Iranian Chill Thread

[Muhammad Saftain Anjum]

Imran Khan should reach out to any and all allies for support here

He needs no external or internal player when public is with him.
General Elections are coming soon and that's the constitutional way to go

 

[sha ah]

 

[TheImmortal]

And political stability in Pakistan is our problem.you have no right to say shit about us.
And one thing more,all no confidence dramma was well in Pakistan's constitutional framework.It was only overruled due to US involvement.So it is not easy for any one to topple Pakistani Government.

You should accept criticism here as many of your fellow countrymen have been making fun of Iran on this board for being “weak” against the USA and being “afarid”.

Meanwhile your own PM is saying his entire country’s power apparatus is infiltrated by US who seeks to over throw him.

So the situation is quite ironic...

So you're comparing China, which has never colonized any African or middle eastern country to the Americans and the west ? Really ?

China until 20 years ago was relatively too weak geopolitically to extend itself beyond its borders. It also went against Chinese philosophy which is to extend economically while having a strong military to block adversaries.

It is now finally opening its wings, so let’s reserve judgement on China. Even the US up to 1930’s was relatively isolationist in many regards.

But China also doesn’t have the get out of jail free card the US does. US can start any war it wants without fear of being sanctioned. China with all its power was threatened with sanctions if it just SUPPLIED Russia with weapons. So it’s walking a tightrope at this point. It’s not trying to rock the boat and rather grow in the shadows.

 

[Dariush the Great]

You should accept criticism here as many of your fellow countrymen have been making fun of Iran on this board for being “weak” against the USA and being “afarid”.

Meanwhile your own PM is saying his entire country’s power apparatus is infiltrated by US who seeks to over throw him.

So the situation is quite ironic...

To be honest there is really no nation on earth that can effectively stand up to the US. China is doing some things but their resistance is still in its infancy.

So in my opinion, there is really no shame in being ''afraid'' or being infiltrated or whatever by the US.

 

[TheImmortal]

The magnitude of the US regime's oppressive practices against nations isn't really comparable with China's. The US not only exploits nations economically, it deprives them of their sovereignty and destroys them by waging wars of aggression, something China has not been doing. Between a regime guilty of this range of mischief versus one which restricts itself to profiteering from others' debt, the rational choice would be to opt for the former over the latter.

China has only recently came to power. So the jury is out on how it would rule versus the US. Even though today China is quite powerful it is still able to be sanctioned. Something that was made quite clear if it supplied Russia with arms.

US can wage any war without retribution of sanctions. Who will sanction it? EU? Canada? Australia? Japan? Almost all major economies give US a blank check to do what it wants. This makes starting wars quite easy when you have no worry about what the world will think.

China does not have this luxury and likely never will as long as Western world order leads this world. So it has to play its cards much more shrewdly and win over countries differently.

 

[BigMelatonin]

It is now finally opening its wings, so let’s reserve judgement on China. Even the US up to 1930’s was relatively isolationist in many regards.

The US has been an aggressive expansionist empire since it's inception. It's entire westward expansion was a colonial war of extermination against the native nations of the continent, it occupied Puerto Rico, invaded Hawaii, went to war with Spain over Cuba, invaded Mexico, implemented the Monroe Doctrine, occupied the Phillipines just off the top of my head all before the 20th century. This statement is pure historical revisionism.

 

[sha ah]

 

[TheImmortal]

The US has been an aggressive expansionist empire since it's inception. It's entire westward expansion was a colonial war of extermination against the native nations of the continent, it occupied Puerto Rico, invaded Hawaii, went to war with Spain over Cuba, invaded Mexico, implemented the Monroe Doctrine, occupied the Phillipines just off the top of my head all before the 20th century. This statement is pure historical revisionism.

Yes, expanded in its own domain. Part of what you mentioned was colonial Ameica. The rest took place largely in its own backyard.

It wasn’t until WWI and being the world order leader post WW2 that US adventurism really took off. Then came the Cold War which kicked it into high gear.

Iran also spread across the Middle East and Asia for over 1000+ years and held a remenants of a large empire till the 1800’s. So what’s your point? Or is it bad only when the US does it?

Nearly every major power (and some countries that are no longer relevant) had empires and spread across the world in some form. It’s just the US came to power relatively late in human history.

