Is India Panicking In Ladakh!

[Dustom999]

Meanwhile Chinese tailor seem to have measured the real chest size .
http://www.chinabankingnews.com/202...of-china-obtains-licenses-to-operate-in-india

 

[peagle]

Since you are so obviously new to facts, you might like to recall that against your own figures of approximately 2 million Afghan refugees in Pakistan, India hosted 10 million Bangladeshi refugees in 1971.

Unlike Pakistan, that was unable to do anything about it, India took steps to relieve the situation by creating conditions for the refugees to return home. Around 95% returned home within three months of learning that the situation was safe.



So sad that the process dictated the execution. But that is part of the learning process, and it is to be hoped that these betises will not be repeated.

As far as I am concerned, it matters little what font, what size and what colours you use; they are merely symptoms of mental and intellectual breakdown, and what is important is the facts that are sought to be conveyed within these clownish posturings.



Facts are facts, and your speculations will change nothing.

1. The Chinese had no American threat in mind; they knew that America was already involved neck-deep in the Cuban Missile Crisis and its aftermath, and that there would be no effective action by them.
2. American aid was in the shape of ammunition and small arms. Not a single piece of major equipment was given to India, unlike the fountains that washed Pakistan. Not one tank, not one aircraft, not one naval vessel. So instead of frothing at the mouth, you might like to make sense of what you are reading.
3. We were non-aligned then, we continued to be non-aligned, and we did not sell ourselves to the highest bidder at any given point of time, like others did. Egypt, for instance; you did realise that was the example that was in mind, right?

I doubt strongly that the avoidance of shooting by both sides since 1967 will be altered.




Would it be possible to build a register of Pakistani fan-boy advice to the Pakistani government and the Pakistan army on what to do in today's circumstances of apparent crisis for the Indian Army? It would come in very handy when later asking for a queue for them to step up and eat crow.



I see the PLA still where it was, with no effort made since the last confrontation.

Shearer you are dumb beyond measure, right now I have to apologize to myself for having thought you are a sensible Indian, I suppose they do not exist.

For one, I never quoted you any figures, so how can they be mine, if you mean Pakistani figures then say so if you mean Indian figures then say so. Please don't personalise a statement when it was not given by me.

Now to you stupid facts, it is not 2 million it was over 4 million registered and unregistered refugees, even now, the total number approaches 3 million, although it is going down now due to various steps.
Pakistan didn't do anything about it?????????????????? you do realize the Soviet Union, one of the most powerful countries in the world is no more, are you so slow that you cannot understand that Pakistan played an important role in bringing about an end that reality. If Pakistan had not stood up to the Soviets and bankrupted them in the process, it is very likely they would have carried on, with some reforms. The Russians recognize this, surely you can too.

Now regarding the so-called 10 million refugees out of East Pakistan, as you are too slow to understand and don't wish to potentially start another topic here, look at the census figures for Bangladesh before 71 and after, and you will realize how stupidly insane that 10 million figure sounds. Just because you people have kept repeating it, it does not make it real.

You are in Hyderabad, tell me how many hundreds of thousands of Muslims were killed 70 years ago, have some shame and decency, you should know better, accept facts as they are, and work towards a peaceful future. We all need recognise facts and move on.

 

[American Pakistani]

This from the character (I am being extremely polite not to fall foul of the Mods) who keeps repeating in a monotone that India has 700,000 soldiers in Kashmir.

A real expert we have here.

So after 1 year you still trying to figure. While I have already gave you links after links as well as videos where Pakistani military and civilian leaders have stated there are 7 lakh Indian occupier in IOK?

Here one more time, hopefully you go mute for 2 years this time...

 

[The Maverick]

Actually you guys are correct
Finger 4 to finger 8 is actually disputed territory 60km of it .China has occuppied no man's land if disputed land

Let's down tools I don't fancy fighting a superpower

 

[Joe Shearer]

You honestly believe that the Americans are going to come to the aid of or fight for the indians?..................

Not at all.

Where did you get that impression?

Did I tell you that you are a very confused person? This is one symptom. I would be happy to have you share what made you think that I was hoping for American aid or assistance.

So after 1 year you still trying to figure. While I have already gave you links after links as well as videos where Pakistani military and civilian leaders have stated there are 7 lakh Indian occupier in IOK?

Here one more time, hopefully you go mute for 2 years this time...

