JF 17 is The Wrong Omnirole Aircraft For PAKISTAN

[rockstarIN]

It fits well with PAF defensive doctrine.

Every AF would love to have jets with more range and take up more role in strike inside enemy territory, thus relieving logistics as well as stress on front line fighters. I do not think that PAF have more aggressive plans but to add more assets to the defensive assets. IAF wanted the Tejas to have long legs enough to use it against PLAAF's future lower end jet, i.e, J-10. Just think JFT have more or less same range to the F-16 or near to it? It will be a grave situation for IAF.

 

[abdulbarijan]

Babu Saab in that thread and master quote, he was just a messenger. that wisdom came out from Pakistani fanboy

I know that sir, (which is why I specifically said "the article Mastan sb Quoted" --- In fact it wasn't a Pakistani fanboy responsible for that article in the first place .. It was a western writer whose article appeared on yahoo news feed -- I think it was titled "how chinese expert fighter jet designers avoid American mistakes" where the author Robert ... something was making such statements ....

ofcourse all of our fanboys jumped and rejoiced on that one ... but what else can we expect ... not every one is in to defense ... and sensational statements like those are alot easier to believe in looking at how we as a nation crave sensationalism in more or less everything ...

 

[ghauri05]

Many people were predicting SU-35 for PAF...in near furture.....i really want to know...what are the chances of happening that???
Response from senior members will be appreciated!!!

 

[Lavrentiy]

We should not be disappointed with the JF-17 considering that it would replace the Mig-21 copies (F-7) and Mirage 3 and 5 which are already too old.

Anything would be better than operating 1950-60 era jets. At least the air force would not suffer from lack of spare parts especially once the Chinese engine is available.

Rather than wasting money on buying small numbers of advanced jets, the air force must aim for indigenous production of avionics and air-frame components.

 

[al_asad_al_mulk]

Many people were predicting SU-35 for PAF...in near furture.....i really want to know...what are the chances of happening that???
Response from senior members will be appreciated!!!

Either Russia or Pakistan not interested to sale or buy it is just a fanboy's wish reasons for that
1-India is big arms purchaser, Russian don't want to make India angry.
2-Pakistan have no support infrastructure or maintenance capability to operate Such Fighter, even maintenance cost is very high.
3-Pakistan don't have budget for that even from USA we get military hardware as a aid or soft loans.
A few from many reasons
Even Russia worried to supply JF-17 engines after Chinese intervention they supplied even Russian air chief personally inspected JF-17 to make sure it is not a market threat for their own MIG-29.

 

[CHI RULES]

The fighter bombers like Panavia Tornado or Jh7b are much better bombers however in air to air combat shall be same like Mirage -III or Mirage V. Not good in maneuverability. So in modern world rich countries which either have limited threats or going against weaker adversaries these are good jets. However there is no question abt that PN especially requires medium to heavy true fighter/bombers but in limited numbers for deep penetration. This tole can only be suitably fulfilled by Chinese Jets like J16 or J11D latest variants which have semi stealth capabilities, have AESA radars/IRST for anti stealth capabilities, effective EW suites and high ceiling. They may prove to be much better in manueverability being developments of Su27 series.

In case of Jf17 it is still developing and may prove to be challenging even ag 4.5 th gen fighter jets in present condition, however in future block-III as expected shall have AESA and IRST features to tackle 5th gen Fighter Jets. One may guess that even with addition of AESA and Irst along with some stealth fetures it may be cheaper from J31 may be availble in price Tag of 30-35 Million USD per plane meanwhile estimated price of J31 is around 65M USD to 70M USD.

We have to fulfill numbers of defensive platforms for which Jf17 block-II and block three may prove to be more beneficial. Even in future at best we may go for J16 for naval role but can't afford to use J31 in all roles.
One I may guess has purposefully mingled light developing jet with already matured platforms. Even Panavia Tornado is on verge of retirement.

One thing is right that we should have block III JF17 equipped with AESA radar.IRST with some stealth fetures to make it compete with the best of our enemy in defensive posture. For offence on land we should rely on J31 but not in case of Navy,

The question is there that if J20 and J31 are near to finalization stage why Chinese experts still developing new versions of J11 and J10. Answer is simple to fulfill the numbers as even countries with strong economies shall not be able to fully rely on 5th gen jets.

 

[ghauri05]

Either Russia or Pakistan not interested to sale or buy it is just a fanboy's wish reasons for that
1-India is big arms purchaser, Russian don't want to make India angry.
2-Pakistan have no support infrastructure or maintenance capability to operate Such Fighter, even maintenance cost is very high.
3-Pakistan don't have budget for that even from USA we get military hardware as a aid or soft loans.
A few from many reasons
Even Russia worried to supply JF-17 engines after Chinese intervention they supplied even Russian air chief personally inspected JF-17 to make sure it is not a market threat for their own MIG-29.

so what's he option for PAF,in sense of air superiority fighters...we can't rely on F-16,jf-17 for the rest of our lives.
And it will be diffcult n time consuming to induct j-31(once it's an official reality).....what options are we left with???