Every country especially one that reaches superpower status will attempt to manipulate its surroundings to its advantage. This is not excusing US atrocities (of which there are many), but it’s also not turning a blind eye to all the empires before it and the ones to come in the future.

 

[Stryker1982]

To be honest there is really no nation on earth that can effectively stand up to the US. China is doing some things but their resistance is still in its infancy.

So in my opinion, there is really no shame in being ''afraid'' or being infiltrated or whatever by the US.

We didn't even have a railway until Reza Shah built one in the 1950s, meanwhile the US had already completed the Empire State building decades earlier, built strategic bombers , subway system and an atomic bomb by then.

Iran has come a long way since and so we should have reasonable expectations that one side is more powerful economically and militarily than the other by many magnitudes.

 

[sha ah]

The western world order is swiftly coming to an end. After WW2, it was a bi polar world with the USSR and USA. After the USSR collapsed it became a unipolar world for a while. Now it's reverting back to a multipolar world just like before WW1.

Ironically the US has pushed this into existence with what they have done with Ukraine and Russia. Sanctioning North Korea, Cuba, Iran is one thing but sanctioning Russia, I mean I'm sorry but that was a big shot in the foot. Russia and Iran alone are energy super powers. Iran has already proven that its impossible to sanction energy. You just give a 2% discount and countries line up.

Just think about this for a second, the US and its allies are now sanctioning about a third of humanity. When you sanction that many people you're essentially sanctioning yourself. Now that the world has seen what the US has done with Russia, you have Venezuela, China, Iran all joining into a SWIFT alternative. It's going to start out small but many countries will join even just to do business with Russia, Iran, Venezuela, Cuba and all those countries, I mean, it's worth it.

That's alot of countries and resources and energy and people. It's its own global financial network that you otherwise would not be able to conduct business with. Also the Yuan can be purchased in digital, encrypted form. I mean just as a contingency plan why not be part of it for most of the world the question is not why, its why not ? The Saudis and Emiratis are also sensing this. They have stated that they want to sell some of their oil in Chinese Yuan. The US dollar hegemony is ending.

Also just look at how at the UN security council the majority of humanity sided with Russia, not the west. Don't look at the number of countries, some countries have populations of 500,000 but they have one vote. A vote is a vote whether you're China or Micronesia but here's the thing, 60%of humanity chose not to side with the western cause on Ukraine.

Believe me, the Chinese are not stupid.They know that what the west is doing to Russia could happen to China when the west inevitably chooses to trigger Taiwan into independence and the Chinese will have no option but to act. So why not take precautions now ?

But it's not just about China. India and Pakistan are also a target now because they refuse to tow the line like vassals. Just look at what the Americans have already tried to do with Imran Khan. Also Indians have stated that they will do business with Russia in Rupees and Rubles. Btw the Ruble has been pegged to gold and has gained 90% of its value back against the US dollar. Also Russian energy will only be sold to Europe in Rubles and under Russian bank accounts.

There is no alternative on this literally the EU does not have the capacity to replace Russian gas with American LNG and it would cost hundreds of billions, the price of the LNG several times more. Also there simply aren't enough ships in the world to replace Russian gas in Europe with American LNG. The capacity would take 5 years to a decade at the very least just to build at the cost of potentially hundreds of billions, or the EU could just pay several times less and just buy cheaper Russian gas in Rubles.

Honestly when the US sanctioned Iran and it didn't really break Iran or bring Iran's oil sales to zero like they planned, that was also a turning point. The US and its allies still view themselves as exceptional and all powerful and might act as if its still their hay day but their hay day is long gone.

Look what the Taliban did to all of NATO in Afghanistan. That was also a turning point. It was an utter and total humiliation and wake up call. But of course the US can't accept it and after Afghanistan ended the US simply moved on to Ukraine and they're still planning on messing with Taiwan and China in the east China sea. So... I mean...

Think about it, the US in Afghanistan spend what 3 trillion and what did US taxpayers or the country get out of it. 3 TRILLION do you know how many hospitals, how many nuclear plants, Universities, they could have build high speed rail for the entire continent but instead they used it to enrich some already excessively wealthy, overly privileged defense contractors.

Eisenhower warned about the military industrial complex but it's turned into a beast with 10 heads or something. He never could have imaged this. It's completely out of control and these policies are actually bleeding out, degrading and destroying the US from the inside out. Right now there is real poverty in the US. There are massive wealth gaps between rich and poor.

