Indonesia Defence Forum

[Kansel]

Keep in mind that it's an LOO (Letter of Offer), the final purchase can be less if MenHan decides that it's too expensive.

I hope they contracted it before 2020 timestamp so the production cost will be cheaper because that means our osprey production line will be inserted with usmc production line

 

[mandala]

https://m.facebook.com/lembagakeris/

^^^ What type of Corvette are we looking at? Gowind?

 

[Alex898]

https://m.facebook.com/lembagakeris/

^^^ What type of Corvette are we looking at? Gowind?

reading the headlines says "percepatan pemenuhan kekuatan pokok TNI" probably means that all the talkings about aquisition of used frigates, used fighter jets has some truth behinds it. besides, the budget is increasing despite the fact that our economy is still in recovery from the pandemy. i just hope they just dont rush the decision and ends up with money-wasting procurement
BTW about the Kapal Selam thing, Alman recent tweet just mention about navy preference to buy either 214 or Scorpene before 2030.

 

[mandala]

reading the headlines says "percepatan pemenuhan kekuatan pokok TNI" probably means that all the talkings about aquisition of used frigates, used fighter jets has some truth behinds it. besides, the budget is increasing despite the fact that our economy is still in recovery from the pandemy. i just hope they just dont rush the decision and ends up with money-wasting procurement
BTW about the Kapal Selam thing, Alman recent tweet just mention about navy preference to buy either 214 or Scorpene before 2030.

Also interesting that future Patrol Vessel will be equipped with missiles with a range of min 150 km. I'm guessing this is the OPV class as the competing shipyards displayed their model or CGI video with missiles.

 

[¿Por qué?]

Why do you keep going on and on about trying to detect F-35's? We already share tactical data with the Singaporeans, Australians, and Americans (as part of the CISMOA for the Link 16's) anyways, why should we be buying things to detect a specific aircraft that we are 1.) already on track on buying and 2.) already have data on where they are based and when there are going to be CAP operations in our bordering areas?

Dude, don't get me wrong. I hate China as much as you do. And I want them to be blown to pieces and wiped off the world map as much as the next guy. But that doesn't change the situation about our regional challenge.

Whether you like it or not, our regional airspace will be swarmed with 5th gen fighter sooner than later. F-35s will only be the first. Singapore & Australia will only be the first. We don't know yet what 5th gen jets that malasya or vietnam or other countries would chose. One thing for sure they all want it. Whether it's F-35, SU-57, J-20, you name it.

Being non-alligned country makes me a lot less optimistic than you regarding our chance to get a hand on those wonderful F-35 jets very soon. On paper, we probably have more chance to operate SU-57 than F-35. But then we can't buy it because of CAATSA. Heck, we can't even buy SU-35.

All that we have left is F-16V, Rafale, and KFX. Against all of those 5th gen fighters. Having IAD that hopefully could detect the 5th gen fighter should be one of our goal.

Having said that, I still have hope, that current SCS alarming situation would change how the U.S. see us.

If what you said was true about the U.S. looking at the possibility to increase defense cooperation with us (by refueling activity, etc) and it means that they will give us all that they have been giving Singapore (especially the F-35) and also much less risk of military stuff embargo/sanction/banning, then I would love to be proven wrong.

Btw, this new theme rather sucks. Can't see the name.

 

[Nike]

Our sides had offered F35 to Indonesian Air Force, and it is up to Indonesian to grasp the opportunity or not. They still waiting to build up the necessary logistic and infrastructure units first. There is long over due programme need to be resolved, like military satelit command and communication units, Central control and integrated intelligent processing units, Integration of data link system, with Link Y (in which badically European derivative of Link 16) and Link 16 and so on.

 

[Kansel]

https://m.facebook.com/lembagakeris/

^^^ What type of Corvette are we looking at? Gowind?

Something similar with belharra/gowindclass

 

[Raduga]

Something similar with belharra/gowindclass

as for my 2 cent of opinion , we should go with intermediate frigate a.k.a the Admiral Ronarc'h , we shall stay away from PKR Gowind pseudo corvette frigate design as for now , a ship with limited capability but a burden on operational and maintenance support cost .

 

[Chestnut]

Dude, don't get me wrong. I hate China as much as you do. And I want them to be blown to pieces and wiped off the world map as much as the next guy. But that doesn't change the situation about our regional challenge.

Whether you like it or not, our regional airspace will be swarmed with 5th gen fighter sooner than later. F-35s will only be the first. Singapore & Australia will only be the first. We don't know yet what 5th gen jets that malasya or vietnam or other countries would chose. One thing for sure they all want it. Whether it's F-35, SU-57, J-20, you name it.

Being non-alligned country makes me a lot less optimistic than you regarding our chance to get a hand on those wonderful F-35 jets very soon. On paper, we probably have more chance to operate SU-57 than F-35. But then we can't buy it because of CAATSA. Heck, we can't even buy SU-35.

All that we have left is F-16V, Rafale, and KFX. Against all of those 5th gen fighters. Having IAD that hopefully could detect the 5th gen fighter should be one of our goal.

