JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 4]

[sancho]

Initially i heard it will be a retractable probe, however it seems we might get the fixed one.

What happened to the Swedish refuelling probe that would be added by the end of last year?

ive posted a pakdef pic of a probe a few pages earlier-- i dont know what kind of probe will be present in jft.. but i speculated it would be a retractable one atleast on the ''stealthy'' varient-- as fixed one increases rcs , as in the case of rafale fighters, in which fixed were built solely on the requirement of french airforce [dessault was against it]

Actually they took a fixed probe to reduce maintenance, because the benefit at fighters that carries external payloads (fuel tanks, pods, bombs, missiles) is limited and Dassault is stating it even on their website, that it was a feature to ensure reduced maintenance.

 

[razgriz19]

sancho i dont think there was ever a swedish probe for thunder...


and the probe PAF will put on thunder wont be retractable, because there's barely enough space in the nose area. and like sancho said it will be cost effective compare to retractable!

 

[Dazzler]

What happened to the Swedish refuelling probe that would be added by the end of last year?

So if it is fixed not retracted, does that change the origin of probe? It was displayed at two IDEAS shows and is bought from Sweden along with some other goodies.

 

[sancho]

sancho i dont think there was ever a swedish probe for thunder...

That's what I think as well, especially because the Gripen has no Swedish probe, but an English from Chobham (just like the Vixen 1000 radar is not Swedish, but italo / english), but Nabil hat different infos, that's why I asked.
A fixed probe is not bad at all and can be changed later as well, also the retractable probe don't have to be in the nose area, or integrated directly in the nose like the following examples shows:

Gripen:

F16 IN:

Eurofighter:

These could be future solutions for JF17 as well, but I guess it will depend mainly on China and what kind of solution they have for J10 to increase the commonality between both. The CFT + fuel prob solution could be interesting as well, because it adds several improvements in a single change. More internal fuel, mid air refuelling capability, more hardpoints available for weapons.

So if it is fixed not retracted, does that change the origin of probe? It was displayed at two IDEAS shows and is bought from Sweden along with some other goodies.

Depends on how reliable your inofficial infos/sources from last year really were.

 

[nightcrawler]

I vote for this configuration...very well adopted even for novice pilots

 

[SQ8]

I dont see the JFt getting conformals in the near future.. not a requirement..
The fixed probe offers several cost advantage..
first.. no moving parts.. well duh.
No hydraulics.. no joints.. nothing.
In the simplest sense..it needs a socket to fit into..
and naturally weighs less.
Now.. how does a fixed probe fit into the RCS arena..
well. it doesnt.. it sticks out like a sore thumb..
Which is why jets emphasizing frontal RCS reduction such as the EF use a retractable probe.
The Rafale use of the fixed variety may have to do with the French using cost savings measures on what .. (till now).. is a commercial failure.
Block II onwards.. one would expect to see a fixed probe on the JFt..
by the time we get to Block III.. it is hoped a retractable solution is found.. optimistically by the Chinese.. so that it conforms to the planned RCS reduction features expected in that batch.

 

[Dazzler]

That's what I think as well, especially because the Gripen has no Swedish probe, but an English from Chobham (just like the Vixen 1000 radar is not Swedish, but italo / english), but Nabil hat different infos, that's why I asked.
A fixed probe is not bad at all and can be changed later as well, also the retractable probe don't have to be in the nose area, or integrated directly in the nose like the following examples shows:

Gripen:

F16 IN:

Eurofighter:

These could be future solutions for JF17 as well, but I guess it will depend mainly on China and what kind of solution they have for J10 to increase the commonality between both. The CFT + fuel prob solution could be interesting as well, because it adds several improvements in a single change. More internal fuel, mid air refuelling capability, more hardpoints available for weapons.




Depends on how reliable your inofficial infos/sources from last year really were.

I don't boast in thin air. This was displayed by Swedes in IDEAS 2006, 2008 and tested/ bought by PAF for JFT. Notice the retractable lines....

 

[Dazzler]

here is Gripen probe. Notice the front portion has the same color and dimension as shown in IDEAS. It also had the banner of "Swedish Air Refueling probe". Amazing how conveniently visible things become vague.

 

[Dazzler]

I can give plenty more info/ pics only to prove the Probe is supplied by SAAB and has an option of retraction. Anyone interested in knowing more??

 

[Dazzler]

This was posted by Mr. Asif Amin who has been known as a person having first hand info on military issues. He is also a regular visitor at IDEAS since long.
Here are his words...


hello all
Thank you for your comments ease notedown, what in possibly we purchase or we r intrest( 21th nov exibition first day & my basic target is Pakistan ),
===Air refuling probe who aredy installed on Gripen, will fitt on JF17 & J-10 & may be possible Mirage 3/5 fighters...
===Air refuling supply system will be fit on new C-130 ( not C-130J), Ukrani IL76 second candidate for PAF requirment, PAF only use 2 or 1 plate form for air refuling supply, because 96 F-16 can not macth this system.
===PAF more choic for air to air missile, IRIS-T, A-DARTER, MICA-IR, SidwinderAIM-9\L-M , and chinese missile, for BVR R-DARTER, AMRAAM, MICA, METEOR, & SD-10's also offer,
=== IRIS-T or Sidwinder-L/M +AMRAAM for F-16, --- A-DARTER, Sidwinder L, SD-10,or R-DARTER for JF-17/F-10 airrafts,----- A-DARTER, Sidwinder L, R-DARTER, or MICA for mirage fleet.
===L-I59 will be part of PAF requirment & FT-5 replace with possibly L-159
===Tiger & Roivalk helicopter candidate for PA requirment ,
===Aspide 2000 and very new IRIS-T SL SAM system are candidate for Airdefence requirments.

 

[Dazzler]

This pic shows the ROSE3 cockpit but what is significant is the HMD system. For those who think HMDS is an issue, it is not...

 

[Dazzler]

Better angle of Swed refueling probe and wingtip launch rail......

 

[Dazzler]

inside view of wingtip launch rail......

 

[razgriz19]

oh my bad then i thought the probe was a chinese version....

and one more thing this is a trainer aircraft for varyag, looks like its based on j-7. (found the pic in some chinese gov magazine), one noticable thing is its front looks like earlier prototype of thunder and maybe just maybe the twin seater thunder might look like this as well...

 

[MilSpec]

Question :- Is the JF 17 developed from the Project 33 or from the Project Sabre II ??