 

[al_asad_al_mulk]

so what's he option for PAF,in sense of air superiority fighters...we can't rely on F-16,jf-17 for the rest of our lives.
And it will be diffcult n time consuming to induct j-31(once it's an official reality).....what options are we left with???

My personal opinion is J-31 will be purchased, because other heavy fighters based on Russian fighter and using Russian engines, Russia will not allow sale to Pakistan. Even Chinese efforts to sale J-10 to Pakistan objected by Russia. Currently P.A.F don't have any more interest in J-10 because its performance is equal or inferior to F-16 which P.A.F have in good numbers. We don't have enough funds to support same generation planes of different origins. Till the time when J-31 available for sale.

 

[Lavrentiy]

We have to fulfill numbers of defensive platforms for which Jf17 block-II and block three may prove to be more beneficial. Even in future at best we may go for J16 for naval role but can't afford to use J31 in all roles.

Absolutely correct. At the moment, the PAF is busy bombing the militants in FATA etc. The PAF doesn't need 5th Generation fighters to bomb Taliban!!

Strategically, the chances of a full-scale conventional war with India are extremely low. However, the instability on the Western border is a matter of concern especially when the ISIS garbage is presenting itself in Afghanistan.

Air dominance can take a back seat for some years. Improvements in CAS capability is a more pressing issue.

 

[shah1398]

never make such posts again. read up the JF-17 info poll and understand why it is classed in medium light category. then check up the specs of the llikes ot J10B or J11s etc and understand what they are for.
your posts are meant to make a case about your counter argument. not demanding others to do work for you so that you can reject them without understanding or make another one liner off topic remark.

Sir plz refer my post as i was asking as why and on what basis Sir MastanKhan concluded that Saab-2000 and system onboard it were inferior to ZDK AWACS bcz i can not find anything like that. JF-17, J-10s etc were not the topic of discussion there.

 

[Godman]

My personal opinion is J-31 will be purchased, because other heavy fighters based on Russian fighter and using Russian engines, Russia will not allow sale to Pakistan. Even Chinese efforts to sale J-10 to Pakistan objected by Russia. Currently P.A.F don't have any more interest in J-10 because its performance is equal or inferior to F-16 which P.A.F have in good numbers. We don't have enough funds to support same generation planes of different origins. Till the time when J-31 available for sale.

can the J-31 stand up to HAL FGFA?

PAK FA seems to be way ahead of the Chinese so HAL FGFA is based on it

 

[Eagle Claw]

By working with Chinese does not mean PAF has changed her approach or doctrine that is based on Western style of warfare. While Chinese may not physically see what is in Blk-52, Pakistani pilots are their eyes and ears and they continuously get useful feedback on improving their systems, particularly those that are made jointly and for PAF. Secondly, it is always good to let the world recognize your technology and capabilities as inferior for war is all about surprises.

We are stuck in same F-16s but their are alot more potent and capable platforms emerged out there.
I am not questioning the Capabilities of F-16, It has ruled the Skies for many years but That era is Over now.
We should move forward to look for more potent Heavy Duty Fighter Jets.
Regarding Thunder, Only 1 thing will work if we change it From LCA to Medium MRCA.

 

[syedali73]

We are stuck in same F-16s but their are alot more potent and capable platforms emerged out there.
I am not questioning the Capabilities of F-16, It has ruled the Skies for many years but That era is Over now.
We should move forward to look for more potent Heavy Duty Fighter Jets.
Regarding Thunder, Only 1 thing will work if we change it From LCA to Medium MRCA.

I guess there are no two opinions on that we do need some twin engine long range fighter bomber. As far as JF-17 is concerned, with the availability of a better engine, it sure will transform from a light to medium weight fighter just lie F-16 or Gripen did. The punch line here is a better engine for without one, it is not going to happen.

 

[Eagle Claw]

I was wondering that is it possible that PAF/PAC takes Assistance from Mig Corporation Regarding JF-17 Thunder Block 3 and Block 4 ?
It will be valuable if get some sort of Input from them in This Jet !
Secondly sooner this Bird is Changed to Medium MRCA, the better it will be for PAF. Extra Hardpoints and Airframe Modifications will be needed and hence we can take Assistance regarding this from Mig Corporation.

 

[Godman]

HAL FGFA still not conceived yet but J-31 is a reality let see when HAL give birth to that lady. In past people comparing JF-17 and LCA but what happen DRDO still pregnant with that child and people are predicting LCA's still berth on the other hand JF-17 grows young battle proven and won first export order.

But keep in mind that most joint Indo-Russian projects went really well like the Brahmos missile

the LCA is a failure