Israeli air force destroys another two Pantsir SAMs in Damascus

[Yongpeng Sun-Tastaufen]

Yes. Pantsir and Buk-2 are most modern systems designed for missile defence.

No they are not. Buk M3 and S-350 I think are latest.

Israel faced most modern Russian air defences.

You use 100 km range missiles against 20 km range SAM. Woop di do. It's not different than what Russia bombers did to ISIS.

 

[500]

No they are not. Buk M3 and S-350 I think are latest.

Not operational.

You use 100 km range missiles against 20 km range SAM. Woop di do. It's not different than what Russia bombers did to ISIS.

1) I am talking about their inability to shoot down any bomb or missile despite all bragging.
2) Spice has about 50 km range, similar to Buk-M2. S-200 and S-300 have 250 km range.

 

[Yongpeng Sun-Tastaufen]

1) I am talking about their inability to shoot down any bomb or missile despite all bragging.

If SAM can shot down 100% of missiles then no point to make missiles is there?

2) Spice has about 50 km range, similar to Buk-M2. S-200 and S-300 have 250 km range.

SPICE 1000 range is 100 km. It's too small for S-300 to hit it.

 

[500]

If SAM can shot down 100% of missiles then no point to make missiles is there?

Russians claim that that shot down some 70-80% rockets each time. Thats hundreds and hundreds missiles. But they are lies.

SPICE 1000 range is 100 km. It's too small for S-300 to hit it.

Spice 1000 max range is 60 km (from max altitude and speed). From average altitude its less than 50 km. S-300 and S-200 can shot down planes from 250 km.

 

[Yongpeng Sun-Tastaufen]

S-300 and S-200 can shot down planes from 250 km.

They shoot planes, not bombs.

 

[ptldM3]

Yes. Pantsir and Buk-2 are most modern systems designed for missile defence.

No they aren't. I showed how that was a lie. The Syrian Pantsirs are already a generation old compared to the new Pantsir and in general the Pantsir is a budget system aimed at the export market. Russia has much better systems in development.

Minor improvement.

New Pantsirs have a different radar with up to 50% better capability, the missiles are also improved with greater range. We can safely also assume jamming capacities have improved as well.

You can work on death star too. Who cares.

Appearently Israeli does since it has a massive military espionage network and has hired thousands of Russian engineers to boost its weapons industry.

1) Israel attacked Pantirs twice: on 10 May after Iranians fired 20 Grads at Israel and on 21 January after Iranians fired another rocket at Israel. Both times they were easily destroyed. On all other instances Israel just ignored these useless systems.

Syrian air defense systems come in two. Short range systems that can not target Israeli aircraft due to range limitations and a handful of long range systems such as S-200 which are not capable of hitting low flying targets. Hence they were designed to hit high altitude targets and did their job when the Israeli F-16 climbed high enough to be exploited.

It's confirmed that Israel hit two Pantsirs, both were empty and Israel did it with standoff weapons and a swarm of them.

2) Pantsir failed to shoot down even a single missile or a bomb out of hundreds attacks

That is nonsense and has been debunked long ago.

Zero. Otherwise they would show them. They would also show Pantsir cam.

There is no such thing as Pantsir cam. I doubt anyone would place video stands and camera equipment inside a crowded air defense batteries during when its under attack.

When I served in tank in Lebanon we fired 3 rounds at any suspected target. Normal practice.

This is nonsense, the US released countless hours of strike footage from the Gulf War to now, they have never hit an air defense batteries or tanks with 3 missiles. Even Israeli footage shows 1 strike per target. Israel has a small military budget and small economy, they will not drop 2 or 3 bombs on a Pantsir. 1 bomb will do the job, so Israel using multiple munitions on air defense batteries indicates low confidence in a first shot first kill--hence they overwhelm systems.


Israeli footage:

US footage:

I don't see 2 or 3 bombs being dropped on a single small target.

Israel faced most modern Russian air defences.


Learn a bit:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Mole_Cricket_19

If you talk about Yom Kippur war, then Arabs lost 3-4 times more jets and tanks. Great victory for Russian weapons.

Israel hasn't faced a fully fledged network--keyword network or modern Russian systems since the 1960 and 1970s, and when they did they lost hundreds of aircraft.

Israel also used a massive propaganda campaign even Israelis now admit to it. You are also using Israeli claims, Arab claims as well as Russian claims do not add up to what Israel claims, the truth is probably somewhere in between. It's also standard knowledge that the Arabs had equal or in some cases better equipment then Israel, the difference is that Israeli forces used superior tactics, better intelligence, deception and better training.


Israeli also destroyed most Arab aircraft while they were on the ground, they also destroyed a lot of Arab armor from the air too. This has nothing to do with better equipment but rather batter planning.

 

[Yongpeng Sun-Tastaufen]

Israeli also destroyed most Arab aircraft while they were on the ground, they also destroyed a lot of Arab armor from the air too. This has nothing to do with better equipment but rather batter planning.

