India's Cold Start Is Too Hot

[Kavin]

Cold Start...

We should thank them who named a strategy of earlier 2000's.

A name still haunting the targeted enemy.. when the originator of that moved on and forgot it!

 

[praveen]

i don't see pakistan having sufficient dedicated air assets to man the whole international border.Pakistan's army seems to be in a quandry

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

According to my info, there is no room of tolerating a limited strike on our territory as per Pak Military's doctrine. Don't you wonder just why your AF or even army didn't even fire a single bullet after the so called 26-11? This is why the sub continent is called "Nuclear Flash point".

Isn't that due the fact that there is no evidence at that point (even now) linking Pakistani Govt to 26/11?

 

[Kavin]

If this kind of plan eva work your military definitely try to do this kind of job after 26/11!

Only kids fight 'I did 26/11, can you counter it with your Sukhois?'. Aren't you kidding?

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

One of the advantage of attack on a wide front is that it makes it difficult for the opposing side to decide where to use their reserves.

The greatest problem is the premature use of reserves and then finding it difficult to scupper up the necessary assets to recreate reserves.

 

[Xeric]

Firstly i would like to say that my response was in reply to the absurd arguments whereupon Nasr or for that matter Tac Nukes were simply being waived off.

Now..

If Pakistan uses tactical nuclear weapons, does it deter India from doing the same?

No it does not, but the question is, should india do it or most importantly would india do it when the CSD is nothing but an off-shoot of LIMITED WAR?

Compare the armour availability and the troop levels.

Sorry, i couldnt understand the context. Is it the comparison of troop concentrations/employment?

And once the nuclear weapons even if tactical is used, what will be the international reaction?

The reaction would be similar rather more ruthless to the case it would have been if india and Pak are ready to contend in terms of (strategic) nukes. So what would this mean, now? Calling off the CS misadventure back to barracks WELL before ANY of its aims had been achieved? Failure? no?

And compare the CNP.

Sorry, what?

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

Now..

No it does not, but the question is, should india do it or most importantly would india do it when the CSD is nothing but an off-shoot of LIMITED WAR?

India would not be the first to use for that will be counter productive as the international community will come down like a ton of bricks.

Sorry, i couldnt understand the context. Is it the comparison of troop concentrations/employment?


The reaction would be similar rather more ruthless to the case it would have been if india and Pak are ready to contend in terms of (strategic) nukes. So what would this mean, now? Calling off the CS misadventure back to barracks WELL before ANY of its aims had been achieved? Failure? no?

Therefore, the Cold Start Doctrine will avoid working up the nuclear scenario, be it tactical or strategic.

Sorry, what?

Comprehensive National Power.

 

[praveen]

till date no country having a deterrence doctrine had thought of tactical nukes .Actually bringing tactical nukes is good for india.If one flies

 

[khurasaan1]

cold start will freeze in the end alongwith the starterz......Insha-Allah....

 

[foxbat]

So in a hypothetical scenario, an Indian IBG pushes across Wagha border towards lahore as a part of CSD manouver. Pakistan lobs a 1 KT tactical Nuke at the IBG?? Say about 20 KM from Lahore?? Are you sure?

 

[praveen]

all will fly from the other side.Brig I think we need to see what sort of strategic nuke inventory pakistan has.Why all talk about this plutonium based tactical nukes when they have uranhum bared nukes

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

cold start will freeze in the end alongwith the starterz......Insha-Allah....

An interesting thought.

Could you share the analysis which brought you to this conclusion?

 

[praveen]

my doubt how will they know where IBG's will do the thrust and how are they going to place this 'nasr' in the IBG's path.Now IBG's are mobile armour formations right .How effective will a 60km missile be against a mobile target

 

[SQ8]

I sure hope so.

And they also hopefully understand the geopolitical and geo strategic compulsions or realpolitik.

Just to amplify, Pakistan should not allow its territorial integrity and sovereignty violated by the US.

But then, Pakistan stands helpless as it appears.

Not anyone's fault, I will not hesitate to state.

It is the stranglehold of geoploitics and geostrategy.

It is not confined to Pakistan alone.

It is a stranglehold that is universal!

Guess why the US is not putting their boots on the ground in Libya?

One has to understand the issue or reality and not be paper tigers.

Guess why Pakistan's Op Badr in Kargil failed?

It was a brilliant plan, but it missed out on the real issue - logistics and resupply, apart from faking it that it was mujahideens in action!

You should read the diary of the Pak Capt that India retrieved.

It was a sad read!

They were left on a wing and a prayer (to use this very apt terms someone used earlier).

I was there!

Somehow its the history of Pakistani adventures..
brilliant tactics.. back by non existent strategy..
brilliant plans.. bungled execution.

Even the current chief was against Musharraf's misadventure..
I too was there in Murree.. heard the guns go off in the distance all night.
I know of PA aviation pilots.. talking of choppers stained with blood.
sending troops in.. did not kill them..
then leaving them to die in the retreat..
many mothers who never know where their sons remains lie today.

I know my people.. I dont say this out of jingoism..
but these are no less than "lions led by lambs"

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

Somehow its the history of Pakistani adventures..
brilliant tactics.. back by non existent strategy..
brilliant plans.. bungled execution.

Even the current chief was against Musharraf's misadventure..
I too was there in Murree.. heard the guns go off in the distance all night.
I know of PA aviation pilots.. talking of choppers stained with blood.
sending troops in.. did not kill them..
then leaving them to die in the retreat..
many mothers who never know where their sons remains lie today.

I know my people.. I dont say this out of jingoism..
but these are no less than "lions led by lambs"

You have said it all.

We buried quite a few with due Muslim rites.

The Kargil Dst Shias were most unhappy that the dead were not reclaimed and they felt (rightly or wrongly) that the chaps were from NLI and so.

I was surprised that they had no resupply planned, especially for those who were deep inside, and they were left on their own on a wing and a prayer!!

Most callous.

Actually, I would call Op Badr as a brilliant sand model plan! Like most armies in the world, they conjure brilliant tactical plan (more so when they will not be in the thick of it) and then like good Generals, conveniently leave the logistics aspects out of the discussion since that is what is the most difficult part to match! To imagine on those heights logistics were forsaken except from some helicopter sorties, and expecting the few soldiers there to lug it up!! No casevac either!

Young chaps they were and full of go.

But that alone cannot win wars!

We felt very sorry for them, even though there were the adversaries.

They were just doing their duty as we were doing ours!

But when one find callousness even if it was by the adversary heads, it makes one wonder!