Jahangir Tareen's new party to be named ‘Istehkam-e-Pakistan’

[SaadH]

Istehkam doesn't roll of the tongue as easily as insaf, will fail just on that count.

 

[lightning F57]

Another party to "split" the vote bank to ensure no party has a large share to change the governance structure.

So looks like rinse repeat madness continues, last nearly 80 years has born the same result which is economic mess and more instability later on in the future. The establishment are not pro pak that is very clear to see.

 

[Asimzranger]

more like Intakam-e-Pakistan

 

[PakAlp]

PPP and Pmlq must be upset, they were ready to take all the ex PTI MNAs MPAs to gain alot of seats in Punjab. If this party fails then they will join PPP and Pmlq. Mustafa Kamal made the PSP for a few years, when it failed he started to sing Mqm songs again. PMLN has 100 Strong candidates in Punjab so they're okay with it. Its the most strongest party in Pakistan.

100+ ex PTI MNAs MPAs are leaving.

 

[Kaniska]

Has it occurred to anyone that maybe, just maybe the PTI leadership cadre is tired of us. vs. the rest of the world narrative?

Is it possible that despite their counsel to IK to build bridges, they have been completely stone-walled and thus this sudden convergence (not with PML, not with PPP, but yet another party)?

Is it possible that people in PTI realize that not everyone across the aisle is NS, SS, Zardari and maybe some muk-mukka can be had for stability ?

Honestly, it's easy to declare all these people sellouts and shame them when none of us personally have been put in the vice that many of these folks were put in. What has anyone sitting in the UK/US/Gulf lost while egging folks on to a bloody revolution?

The situation on hand reminds me of the interview that happened around December timeframe with Shuja Nawaz with WSK where he had said that Army can handle this situation and he was attacked by the entire PTI base online saying "buddha sathiya giya hai" and that "he is not in touch with the ground reality" etc. By this I am not stating that PTI's street power was not formidable but it was also not ready to go all the way and the establishment has known this all along.

At this juncture, the extra-constitutional powers have ascendancy so IK/PTI need to regroup, plan for a come-back (this is Pakistan so never say never).

Our economy needs breathing space (not that I have any confidence in Dar), but what else can be done at this juncture.

Unfortunately, in South Asia, democracy is all about how much half-educated and loyal followers can be aligned to your party. If someone brings a revolution with new ideas, the status quo is broken. So none of the established player will support.

 

[blain2]

PPP and Pmlq must be upset, they were ready to take all the ex PTI MNAs MPAs to gain alot of seats in Punjab. If this party fails then they will join PPP and Pmlq. Mustafa Kamal made the PSP for a few years, when it failed he started to sing Mqm songs again. PMLN has 100 Strong candidates in Punjab so they're okay with it. Its the most strongest party in Pakistan.

100+ ex PTI MNAs MPAs are leaving.

Thus the opportunity for PTI to make a comeback. We mustn't forget the dismantling of PML-N in not too distant a past.

 

[mangochutney]

So kind of the Army to hand pick our future leaders for US .

 

[PakAlp]

Thus the opportunity for PTI to make a comeback. We mustn't forget the dismantling of PML-N in not too distant a past.

But like @Meengla is saying, PTI and IK should back off for a few years, then when the new army leadership comes then make an agreement with them that they will not cross the red line. If they allowed Mqm, PmlN to come to power then they will allow Pti aswell.

PmlN is in similar place as Pti, Nawaz Sharif was removed and exiled, Shabaz Sharif who is close to the establishment is the new leader and in power. We all laughed at NS for leaving but he had no choice, he would have been jailed, killed and party would have faced same consequences as Pti.

 

[M. Sarmad]

We mustn't forget the dismantling of PML-N in not too distant a past.

The assertion that the establishment has emerged victorious, resulting in the dismantling of PTI and IK, and the expectation of a return to normalcy, represents a profound misinterpretation of the current situation. Throughout our history, whenever the military undermined democratic processes, such actions were met with widespread support from the general populace. But now a remarkable departure from this pattern has taken place, as the current generation demonstrates an unprecedented skepticism towards the conventional narratives propagated by the military. They struggle to comprehend how a profoundly inept and deeply corrupt PDM, forcibly installed by the Army, can serve the best interests of Pakistan.

And an essential distinction, often overlooked by the boomers sitting in the GHQ, lies in the advent of social media. Unlike previous instances, the manipulation of public opinion is no longer a straightforward endeavor. The Army has unwittingly declared war against its own people, esp. the younger generation and overseas Pakistanis, it's a war in which victory is unattainable.

 

[Friday]

FOOL and hafeezmalik are hired as Party cheerleaders.

 

[Krayon]

Pakistan needs some stability in govt and policies. Hell nobody is even bothered about the budget in the biggest province of the country which does not even have a govt right now.

 

[blain2]

The assertion that the establishment has emerged victorious, resulting in the dismantling of PTI and IK, and the expectation of a return to normalcy, represents a profound misinterpretation of the current situation. Throughout our history, whenever the military undermined democratic processes, such actions were met with widespread support from the general populace. But now a remarkable departure from this pattern has taken place, as the current generation demonstrates an unprecedented skepticism towards the conventional narratives propagated by the military. They struggle to comprehend how a profoundly inept and deeply corrupt PDM, forcibly installed by the Army, can serve the best interests of Pakistan.