Having said that, I still have hope, that current SCS alarming situation would change how the U.S. see us.

If what you said was true about the U.S. looking at the possibility to increase defense cooperation with us (by refueling activity, etc) and it means that they will give us all that they have been giving Singapore (especially the F-35) and also much less risk of military stuff embargo/sanction/banning, then I would love to be proven wrong.

Btw, this new theme rather sucks. Can't see the name.

You do realize we have more concrete military cooperation agreements with the United States and her MNNA allies such as Australia and Singapore compared to that of China and Russia, right? The TNI has historically been aligned rather closely to their Western counterparts irrespective of the civilian government's policy toward the West (thanks to Suharto).

We are non-alligned only by name. You don't need an official declaration from MenLu to see that. And that's not fanboyism, really just stop and look at who has been around doing major exercises and doing AFB/Naval base visits.

If anything, politically we're Sweden. Officially we're "Neutral" but push comes to shove we know which orbit we're going to run to.

 

[Gen3115]

You do realize we have more concrete military cooperation agreements with the United States and her MNNA allies such as Australia and Singapore compared to that of China and Russia, right? The TNI has historically been aligned rather closely to their Western counterparts irrespective of the civilian government's policy toward the West (thanks to Suharto).

We are non-alligned only by name. You don't need an official declaration from MenLu to see that. And that's not fanboyism, really just stop and look at who has been around doing major exercises and doing AFB/Naval base visits.

If anything, politically we're Sweden. Officially we're "Neutral" but push comes to shove we know which orbit we're going to run to.

In 2019 we've had more exercises with the US than most countries in the region other than the Philippines, Australia and Japan, we even had more military exercises with the US than that of Singapore who people perceive as a US ally even though officially they're not.

 

[Gen3115]

Dude, don't get me wrong. I hate China as much as you do. And I want them to be blown to pieces and wiped off the world map as much as the next guy. But that doesn't change the situation about our regional challenge.

Whether you like it or not, our regional airspace will be swarmed with 5th gen fighter sooner than later. F-35s will only be the first. Singapore & Australia will only be the first. We don't know yet what 5th gen jets that malasya or vietnam or other countries would chose. One thing for sure they all want it. Whether it's F-35, SU-57, J-20, you name it.

Being non-alligned country makes me a lot less optimistic than you regarding our chance to get a hand on those wonderful F-35 jets very soon. On paper, we probably have more chance to operate SU-57 than F-35. But then we can't buy it because of CAATSA. Heck, we can't even buy SU-35.

All that we have left is F-16V, Rafale, and KFX. Against all of those 5th gen fighters. Having IAD that hopefully could detect the 5th gen fighter should be one of our goal.

Having said that, I still have hope, that current SCS alarming situation would change how the U.S. see us.

If what you said was true about the U.S. looking at the possibility to increase defense cooperation with us (by refueling activity, etc) and it means that they will give us all that they have been giving Singapore (especially the F-35) and also much less risk of military stuff embargo/sanction/banning, then I would love to be proven wrong.

Btw, this new theme rather sucks. Can't see the name.

Indonesia's prospect of operating F-35's already dates back to 2008, getting F-16V's/operating latest F-16's is preliminary step to operating F-35's. Most of the F-35 operators are currently part of the JSF program or are already operating the latest F-16's.

 

[san.geuk]

as for my 2 cent of opinion , we should go with intermediate frigate a.k.a the Admiral Ronarc'h , we shall stay away from PKR Gowind pseudo corvette frigate design as for now , a ship with limited capability but a burden on operational and maintenance support cost .

I'm agree with you, gowind not so much advantage over martadinata class, belharrra will be better, or at least the instanbul class milgem if the price to high

 

[Alex898]

I'm agree with you, gowind not so much advantage over martadinata class, belharrra will be better, or at least the instanbul class milgem if the price to high

in terms of firepower, gowind, bellhara and PKR isnt so different though. why dont we just stick with PKR ?

 

[san.geuk]

in terms of firepower, gowind, bellhara and PKR isnt so different though. why dont we just stick with PKR ?

there is some issue about the PKR price, the ToT are not as their expectation, meanwhile belharra much bigger 4k+ ton compare to PKR 2k+ ton and gowind also 2k+ ton, with bigger ship they can sail better in hard seastate condition, in terms of weapons, belharra can accommodate slyver A50 VLS or aster 30 missile meanwhile afaik PKR limited only slyver A35 VLS or limited only for mica missile or mica vls
and don't forget belharra is succesor for formidable/lafayette class

 

[Alex898]

there is some issue about the PKR price, the ToT are not as their expectation, meanwhile belharra much bigger 4k+ ton compare to PKR 2k+ ton and gowind also 2k+ ton, with bigger ship they can sail better in hard seastate condition, in terms of weapons, belharra can accommodate slyver A50 VLS or aster 30 missile meanwhile afaik PKR limited only slyver A35 VLS or limited only for mica missile or mica vls
and don't forget belharra is succesor for formidable/lafayette class

well, let just go for Iver for all then,