There are criminals, the largest prisons, drug addicts, open air drug markets with tents like you couldn't imagine. You can be going to 711 and u can randomly get shot in the head for your iphone. and don't try to deny it like it doesn't happen or can't happen because it happens to people in the United States. The US is the only industrialized country without universal healthcare and insulin costs 8 times more in the US than in Canada.

I mean let's be brutally honest here. Is the United States going to continue to thrive and dominate in a 2 decades when blacks and latinos are the majority ? I'm sorry I just don't see it. China is already set to surpass the US as the worlds largest economy and then after a few decades it'll be India if they can manage to get their population under control or find a way to feed themselves.

Anyways, welcome to the multipolar world. It wouldn't have happened as quickly if the US had not targeted Russia the way it did but now believe me now the world is changing. Some people will never let go of their old world mentality and they will just stick to what they know but no matter what the world is changing whether you like it or not.

China has only recently came to power. So the jury is out on how it would rule versus the US. Even though today China is quite powerful it is still able to be sanctioned. Something that was made quite clear if it supplied Russia with arms.

US can wage any war without retribution of sanctions. Who will sanction it? EU? Canada? Australia? Japan? Almost all major economies give US a blank check to do what it wants. This makes starting wars quite easy when you have no worry about what the world will think.

China does not have this luxury and likely never will as long as Western world order leads this world. So it has to play its cards much more shrewdly and win over countries differently.

There is no nation that can stand up to the US ? Yes except for the US itself. Look at what the Taliban did in Afghanistan. A bunch of rag tag cavemen with rusty AKs and bicycles.

Honestly what did the US gain out of Afghanistan after 20 years and 3 trillion dollars ? Do you realize what 3 trillion dollars could have build ?

How many hospitals, how much healthcare, how many Universities. Honestly they might have been able to find the cure to Cancer with that funding. Imagine the scientific institutions they could have built. Imagine they could have linked up all of America with cheap and inexpensive high speed rail.

Right now something like 70% of the worlds high speed rail is in China. The US is just a money making machine for elites at the very top. However the middle class is largely becoming extinct as time passes.

This level of corruption and control by the banksters (wall street) and the military industrial complex is just too much of a toxic mixture. It's slowly but surely draining the US. In a few years now China's GDP will surpass that of the US.

A government is supposed to have its peoples best interests at heart but that's not how the US operates. Instead you have the US government having the wealthy elites best interests at heart.

We didn't even have a railway until Reza Shah built one in the 1950s, meanwhile the US had already completed the Empire State building decades earlier, built strategic bombers , subway system and an atomic bomb by then.

Iran has come a long way since and so we should have reasonable expectations that one side is more powerful economically and militarily than the other by many magnitudes.

 

[sha ah]

Hey guys this is just an idea but when Iran actually goes through with revamping the currency and slashing those 4 zeros, why not peg the new Iranian currency to oil and gold ? or oil, silver, gold or some combination like that ? So countries that do business with Iran could actually be able to trade with Iran for those commodities if they wanted to ?

I'm not a financial expert or economist but wouldn't that help keep Iran's currency more stable ? I mean the only issue would be if some countries would buy up enough Iranian currency and then request for so much energy at once. But there would have to be limits to it as well. They could also have the currency fully digitized and encrypted. Why not ?

As a sidenote, even polymer notes can be faked. Allegedly its North Korea behind the scheme.

 

[Hack-Hook]

Fun fact: No
It has long been proven that economic prosperity does not (necessarily) bring happiness.
One study has shown that the happiest people on earth are Indonesians, who are certainly not the richest people on earth. Meanwhile many western developed nations ranked low on happiness.
Another example is South Korea and Japan, two of the richest nations on earth, yet they have some of the highest suicide rates, and they don't have access to guns.
However, in the case of Iran, the effects of economic hardship on mental instability is being amplified by a massive psyops by Iran's enemies. It's one thing to have economic problems, but amount of negative and demoralizing messaging being pumped into the minds of Iranians is simply out of this world, to the point that many Iranians unironically think that Iran has the worst living standard in the entire planet.

and another study showed north korean are one of the happiest people on the earth , well sadly there is no standard scale for measuring happiness

and yes there is no direct correlation between happiness and wealth but what about lack of wealth and life discontent . here the talk was not about happiness it was about mental problem , they are some how different

 

[sha ah]

There have been a number studies conducted but the issue in general is extremely subjective in nature. It also largely depends on which parts of a society you ask and timing is extremely vital.

