India, Iran to resume talks on gas pipeline through Pak

[Neither Right Nor Wrong]

Even the under sea pipeline shall pass through Pakistan's EEZ.

So???

 

[ice_man]

i recall sometime back indians were claiming this pipeline will be PAKISTAN's ENRON!!! and now they want to be a part of it

india NEEDS this pipeline but on its on terms!!! this will never happen!!! you can't hoodwink two nations!!

 

[amit27]

At least if India builds it undersea we dont have to pay transit fees to pakistan im sure in the long run it will save India money and be more secure then the land route.

 

[ejaz007]

At least if India builds it undersea we dont have to pay transit fees to pakistan im sure in the long run it will save India money and be more secure then the land route.

Offcourse you have to. It shall still pass through our territory. Law of seas states that every nation's EEZ is 200 nautical miles.

The beauty shall be we shall not be responsible for the safety of the pipeline since it is under sea. On land it is a different story.

---------- Post added at 08:56 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:55 AM ----------

So???

So you still require our permission and pay us transit fee. Stuck aren't you

 

[ejaz007]

And some pakistani members here don't want to milk Indians for Cash ?

Hypothetically , if



Key bit to the whole agreement.

India will loose badly , If it has to pay for every bit of gas entering Pakistan.
No , one knows how much of it will ever actually reach India.

If Iran considers it too much of a risk , to take Pakistan's guarantee on security.
How can they expect India to feel differently about it.

fact is , IF moving this pipe through Pakistan is feasible proposal , then Iran should have no problem taking responsibility for the gas while it is there. Like they say what could ever go wrong.

If Iran feels it's too risky , It's hardly fair for India to have to take that gamble.

India is not understandign the legal grounds of the matter. Irans authority ends at Iran Pakistan border. Pakistan authority shall end at Pakistan India border. After that it shall be Indias authority.

Than how can Iran provide guarantee when it does not have any authority inside Pakistan's territory.

Sufficient guarantees have been assured by Pakistan. That is not the issue. The issue is India does not want to depend on Pakistan for her energy needs but unfortunately does not have any economically feasible alternative.

 

[Neither Right Nor Wrong]

Offcourse you have to. It shall still pass through our territory. Law of seas states that every nation's EEZ is 200 nautical miles.

Correct, however it can be extended to 350 NM or upto continental shelf, which ever is near.

---------- Post added at 08:56 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:55 AM ----------

[/COLOR]

So you still require our permission and pay us transit fee. Stuck aren't you

UNCLOS -Uninted Nation Convention On Laws Of the Sea.

Part V

Article56

Rights, jurisdiction and duties of the coastal State in the exclusive economic zone

1. In the exclusive economic zone, the coastal State has:

(a) sovereign rights for the purpose of exploring and exploiting, conserving and managing the natural resources, whether living or non-living, of the waters superjacent to the seabed and of the seabed and its subsoil, and with regard to other activities for the economic exploitation and exploration of the zone, such as the production of energy from the water, currents and winds;

(b) jurisdiction as provided for in the relevant provisions of this Convention with regard to:

(i) the establishment and use of artificial islands, installations and structures;

(ii) marine scientific research;

(iii) the protection and preservation of the marine environment;

(c) other rights and duties provided for in this Convention.

2. In exercising its rights and performing its duties under this Convention in the exclusive economic zone, the coastal State shall have due regard to the rights and duties of other States and shall act in a manner compatible with the provisions of this Convention.

3. The rights set out in this article with respect to the seabed and subsoil shall be exercised in accordance with Part VI.

Article58

Rights and duties of other States in the exclusive economic zone

1. In the exclusive economic zone, all States, whether coastal or land-locked, enjoy, subject to the relevant provisions of this Convention, the freedoms referred to in article 87 of navigation and overflight and of the laying of submarine cables and pipelines, and other internationally lawful uses of the sea related to these freedoms, such as those associated with the operation of ships, aircraft and submarine cables and pipelines, and compatible with the other provisions of this Convention.

2. Articles 88 to 115 and other pertinent rules of international law apply to the exclusive economic zone in so far as they are not incompatible with this Part.

3. In exercising their rights and performing their duties under this Convention in the exclusive economic zone, States shall have due regard to the rights and duties of the coastal State and shall comply with the laws and regulations adopted by the coastal State in accordance with the provisions of this Convention and other rules of international law in so far as they are not incompatible with this Part.