Better training too. Every Israeli gets military training. Also because White people are better than Arabs at war.

 

[500]

No they aren't. I showed how that was a lie. The Syrian Pantsirs are already a generation old compared to the new Pantsir and in general the Pantsir is a budget system aimed at the export market. Russia has much better systems in development.

Yes they are newest. Claiming that minor modification is generation is pure idiotism.

New Pantsirs have a different radar with up to 50% better capability, the missiles are also improved with greater range. We can safely also assume jamming capacities have improved as well.

All changed there is better search radar. Tracking and guidance radar is same (most important part), missiles are same. Overall Pantsir has outdated radio guided scheme, so u can;t improve its range.

Syrian air defense systems come in two. Short range systems that can not target Israeli aircraft due to range limitations and a handful of long range systems such as S-200 which are not capable of hitting low flying targets. Hence they were designed to hit high altitude targets and did their job when the Israeli F-16 climbed high enough to be exploited.

In order to drop a glide bomb u need to fly high.

So both Russian S-200/300 and Russian anti missile Pantsir and Buk failed.

It's confirmed that Israel hit two Pantsirs, both were empty and Israel did it with standoff weapons and a swarm of them.

Its nonsense. It took just one missile to take out Pantsir.

That is nonsense and has been debunked long ago.

That's lie. There is ZERO evidence that Pantsir managed to shot down any missile or bomb. Out of over thousand.

There is no such thing as Pantsir cam. I doubt anyone would place video stands and camera equipment inside a crowded air defense batteries during when its under attack.

You are unbelievable ignorant. Even ancient Osa had camera.

Here is camera of Pantsir on 17:58

This is nonsense, the US released countless hours of strike footage from the Gulf War to now, they have never hit an air defense batteries or tanks with 3 missiles. Even Israeli footage shows 1 strike per target. Israel has a small military budget and small economy, they will not drop 2 or 3 bombs on a Pantsir. 1 bomb will do the job, so Israel using multiple munitions on air defense batteries indicates low confidence in a first shot first kill--hence they overwhelm systems.

Here empty hill with couple ISIS guys hit by at least 4 guided bombs:

Its normal practice. You never served in the army its ur problem.

Israel hasn't faced a fully fledged network--keyword network or modern Russian systems since the 1960 and 1970s, and when they did they lost hundreds of aircraft.

In 1982 Israel faced modern Sovet multilayer SAM commanded by hundreds of Soviet officers. It was taken oyt without loses.

During Yom Kippur War Israel was surprised and lost 100 jets. Yet Arabs lost 3-4 times more. You consider it a super duper victory?

And not they were not destroyed on the ground.

 

[UKBengali]

@500

In 1982, the best that Syria had was the short-range s-8 which was made obsolete by S-300.
You Jews also had the latest US F-15s, F-16s and E-2 AWACs while Syria only had the Mig-23 and no AWACs. If Syria was given Mig-29 which was just coming into service, S-300 and had AWACs, then the battle would have been different.

 

[500]

@500

In 1982, the best that Syria had was the short-range s-8 which was made obsolete by S-300.
You Jews also had the latest US F-15s, F-16s and E-2 AWACs while Syria only had the Mig-23 and no AWACs. If Syria was given Mig-29 which was just coming into service, S-300 and had AWACs, then the battle would have been different.

MiG-29 was not operational in 1982. S-300 was total trash then. They supplied best they could.

 

[UKBengali]

MiG-29 was not operational in 1982. S-300 was total trash then. They supplied best they could.

Mig-29 came into service in 1982.
Who told you S-300 was trash in 1982 - it was a lot better than S-8 for sure.

 

[500]

Mig-29 came into service in 1982.

MiG-29 finished tests in 1984. First units achieved IOC in 1985.

Who told you S-300 was trash in 1982 - it was a lot better than S-8 for sure.

Early version of S-300 was poorly mobile and range of only 47 km. In same time it was super bulky and expensive.

Small mobile Kub had 25 km range and S-200 - around 250 km.

 

[Yongpeng Sun-Tastaufen]

So what? And Israel is a tiny puny country.

 

[ptldM3]

Yes they are newest. Claiming that minor modification is generation is pure idiotism.

Idiotism is making blank statements, erroneously confusing video cameras with display monitors and not fully knowing what happened.

All changed there is better search radar. Tracking and guidance radar is same (most important part),

http://www.worldinwar.eu/pantsir-s1/


Modernized system for the Armed Forces and for export. Incorporates news tracking radar, 2 faced radars with enhanced features and range. In service with Russia and Algeria.

missiles are same. Overall Pantsir has outdated radio guided scheme, so u can;t improve its range.

Unbelievable how you lie.....new Pantsirs have a new missile with more then double the range as well as increased detection range. Nice try.




