JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 2]

[kiuppal]

guys check this out

AeroScale :: 1/48 JF-17 Thunder from Trumpeter

 

[Munir]

Wrong belly tank...

 

[mean_bird]

Translation courtesy of hmmwv from CDF

I'm way too tired to do a translation so here are a few points.
1. This is pretty much a summary of the FC1 program, some history stuff that we've heard many times.
2. 42 kits will be delivered in 3 years, it'll take Pakistan up to 3 and half years to assemble them.
3. A contract of an additional 100 unit will be signed in the coming years.
4. R&D of FC1 is not done yet, potential customers request a complete package, China has no problem selling BVR weapon with FC1.
5. General performance is comparable with F16A/B, avionics is comparable to F16C/D Block 50, with basic datalink capability.
6. Uses MIL-STD-1760 bus (improved 1553 bus), fully compatible with western weapons.
7. CAC is working with engine suppliers to increase RD93 thrust to 91.1kn, and possible VTC nozzle.
8. Current payload is 3.6t, next goal is to increase that to 5 to 6 ton.
9. Next variant will include IFR capability and WSO seat.

 

[SBD-3]

nice piece of info.where did you get this one from?

 

[Munir]

1. This is pretty much a summary of the FC1 program, some history stuff that we've heard many times.
2. 42 kits will be delivered in 3 years, it'll take Pakistan up to 3 and half years to assemble them.

The expected 10-25 a year but three and half year seems to a bit long but it does sound logical... We have 8. 50-8=42. PAC is busy since beginning 2009. Say 10 till end 2009... Then 15 till 2010... Then 17 till 2011...

3. A contract of an additional 100 unit will be signed in the coming years.

They are doing some alterations in model and the avionics are improved.

4. R&D of FC1 is not done yet, potential customers request a complete package, China has no problem selling BVR weapon with FC1.

Well, a customer is crazy if he buys unfinished product... Tehy cannot afford that during war the plane shows problem or that they only can use dumb bombs.

5. General performance is comparable with F16A/B, avionics is comparable to F16C/D Block 50, with basic datalink capability.

F16A is very agile but lacks good weapons and ecm.

6. Uses MIL-STD-1760 bus (improved 1553 bus), fully compatible with western weapons.

Well, I can provide more info on that:

http://ams.aeroflex.com/ProductFiles/AppNotes/MILSTD1760c.pdf

7. CAC is working with engine suppliers to increase RD93 thrust to 91.1kn, and possible VTC nozzle.

Thrust is important...

8. Current payload is 3.6t, next goal is to increase that to 5 to 6 ton.

It has to compete with planes with 5 to 6 ton ordnance...

9. Next variant will include IFR capability and WSO seat.

PAF will get this in the first 50.

 

[Tempest II]

The most revealing part here is that the avionics are comparable to F-16 Block 50s. That is the APG-68 = 150km range. Even if it 120, that is still much better than the 75km published by Janes.

 

[sancho]

7. CAC is working with engine suppliers to increase RD93 thrust to 91.1kn, and possible VTC nozzle.

Sounds just like the Mig 35 engine (around 90Kn thrust and 3D TVC), if so I bet Zhuk AESA will come too.
I had this feeling that they will offer these techs to China if we won't go for Mig 35 and for commonality you could use it in JF 17 and J10B too. Wouldn't be a bad decision, cheap and capable!

 

[Munir]

I think you answered the questions correct. No matter India will decide (or delay) the result will be that all other parties will love to sell to Pakistan. As long as JF17 does not compete Mig29 versions it will have the option to absorb Russian technology. If that means selling to Pakistan (indirectly from China) the Russians do not care. They no longer need India to finance their military programs nor did they like the attitude of IAF when going for western parts (certainly this re-elected government will push to do)...

 

[Arsalan]

I think you answered the questions correct. No matter India will decide (or delay) the result will be that all other parties will love to sell to Pakistan. As long as JF17 does not compete Mig29 versions it will have the option to absorb Russian technology. If that means selling to Pakistan (indirectly from China) the Russians do not care. They no longer need India to finance their military programs nor did they like the attitude of IAF when going for western parts (certainly this re-elected government will push to do)...

infact the JF wont ever come in mig29's way because both these are on dofferent tracks! russia wont mind giving technology to pakistan when approached jointly with china as the joint export potential to both china and pakistan is doucle then india's!
also the the JF programme wont spoil the mig29 customers as it is a single engine light multirole aircraft where as the Mig is a medium weight matured fighter aircraft! the price marlet for both the jets is also very different!
all in all i hope we can get our hands onto ssome very fine russian technology if we pursue it in colaboration with china!

 

[Munir]

Russian-Indian relationship are in trouble...

>>>Russia yields after Antony burst
OUR SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT

New Delhi, June 4: Upset with an India that is increasingly turning westwards to source its military hardware, Russia has promised to scale down the prices it has demanded and has come up with assurances of steadier supplies.

Indian defence secretary Vijay Singh returned this morning from Moscow where he led a team of officials to a meeting of the India-Russia High-Level Monitoring Committee. The Russian side was led by the Director-General of Military Services, Dimitriev.

Russia is by far the largest supplier of military equipment to India, and nearly 65 per cent of the Indian armed forces’ hardware is of Russian or Soviet origin. Annual military purchases from Russia total between Rs 15,000 crore and Rs 20,000 crore. India is Russia’s largest buyer.

The Russian assurances come after an outburst by defence minister A.K. Antony last week at a public ceremony in the presence of the Russian ambassador. The defence minister expressed his “anguish” at the frequent delays in the delivery of hardware.

