier people still loves pakistan ......u can see that these complex problems r created by us ... so who is going to solve these problems the answer is us....

 

[dexter]

Russian air Cheif checking up the JF 17 Thunder cockpit.

 

[Usman Ali 1999]

commander of the qater emiri air forces examining cockpit of jf 17 thunder...

 

[fatman17]

JF-17B Dual-Seat

JFT Blk-II

JFT Assembly line - Kamra