For example if you ask during a time of high societal tensions due to maybe a heated political election or what if there are riots raging or a war being waged like in Ukraine. All of those will greatly effect your potential outcomes.

I mean are you going to ask prisoners/drug addicts or just go in the center of large cities ? But then you're excluding people in the countrysides of nations who in some cases tend to have less stress in their lives ?

One study recently said Finland but it's just completely silly. They don't have the best weather that's for sure and what gives Finland this distinctive disadvantage ? It just seems that this study was based on the perceptions of the people conducting the studies or variables that they perceived as the most meaningful or important due to their own cultural norms.

Happiest Countries in the World 2024

worldpopulationreview.com

"The above study took the following into consideration. gross domestic product per capita, social support, healthy life expectancy, freedom to make your own life choices, generosity of the general population, and perceptions of internal and external corruption levels."

But why don't they consider purchasing price parity with GDP per capita or relative costs of living ? Freedom to make your own choices ? Like the choice to change sexes or kill yourself ? Also the study added a variable known as "dystopia" to the very bottom. You can quickly see that the test itself is structured largely around some superficial western cultural norms/perceptions

Anyways some studies conclude though that wealth does not necessarily bring you happiness. Personally I think weather and climate have a huge effect. Your daily interactions, ease of access to work, food, quality of food, relationships, personal status, goals in life, expectations etc.

Also just because you ask does that mean people are going be completely honest with you ? What would even be a proper sample size ? As some have pointed out, in Japan or South Korea for example, they are industrialized east Asian nations, but their citizens tend to work long hours. Perhaps as a result they have have high stress rates which might contribute to their suicide rates. Also in industrialized nations don't people often tend to have higher debt rates. Doesn't that add to stress then ?

and another study showed north korean are one of the happiest people on the earth , well sadly there is no standard scale for measuring happiness

and yes there is no direct correlation between happiness and wealth but what about lack of wealth and life discontent . here the talk was not about happiness it was about mental problem , they are some how different

 

[BigMelatonin]

Yes, expanded in its own domain. Part of what you mentioned was colonial Ameica. The rest took place largely in its own backyard.

It wasn’t until WWI and being the world order leader post WW2 that US adventurism really took off. Then came the Cold War which kicked it into high gear.

Iran also spread across the Middle East and Asia for over 1000+ years and held a remenants of a large empire till the 1800’s. So what’s your point? Or is it bad only when the US does it?

Nearly every major power (and some countries that are no longer relevant) had empires and spread across the world in some form. It’s just the US came to power relatively late in human history.

Every country especially one that reaches superpower status will attempt to manipulate its surroundings to its advantage. This is not excusing US atrocities (of which there are many), but it’s also not turning a blind eye to all the empires before it and the ones to come in the future.

It's not their domain, despite what the Euros like to think, the world isn't theirs. Like I said they aggressively conquered and committed genocide against the native nations who the land belongs to.
Iran hasn't had any significant empires beyond it's cultural borders in over 1500 years. And even by the standards of the ancient world, i don't think they ever reached the level of savagery and barbarism of the Euros in the last half-millenium.
So no, all colonialism and imperialism is bad, but it is especially bad when done by the so-called "civilized" nation that inspired the Holocaust with it's methods.

 

[TheImmortal]

It's not their domain, despite what the Euros like to think, the world isn't theirs. Like I said they aggressively conquered and committed genocide against the native nations who the land belongs to.
Iran hasn't had any significant empires beyond it's cultural borders in over 1500 years. And even by the standards of the ancient world, i don't think they ever reached the level of savagery and barbarism of the Euros in the last half-millenium.
So no, all colonialism and imperialism is bad, but it is especially bad when done by the so-called "civilized" nation that inspired the Holocaust with it's methods.

And yet if you look beyond Nazi Germany

Most of the worst genocides in human history by death toll were done by African, Middle Eastern, Asian countries (Japan) including Ottoman Empire as well as Russia/Soviet Union

List of genocides - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

So again, your blinders are focused on Western powers while you ignore rest of human history.

While Colonial powers are responsible for insensibly drawing borders of many regions, it is those regions themselves that for the next hundreds of year infighted with one another over petty power plays (Africa and Middle East)

and another study showed north korean are one of the happiest people on the earth