And an essential distinction, often overlooked by the boomers sitting in the GHQ, lies in the advent of social media. Unlike previous instances, the manipulation of public opinion is no longer a straightforward endeavor. The Army has unwittingly declared war against its own people, esp. the younger generation and overseas Pakistanis, it's a war in which victory is unattainable.

People have been harping over social media...so very respectfully, so what? Social media exists for Egyptian diaspora and opposition as well. How much has that been able to change the situation? Not much. There is a limit and SM is no replacement for what people/activists do on the ground. Another example, Turks on the ground did what they did without any significant SM campaign. So let's no over-pivot on the SM front because it will lead you to the wrong conclusions.

The single biggest change is that the social media has made the military leadership and its constituency more self-aware. As such, as PakAlp is suggesting, there is a possibility that a future military dispensation, sans incumbent CoAS, would realize that this current situation of Army vs. PTI base (read Punjab and KP predominantly..the recruiting grounds for the army) is not good for the country or the military and in order to achieve stability (regardless of what people say, this is the single most important thing for the establishment, they want stability and chaos checked) and opt for a democratic dispensation that is left to operate on its own. I have maintained, it takes one leader to set the course. We have examples like Asif Nawaz, Waheed Kakar, Jehangir Karamat who let the democratic dispensation run its own course (unfortunately it ran aground due to the acrimony between the then democrats) so there is hope.

So the above is somewhat of an optimistic view, but I think we need to give less credence to SM and more space to evolution within the system in place in Pakistan. Bloody revolution, always thrown around here, is not without its deep pitfalls.

 

[M. Sarmad]

People have been harping over social media...so very respectfully, so what? Social media exists for Egyptian diaspora and opposition as well. How much has that been able to change the situation? Not much. There is a limit and SM is no replacement for what people/activists do on the ground. Another example, Turks on the ground did what they did without any significant SM campaign. So let's no over-pivot on the SM front because it will lead you to the wrong conclusions.

The single biggest change is that the social media has made the military leadership and its constituency more self-aware. As such, as PakAlp is suggesting, there is a possibility that a future military dispensation, sans incumbent CoAS, would realize that this current situation of Army vs. PTI base is not good for the country or the military and in order to achieve stability (regardless of what people say, this is the single most important thing for the establishment, they want stability and chaos checked) and opt for a democratic dispensation that is left to operate on its own. I have maintained, it takes one leader to set the course. We have examples like Asif Nawaz, Waheed Kakar, Jehangir Karamat who let the democratic disposition to run its own course (unfortunately it ran aground due to the acrimony between the then democrats).

So the above is somewhat of an optimistic view, but I think we need to give less credence to SM and more space to evolution within the system in place in Pakistan. Bloody revolution, always thrown around here, is not without its deep pitfalls.

Firstly, the situation in Pakistan stands in stark contrast to that of Egypt, where, for seventy years, all presidents except Morsi had come from the military. Similarly, the case of Turkey involved a victorious general populace, aided by the Army and state institutions, thwarting a rebellious faction within the military. OTOH, Pakistan is witnessing the utilization of the entire state machinery to suppress democracy and the masses. If one perceives the absence of widespread public uprising against a heavily armed million-strong professional army as an endorsement of the military regime's actions, it indicates a severe disconnect from reality.

Secondly, mass movements do not materialize spontaneously, rather they undergo a gradual process of development influenced by various factors. Presently, the control over narrative-building lies predominantly within the realm of social media, and the anti-Army narrative has already attained levels higher than most of us realize. Those who believe that this sentiment will fade away on its own instead of evolving into processes that may surpass the Army's ability to contain are dwelling in a realm of wishful thinking.

 

[blain2]

Firstly, the situation in Pakistan stands in stark contrast to that of Egypt, where, for seventy years, all presidents except Morsi had come from the military. Similarly, the case of Turkey involved a victorious general populace, aided by the Army and state institutions, thwarting a rebellious faction within the military. OTOH, Pakistan is witnessing the utilization of the entire state machinery to suppress democracy and the masses. If one perceives the absence of widespread public uprising against a heavily armed million-strong professional army as an endorsement of the military regime's actions, it indicates a severe disconnect from reality.

Secondly, mass movements do not materialize spontaneously, rather they undergo a gradual process of development influenced by various factors. Presently, the control over narrative-building lies predominantly within the realm of social media, and the anti-Army narrative has already attained levels higher than most of us realize. Those who believe that this sentiment will fade away on its own instead of evolving into processes that may surpass the Army's ability to contain are dwelling in a realm of wishful thinking.

I did not say the narrative will fade. If anything, army is aware of it and they see this anti-army sentiment/content snowballing. Any officer with children is becoming aware of what is being said even if they themselves are not on SM.

However, I think the desired change won't necessarily come from outside, it will be more from within albeit shaped by all the abuse being piled on and the trust being so low with the army amongst a segment of the society.

On the other hand, this segment also needs to realize that targeting national security on SM will prolong this process of reconciliation because the military will rely on the anti-state rhetoric to fight back and there are ample supporters of the military as well. This would be a bad situation for all involved. There is a need to cool down and for all involved to take a step back. Doubt the hard-core on either side will pay heed but it will help move things forward.

 

[Gaomayaslayer]

SM Pakistan is the best name, Sugar Mafia Pakistan.

I thought sugar mafia is the nick name of N league.