 

[amit27]

I have a feeling Pakistan has India by the balls on this one lol

 

[Tshering22]

That will be costly as hell...plus there was talk of electricity also...

It is better to be safe than sorry. You want Pakistan to hold our economy by its jugular? I think most Indians would prefern uninterrupted flow of gas from Iran with a little bit more cost than to everytime beg Pakistan to release its chokehold on us.

 

[Tshering22]

Then I assure you that it will be India which shall suffer the most. Your energy needs are growing and you need gas and the route is through Pakistan.

I guess you are stuck between the rock and the hard place.

Not really. We have the nuclear deal to substitute total requirements and emulate France in terms of relying on nuclear civil energy while redirect all of our gas and oil imports soley for consumption rather than generating electricity.

Gas is an important part in generating electricity now and this once replaced with nuclear power completely will reduce the pressure on government. It might be a considerable loss for us overall but if needed, we're willing to take it considering the consequences if we go ahead with the deal.

 

[karan.1970]

India is not understandign the legal grounds of the matter. Irans authority ends at Iran Pakistan border. Pakistan authority shall end at Pakistan India border. After that it shall be Indias authority.

Than how can Iran provide guarantee when it does not have any authority inside Pakistan's territory.

Sufficient guarantees have been assured by Pakistan. That is not the issue. The issue is India does not want to depend on Pakistan for her energy needs but unfortunately does not have any economically feasible alternative.

I think its you who has an understanding issue. When an exporter sends goods to an importing country then the exporter can be responsible for safe delivery at the port of receipt. When Bangladesh exports garments to USA, they are responsible till the time the goods reach the US shores irrespective of the number of countries it passes thru. same applies here..

 

[LaBong]

Sufficient guarantees have been assured by Pakistan. That is not the issue. The issue is India does not want to depend on Pakistan for her energy needs but unfortunately does not have any economically feasible alternative.

Guaranty has been issued by Pak Govt, and I have no doubt on their good intentions. But who's stopping non-state actors to meddle? Think about this, shiny pipeline is stretched on Pakistan's wild wild west, who's stopping some Balooch warlord to blow up the pipe line because some other warlord killed two of clan members!

 

[Nahraf]

Pakistan with 180 million people is a big market for natural gas from Iran. We neither need nor desire any Indian participation in this project. Pakistan should invest in extending already existing Sui gas network to more towns and villages. This natural gas help Pakistan to save forests as people in villages switch from firewood to gas.

 

[gogbot]

India is not understandign the legal grounds of the matter. Irans authority ends at Iran Pakistan border. Pakistan authority shall end at Pakistan India border. After that it shall be Indias authority.

Than how can Iran provide guarantee when it does not have any authority inside Pakistan's territory.

Sufficient guarantees have been assured by Pakistan. That is not the issue. The issue is India does not want to depend on Pakistan for her energy needs but unfortunately does not have any economically feasible alternative.

YOU Have failed to understand by point

Sources said Tehran wants to transfer ownership of gas to India at Iran-Pakistan border while New Delhi wants it to be at the Pakistan-India border, thereby making Iran explicitly responsible for safe delivery of gas.

Let Iran pay for Any gas lost in Pakistan , if lost. Becuase it will still be their gas flowing though PAk.

India should not pay for Gas coming into Pakistan , but only gas coming into India.

What's wrong with that.

If moving this gas through Pakistan is safe , then Iran does not have anything to be concerned about , when it crosses the PAk border the GAs is still owned by Iran till it reaches the India border.

The fact that Iran does nto want to agree to this , is acknowledgement from Iran that they themselves find moving the gas through Pak too risky.

Otherwise why would they have any problem being financially liable for any losses in Pakistan.

 

[KSRaj]

Price of gas in India

Price of gas from KG Basin - 4.2$mmBtu

From Qatar (until 2009) - 2.53$
(currently) - 7$
(expects) - 10$

US Natural gas futures - 4$


With the current oil prices, does anyone have any idea what the price of the gas supplied from Iran to Pakistan will be? Have tried searching over the net, but could not get the required info.

 

[KSRaj]

On a lighter vein, even if India doesnt get any of the gas from Iran, its good that Pakistan is buying it. Because India has a stake in the South Pars fields from where the gas gets supplied to Pakistan.

Hopefully, Pakistanis dont have any issues buying gas from an entity with an Indian stake.