Yes, Pakistani leaders have said that. If you were not totally befuddled, you would have read your own military member of this forum explaining in very simple terms how many were located and where.

 

[H. Dawary]

This seems so awfully strange... Sun Tzu said “All warfare is based on deception”.

Would India hand over Ladakh for Kashmir? Could this be a ploy by India and China to get Pakistan to take over the rest of Kashmir?

Keep in mind these are just possibilities. But I warn that Pakistan should tread carefully and wait to see a fully committed Chinese military act before making any serious moves.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

Not at all.

Where did you get that impression?

Did I tell you that you are a very confused person? This is one symptom. I would be happy to have you share what made you think that I was hoping for American aid or assistance.

So then why would have the 1962 Cuban Missile crisis have had ANY influence on the 1962 war between india and China?....................are you sure you are not the one who is confused here?.........

 

[Joe Shearer]

Shearer you are dumb beyond measure, right now I have to apologize to myself for having thought you are a sensible Indian, I suppose they do not exist.

For one, I never quoted you any figures, so how can they be mine, if you mean Pakistani figures then say so if you mean Indian figures then say so. Please don't personalise a statement when it was not given by me.

Now to you stupid facts, it is not 2 million it was over 4 million registered and unregistered refugees, even now, the total number approaches 3 million, although it is going down now due to various steps.
Pakistan didn't do anything about it?????????????????? you do realize the Soviet Union, one of the most powerful countries in the world is no more, are you so slow that you cannot understand that Pakistan played an important role in bringing about an end that reality. If Pakistan had not stood up to the Soviets and bankrupted them in the process, it is very likely they would have carried on, with some reforms. The Russians recognize this, surely you can too.

The point is that the refugees exist on Pakistani soil. The point is that as usual there was that being too clever by half; you drove out the Soviets, but created a new nightmare in their place, and the refugees stayed in their places.

Now regarding the so-called 10 million refugees out of East Pakistan, as you are too slow to understand and don't wish to potentially start another topic here, look at the census figures for Bangladesh before 71 and after, and you will realize how stupidly insane that 10 million figure sounds. Just because you people have kept repeating it, it does not make it real.

You don't seem to have noticed, being new to this, that 95% of the refugees returned at the time of Liberation. That was the big difference between the behind-the-scenes manipulations of the Pakistani secret services in Afghanistan, and the direct intervention in Bangladesh. People voted with their feet; their votes are in front of you.

Those are the figures as recorded, and as acknowledged by all, Indian, Bangladeshi and international. Do your homework, and let's have less vapour about what should have been and what could have been.

You are in Hyderabad, tell me how many hundreds of thousands of Muslims were killed 70 years ago, have some shame and decency, you should know better, accept facts as they are, and work towards a peaceful future. We all need recognise facts and move on.

No hundreds of thousands, a few hundred Razakars in direct combat (there was not much of that), and a few thousands more in civil riots and disturbances thereafter.

Before you enter these discussions, get your facts correct.

 

[El Sidd]

Why would India panic? She is only surrendering territory which she had occupied in confusion of post British withdrawal from Asia.

 

[Joe Shearer]

So then why would have the 1962 Cuban Missile crisis have had ANY influence on the 1962 war between india and China?....................are you sure you are not the one who is confused here?.........

No, I am sure that I am not the one confused here.

The Missile crisis ensured that the Americans were NOT free to intervene; they were tied up with the Russians. So my argument is 180 deg. the opposite of what you thought it was; I was not suggesting that the Americans WOULD have come to India's aid, I was suggesting that it was impossible for them to do that.

This is what I actually said, and that you could not understand:

The Chinese had no American threat in mind; they knew that America was already involved neck-deep in the Cuban Missile Crisis and its aftermath, and that there would be no effective action by them.

You do realise that I do not think poorly of another member's intellect without due cause?

 

[Smoke]

So please build your canoe or canoes with your pieces of straw. I remain glad that your shooting down a single plane is such a red letter day in your lives, and that it is, in your minds, on par with the conflict of 1971.



Ah yes, a failure to present facts, followed by personal attacks. This shows how strong your basic positions are.



Once again, it is the swarm of Pakistani fan-boys on this forum who will insist that their grandiose visions of conquering the world (with the help of their iron brothers, of course) are real. They are effective here merely because they have a sheltered environment here, unlike the harsh environment outside, where their equivalent ignorant fan-boys from India, are in the majority.