“There is now an awareness in Russian industry of the competition they have to face (in India),” a senior defence ministry official said here today. He said there was an acknowledgement in the discussions that there were “bottlenecks and delays”.

Russia indicated that it was willing to look at a downward revision of the price that it had demanded for the aircraft carrier, the Admiral Gorshkov.

Russia had demanded an additional $2 billion for refurbishing the carrier after the vessel was contracted by India in 2004 for $964 million. India was willing to pay a total of $2.2 billion but Moscow kept insisting on a total of $ 2.9 billion.

In the latest round of meetings, however, Moscow has indicated it is willing to compromise, senior officials said. A firm price will be contracted again by July.

Last week, India paid up another $102 million for the carrier. So far, it has paid a total of $602 million.

The delivery of the carrier, being negotiated since 1997, has also been delayed. “It is floating,” an official said, to indicate that work has progressed enough. The carrier is not likely to be with the Indian Navy before the end of 2012.

The Russians were upset that the Indian Air Force had chosen Airbus’s MRTT refueller aircraft over the Russian IL-78, the senior official said. The Indian government has not yet decided the choice of refueller.

The IAF’s mid-air refueller squadron is currently made up of Russian IL-78 aircraft but air headquarters has preferred the Airbus in trials.

“Whatever decision is taken (on which refueller to buy) will be taken on sound commercial and technical grounds,” the senior defence official said. To override the Indian Air Force’s choice, however, would be difficult.

The official said the talks related to product support, supply of spares for old equipment, upgrade of MiG-29s with the IAF and transfer of technology for the T-90 tanks for the Indian Army.

 

[Arsalan]

Russian-Indian relationship are in trouble...

>>>Russia yields after Antony burst
OUR SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT

New Delhi, June 4: Upset with an India that is increasingly turning westwards to source its military hardware, Russia has promised to scale down the prices it has demanded and has come up with assurances of steadier supplies.

Indian defence secretary Vijay Singh returned this morning from Moscow where he led a team of officials to a meeting of the India-Russia High-Level Monitoring Committee. The Russian side was led by the Director-General of Military Services, Dimitriev.

Russia is by far the largest supplier of military equipment to India, and nearly 65 per cent of the Indian armed forces’ hardware is of Russian or Soviet origin. Annual military purchases from Russia total between Rs 15,000 crore and Rs 20,000 crore. India is Russia’s largest buyer.

The Russian assurances come after an outburst by defence minister A.K. Antony last week at a public ceremony in the presence of the Russian ambassador. The defence minister expressed his “anguish” at the frequent delays in the delivery of hardware.

“There is now an awareness in Russian industry of the competition they have to face (in India),” a senior defence ministry official said here today. He said there was an acknowledgement in the discussions that there were “bottlenecks and delays”.

Russia indicated that it was willing to look at a downward revision of the price that it had demanded for the aircraft carrier, the Admiral Gorshkov.

Russia had demanded an additional $2 billion for refurbishing the carrier after the vessel was contracted by India in 2004 for $964 million. India was willing to pay a total of $2.2 billion but Moscow kept insisting on a total of $ 2.9 billion.

In the latest round of meetings, however, Moscow has indicated it is willing to compromise, senior officials said. A firm price will be contracted again by July.

Last week, India paid up another $102 million for the carrier. So far, it has paid a total of $602 million.

The delivery of the carrier, being negotiated since 1997, has also been delayed. “It is floating,” an official said, to indicate that work has progressed enough. The carrier is not likely to be with the Indian Navy before the end of 2012.

The Russians were upset that the Indian Air Force had chosen Airbus’s MRTT refueller aircraft over the Russian IL-78, the senior official said. The Indian government has not yet decided the choice of refueller.

The IAF’s mid-air refueller squadron is currently made up of Russian IL-78 aircraft but air headquarters has preferred the Airbus in trials.

“Whatever decision is taken (on which refueller to buy) will be taken on sound commercial and technical grounds,” the senior defence official said. To override the Indian Air Force’s choice, however, would be difficult.

The official said the talks related to product support, supply of spares for old equipment, upgrade of MiG-29s with the IAF and transfer of technology for the T-90 tanks for the Indian Army.

now this may well be our chance to pop in!!
get some JF 17's better engine order going with the russian and we can very well sort out some place for our self in moscow!!
regards!

 

[MastanKhan]

now this may well be our chance to pop in!!
get some JF 17's better engine order going with the russian and we can very well sort out some place for our self in moscow!!
regards!

Hi,

Are you familiar with the russians---do you think that they will come to our party and if you do----why so!

 

[Arsalan]

Hi,

Are you familiar with the russians---do you think that they will come to our party and if you do----why so!

yes sir i think it to be very much possible!
first of all its all about money now! i have mentioned earlier that the weapon export potential of pakistan and china together is more than two times that of india so considering the russian unhappy with indian behaviour we can very well get our hands onto there system when we follow the deal jointly with china!
this was for the money issue!

secondly russian may well be very happy to join hands with us as russia,china and pakistan form a very strong and important regional strategic chain!
the soviets attacked afghanistan to find a way to the arabian sea's warm water, why not give them access to it as a friendship gift! the strong ties between pakistan and russia will be equally good for both the countries, we get some high end systems and they get the love of therte life! the Warm Water Sea!!

also china russia iran and pakistan naturally form a stron alliance against the incerasing US influence in the region!

what do you think!

regards!

 

[a1b2c145]

handsome pics!

 

[wangrong]

They are old pics

Because the FC#6 is better than FC#4