The Pantsir-SM variant incorporates a multi-functional targeting station, increasing target detection range from 40 to 75 km (25 to 47 mi) and engagement range from 20 to 40 km (12 to 25 mi). The system also uses a new high-speed extended range missile.

In order to drop a glide bomb u need to fly high.

No you don't, 20,000-30,000 feet is plenty of altitude to drop glide bombs which would would take around 30 seconds or less for an F-16 to reach that altitude. Once they are dropped they would take a minutes to reach their intended targets, in the mean time Israel would give their advanced "warning" of a strike at that time F-16s would already be landing, well out of Pantsir reach and not enough time or altitude for S-200 be much of a threat.

Its nonsense. It took just one missile to take out Pantsir.

Here is video screen grab from one Israeli bomb aimed at an empty Pantsir. From the other side another Israel missile impacts the Pantsir, so even from Israeli footage they use multiple missiles to attack a single Pantsir which indicates low first hit probability but continue to make absurdities about how it's normal to use countless missiles to strike a single air defense battery.

That's lie. There is ZERO evidence that Pantsir managed to shot down any missile or bomb. Out of over thousand.

Apart from wreckage of Israeli missile I will just show this:


A missile exploded in the air and then you see an explosion on the ground which is 99% probably the Israeli warhead that failed to detonate when it was hit. Let me guess though, it's Assadist missile, Pantsir warhead magically explodes like 500lbs warhead. Other then that there is wreckage of Israeli bombs and F-16, but Syrian air defenses don't work and Israeli aircraft blitz Pantsirs with barrages of missiles for fun.

You are unbelievable ignorant. Even ancient Osa had camera.

Here is camera of Pantsir on 17:58

No you are ignorant and can't read appearently. Learn the difference between a display monitor and a camera.

This is my exact quote:


"There is no such thing as Pantsir cam. I doubt anyone would place video stands and camera equipment inside a crowded air defense batteries during when its under attack."



You mentioned a camera, and nothing about display monitors (don't put words in my mouth or try to wiggle your way out now) I then questioned as to why Syrians would place video cameras and equipment in a crowded air defense battery. If you read between the lines I was hinting as to why they would film their display monitors. I never denied Pantsir has display monitors, in fact I questioned why they would film them but it's amazing how poor of an argument you make and how you confuse simple terminology and then try to pin blame on me.

Besides even if Syrian wanted to show film as proof, thermal imagery has range limitations and is degraded by weather conditions. In other words sometimes range and cloud cover won't allow for a video to show any impact.

Here empty hill with couple ISIS guys hit by at least 4 guided bombs:

Its normal practice. You never served in the army its ur problem.

Again stop with the embarrassing claims. No one attacks a SAM battery with 2 or 3 missiles simultaneously if 1 will do the job. Bombing a hill side is completely different from hitting a Pantsir. On a hill side there could be groups of enemy fighters hundreds of yards apart, its necessary to use multiple strikes in those situations---not nessesary to use a million missiles on a single air battery if you are 100% confident on a first hit.

So far you proved nothing and have not shown a single video that proves its standard practice to launch multiple missiles at a single air defense battery.



Look at this, why are dumb Americans not dropping 2 or 3 bombs on this Iraqi AAA gun? Smart Israelis would have hit it with 20 missiles

In 1982 Israel faced modern Sovet multilayer SAM commanded by hundreds of Soviet officers. It was taken oyt without loses.

During Yom Kippur War Israel was surprised and lost 100 jets. Yet Arabs lost 3-4 times more. You consider it a super duper victory?

And not they were not destroyed on the ground.

You are again quoting Israeli figures, which have been known to make grand lies during war time. Also even if we take Israeli claims at face value, Israel destroyed hundreds of Arab aircraft on the ground. Nothing to do with technology but rather planning and training. Ask some Pakistani pilots about superior Israeli technology and pilots.

 

[925boy]

@500

In 1982, the best that Syria had was the short-range s-8 which was made obsolete by S-300.
You Jews also had the latest US F-15s, F-16s and E-2 AWACs while Syria only had the Mig-23 and no AWACs. If Syria was given Mig-29 which was just coming into service, S-300 and had AWACs, then the battle would have been different.

And also remember that even if we agree that ISrael has been succesfully attacking Syrian and Iranian targets, the real question is- What have these strikes achieved? In the short term, there's been material damage, but in the long term, there will be no effect.

Israel has no real war endurance. If 100K soldiers from Hezbollah, SAA and IRGC engage ISrael, the first thing ISrael will do is call US. i can bet every last $ on that. ISrael fought HEzbollah for 30 days and was asking US for resupply of smart bombs, so no doubt, even 50K islamic soldiers fighting ISrael wil mean Netanyahu flying to DC for "weapons stimulus". Iran knows this, and this is why ISraeli military technology only goes so far- when your enemy has a serious quantitative edge over you, your qualitative edge is eroded. WIthout US support, Iran will start war of attrition to wear Israel down yesterday.