This recital by keyboard warriors of what China will or will not do is amusing. The grim part is that it creates a permanent toxic atmosphere in which anything can happen at moments of crisis.

Funny how you try to weasel your way out of legitimate points like the rat you are. You complain about personal attacks? You're lying to yourself to make yourself feel better, you're manufacturing your own facts and you complain about US having GRANDIOSE VISIONS OF CONQUERING THE WORLD?

We want Kashmir, INDIA wants to rule the muslim world with an iron fist, supa powa 2020 remember?

Joe, I could have respected you because you seem like a guy that knows his stuff, but seeing you like this just makes happy I didn't waste the time to.

 

[Dil Pakistan]

Its not that simple a walkover, in the present domestic, regional and global environment, for either Chinese, Indians or Pakistanis......

I agree Sir!

However, one cannot deny that China has grabbed every possible initiative, and is (very rapidly) building it. FOr example:

1. They are the first to reach the (potential) battle ground, occupy the positions they want. Interestingly, in this way, they have reduced the chances of war.

2. They have not lost international reputation, and have not projected themselves as the aggressors. They have carved out the legitimacy, of being where they are, by calling Indians to be ones to change the legal definition of disputed territory.

3. They clearly have blocked the areas from where India could exert initiative attack on Pakistan. This includes Galwan valley - which, apparently, is not even a disputed territory.

4. They are openly refusing to listen to Indians, and refusing to go back.

5. Still! they have left the initiative to start the war up to Indians.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Funny how you try to weasel your way out of legitimate points like the rat you are. You complain about personal attacks? You're lying to yourself to make yourself feel better, you're manufacturing your own facts and you complain about US having GRANDIOSE VISIONS OF CONQUERING THE WORLD?

We want Kashmir, INDIA wants to rule the muslim world with an iron fist, supa powa 2020 remember?

Joe, I could have respected you because you seem like a guy that knows his stuff, but seeing you like this just makes happy I didn't waste the time to.

I don't see how your personal abuse wins any points or makes any reasonable point.

Where did I lie? Can you point to any instance? Repeating your own self-created delusions does not mean that someone who disagrees is lying; it simply means that you are delusional.

No change at point of conflict at all... Just a new road to jampheri which actually is slicing even a bigger slice from Bhutan, that's the payback. You still don't get Chinese Go? Lollololol

You do understand that you have just said that there is no change at the point of conflict, and that there is instead a new intrusion?

That does disprove your own point, or don't you understand what it means when you say, look at X and tell me how it changed, and are told it has not changed, and then reply, but Y has!

No, I don't get Chinese Go. I think these are just games that you play with yourselves to console yourselves.

 

[Dil Pakistan]

And what makes you believe that the numbers published are factual. No country ever publishes the correct numbers. If they did my the world would have been a mess. Again, as a full time defence analyst I can tell you that at this point in time in South East Asia, the only country that has full support from the west is India. Pakistan has lost trust of the US since 2012 and China is treading a difficult path with the US trade war. Plus for those who dont know I must say China also has a lot of internal problems - since there is no free press the world doesn't know about it. I will write a detailed post about it someday.

BTW - If we havent met earlier, I am a full time defence analyst. I get paid to study and research defence strengths and advice companies and governments on strategy.

A very strange post.

You are the first one to openly state that US and West are the real war mongers in this region, and India is only a stooge. No one has openly stated this as yet.

Pakistan losing US favours has actually helped Pakistan to learn to stand on her feet. In addition, Pakistan, for the first time, has realised the importance of involving its neighbours to become partners in defence strategy. This shift is massive, and, actually, good for Pakistan.

At the same time, India, now relying on international powers for back up; and picking wars with neighbours is a weakness of Indian planning, not a strength.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

No, I am sure that I am not the one confused here.

The Missile crisis ensured that the Americans were NOT free to intervene; they were tied up with the Russians. So my argument is 180 deg. the opposite of what you thought it was; I was not suggesting that the Americans WOULD have come to India's aid, I was suggesting that it was impossible for them to do that.

This is what I actually said, and that you could not understand:

The Chinese had no American threat in mind; they knew that America was already involved neck-deep in the Cuban Missile Crisis and its aftermath, and that there would be no effective action by them.

You do realise that I do not think poorly of another member's intellect without due cause?

And you REALLY believe that america would intervene against China on behalf of india???????....................keep going!........